Wheels for TT bike

Amprodude

Hi all,

I recently purchased a second hand TT bike and I'm happy with what the bike came with but it came with basic heavy crap wheels that aren't TT wheels. The guy that sold it to me put the original wheels on it and they are the type of wheels you would put on a winter bike. Savage heavy wheels. I got set up with a pro bike fit and bought a TT helmet and skin suit and shoe covers and I'm going pretty well in all the TTs I have done with it so far. At the moment I'm using my racing wheels but this is short term.

Anyway to the point I am now in the market for a good set of TT wheels. I was looking at the zipps 808 but I don't know how good these wheels are. Have a bit of cash at present so I would like a decent set in the price range of the 808s. If anyone could recommend a good set of TT wheels please let me know. I was thinking of purchasing a rear disk wheel as wheel while I'm at it.


Suggestions, advice, practicality all appreciated.

Lusk_Doyle

FFWD full disc for the rear and 90 for the front. Tubs.

nilhg

Have a look at these, a lot of published aero work gone into them.

http://www.swissside.com/shop/category/hadron-collection/

I have a set of the non aero Gotthards and am very happy with them.

mossym

much cheaper and faster option. get a kysrium rear. get a disc cover from here:
http://www.wheelbuilder.com/aero-disc-covers.html

picked one up a few weeks back. got it's first outing in anger on saturday



now i had a set of deep rims already so the front wheel was sorted. i got the cover for my kysrium so that i can install the cover, and if they say no discs on race day i still have the deep rim available without having to worry about taking the cassette off


the other option i'd look at is flo wheels get a 60 front 90 rear and get a cover. or go all in and get a solid disc.

mossym

meant to add, the other advantage of the cover is you can use the wheels on other bikes in non disc mode

dermabrasion

Anyone tried Planet X 80-101? Looks like decent option under €800

Lumen

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

Tubs.

Why tubs? Are they faster/lighter than fast clinchers with latex tubes?

I'd concur with disc or disc cover for the rear. Good for all conditions except hillclimbs.

For the front whatever you're having yourself. Maybe a used 404 or trispoke. Trispokes are legendarily wonky and can be a bit of a handful in the wind. I've used a 50mm front in very windy conditions and it was exciting rather than dangerous, but I'm not sure I'd want to go deeper.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/HED-3C-Carbon-Trispoke-Tubular-Rear-Wheel-Shimano-Sram-9-10-11-speed-disc-/151704406928?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2352498b90

I'm a crap TTer, FWIW.

RJM85

I bought a Flo disc and 90 front last year. Great wheels and great value.

Lusk_Doyle

Lumen wrote: »

Why tubs? Are they faster/lighter than fast clinchers with latex tubes?

Well you can get the pressure up nice and high in tubs. I get mine up to 140 minimum. I understand that the higher pressure makes achieving higher speed easier than with clinchers. Other than that I think that tubs are where it's at for TT bikes if the masses are to be listened to. Don't the pro riders now use tubs on their road bikes also?

mossym

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

Well you can get the pressure up nice and high in tubs. I get mine up to 140 minimum. I understand that the higher pressure makes achieving higher speed easier than with clinchers. Other than that I think that tubs are where it's at for TT bikes if the masses are to be listened to. Don't the pro riders now use tubs on their road bikes also?

tony martin rides a clincher disc. he seems to do okay for speed.

Lusk_Doyle

mossym wrote: »

tony martin rides a clincher disc. he seems to do okay for speed.

Imagime what he could do with tubs...Wiggos record and wc stripes would be but footnotes on the pages of cycling history.

mossym

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

Imagime what he could do with tubs...Wiggos record and wc stripes would be but footnotes on the pages of cycling history.

or looking it another way, guy on clincher regularly beats rest of field on tubs who bought into the hype.:D


tubs are probably faster. i can imagine using them for road racing. for tt though i think the gluing is more of a hassle than a benefit.

plus, any article i've read says the pro's aren't using anything close to 140 in their tyres, more 105 to 110 which is clincher territory too

for TT, the wheel choice is going to be more important than the tyre.

Chips Lovell

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/07/tour-de-france/exclusive-review-tony-martins-new-specialized-turbo-cotton-clinchers_338196

Think I'll stick with tubs.

RJM85

Optimal tyre pressure isn't a case of the higher the better. After a certain point, high pressure has a negative impact by way of increasing rolling resistance. It depends on the weight of the rider, the surface etc but for your avg cyclist 100-120 psi is better than 140

Lumen

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/07/tour-de-france/exclusive-review-tony-martins-new-specialized-turbo-cotton-clinchers_338196

Think I'll stick with tubs.

Did you mean to link to this?

http://velonews.competitor.com/2012/12/analysis/velo-tech-blunder-of-the-year-specialized-prototype-clinchers-cursed-product-launch-of-the-year-trek-domane_268183

The pros can presumably afford to glue a fresh tub on for each race.

One of the things which has put me off tubs is that when they pick up any damage you have to decide whether to continue running them and risk punctures or glue on a new one. With clinchers you can just throw the slightly cut up tyre on a commuter or training bike and get full use of it until it's worn out.

How do you manage this in practice?

Lusk_Doyle

mossym wrote: »

i can imagine using them for road racing. for tt though i think the gluing is more of a hassle than a benefit.

I don't understand your logic here.

Chips Lovell

Wheel covers aren't UCI legal. They'd probably be fine in club races but you could run into difficulties at open races, in particular the Nationals.

Lumen wrote: »

One of the things which has put me off tubs is that when they pick up any damage you have to decide whether to continue running them and risk punctures or glue on a new one. With clinchers you can just throw the slightly cut up tyre on a commuter or training bike and get full use of it until it's worn out.

How do you manage this in practice?

That wouldn't be a priority for me.

tommy_tucker

Jep Gambardella wrote: »

Wheel covers aren't UCI legal. They'd probably be fine in club races but you could run into difficulties at open races, in particular the Nationals.

I'd say national might be the only place where you would run into difficulties, i've used wheel covers at 3 different stage races now, unless there's a lad specifically there to stop people using them i'd say your grand. There hard to tell apart from a disc at a distance.

AstraMonti

Lumen wrote: »

How do you manage this in practice?

I punctured a tub on August last year. I am still riding it today with no issues. Once the latex liquid settles in the hole, it's good as new. You need to be fairly unlucky to damage the tyre at exactly the same spot.

shellda1

Im in the market for a TT wheelset myself. Are Zipps still considered the gold standard or have the rest caught up? EG FFWD, FLO etc

Lumen

AstraMonti wrote: »

I punctured a tub on August last year. I am still riding it today with no issues. Once the latex liquid settles in the hole, it's good as new. You need to be fairly unlucky to damage the tyre at exactly the same spot.

Does that gunk not ruin the rolling resistance?

AstraMonti

In theory yes, in practice I 've no idea what percentage that would be. Essentially you are adding more weight (a few mls) on a specific part of the tyre with whatever effect that has. In my experience I couldn't tell the difference before and after and I am quite picky at how my tyres feel.

mossym

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

I don't understand your logic here.

two sentences weren't directly related. one of the advantages of tubs is that you can keep riding on a flat(for a while at least). i can see the benefit of this for road racing, but in a tt your day is done if you drop from optimal speed, so i don't see the advantage

re the gluing. if using the wheels week in and out the effort gluing gets mroe bang for the buck than a rare clincher. that's more personal opinion than based on anything factual

i can see the arguements behind tubs, it just doesn't do enough to convince me they are worth the hassle over clinchers for TT, or my main use for tri.

Alek

Lumen wrote: »

Does that gunk not ruin the rolling resistance?

http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/specials/road-bike-tubeless-sealant

Lusk_Doyle

mossym wrote: »

two sentences weren't directly related. one of the advantages of tubs is that you can keep riding on a flat(for a while at least). i can see the benefit of this for road racing, but in a tt your day is done if you drop from optimal speed, so i don't see the advantage

re the gluing. if using the wheels week in and out the effort gluing gets mroe bang for the buck than a rare clincher. that's more personal opinion than based on anything factual

i can see the arguements behind tubs, it just doesn't do enough to convince me they are worth the hassle over clinchers for TT, or my main use for tri.

Ah right. I get my LBS to glue my tubs ao the effort is minimal on my part!

lennymc

So i think i am in the market for a set of TT wheels myself. I have been looking at the various options:
Disk and trispoke wheel. Pros - fastest (in theory), whomp whomp sound. Cons, expensive, no power meter
Disk and deep wheel. Pros - fast, whomp whomp sound, Cons, less expensive, no power meter
Disk cover on current 50 mm wheels, Pros - fastish, bit of a whomp sound but not like the disk, a lot less expensive than disks, maybe I could get a power meter aswell. Cons, no power meter (maybe)
Disk cover on powertap rear with deep front, Pros, power, improved aero, cost, Cons, no whomp whomp sound.

The TT bike is BB30 as is the BMC, so I could get a crank pm and swap between the two........

I want a fast wheelset, that makes the noise (cos that's worth about 5kph on it's own!) and some form of power meter. I have no idea what my budget is. I would also need something that I could use on the track bike if going for a disc wheel.

Raltec do a nice looking disc cover, gets good reviews, is lenticular carbon fibre rather than just flat plastic, so if I do go for a disc cover I think I will go for that on a mavic open pro with powertap
Flo wheels have a sale coming up next month, disc wheel and 90mm front (clinchers) could be an option, then find a power meter somewhere.
Second hand discs seem to come up from time to time, one of those and my existing front (50mm) plus a power meter would be nice.
Chinese disc & tri spoke wheels are available from ebay, and i am (and know of several people) using carbonzone wheels with no problems and a power meter.

thoughts?

Lusk_Doyle

A power meter Lenny? You need to spend more time with your darling daughter!

lennymc

Darling daughter goes in my backpack - added resistance training. When she gets her own bike I'll teach her how to lead me out.

RJM85

Flo wheels make a very satisfying whirring noise. Go with them.

joey100

RJM, how much did you pay bringing the FLO wheels into the country? Looking at the disc but just wondering bout customs fees.

RJM85

joey100 wrote: »

RJM, how much did you pay bringing the FLO wheels into the country? Looking at the disc but just wondering bout customs fees.

Roughly €1.1k in total for 90 front and a disc including customs agent fees, customs, etc.

lennymc

due to the poor exchange rate, a set of flo wheels at $1100, with a shipping cost of $100 dollars would be just under €1400 landed according to dutycalculator.com

lennymc

ended up getting a raltech wheel cover from Frank Grimes - he had a nearly new one he was selling. Picked it up Friday night, raced with it yesterday and knocked over a minute of my previous PB. There was a lot more wind than when I set my previous PB, so I would hope that I can knock some more time from that at the next one.

Amprodude

What about zipp 800? Are they worth it?

Beasty

Amprodude wrote: »

What about zipp 800? Are they worth it?

Presumably you mean 808?

As a front wheel they are excellent, particularly in the wind. A disc will always win out for the back in TTs though

Amprodude

Beasty wrote: »

Presumably you mean 808?

As a front wheel they are excellent, particularly in the wind. A disc will always win out for the back in TTs though

Yeah sorry typo error.

Amprodude

Beasty wrote: »

Presumably you mean 808?

As a front wheel they are excellent, particularly in the wind. A disc will always win out for the back in TTs though

Correct me if I'm wrong here but I thought the 808 front wheel were an extreme deep section wheel and that they are hard to ride in wind?

lennymc

it was windy last weekend at the TT I did, and at least one person on tri spokes pulled out due to the wind on his front wheel. I did have a couple of moments where I changed line due to the wind with a 50mm front, but other lads were out on 808's, and were fine. I guess it depends a lot on your ability to control the TT bike

Amprodude

lennymc wrote: »

it was windy last weekend at the TT I did, and at least one person on tri spokes pulled out due to the wind on his front wheel. I did have a couple of moments where I changed line due to the wind with a 50mm front, but other lads were out on 808's, and were fine. I guess it depends a lot on your ability to control the TT bike

How would a zipp 404 perform on a TT bike as a front wheel?

Beasty

Amprodude wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong here but I thought the 808 front wheel were an extreme deep section wheel and that they are hard to ride in wind?

They are generally, but the 808 handles more like a 4 cm deep rim than an 8cm one. I used one (with disc on the front) in an IVCA 25m TT a few years ago and was only about a minute outside my PB in winds of around 45 km/h (I do have plenty of ballast to secure me to the bike and the bike to the road - some of the guys actually abandoned that day due to the wind and they didn't even have deep section wheels on). Some wheels handle a lot better in the wind and this is one of them

Beasty

Amprodude wrote: »

How would a zipp 404 perform on a TT bike as a front wheel?

A 404 should be fine. lenny mentioned tri-spokes which are much more difficult to handle in strong winds, with 5 spokes even more difficult (as both are deep section but with a lot more "coverage" within the broad spokes to catch the wind