Vaping Rights Organization Ireland

Vaper111

Irish vapers,

If we in Ireland want to defend our rights as vapers, we are in need of a consumer led organization.

I'm sure you have heard the news that the Welsh government want to ban vaping in enclosed public spaces. There is a lot of opposition to this in Wales so it's not certain if it will go ahead because many UK health charities and organizations have voiced their opinions against the proposed law, and as well as that the Welsh public don't seem to want it.

I'm pretty sure the Irish government will try and ban vaping in public places soon. There already has been a bill put forward by Avril Power and John Crown that proposes to do so.

In Ireland it seems like no one wants to stand up for the people who have quit smoking through vaping.The Irish Cancer Society are opposed to vaping (they receive funding from pharmaceutical companies ). ASH Ireland are against it even though their counterparts in the UK are pro vaping. The public in Ireland are being led to believe that vaping is just as harmful as smoking.

We have no chance in Ireland unless we try and get some vaping rights organization together and try and inform as many people as possible about the benefits of vaping.

I'm sure almost everyone in the country knows of a hard core smoker that has given up smoking through vaping. This is the one thing we have going for us. Maybe we could organize a website of testimonials of Irish people who have quit through vaping.

The anti smoking lobby are going to go after us very soon. We need to organise ourselves in preparation.

Does anyone else agree? I'm based in Dublin and happy to organise some meetings there.

It might already be too late, but if we do something now we might have some chance.

Thanks

Vaper 111

Didihno

Indeed.
I think the vendors are part of an organisation but I don't think there is anything for us to voice our concerns is there?

Vaper111

A small number of vendors are part of the Irish Vaping Vendors Association (IVVA).

There is nothing for us. The IVVA will be seen as biased since they are profiting from vaping.

There needs to be a user group, formal or informal.

Didihno

Have you spoken to anyone from any other countries yet?
UK and US have several grass roots organisations.

I am onboard and will attend any meeting I can.
You are dead right, its about time Irish vapers banded together before we are bent over the table.

Didihno

Oh, one other thing, who are you and whats your background?
You only signed up on this forum so I think people will naturally be distrustful of such a new account.

Vaper111

I've e-mailed Clive Bates who recommended getting political and getting on here and trying to get people together. I've considered e-mailing the New Nicotine Alliance (UK) and seeing if they could extend to Ireland.

Paarthurnax

Didihno wrote: »

its about time Irish vapers banded together before we are bent over the table, and vaped

But seriously I agree with you!

Vaper111

Didihno wrote: »

Oh, one other thing, who are you and whats your background?
You only signed up on this forum so I think people will naturally be distrustful of such a new account.

My name is Mark. I quit smoking 5 months ago through vaping. I have been shocked by the level of opposition to vaping in Ireland. I don't sell anything or profit from vaping in any way (besides health). Since I started vaping I have been following the news about it a lot and there are a lot of blogs I read regularly. I hate to see politicians and vested interests trying to discourage smokers from trying electronic cigarettes.

Shinobollo

Vaper111 wrote: »

My name is Mark. I quit smoking 5 months ago through vaping. I have been shocked by the level of opposition to vaping in Ireland. I don't sell anything or profit from vaping in any way (besides health). Since I started vaping I have been following the news about it a lot and there are a lot of blogs I read regularly. I hate to see politicians and vested interests trying to discourage smokers from trying electronic cigarettes.

Hi Mark,
Count me in as well please. There are a few groups on facebook, Irish Vaping and Vape and Banter Ireland are two off the top of my head. Lots of dedicated vapers there so it'd be a good place to drum up support.
Dec

Didihno

Thank you Mark and welcome.

I've been mulling an idea for a while now, to hold a vapemeet in a Dublin City Centre Vape shop.
I think if that could be done, and advertised through these boards and facebook, then we could get a lot of like minded people into a room together. Might be useful to get a few names on a sheet of paper type thing.
We could even leave a petition in all the nationwide vapeshops to garner support, obviously we'd need a topic or agenda for such a petition.

Vaper111

Didihno wrote: »

Thank you Mark and welcome.

I've been mulling an idea for a while now, to hold a vapemeet in a Dublin City Centre Vape shop.
I think if that could be done, and advertised through these boards and facebook, then we could get a lot of like minded people into a room together. Might be useful to get a few names on a sheet of paper type thing.
We could even leave a petition in all the nationwide vapeshops to garner support, obviously we'd need a topic or agenda for such a petition.

Thanks. I think a vapemeet is a good idea. It is encouraging to see the opposition to the proposed ban in Wales from such high profile groups. I fear that when they go to ban indoor vaping in Ireland there won't be much opposition and they will easily get it through.

A starting point for a petition would be the indoor ban and some of the other ludicrous measures such as plain packaging that have already been proposed in a bill by Senators John Crown and Avril Power. This bill was proposed in January and there has been no word on it since. I'm not usually a political kind of person myself and I confess that I don't know the process involved in getting a proposed bill into law.

It's only a matter of time before an indoor vaping ban is attempted in Ireland. I think it would be better if we can prepare to oppose it in advance.

The way I see things happening if allowed:
-Indoor vaping ban.
-Government and others will attempt to create the impression that vaping is as harmful as smoking
-Government will heavily tax e liquid and probably hardware, removing the financial incentive for smokers to switch to vaping.

Call me pessimistic but that's what the future looks like to me, especially in this nanny state.

Didihno

Vaper111 wrote: »

The way I see things happening if allowed:
-Indoor vaping ban.
-Government and others will attempt to create the impression that vaping is as harmful as smoking
-Government will heavily tax e liquid and probably hardware, removing the financial incentive for smokers to switch to vaping.

No, thats exactly whats going to happen.
And heres why (in my head anyway):

Indoor ban to appease the anti smoking lobby, thats a no brainer.
Like it or not, a lot of people see people blowing vapour in pubs and restaurants as a nuisance at best (because well, it is), and as indoor smoking at worst (based on public ignorance and propaganda).

Tax on eliquid up to cigarette levels. This is also a no brainer. Govts all over the world are in shock, smoking taxes are plummetting and that has always been handy money for them. Also factor in the amount of people not buying pharma products to quit and it all adds up to 'sin' taxes being inevitable.
They want their money and they will do anything to get it. The get out from our point of view is zero nic eliquids, which cannot be taxed the same. The sin tax is on tobacco and alcohol products. Nicotine is seen as a tobacco derivative as far as I know, I don't know if the stuff we buy is synthesized or not.

Taxes on vaping equipment: This I don't think will happen, or can happen.
Equipment is just that, inert. Like a Tobacco pipe, or a cigarette rolling device, its an inert thing and they can only put the normal taxes on it, or they have to open a can of worms.
A battery is a battery and an atomiser is a piece of tech. They can have their VAT and thats it.

Shinobollo

Vaper111 wrote: »

Thanks. I think a vapemeet is a good idea. It is encouraging to see the opposition to the proposed ban in Wales from such high profile groups. I fear that when they go to ban indoor vaping in Ireland there won't be much opposition and they will easily get it through.

A starting point for a petition would be the indoor ban and some of the other ludicrous measures such as plain packaging that have already been proposed in a bill by Senators John Crown and Avril Power. This bill was proposed in January and there has been no word on it since. I'm not usually a political kind of person myself and I confess that I don't know the process involved in getting a proposed bill into law.

It's only a matter of time before an indoor vaping ban is attempted in Ireland. I think it would be better if we can prepare to oppose it in advance.

The way I see things happening if allowed:
-Indoor vaping ban.
-Government and others will attempt to create the impression that vaping is as harmful as smoking
-Government will heavily tax e liquid and probably hardware, removing the financial incentive for smokers to switch to vaping.

Call me pessimistic but that's what the future looks like to me, especially in this nanny state.

If we are told that we have to Vape outside with smokers, how long will it be before some of us get cancer from second hand smoke inhalation ???
One would think that this is a lawsuit that's just waiting to happen

ChaosIsOrder

I think we should totally make an organisation to explain the health benefis etc of vaping! I cant source my info on this stupid phone, but a number of studies have been done that shows nicotine being beneficial to sufferers of depression and some other mental health problems. Im pretty sure all vapers know that nicotine is one of the leaat bad things in cigarettes/tobacco...but do non-smokers/normal smokers know this?
Just simple things like getting that info out there could be hugely beneficial to us!

jamesbondings

Shinobollo wrote: »

If we are told that we have to Vape outside with smokers, how long will it be before some of us get cancer from second hand smoke inhalation ???
One would think that this is a lawsuit that's just waiting to happen

I was back home last week for a few days and not one place allowed me to vape indoors, i was lumped with the smokers.....inevitably i ended up having one or two....i think one major issue should be businesses being more vocal about weather or not one could vape in their establishment. I am sick of having to explain nearly to a tee what it is everytime i go into a new place and ask permission to use it.

Whereas in Spain, just vape away. Even buses, (most of them not all) allow you to vape. Why are we so backward. One thing i have considered is seeing as no one is going to fund decent research and tests on vaping, perhaps vendors should be donating a small percentage of profits (if this includes a small percentage increase on products then im happy) to the greater good and fund it themselves or ourselves.

Someone does have to do it before the government rapes us all and gets us all back on the fags....

JH_raheny

I haven't had any problems vaping indoors except from Dublin airport, the owner of one of my local pubs even told a guy that he could go somewhere else if he didn't like it ( some contrary old grumpy guy )

Didihno

Yeah so far I've only had issues on a couple of pubs, though I always ask when I go into a new establishment, its just manners. I also don't blow huge clouds into the air or into peoples faces, but down under the table or such. Again, manners. I also don't vape in enclosed spaces like buses or trains or in any restaurant.

There is no point drawing unwelcome attention from non smokers or disgruntled cigarette smokers.

tommy2bad

This is a great idea, one I mooted myself a few years ago, so tired of forest representing us every time vaping is in the news.
pm me or Twitter, I'm not as active here as I used to be. Which is a sign of age more than lack of interest.

Tom Gleeson.