Free running dogs on Lee Fields

GuitarMusic

I was walking along the Lee Fields the other day with my very young boys and this little dog came up barking at them. Two of my boys are afraid of dogs due to bad experiences with dogs when they were younger (again these dogs weren't on leashes).

There are several signs on the Lee Fields that say that dogs should be on leads all the time but looking around there are many dogs that aren't.

When I told the dog owner his dog should be on a lead he just laughed.

I can understand that people want to exercise their dogs but imo they shouldn't do it in a public area where there are signs up that say that dogs should be on leads all the time.

I swear that the next time a dog frightens my children I will either kick the dog in the head or throw the owner in the river. :eek:

Thoughts please.....

denhaagenite

GuitarMusic wrote: »

I will either kick the dog in the head or throw the owner in the river. :eek:

Thoughts please.....

I think you should be on a lead :eek:

Was the dog being aggressive? I know dogs should be on leads at all times but unfortunately the council doesn't provide very well for dog owners so there doesn't seem to be any space where they are welcome. Dogs need to be walked, and I see no problem with giving them a little bit of off leash play as long as they are under control of the owners.

If your child is afraid of dogs then it being on or off the lead won't make a difference to whether he/ she is frightened or not, so maybe reserve your kicking and throwing. If the dog was just making a bit of noise then you have no reason to be angry, your child was in no danger. Maybe in future ask the owner, and if the dog is friendly use the opportunity to teach your child that not all dogs are scary. Children are great because they're afraid of very little, seems to me that you might have passed your animosity towards dogs onto your child.

gimmick

Yes, kicking a dog in the head will solve everything. No way would that escalate to something far worse.

Good example you will be setting as well.

mordeith

Seems pretty straightforward to me. Signs say dog should be on a leash, dog should be on a leash.

gimmick

And if a leashed up dog approaches OP, will the dog still get a kick int he head, or is it only if the dog is running free wildly upsetting all and sundry?

mordeith

gimmick wrote: »

And if a leashed up dog approaches OP, will the dog still get a kick int he head, or is it only if the dog is running free wildly upsetting all and sundry?

I've no idea how vicious the OP will be towards a leashed dog.

j8wk2feszrnpao

GuitarMusic wrote: »

....
I swear that the next time a dog frightens my children I will either kick the dog in the head or throw the owner in the river. :eek:....

I think that some people are taking this a bit too literal. It's seems to be a throwaway comment, at least I hope so.

OP, you may just have to avoid the Lee Fields if the dogs are frightening your children. Unfortunate I know, but you'll find plenty of dog owners that couldn't give a damn about anyone else.

JoeySully

If my dog was off a leash and was aggressive towards you or you felt threatened I would not be in the slightest bit upset if you gave her a good kick.

I used to walk our dog there a lot but mostly stuck to the middle of the field so not to annoy people on the path.

If you want to make a complaint you can find the infor here but only 9-5 monday to friday :rolleyes:

Mightydrumming

As said previously, If the signs state that dog's should be on a leash - They should be.

Kicking the dog wouldn't solve anything. At the end of the day, the owner responsible for keeping a leash on the dog - not the dog.

GuitarMusic

munstermagic11 wrote: »

I think that some people are taking this a bit too literal. It's seems to be a throwaway comment, at least I hope so.

OP, you may just have to avoid the Lee Fields if the dogs are frightening your children. Unfortunate I know, but you'll find plenty of dog owners that couldn't give a damn about anyone else.

Indeed, it was a throw away comment.

My children are fine if the dogs are on leads as they can sidestep the dogs by some margin however the earlier dog was running in cicles around them so they clung to my legs like there was no tomorrow.

I might ring the council, explain my situation and ask them to police the area more often.

Rhys Essien

OP,I understand your frustration.This tells you everything you need to know.

http://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/doglicensinganddogownership/keepingadogincorkcity/

GuitarMusic

Rhys Essien wrote: »

OP,I understand your frustration.This tells you everything you need to know.

http://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/doglicensinganddogownership/keepingadogincorkcity/

Great find. Thanks!

keithclancy

Rhys Essien wrote: »

OP,I understand your frustration.This tells you everything you need to know.

http://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/doglicensinganddogownership/keepingadogincorkcity/

Absolutely useless, people leave their dogs running around on the roads outside their house and the council does nothing about it.

whisky_galore

keithclancy wrote: »

Absolutely useless, people leave their dogs running around on the roads outside their house and the council does nothing about it.

It's the Irish of doing things, have them running after cars, maybe getting a slap off a car, sh*tting all over the place...no such thing as a bad dog, just lazy irresponsible owners with little fear of or regard for our toothless laws and enforcement.
Some people shouldn't be allowed keep a goldfish.

darkdubh

GuitarMusic wrote: »

I was walking along the Lee Fields the other day with my very young boys and this little dog came up barking at them. Two of my boys are afraid of dogs due to bad experiences with dogs when they were younger (again these dogs weren't on leashes).

There are several signs on the Lee Fields that say that dogs should be on leads all the time but looking around there are many dogs that aren't.

When I told the dog owner his dog should be on a lead he just laughed.

I can understand that people want to exercise their dogs but imo they shouldn't do it in a public area where there are signs up that say that dogs should be on leads all the time.

I swear that the next time a dog frightens my children I will either kick the dog in the head or throw the owner in the river. :eek:

Thoughts please.....

You could keep your little darlings on a lead.

Ludo

darkdubh wrote: »

You could keep your little darlings on a lead.

Nice soundbite.
Pity that wouldn't solve the problem of a dog coming and bothering them.
Oh and the minor matter of it being illegal of course but who cares about that.

denhaagenite

You're absolutely right the dog should be on a lead and mine always is, but a little bit of empathy for the fact that dog walkers are (pardon the pun) hounded from everywhere. They pay a fee per annum to keep the dog, never mind the cost of feeding, vet, kennelling etc, and there is nowhere safe to go and have a relaxed walk with them off lead. There are hardly even bins to clean up after them ffs!! There are some parks such as Shandon, Ballincollig and the Lee Fields that seem to be frequented by dogwalkers, I suggest giving them a break and going to one of the other ones if you're that adverse to dogs. Of course you've got a right to be there but so do they and they're not bothered by you.

As for children being frightened of dogs, my dog absolutely adores children and while I would never leave her alone with them as it is irresponsible, she is as gentle as they come with a child and the only fear would be of them tormenting her. My next door neighbour of 5 years who knows our dog well has a two year old grandson who will actually start crying and running away if he even sees her inside the window. Totally ridiculous that it's never occurred to her that this completely irrational fear that the baby has might be an issue, one that could very easily be corrected. It's not only pups that need socialisation.

mordeith

denhaagenite wrote: »

You're absolutely right the dog should be on a lead and mine always is, but a little bit of empathy for the fact that dog walkers are (pardon the pun) hounded from everywhere. They pay a fee per annum to keep the dog, never mind the cost of feeding, vet, kennelling etc, and there is nowhere safe to go and have a relaxed walk with them off lead. There are hardly even bins to clean up after them ffs!! There are some parks such as Shandon, Ballincollig and the Lee Fields that seem to be frequented by dogwalkers, I suggest giving them a break and going to one of the other ones if you're that adverse to dogs. Of course you've got a right to be there but so do they and they're not bothered by you.

As for children being frightened of dogs, my dog absolutely adores children and while I would never leave her alone with them as it is irresponsible, she is as gentle as they come with a child and the only fear would be of them tormenting her. My next door neighbour of 5 years who knows our dog well has a two year old grandson who will actually start crying and running away if he even sees her inside the window. Totally ridiculous that it's never occurred to her that this completely irrational fear that the baby has might be an issue, one that could very easily be corrected. It's not only pups that need socialisation.

That's all well and good but dogs are supposed to be on leads in certain parks. Telling people to go somewhere else because dog owners break the rules is nonsense.

As for the cost of owning a dog, do you think children are brought up for free?

Lastly you have no idea why that child is scared. Socialisation of dogs is no guarantee to their behaviour. That 3 week old killed by a terrier last week in England for example.
(I do recognise your responsible attitude towards leaving dogs alone with children.)

celica00

NEVER EVER blame the dog...it is ALWAYS the owner.

Its not the dog who does not put himself on the leash because the sign says so....

This needs to be addressed with the dog owners (and you tried) but don't kick the dog. that could result in a bite back and you wouldn't want that I'm sure.

denhaagenite

mordeith wrote: »

That's all well and good but dogs are supposed to be on leads in certain parks. Telling people to go somewhere else because dog owners break the rules is nonsense.

They are supposed to be on leads everywhere, all the time. I know this because I researched extensively bringing my Dutch dog to Ireland for six months this year. We had no freedom anywhere. She was never off the lead unless she was in our car, home or garden. There is no public space that you can bring them to anywhere for off lead playing and exercise. There are barely bins to clean up after them.

I am absolutely for responsible dog ownership, and I know that a lot of people are incredibly irresponsible. There was a dog that must have been living in a 1/ 2 km radius from us who took a shine to my dog so I would actually put him in the garden to play with her sometimes, or if I was walking with her he would come with us. He was clearly fed but he was wandering about all day everyday, no trouble at all as a dog as he was actually quite shy and would avoid people but hardly responsible ownership. He wasn't the only one I came across like that either.

I just think that there is enough open space in and around the city for everyone to live and let live. I have a feeling that the OP has a tendency to overreact and definitely has in this case (whether their original comments were in jest or not) but a bit of empathy towards the dog owners in the city is to be advised. If you want to go to a nice park with your kids try Fitzgeralds Park, or the one in Togher where there are lovely playgrounds and less dogs.

iusedtoknow

Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children.

Glad to see the tradition of dogs at the lee fields is still going. We used to bring ours there on Saturday/Sunday to have a bit of a stroll and play fetch with our dogs. They were peaceful and needed the run. We lived in the country, and they had space but it was a nice long walk for them as well.

I'm all for responsible ownership of dogs, and refuse to have one living where I do, despite the fact that there is a park with ample space for runs (and 2 city sponsored dog parks). However, I am also for responsible raising of children, and equally believe that if a place is well known for being a dog run, and you have kids that are afraid of dogs then perhaps any of the countless other parks (fitzgeralds etc) would be more suitable for them

j8wk2feszrnpao

Won't somebody PLEASE think of the children................and the dogs.

denhaagenite

iusedtoknow wrote: »

if a place is well known for being a dog run, and you have kids that are afraid of dogs then perhaps any of the countless other parks (fitzgeralds etc) would be more suitable for them

THIS

Can't stress it enough, and it is a shame how many children (and parents) seem to be terrified of dogs in Ireland. A lot of my walks in Fitzgerald's Park with the mutt, short lead, totally under control and quiet (if a bit confused!!), were spent asking parents of hysterical children if they would like to maybe help them not be so terrified by petting a nice gentle dog who displays no more menacing tendencies than licking :P. There is a lovely little café on Barracks St that my husband took her once, herself and a 15 month old girl had a lovely time making friends.

Honestly, if dogs were so awful they never would have become domesticated in the first place.

whisky_galore

mordeith wrote: »

That's all well and good but dogs are supposed to be on leads in certain parks. Telling people to go somewhere else because dog owners break the rules is nonsense.

Having the rules is a nonsense if there's no enforcement, Irish people don't do civic responsibility very well.

wonka

Dogs need to be on a lead at all times when in a public place - END of. You can't debate on ... oh my dog isn't aggressive etc. That's not even to mention on having specific breeds muzzled at all times. We've had German Shepard's, Bulldogs etc roaming free around our estate which is just plain stupidity. The Dog wardan has been very responsive to any calls, so thankfully i'm not aware of any incidents resulting from this.

GuitarMusic

I don't think that I am over reacting. If I am walking along with my children a few metres in front of me and a dog runs circles around the kids and barks which results in the kids running to me, visibly scared, and holding onto my legs so hard I cant move then i think that there is an issue.

Like I said the last line in the OP was a throw away comment which I shouldnt have made. I would not kick a dog nor throw someone into a river.

I also said in the OP that I am aware of the need for dogs to exercise and as an ex-dog owner myself, in another country, I am well aware of the ethics of dog ownership.

I think that if people want to let dogs of leads at the Lee Fields then the grass area next to the road is a more appropriate area than the footpath.

The reason my eldest is scared off dogs is that when he was very young and sitting on the back of my non-moving bike an unrestrained dog ran up, went to bite his hand, just missed and got his teeth stuck in my sons glove. Needless to say there was a very short tug of war before the dog ran away with my sons glove.

Anyhow I now have the number listed in the above document in my phone so the next time this ignorance happens I will ring this number and see what happens plus I always have my phone with me so I can take a photo of dog and owner.

biko

keithclancy wrote: »

Absolutely useless, people leave their dogs running around on the roads outside their house and the council does nothing about it.

We're not talking about the streets now, we're talking about a specific location with signage.
But do talk to the council abut free running dogs on the streets, every cause needs a champion.

If the council nabbed a few it'd spread word to the other owners.

iusedtoknow

GuitarMusic wrote: »

I always have my phone with me so I can take a photo of dog and owner.

And do what with it exactly? I mean this sincerely. It's all well and good phoning the dog warden (like they'll do anything) but what would you actually do with a photo aside from wanting to intimidate someone.

How would you feel if said dog walker took a photo of you and your kids, for his records?

gimmick

I really hope the law abiding citizens of this thread never break a speed limit, have paid their household charge and property tax and are signed up for irish water.

It would be terrible if we didn't all follow those rules.

iusedtoknow

gimmick wrote: »

I really hope the law abiding citizens of this thread never break a speed limit, have paid their household charge and property tax and are signed up for irish water.

It would be terrible if we didn't all follow those rules.

not to mention NEVER double parking and leaving the hazards on, doing illegal U turns, cutting of bikes, putting bins out on the wrong day or a little earlier than you're supposed to...

Padraig Mor

iusedtoknow wrote: »

if a place is well known for being a dog run, and you have kids that are afraid of dogs then perhaps any of the countless other parks (fitzgeralds etc) would be more suitable for them

Nice. So, let's have the irresponsible dog owners of Cork have their mutts flying around a public area in breach of the law, and people's kids can **** right off somewhere else if they don't like it.

iusedtoknow

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Nice. So, let's have the irresponsible dog owners of Cork have their mutts flying around a public area in breach of the law, and people's kids can **** right off somewhere else if they don't like it.

Pretty much!

In reality, I am saying that the place is well known for dogs. If you know your kids are naturally fearful then there are other places to be. It's like saying you were surprised at there being prostitutes in a red light area...

gimmick

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Nice. So, let's have the irresponsible dog owners of Cork have their mutts flying around a public area in breach of the law, and people's kids can **** right off somewhere else if they don't like it.

Exactly.

namloc1980

iusedtoknow wrote: »

Pretty much!

In reality, I am saying that the place is well known for dogs. If you know your kids are naturally fearful then there are other places to be. It's like saying you were surprised at there being prostitutes in a red light area...

So keep dogs on leads signs are simply to be ignored?

iusedtoknow

namloc1980 wrote: »

So keep dogs on leads signs are simply to be ignored?

I think common sense needs to prevail. If there is a lot of open space and not many people around, then yes I think they should be.

Just in the same way, if it's safe to do so - parking restrictions are often ignored or any other number of rules and by-laws are done when it makes sense.

greenfrogs

I think it depends on who is around. If there is no one around then I let my dog off the leash. However as we pass someone I make sure to put the leash on. If the place is busy or its not safe to let the dog off then the leash stays on. I think it's selfish to let your dog bother other people. When they are off the leash you have zero control. Everybody says their dog is perfect, would never harm anyone but the reality is dogs are animals.

My dog is really quiet but a nervous dog so I would never put him in a situation where he is frightened. Same as the op feels towards her children. I mean if the man apologised then that would have made the situation different but he laughed. I would be mortified if my dog frightened little children. There was a few years where I was afraid of dogs so I know what it feels like to be scared of dogs. It kinda ruins a nice leisurely walk.

biko

gimmick wrote: »

I really hope the law abiding citizens of this thread never break a speed limit, have paid their household charge and property tax and are signed up for irish water.

Tbh, that's different. None of these will affect children out walking.

Why would anyone want to diffuse the issue into "people do bad **** all the time". It just serves to make everyone feel hopeless when it's so easy to address the issue at hand, loose dogs at Lee fields.

mordeith

iusedtoknow wrote: »

Just in the same way, if it's safe to do so - parking restrictions are often ignored or any other number of rules and by-laws are done when it makes sense.

That's why this country is a joke

whisky_galore

mordeith wrote: »

That's why this country is a joke

Pretty much, from top to bottom..."shur it'll be grand"

sillysmiles

wonka wrote: »

Dogs need to be on a lead at all times when in a public place - END of.

I'm pretty sure (aside for by-laws of specific locations) the legislation states that a dog must be under effective control*. Effective control doesn't necessarily mean a lease. A dog with good recall, is under effective control.

RBL and specific locations being the exceptions

denhaagenite

By right, what the council should provide is an actual enclosed space where owners can take their dogs and have them off the lead, without fear that they will bother anyone, adult or child. But they don't.

I'm all for respecting the rules but if I lived in Ireland, I just wouldn't keep a dog unless I had a place with a huge garden because it's just completely unfriendly when it comes to our four legged buddies. It would break my heart if she couldn't have a bit of freedom on a regular basis. I honestly wasn't happy to do it when we were in Cork because there is too much risk. Roads, other dogs etc etc. She's just not used to the dangers there so I had to be more careful.

These are things that you have to think about as a dog owner. People with kids can take them anywhere. Shops, restaurants, into town- doesn't matter how well or badly behaved they are going to be, nobody can tell you that you can't do it. There are very few places where you're going to be subjected to dogs and if you want to avoid them you can.

denhaagenite

biko wrote: »

But do talk to the council abut free running dogs on the streets, every cause needs a champion.

If the council nabbed a few it'd spread word to the other owners.

Thing is if you do this, there is a possibility that the (possibly harmless) dogs will end up in the shelter where they will be euthanized if not adopted. Obviously I would prefer if the owner kept them in and just walked them like they're supposed to do but if they're not bothering anyone and are well fed and looked after I'm not going to call the warden to take it to certain death, am I?

mordeith

denhaagenite wrote: »

By right, what the council should provide is an actual enclosed space where owners can take their dogs and have them off the lead, without fear that they will bother anyone, adult or child. But they don't.

This I agree with. If every dog owner paid their license and the powers that be put this into providing dog parks then it'd all be good.

blackbird 49

darkdubh wrote: »

You could keep your little darlings on a lead.

You obviously think more of dogs than children

sillysmiles

blackbird 49 wrote: »

You obviously think more of dogs than children

Surely that's fair enough. Not everyone likes children.

pwurple

denhaagenite wrote: »

By right, what the council should provide is an actual enclosed space where owners can take their dogs and have them off the lead, without fear that they will bother anyone, adult or child. But they don't.

Spot on. In almost every other first world country I've been in, there are dog beaches, dog parks, dog play zones. Nothing here.

I absolutely love dogs, but I won't get one here, because I don't like pissing others off for my own selfish sake. There are no canine amenities, and I'm not going to lock a dog up only to have it barking away in loneliness for days on end while I go to work.


And like it's a big shocker... I don't speed, chuck litter about or park illegally. I pay my taxes and am generally a socially responsible frikken grown-up.

Ludo

sillysmiles wrote: »

Surely that's fair enough. Not everyone likes children.

You don't have to like people to value them and treat them with respect. If you can't see the difference in how you treat children to animals then I really feel sorry for you. Would you want all children put in the hold of a plane in a cage for journeys also? Some people would probably answer yes to that in here but I would like to see them suggest it in a face to face situation rather than on a random internet forum or try it in reality and see how they get on.

iusedtoknow

biko wrote: »

Tbh, that's different. None of these will affect children out walking.

Why would anyone want to diffuse the issue into "people do bad **** all the time". It just serves to make everyone feel hopeless when it's so easy to address the issue at hand, loose dogs at Lee fields.

Breaking the speed limit I'm pretty sure could affect children out walking

iusedtoknow

Ludo wrote: »

You don't have to like people to value them and treat them with respect. If you can't see the difference in how you treat children to animals then I really feel sorry for you. Would you want all children put in the hold of a plane in a cage for journeys also? Some people would probably answer yes to that in here but I would like to see them suggest it in a face to face situation rather than on a random internet forum or try it in reality and see how they get on.

Conversely, you don't have to like dogs to value them them and treat them with respect. 90% of dogs are trained and just want to play with their owners. Their owners also want to make sure that they dogs get proper exercise AND enjoy their lives without harming anyone

I actually would like kid only sections on planes, or at least "family friendly" sections where those of us without can enjoy our trip in peace. The last 3 flights I've had kids kicking the back of my seat. And yes, that is down to bad parenting and #notallparents #notallkids but the same goes for dogs. Not all dogs are going to harm little Johnny.

namloc1980

sillysmiles wrote: »

I'm pretty sure (aside for by-laws of specific locations) the legislation states that a dog must be under effective control*. Effective control doesn't necessarily mean a lease. A dog with good recall, is under effective control.

RBL and specific locations being the exceptions

The bye law in Cork city is that the dog must be on a lead in public open spaces and must not be an annoyance to any person.

iusedtoknow

namloc1980 wrote: »

The bye law in Cork city is that the dog must be on a lead in public open spaces and must not be an annoyance to any person.

True
But the same bylaws prohibit riding a bike unless on a specific bike lane, fishing in a park, swim in the rivers in park property, play soccer or lash a sliotar back and forth.

How many of those laws do you see broken every day in each of the city parks?

Source: http://www.corkcity.ie/services/recreationsport/cemeteries/Parks%20Open%20Spaces%20and%20Cemeteries%20Bye%20Laws%202011.pdf