fiance and marriage visas

pickingpennies

hello all! hopefully this thread is allowed, really looking for some advice or helpful hints from people who have been through this before. my fiance is irish and i am an american citizen. we've been looking through all the requirements for the fiance and marriage visas and it's a bit overwhelming. he's never had an american visa before, he's been coming over to visit me for three months at a time on the esta so this is our first time dealing with all this paperwork. first - he has to be here on the fiance visa for us to get married, correct? is it okay to have the wedding towards the end of that 90 day period, or would it be better to have it at the beginning? we're planning on getting married in the spring but i'm scared to set a date for invitations and reserving a venue etc for the wedding in case of visa hold ups. how long does the process usually take? is there anything else we should be aware of?

any insight from someone who has done this before would be super helpful, thanks in advance!

fear88

How many times has your fiancée stayed in the us for 3 months on the ESTA? and does he have any trouble getting back into america?

pickingpennies

fear88 wrote: »

How many times has your fiancée stayed in the us for 3 months on the ESTA? and does he have any trouble getting back into america?

twice, hoping to come back for the third time soon. last time he came he said they pulled him aside and asked where he was going and why instead of just asking at the desk, then he said the guy asked him if we were getting married. he said no since we weren't engaged yet but i did think that was a little strange. no troubles other than that!

fear88

I see. I just came back from a 90 day visit to my girlfriend in the US and planning on heading back there next week on esta. I'm expecting some hassle at the border. What kind of things did they ask him when they pulled him aside? I'm kind of worried about it.

A fiancée visa is something I'm looking into though, and I' sure as long as you get married within the 90 day period you're fine, just don't go over that. Also, would you not talk to an immigration lawyer about the whole visa thing and your fiancée becoming a us citizen.

ArseBurger

Does he earn money while visiting you in the US? Even from work or income from outside of the US?

If so, he may become liable to pay tax in the US as he could be considered resident for tax purposes. (completely different from domicile and ordinary residence btw)

Ref: http://www.irs.gov/Individuals/International-Taxpayers/Substantial-Presence-Test

iusedtoknow

fear88 wrote: »

I see. I just came back from a 90 day visit to my girlfriend in the US and planning on heading back there next week on esta. I'm expecting some hassle at the border. What kind of things did they ask him when they pulled him aside? I'm kind of worried about it.

A fiancée visa is something I'm looking into though, and I' sure as long as you get married within the 90 day period you're fine, just don't go over that. Also, would you not talk to an immigration lawyer about the whole visa thing and your fiancée becoming a us citizen.

you need to be careful doing this. The rule of thumb with US immigration is to stay out of the country for as long as you were in the country - if you're just back from 3 months and want to re-enter, it flags you in the offiicial's eyes that you are doing something illegal like working etc......

fear88

iusedtoknow wrote: »

you need to be careful doing this. The rule of thumb with US immigration is to stay out of the country for as long as you were in the country - if you're just back from 3 months and want to re-enter, it flags you in the offiicial's eyes that you are doing something illegal like working etc......

So, do you think I wont be allowed back in ? I'm really worried about this and was wondering what I should say to the border security. I'm staying with my girlfriend and doing some travelling, not working over there.

silja

It is possible you won't be allowed back in yes, but no-one can tell you for sure. If you are going to try for it, make sure you bring proof of funds (bank statement etc), and proof of ties to home/ reasons you will return, such as a job to come home to, university enrollment, small kids.
You may want to look into other options- your partner coming to Ireland, meeting in Canada or Mexico, or simply waiting a bit longer. It's not just the travelling so much, it is also that you have spent a long time over there, and US immigration is not used to people getting so much time off work/ being able to afford such long holidays without working under the table.

Op: you CAN get married in the USA on the Visa Waiver program, but you cannot get married AND STAY that way- this would be visa fraud. So essentially, you have three options:
1. Petition for the K1 fiance visa, move over when done, get married within 90 days. Positives: quickest way of doing things (but if you want a spring 2016 wedding, you'll need to file very soon!). Negatives: more expensive than a spousal visa, cannot work or travel once you arrive in the USA for 3+ months, because you need to do more paperwork after the wedding.
2. Go over on holiday, get married, come back to Ireland, file for CR-1 spousal visa. Positives: cheaper, you can work and travel right away when you enter on the visa, as you will have a greencard right away. Negative: Slow- you are currently looking at 1+ year.
3. Get married somewhere else... here in Ireland for example, if you have elderly relatives that would like to be there, or a destination wedding. Then do as 2.

pickingpennies

fear88 wrote: »

I see. I just came back from a 90 day visit to my girlfriend in the US and planning on heading back there next week on esta. I'm expecting some hassle at the border. What kind of things did they ask him when they pulled him aside? I'm kind of worried about it.

A fiancée visa is something I'm looking into though, and I' sure as long as you get married within the 90 day period you're fine, just don't go over that. Also, would you not talk to an immigration lawyer about the whole visa thing and your fiancée becoming a us citizen.

all they asked him when they pulled him aside were the normal questions (where are you going, how long) and he said he was coming to visit me and gave them the date of his flight back to ireland. i think he said they asked how he had the money for it as well, since he was out of america for less than two months, but that was it. it totally freaked me out when he told me they pulled him aside but they ended up not asking anything out of the ordinary. i would guess that they will probably ask you questions since you haven't been out of the us for long but try not to worry too much! i'm not an expert of course, but i know 3 months of him being gone would feel like a lifetime to me so i don't blame you for coming back so soon!

and yeah that's what i was thinking about the lawyer. all of the paperwork seems a bit overwhelming to try and do on our own!

pickingpennies

ArseBurger wrote: »

Does he earn money while visiting you in the US? Even from work or income from outside of the US?

If so, he may become liable to pay tax in the US as he could be considered resident for tax purposes. (completely different from domicile and ordinary residence btw)

Ref: [

nah, (unfortunately for us financially) he doesn't earn anything at all while he's here. when he's been here for so long at a time it's been tempting to try and find him something working under the table but we really don't want anything to further complicate him coming into the country or getting a visa.

pickingpennies

silja wrote: »

It is possible you won't be allowed back in yes, but no-one can tell you for sure. If you are going to try for it, make sure you bring proof of funds (bank statement etc), and proof of ties to home/ reasons you will return, such as a job to come home to, university enrollment, small kids.
You may want to look into other options- your partner coming to Ireland, meeting in Canada or Mexico, or simply waiting a bit longer. It's not just the travelling so much, it is also that you have spent a long time over there, and US immigration is not used to people getting so much time off work/ being able to afford such long holidays without working under the table.

Op: you CAN get married in the USA on the Visa Waiver program, but you cannot get married AND STAY that way- this would be visa fraud. So essentially, you have three options:
1. Petition for the K1 fiance visa, move over when done, get married within 90 days. Positives: quickest way of doing things (but if you want a spring 2016 wedding, you'll need to file very soon!). Negatives: more expensive than a spousal visa, cannot work or travel once you arrive in the USA for 3+ months, because you need to do more paperwork after the wedding.
2. Go over on holiday, get married, come back to Ireland, file for CR-1 spousal visa. Positives: cheaper, you can work and travel right away when you enter on the visa, as you will have a greencard right away. Negative: Slow- you are currently looking at 1+ year.
3. Get married somewhere else... here in Ireland for example, if you have elderly relatives that would like to be there, or a destination wedding. Then do as 2.

thanks for the info! so basically, with the fiance visa, he would be able to stay but not able to work or do anything until after the wedding. with the cr-1 and not being able to stay, he'd still be able to come over and visit on the esta until the visa goes through?

silja

pickingpennies wrote: »

thanks for the info! so basically, with the fiance visa, he would be able to stay but not able to work or do anything until after the wedding. with the cr-1 and not being able to stay, he'd still be able to come over and visit on the esta until the visa goes through?

He can visit with either visa in process.
With the K1, he can't come over and stay right away- the process takes 6-9 months, then you move over, get married, and file Adjustment of Status paperwork.

él statutorio

Speak to an immigration lawyer. They'll have seen all of this before and will know the best and easiest method for you.

silja

él statutorio wrote: »

Speak to an immigration lawyer. They'll have seen all of this before and will know the best and easiest method for you.

Going to disagree here. Lawyers can be good if you have a complicated case, or are really bad at filling in detailed forms, but lawyers can also advise you wrongly (I have seen this time and again, esp with US immigration), and they will slow your case down as all your paperwork etc needs to go via the lawyer.

Seriously, US immigration via spousal or fiance visa is not that complicated, just a lot of paperwork.

Watch Ryder

silja wrote: »

It is possible you won't be allowed back in yes, but no-one can tell you for sure. If you are going to try for it, make sure you bring proof of funds (bank statement etc), and proof of ties to home/ reasons you will return, such as a job to come home to, university enrollment, small kids.
You may want to look into other options- your partner coming to Ireland, meeting in Canada or Mexico, or simply waiting a bit longer. It's not just the travelling so much, it is also that you have spent a long time over there, and US immigration is not used to people getting so much time off work/ being able to afford such long holidays without working under the table.

Op: you CAN get married in the USA on the Visa Waiver program, but you cannot get married AND STAY that way- this would be visa fraud. So essentially, you have three options:
1. Petition for the K1 fiance visa, move over when done, get married within 90 days. Positives: quickest way of doing things (but if you want a spring 2016 wedding, you'll need to file very soon!). Negatives: more expensive than a spousal visa, cannot work or travel once you arrive in the USA for 3+ months, because you need to do more paperwork after the wedding.
2. Go over on holiday, get married, come back to Ireland, file for CR-1 spousal visa. Positives: cheaper, you can work and travel right away when you enter on the visa, as you will have a greencard right away. Negative: Slow- you are currently looking at 1+ year.
3. Get married somewhere else... here in Ireland for example, if you have elderly relatives that would like to be there, or a destination wedding. Then do as 2.

2. If you enter the country and happen to get married it's a different fish to entering with the intent to marry. You don't have to leave the country to file for a CR1 visa in this case. Can be applied while in-country via AOS (adjustment of status).

dodohert

Watch Ryder wrote: »

2. If you enter the country and happen to get married it's a different fish to entering with the intent to marry. You don't have to leave the country to file for a CR1 visa in this case. Can be applied while in-country via AOS (adjustment of status).

Speaking from my own personal experience... I traveled to USA on ESTA,(to visit my my GF she's US citizen by birth) applied for AOS (before 90 day ESTA expiry) Dec'13 , received work my permit March'14, received my greencard June'14.
It can be done if you get a GOOD immigration lawyer, THIS IS A MUST don't attempt DIY AOS application if you decide to go this route.

Got me a job in June 2014 and living happily here ever since. :D:D

spideog7

dodohert wrote: »

Speaking from my own personal experience... I traveled to USA on ESTA,(to visit my my GF she's US citizen by birth) applied for AOS (before 90 day ESTA expiry) Dec'13 , received work my permit March'14, received my greencard June'14.
It can be done if you get a GOOD immigration lawyer, THIS IS A MUST don't attempt DIY AOS application if you decide to go this route.

Got me a job in June 2014 and living happily here ever since. :D:D

Did you leave out the but about getting married?!

I did Adjustment of Status with no lawyer (albeit not from ESTA), took 3 months to the day from when I mailed the application to when my green card was delivered in the post, there was no issues with any of my documentation and I didn't pay a penny more than the application fee and postage.

dodohert

spideog7 wrote: »

Did you leave out the but about getting married?!

I did Adjustment of Status with no lawyer (albeit not from ESTA), took 3 months to the day from when I mailed the application to when my green card was delivered in the post, there was no issues with any of my documentation and I didn't pay a penny more than the application fee and postage.

Yes of course we got married! -- (smirks at not so stupid question)

We didn't want to take the chance just in case anything went went wrong thankfully nothing did.
More power to you if you DIY'ed and saved a bit of cash :-) but to myself & my wife it wasn't worth taking a risk if anything had gone wrong with application particularly as my wife wasn't my sponsor.

swatki

hey dodoheart where are you located if ny- any recommendations on a lawyer to pm me ? much appreciated
thanks

dodohert

swatki wrote: »

hey dodoheart where are you located if ny- any recommendations on a lawyer to pm me ? much appreciated
thanks

PM sent my friend. Contact me anytime during the day/ evening. EST.

swatki

Thanks Much appreciated!

jdaly1001

dodohert wrote: »

PM sent my friend. Contact me anytime during the day/ evening. EST.

hi! I am in the same boat. Can you pm me the lawyer you used? Much appreciated!

InTheTrees

I went through the process many years ago. I would say that the rules may be a bit obscure and strictly enforced however every employee of the US immigration service that I encountered was friendly, informative and willing to help. It felt like they were people who actually liked their jobs instead of officious bureaucrats.

I hope that helps.

jdaly1001

spideog7 wrote: »

Did you leave out the but about getting married?!

I did Adjustment of Status with no lawyer (albeit not from ESTA), took 3 months to the day from when I mailed the application to when my green card was delivered in the post, there was no issues with any of my documentation and I didn't pay a penny more than the application fee and postage.

Spideog7, do you remember the website that helped you figure out all the forms necessary for AOS? My 3 year visa is up in July and I would love to get this all figured out asap.

Thanks!

Watch Ryder

silja wrote: »

It is possible you won't be allowed back in yes, but no-one can tell you for sure. If you are going to try for it, make sure you bring proof of funds (bank statement etc), and proof of ties to home/ reasons you will return, such as a job to come home to, university enrollment, small kids.
You may want to look into other options- your partner coming to Ireland, meeting in Canada or Mexico, or simply waiting a bit longer. It's not just the travelling so much, it is also that you have spent a long time over there, and US immigration is not used to people getting so much time off work/ being able to afford such long holidays without working under the table.

Op: you CAN get married in the USA on the Visa Waiver program, but you cannot get married AND STAY that way- this would be visa fraud. So essentially, you have three options:
1. Petition for the K1 fiance visa, move over when done, get married within 90 days. Positives: quickest way of doing things (but if you want a spring 2016 wedding, you'll need to file very soon!). Negatives: more expensive than a spousal visa, cannot work or travel once you arrive in the USA for 3+ months, because you need to do more paperwork after the wedding.
2. Go over on holiday, get married, come back to Ireland, file for CR-1 spousal visa. Positives: cheaper, you can work and travel right away when you enter on the visa, as you will have a greencard right away. Negative: Slow- you are currently looking at 1+ year.
3. Get married somewhere else... here in Ireland for example, if you have elderly relatives that would like to be there, or a destination wedding. Then do as 2.

Option 4. Got to US and get married on a B1 / B2 Visa and do a change of status. Positives are you don't change your visa to a K1 (which is only 90s days validity compared with 10 years (six months per visit).

Drawbacks. May have to be interviewed at a USIS office nearest to your location after you file. There may be hassle if you leave the country and return again as the DHS may be miffed you didn't ditch your B1 / B2 Visa for a K1 type.

silja

Watch Ryder wrote: »

Option 4. Got to US and get married on a B1 / B2 Visa and do a change of status. Positives are you don't change your visa to a K1 (which is only 90s days validity compared with 10 years (six months per visit).

Drawbacks. May have to be interviewed at a USIS office nearest to your location after you file. There may be hassle if you leave the country and return again as the DHS may be miffed you didn't ditch your B1 / B2 Visa for a K1 type.

No, this is visa fraud and illegal. B2 tourist visas and the Visa Waiver Program are for visits, NOT for moving over and staying.

SHOVELLER

As has been pointed out previously here each case is looked at on its own merits. It's not as cut and dry to just say it is illegal.