Why are they using the word fiber?

euser1984

It's just high speed copper.....available up to 2km from the exchange.

Is it just that the exchange is connected to an upper tier by fibre now? What was in place before?

swoofer

where have you been? can you explain a bit more? and what is high speed copper?

have look here

https://twitter.com/eircomwholesale

ForstalDave

euser1984 wrote: »

It's just high speed copper.....available up to 2km from the exchange.

Is it just that the exchange is connected to an upper tier by fibre now? What was in place before?

Depends on who you are referring to, ESB(Sros) is going to be fiber to the home, Eircom upgraded there cabinets to fiber where as before it was cooper and they are planing to roll out fiber to the home also i believe

euser1984

I just found out yesterday after talking to a guy working in the field.

Basically if you ring eircom and ask for a fiber package; you get your 80Mb or whatever, it still comes from the exchange via copper; I'm not sure what the technology is...

It makes sense - I didn't see eircom connecting fiber right into the home from the manhole on the footpaths....it seems to me it's just a marketing buzzword....it's being used because fiber is associated with "high speed".....

I'm not sure if the word broadband really means much from a technical pov either? I think I remember discussing this with someone years ago.

ForstalDave

euser1984 wrote: »

I just found out yesterday after talking to a guy working in the field.

Basically if you ring eircom and ask for a fiber package; you get your 80Mb or whatever, it still comes from the exchange via copper; I'm not sure what the technology is...

It makes sense - I didn't see eircom connecting fiber right into the home from the manhole on the footpaths....it seems to me it's just a marketing buzzword....it's being used because fiber is associated with "high speed".....

I'm not sure if the word broadband really means much from a technical pov either? I think I remember discussing this with someone years ago.

Broadband and fiber are different, Fiber to the home is being coming though look up soros that will be all the way into your house fiber,

ED E

Its VDSL2. Its FTTC (mostly) not exchange launched. Usually its running less than 1000m on copper.

Its called eFibre/Fibre Powered because joe soap doesnt understand what VDSL is, thats marketing for you.

New FTTH is direct FTTP/FTTB and is starting in 19 towns(+10 ESB towns).

Nollog

They call it fibre so the word loses meaning and turns into a buzzword.
It's marketing.

And now they're going to have to call real fibre fibre to the home, or light or some nonsense.

At least UPC called it "fibre-powered", which is the more accurate term, being that the fibre is in the cabinet and the exchange, which feeds your copper direct to your home.

euser1984

Are they talking about fiber to the home to extend beyond 2km? (I was told 2km by an eircom engineer)

At the moment, my understanding and this is based on above posts; is that they are going to install a glass cable (presumably eircom or subcontractor - kn networks here) from the manhole right into your socket?

I don't see the point in this....it seems to me that the speeds capable with this infrastructure are just beyond crazy.

I can only think of it being useful for skype video calls, HD & 4k....
Take for example netflix and streaming of 4k (it's gonna need around 16Mb/s; @ 80Mb that is 5 simultaneous 4k streams).
Copper is capable of 80Mb; well, it's actually 100Mb but the eircom guy was saying you can't max out the line because of signal to noise......so, it seems to me that by the sounds of things, if you have good up to date infrastructure you would get away with 90Mb.

In my location I think I could test 90Mb for reliability seeing as everything was well above par when the line was tested with his handheld testing device.....anyone know what these devices are called?

Back to streaming; and thinking about the future.....If you have copper @ 80Mb you will be able to watch 2.5 movies @ 8K.

It's got the term "dark fiber" in my head that was installed in the late nineties/ early 2000's...although perhaps a more apt name would be dimly lit fiber.

Maybe they are thinking like the IP V6 folk.... in that there making sure enough unique addresses are available for every grain of sand in the world....I think telecommuncations here are going overboard with future predictions.....why would anybody at home need such throughput? IPV6 has to be done right because it's such a huge job to switch over, am I correct in saying that? Perhaps, it's not the case seeing as IT equipment is updated so frequently.

Fiber just involves installing a few cables by an "engineer" or to use the proper non-marketing term "technicians". Makes me feel bad about proper engineers.....imagine if they started calling nurses doctors? It's the same thing, no? Of course, I am aware that eircom has proper engineers working for them and if not, they must be outsourcing.

Here's a story that surprises people. I worked in an office with 90 people & 63 stores....all data was was being sent back and forth to HO and stores. The email server was hosted in HO and each store had a few email addresses....90 people in HO....have a guess what speed they had (it was on a metropolitan network (all "proper" fiber I presume). It was a large erp system and thousands of emails were going back and forth including spam which accounted for two thirds....(filtered by a mail firewall). How many stores does Tesco have? That bandwidth included the marketing departments email which would have lots of graphics attachments....


Even if we get our underpants connected to the internet so we can get status updates on whether we need to change them or not; the bandwidth required for such a thing will be sweet f all. If you connected loads of stuff in your house to the internet it would still use v. little bandwidth.

euser1984

ForstalDave wrote: »

Broadband and fiber are different, Fiber to the home is being coming though look up soros that will be all the way into your house fiber,

I was just referring to broadband as a marketing buzzword as well as fiber...not comparing them technically.

Although they could just as easily have used the term "ultra broadband" or similar if they wanted....

ForstalDave

Yes fiber to the home will be right up to your door, ESB are going via power cable and there start up speed is 1GB this is being sold to companies who will sell it on, It launches in 10 town this year and will roll out to more next year. And yes at this point the speed is not really needed for home users but it does future proof the industry to a large extent, Also many of the places where this will be have piss poor internet option so they stand to really take over.

euser1984

ForstalDave wrote: »

Yes fiber to the home will be right up to your door, ESB are going via power cable and there start up speed is 1GB this is being sold to companies who will sell it on, It launches in 10 town this year and will roll out to more next year. And yes at this point the speed is not really needed for home users but it does future proof the industry to a large extent, Also many of the places where this will be have piss poor internet option so they stand to really take over.

That isn't fiber to the door then, still copper Same as eircom.

ForstalDave

euser1984 wrote: »

That isn't fiber to the door then, still copper Same as eircom.

Nope its fiber heavy duty power cable is surrounded by fiber and this is what the network will be run on, they will just run it to the door for the last part

swoofer

Do you mean SIRO for the ESB/Vodafone venture? I am still confused with the OP. Its fibre to the local cabinet then as the phrase goes, the last mile is still copper. The next step up was fibre/fiber to the home ie a dedicated fibre line to the house, eircom have had to rush it out as the ESB/Vodafone venture was a wake up call. But eircom were on the ball as they ran 24 lots of fibre to the local cabinet to meet the FTTH requirements, IE FUTURE PROOFED.

Not everyone gets 80mb or better at present and anyone who started with dial up and then the next bit etc will be quite happy to have 150mb or better, depending on the price.

And I am not to bothered what the call it as long as I can get it, afford it and its fast.

ps you can still retain the copper line if you want to for your phone as long as you pay the rental

ForstalDave

swoofer wrote: »

Do you mean SIRO for the ESB/Vodafone venture? I am still confused with the OP. Its fibre to the local cabinet then as the phrase goes, the last mile is still copper. The next step up was fibre/fiber to the home ie a dedicated fibre line to the house, eircom have had to rush it out as the ESB/Vodafone venture was a wake up call. But eircom were on the ball as they ran 24 lots of fibre to the local cabinet to meet the FTTH requirements, IE FUTURE PROOFED.

Not everyone gets 80mb or better at present and anyone who started with dial up and then the next bit etc will be quite happy to have 150mb or better, depending on the price.

And I am not to bothered what the call it as long as I can get it, afford it and its fast.

ps you can still retain the copper line if you want to for your phone as long as you pay the rental

Yes SIRO as far as i have read it is full fibre upto the house no copper involved which is what allows them to get 1GB

euser1984

swoofer wrote: »

And I am not to bothered what the call it as long as I can get it, afford it and its fast.
/QUOTE]

What do you want it for? It won't load any webpages quicker...

Joe prim

The salesman told me that high-fibre broadband would prevent constipation when downloading?

MBSnr

euser1984 wrote: »

Here's a story that surprises people. I worked in an office with 90 people & 63 stores....all data was was being sent back and forth to HO and stores. The email server was hosted in HO and each store had a few email addresses....90 people in HO....have a guess what speed they had (it was on a metropolitan network (all "proper" fiber I presume). It was a large erp system and thousands of emails were going back and forth including spam which accounted for two thirds....(filtered by a mail firewall). How many stores does Tesco have? That bandwidth included the marketing departments email which would have lots of graphics attachments....


.

You do realise that it could have been running at only 100Mb or probably much less (10Mb) between the stores - even though it was fibre? We have fibre at work over the MAN (via eNet). It's capable of running at Gb speeds but we only run 100Mb, as of course you'd have to pay more for a faster service.

Nollog

Sure don't ATM's still use ISDN? That's 64 or 128k right?

euser1984

MBSnr wrote: »

You do realise that it could have been running at only 100Mb or probably much less (10Mb) between the stores - even though it was fibre? We have fibre at work over the MAN (via eNet). It's capable of running at Gb speeds but we only run 100Mb, as of course you'd have to pay more for a faster service.

HO connection to magnet was 10Mb - never any problems....internet open policy. Standard broadband services in the stores (nothing special at all)

All the data was even migrated to a new HO computer room in 2 days...

chris_ie

euser1984 wrote: »

I don't see the point in this....it seems to me that the speeds capable with this infrastructure are just beyond crazy.

What seems crazy now wont seem crazy in the future. Pretty sure in the beginning of broadband people didn't think we'd be looking for speeds of up to 100MB or whatever. Netflix and the likes may not have been forseen. Its a waste if they just upgrade to what's required now and don't think about the future.

euser1984

I am talking about the future chris - far into the future.....these speeds aren't even required for many medium sized organizations at the moment.

I'm just saying that's its f'ckin stupid and the reason is because it is.

The Cush

euser1984 wrote: »

At the moment, my understanding and this is based on above posts; is that they are going to install a glass cable (presumably eircom or subcontractor - kn networks here) from the manhole right into your socket?

Concise explanation here from ED E

ED E wrote: »

The same fibre runs from splitter (at cab or manhole) all the way into the interior wall behind your ETU, wherever that happens to be. They drill a hole and shove in 3-4ft of fibre and fit that into an internal optical faceplate. The ONT is mounted beside this. They fit it there, it stays there. After that they don't care. You ISP gives you a modem and an ethernet cable to link to the ONT, if you want your network gear in the attic, run ethernet from the ONT to the attic, stick a router and switch there, done.

Important bit is dont go messing with the optical side of the setup, run your own CAT5e/6 from the demarcation point onwards.

bonzer1again

Some ESB promo videos here explaining what they are planning....hope it helps.

http://www.esb.ie/main/press/pr-4074.jsp