Shotgun problem

chris20

Hey lads
Was out last weekend with the shotgun, it's a semi auto armsan a612

When firing it would fire the cartridge in the barrel,eject not a problem and load the second cartridge however it would not fire the second one?

Any ideas?

The gun is regularly cleaned and the ammo was hull high pheasant 32g 6

Cheers lads

Cass

Sounds like short stroke. This is when the action cycles enough to pick up the next round, but not so much that it engages the firing mechanism.

Quick test. Load two rounds. Fire the first. Make sure it picks up the second. See if it fires. If not then manually pull the bolt back (if the round is ejected put the same one back it) all the way with enough force to make sure it is fully rearward. Let it forward on the same round. Test to see if it fires.

If it does then it's short stroke. There are only two causes i know of to this:

1. Insufficient rearward force
2. Fouled up mechanism

They are:

1. Insufficient rearward force. I've seen this in a Benelli. It would not cycle light loads. The reason was the pressure from the round was so low that it could not work the semi auto action enough to cycle the action to both pick up the next round and engage the firing mechanism. Once he used anything over 28gr it worked fine.
2. Fouled up. regardless of how clean you think it is semi autos need a good, thorough cleaning. I mean strip it to it's bones. Fouling could cause friction that hampers the working of the bolt so while the gun picks up the second round it does not engage the firing mechanism so cannot fire. Fouling in itself may also gunk up the mechanism so while it works fine the firing mechanism cannot properly engage. However as it fire the first with a manual cycling it'd suspect if it were lack of cleaning it would show up on the first round too.

My guess is low load rounds. What are you firing in it? Have you anything substantially stronger? If so try two of those. If the problem persists with much heavier rounds i'd strip the nuts out of the gun and clean every single part.

chris20

Cass wrote: »

Sounds like short stroke. This is when the action cycles enough to pick up the next round, but not so much that it engages the firing mechanism.

Quick test. Load two rounds. Fire the first. Make sure it picks up the second. See if it fires. If not then manually pull the bolt back (if the round is ejected put the same one back it) all the way with enough force to make sure it is fully rearward. Let it forward on the same round. Test to see if it fires.

If it does then it's short stroke. There are only two causes i know of to this:

1. Insufficient rearward force
2. Fouled up mechanism

They are:

1. Insufficient rearward force. I've seen this in a Benelli. It would not cycle light loads. The reason was the pressure from the round was so low that it could not work the semi auto action enough to cycle the action to both pick up the next round and engage the firing mechanism. Once he used anything over 28gr it worked fine.
2. Fouled up. regardless of how clean you think it is semi autos need a good, thorough cleaning. I mean strip it to it's bones. Fouling could cause friction that hampers the working of the bolt so while the gun picks up the second round it does not engage the firing mechanism so cannot fire. Fouling in itself may also gunk up the mechanism so while it works fine the firing mechanism cannot properly engage. However as it fire the first with a manual cycling it'd suspect if it were lack of cleaning it would show up on the first round too.

My guess is low load rounds. What are you firing in it? Have you anything substantially stronger? If so try two of those. If the problem persists with much heavier rounds i'd strip the nuts out of the gun and clean every single part.

Cheers for the reply cass

When I went to fire the second shot I heard a "click" from the mechanism, then I manually pulled back the mechanism and loaded the first shell, fired no problem

Normally I run 32g 6 or 5with no problem until now , I have a box of alphamax that ill run through it

Only have it around 3 months so if it persists I'll bring it back to the shop

Cass

Have you tried manually loading each cartridge then firing them?

Load a cartridge, fire it. Let the bolt come back and make sure it locks in the open position. If it does load a second cartridge manually into the barrel/chamber, release the bolt and fire the second one. If it fires and locks the bolt back then it's not the cartridge. Make sure you use the same cartridge you are using at the moment and not another. It's important to eliminate each aspect of what you're using/doing now.

If the bolt does not lock back with each individual firing of a cartridge then you've identified a problem. Now all you need to do is determine whether it's the cartridge or the mechanism. To do this you now change cartridge. Go to a 36 gr or heavier. Again manually load one cartridge at a time. Make sure the bolt is back and open for each shot, and that when fired the bolt comes back to the locked & open position.

If the bolt locks back o the heavier cartridges but not on the lighter ones (or whatever you're using now) then it's the cartridge. If the bolt will not lock back and/or fire regardless of cartridge then i'd be looking at the mechanism.

However, and i cannot stress this enough, if the gun is only new get it back to the shop and have them do it. It's under warranty and even if it's not (say you bought second hand) any work you carry out will void any hope of having the shop resolve this for you.

Grizzly 45

Check also that your extractor claw are engaging fully into the recesses in the barrel. That might explain your "click" and not boom. I had this maddening problem with my Mossberg when I was using a diffferent barrel for game shooting.It would some times not fire unless the slide was almost slammed forward,and it never had that problem with its usual short deer barrel.
Turns out that the second barrel had still some machineing groves in the barrel extractor lugs that wasnt allowing the extractors to sit in place 100% to allow the mechanism to clear to fire the gun. IOW yes it has oomph to extract,eject and cycle,and go into battery again,but the extractors arent sitting properly into their recesses and it only takes a milimeter or two to still have the gun out of battery to just to give you a click,and no hammer drop.

So make sure those lugs are spotless and there isnt any residue sitting in there,as well as that the extractor spring and extractor are functioning correctly. This is clean with a toothpick or dental pick work and magnifying glass time to see if there is damage to the extractors /ejector and that those recesses are clean and finished out properly.Sometimes a micro file can sort out that problem,but as Cass sid if it is a new gun,let the dealer sort it out.

chris20

Cheers lads,I'm just gonna bring it back as I bought it new

juice1304

Sounds like the timing is out. If the bolt isnt all the way forward the hammer will drop when you pull the trigger but not strike the firing pin so as not to fire when the bolt is not fully locked etc...

Cass

How did you get on with this?

useurowname

No firearms expert but aren't Hull cartridges 67mm, the auto might be having trouble cycling them?