Timing Belt Scam?

iniall

I had my 2009 C4 Grand Picasso serviced yesterday and I got a call from the service guy (because there's always a call from the service guy to say there'll be an additional cost) saying the timing belt and water pump needed to be replaced, because of the age of the car. The cost would be €425 ex-VAT. So I did a search and according to this site

http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=130

the car only needs its timing belt changed every 10 years. Is the guy being genuine, do you think, or is he just looking to squeeze another big chunk of money out of me? (It's a Citroen dealer)

tred

iniall wrote: »

I had my 2009 C4 Grand Picasso serviced yesterday and I got a call from the service guy (because there's always a call from the service guy to say there'll be an additional cost) saying the timing belt and water pump needed to be replaced, because of the age of the car. The cost would be €425 ex-VAT. So I did a search and according to this site

http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=130

the car only needs its timing belt changed every 10 years. Is the guy being genuine, do you think, or is he just looking to squeeze another big chunk of money out of me? (It's a Citroen dealer)

what mileage on the picasso

iniall

90,000 km (about 55,000 miles)

keysersoze1

Timing belts are changed by miles driven not years driven

my3cents

keysersoze1 wrote: »

Timing belts are changed by miles driven not years driven

Or years which ever comes first.

daheff

I reckon hes chancing his arm.


tell him you'll have to get back to him another time. Go and have another garage(preferably a main dealer) look at it and see. If they reckon it needs changing then it probably does. If not, then i'd avoid garage number one in future.

zl1whqvjs75cdy

When's the last time it was done? 90 k Km on one belt seems like a lot.

thomas anderson.

60k miles sounds about right

neacy69

sounds dodgy to me...only half (roughly) the recommended timing belt intervals for time and miles...i'd look for a second opinion

iniall

donkeyoaty0099 wrote: »

When's the last time it was done? 90 k Km on one belt seems like a lot.

Don't know that it's ever been done. I bought the car in 2012 from a Citroen dealer and I never thought about it until yesterday. Is 90,000 km a lot though? According to http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=130 it only has to be changed every 150,000 miles...

johnayo

Ring the Main Dealer and ask when it needs to be done.

iniall

He is the main dealer...!

ZiabR

Can you confirm the engine OP?

my3cents

150,000 miles or every 10 years does sound very high and I wouldn't rely on just one website for the information.

iniall

1.6 HDI

biko

According to http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=130
150K miles or 10 years

punisher5112

No belt would be 150k miles it would have snapped well before unless the engine always was been driven down hill and no stress whatsoever.


60k miles or 100km would be right and quite possible if excess wear is spotted it may well be good to change.

I would ask him is there any chance it could be a bit less or tell him you will think about it... an indymechanic to do the job if a lot less.

Tony Beetroot

Phone the main dealer, pulling info off random websites is the incorrect thing to do.

ZiabR

For the 1.6HDI engine UP to 2006 it is

150,000 miles, not sure on the years though, i would say in the region of 5-7 years.

For the 1.6HDI enginer 2006 Upwards it is

150,000 miles or every 5 years (120 months).

If the belt in your car has never been done and it is 2009 then I would say you are due a belt change regardless of the mileage.

johnayo

iniall wrote: »

He is the main dealer...!

Ring another main dealer to confirm.

kunst nugget

biko wrote: »

According to http://www.mytimingbelt.com/Results.aspx?ModelId=130
150K miles or 10 years

The timing belt going on my old Megane wrote off the engine so I tend to be cautious enough these days about changing them regularly enough. I definitely wouldn't leave it until 150k miles myself but I would do it between 80k and 100k.

mullingar

That same engine in the Focus Ford recommend 125k miles or 10 years. Volvo's with this same engine specify 150kmiles or 10 years.

These belts are not known to die prematurely so at 55k miles is not even half way through its life.

Do not go ahead with it.

Also, €425+ vat is around €500! way over priced too.

mullingar

logik wrote: »

For the 1.6HDI engine UP to 2006 it is

150,000 miles, not sure on the years though, i would say in the region of 5-7 years.

For the 1.6HDI enginer 2006 Upwards it is

150,000 miles or every 5 years (120 months).

If the belt in your car has never been done and it is 2009 then I would say you are due a belt change regardless of the mileage.

120 months is 10 years!

punisher5112

I looked it up and there are asterix beside the service intervals as in special circumstances.

Citroen recommend 150k miles but also 120k miles at service interval so change at 120k but also terms on that.

Special Circumstances

punisher5112 wrote: »

I looked it up and there are asterix beside the service intervals as in special circumstances.

Citroen recommend 150k miles but also 120k miles at service interval so change at 120k but also terms on that.

Leave me outta this!

my3cents

punisher5112 wrote: »

I looked it up and there are asterix beside the service intervals as in special circumstances.

Citroen recommend 150k miles but also 120k miles at service interval so change at 120k but also terms on that.

Some information on those figures and the (Servere) Conditions that indicate a change at 120k as opposed to 150k (miles).

Edit> Link http://c4owners.org/plugins/faq/faq.php?0.cat.2.106

punisher5112

Special Circumstances wrote: »

Leave me outta this!

will do ha

enumbers

Have never seen an issue with these belts left to run there interval of 150,000 miles always seem in decent condition when removed.

magentis

I don't think that is an engine with history of premature belt failure.
If it was mine i would be happy enough to leave it for another two years/40000km.
On the other hand,its a massive bill if it snaps!

Mycroft H

I've pics of our old belt somewhere with the belt coming off at 160k miles on the 1.6HDi. Looked fine to be honest. Wouldn't go near it for another while yet.

walus

I'd be careful with this OP. Manufacturer recommendation and experienced mechanic suggestions tend to be two different things. To my knowledge 150k miles on a timing belt is way too much. There was a time when almost all manufacturers were stretching service intervals etc to have their cars more appealing to fleet managers. We now know that changing oil in complex turbo diesel engines every 30k kilometres is simply a crime (manufacturers reduced oil change intervals to 15k since) and I would worry that the same thing would apply to timing belts. I would ring one or two other reputable garages and enquire about that. I would not however leave it until I get to 150k miles as you might be on your second engine at that stage.

HandsomeDan

punisher5112 wrote: »

... unless the engine always was been driven down hill and no stress whatsoever.

Driving a car down a hill does not reduce stress on a timing bet, wtf?

Cee-Jay-Cee

walus wrote: »

I'd be careful with this OP. Manufacturer recommendation and experienced mechanic suggestions tend to be two different things. To my knowledge 150k miles on a timing belt is way too much. There was a time when almost all manufacturers were stretching service intervals etc to have their cars more appealing to fleet managers. We now know that changing oil in complex turbo diesel engines every 30k kilometres is simply a crime (manufacturers reduced oil change intervals to 15k since) and I would worry that the same thing would apply to timing belts. I would ring one or two other reputable garages and enquire about that. I would not however leave it until I get to 150k miles as you might be on your second engine at that stage.

But the OP car only has 55k miles on it.

I'd leave it till closer to 100k miles and do it then but in the meantime I'd ring back the dealer and ask him if it's excessively worn or why they're recommending it be changed when the manufacturer recommends changing the belt at 150k miles?

I'd also tell them that your emailing/contacting Citroen Ireland to ask why it's not highlighted at the point of sale that the recommended service intervals for belts in the book are grossly incorrect.

billy few mates

I had a car with that engine in it and the interval was also 140,000 - 150,000. I traded in the car at 115,000 without it being done and it wasn't an issue...

Bio Mech

punisher5112 wrote: »

No belt would be 150k miles it would have snapped well before unless the engine always was been driven down hill and no stress whatsoever.


60k miles or 100km would be right and quite possible if excess wear is spotted it may well be good to change.

That's not correct. Lots of modern diesels have 150,000 intervals. it might seem to lot as people are used to shorter intervals on older/other cars but a lot of the PSA diesels have long intervals and seem to do fine. For example in mondeos once they aren't wet belts they seem to be ok to the intervals.

Ded_Zebra

punisher5112 wrote: »

No belt would be 150k miles it would have snapped well before unless the engine always was been driven down hill and no stress whatsoever.


60k miles or 100km would be right and quite possible if excess wear is spotted it may well be good to change.

I would ask him is there any chance it could be a bit less or tell him you will think about it... an indymechanic to do the job if a lot less.

I'm sorry, do you have the slightest clue what a timing belt actually does???:rolleyes:

How could there possibly be less force required to drive the camshafts when driving down hill?

Please, before you try to give someone else advice, have some sort of an idea what you are talking about.

punisher5112

Ded_Zebra wrote: »

I'm sorry, do you have the slightest clue what a timing belt actually does???:rolleyes:

How could there possibly be less force required to drive the camshafts when driving down hill?

Please, before you try to give someone else advice, have some sort of an idea what you are talking about.

I meant as in no stress with the car always rolling down hill.

Its ok I don't know what car even is.

Imo I would not trust a belt that long and by the way look up the terms on belts as in they have asterix beside them stating how different mileage to change at.

Good luck

jayo26

Anychance its the problem with the waterpump and not the timing belt. The waterpump could be showing signs of wear and needs to be changed and in that event he will change the belt also when at it.

enumbers

Why do people bother posting if they have nothing useful to add , recommending the op get a belt done because some totally different car and engine combination needs to be done much sooner is ridiculous , several experienced posters have posted to explain that running the full interval of 150,000 miles has shown no issues common issues ,

iniall

Thanks for all the replies, folks. I (eventually) found the official answer in the maintenance manual that came with the car: 150,000 miles or 10 years, so I think the guy was either mis-informed or was chancing his arm.

As it happens, the battery died four days after the service, which ruined my weekend and made me think that they should have noticed signs of failure during the service. But apparently, batteries can just fail without warning. Who knew?

Cee-Jay-Cee

Modern batteries do seem to act like they, one day they're perfect and a day or two later they simply run out of juice. It's not something that would be noticed at a service because if the car starts when they turn the key then how could you expect them to know it's on it's way out.

Did you ring the dealer and ask was thebt excessively worn?

biko

Yeah, batts can just give up the ghost one day. It's not something the mechanics may have noticed at all.

iniall

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

Modern batteries do seem to act like they, one day they're perfect and a day or two later they simply run out of juice. It's not something that would be noticed at a service because if the car starts when they turn the key then how could you expect them to know it's on it's way out.

Did you ring the dealer and ask was thebt excessively worn?

I had asked him when he mentioned that it was due to be replaced, but I'm pretty sure he said at the time that they couldn't see the belt as it was under most of the engine...

Joe 90

HandsomeDan wrote: »

Driving a car down a hill does not reduce stress on a timing bet, wtf?

In neutral?:)

whiterebel

walus wrote: »

I'd be careful with this OP. Manufacturer recommendation and experienced mechanic suggestions tend to be two different things. To my knowledge 150k miles on a timing belt is way too much. There was a time when almost all manufacturers were stretching service intervals etc to have their cars more appealing to fleet managers. We now know that changing oil in complex turbo diesel engines every 30k kilometres is simply a crime (manufacturers reduced oil change intervals to 15k since) and I would worry that the same thing would apply to timing belts. I would ring one or two other reputable garages and enquire about that. I would not however leave it until I get to 150k miles as you might be on your second engine at that stage.

That'll be news to Audi and Opel then......

Bigus

Maybe the battery got a BELT of something