Penalty Points

Can a Garda take the word of a member of the public and therefore issue a fine and penalty points to another person on this basis of what one person has said? If the garda was not even there when it happened would this not be one persons word over another?

pa990

Deleted User wrote: »

Can a Garda take the word of a member of the public and therefore issue a fine and penalty points to another person on this basis of what one person has said?

imo Its not best practice, to simply go on the verbal word of a third party

But if the other person has given a statement and is willing to be a witness in a court case then, yes

Deleted User wrote: »

If the garda was not even there when it happened would this not be one persons word over another?

sure isn't that the case with most court cases.

That's why we have Judges

pa990

pa990 wrote: »

imo Its not best practice, to simply go on the verbal word of a third party

But if the other person has given a statement and is willing to be a witness in a court case then, yes



sure isn't that the case with most court cases.

That's why we have Judges

Thanks for your reply. This person is not really a third party and is likely gearing up for compo however the gardai did not wish to hear my version of events or that I had two witnesses to verify this.

ironclaw

Deleted User wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. This person is not really a third party and is likely gearing up for compo however the gardai did not wish to hear my version of events or that I had two witnesses to verify this.

Gardai are legally obliged to take a statement if deemed nessisary. They can't just wave you off. That said, a Garda will not attribute blame in any instance. That's for insurance companies / the courts to decide if it goes that far. As such sometimes the Gardai get guff for 'taking sides' at an accident when in fact they are attempting to stay impartial. They can give their opinion but they can't attribute blame.

messrs

Deleted User wrote: »

Can a Garda take the word of a member of the public and therefore issue a fine and penalty points to another person on this basis of what one person has said? If the garda was not even there when it happened would this not be one persons word over another?

I wouldn't imagine they could , sure if that was the case whats to stop someone that has a grudge against you reporting you for doing stuff just so you would get fine or penalty points - suppose it depends on what exactly they are reporting - id imagine they would need some kind of proof

Atlantic Dawn

Deleted User wrote: »

Thanks for your reply. This person is not really a third party and is likely gearing up for compo however the gardai did not wish to hear my version of events or that I had two witnesses to verify this.

Could be a mate of the Garda, did you take their badge number or name? The days of this type of sheite should be long gone with the goings on in Donegal and that.

CiniO

ironclaw wrote: »

That said, a Garda will not attribute blame in any instance. That's for insurance companies / the courts to decide if it goes that far. As such sometimes the Gardai get guff for 'taking sides' at an accident when in fact they are attempting to stay impartial. They can give their opinion but they can't attribute blame.

I understand you are talking more about accident scenario now than reporting someone.

But actually interesting point is why Irish Gardai are not allowed to attribute blame at accident? Makes no sense to me.

ironclaw

CiniO wrote: »

I understand you are talking more about accident scenario now than reporting someone.

But actually interesting point is why Irish Gardai are not allowed to attribute blame at accident? Makes no sense to me.

Kinda harks back to the judgement by peers and due process. A Garda at the side of the road may be unknowingly influenced or biased, an insurance company or court is going to be fairly impartial. It's difficult in heated situations where there may be people injured or worked up to get all the facts. Hence why it's better to take some statements and for due process to take place. In any professional setting, you only ever state your opinion any way, you never direct blame. Only a court can do this.

Its the same, for example, in air accident investigation etc.

CiniO

ironclaw wrote: »

Kinda harks back to the judgement by peers and due process. A Garda at the side of the road may be unknowingly influenced or biased,

While possibly they could, I hardly can think of reason why they would be.

an insurance company or court is going to be fairly impartial.

Court - allright.
But insurance company? Why would they be impartial?
In the end of the day, there might a be a huge difference in payout depending on who was at fault so insurance companies might have big business in assinging blame one way than the other?
IMO insurance companies should be there only to pay out for damage - definitely not to decide about blame.

Imagine - 2 vehicles collide (A and .
Both vehicles worth about 1000 euro each - both destroyed. Driver A is badly injured. Driver B is 100% allright.
Now - if blame is on driver B, then his insurer will have to pay out huge money to driver A. If blame is on driver A, then his insurer will only have to pay out 1000 euro to driver B for his damaged vehicle.
Definitely not a good idea to have insurers decide who was at fault.

It's difficult in heated situations where there may be people injured or worked up to get all the facts. Hence why it's better to take some statements and for due process to take place.

But problem is that is doesn't really happen. Not in small cases anyway where there is only property damage.
If you have a crash with other driver, and only vehicles are damaged - no injuries, gards most like won't even bother to come and there will be no statements or evidence. Insurer will be only able to rely on statement drivers made next day or so which might be not true.
If gards would come on the spot, see traces, skid marks, broken glass, etc, talk to the drivers on the spot, I'm sure in 90% cases they would be able to tell the blame straight away.
And that's how it works abroad in many countries successfully. Should be similar in Ireland.
Only if one party doesn't agree with gards blame assignment case should go to court.
Simple and effective.