Expressway Service, not like the car, not better, not even the service that was sold

cerastes

So I saw that there is an offer on the new? expressway service, comfortable seats, wifi and toilets.
For the first time in a long time I decided to get the bus and that it would be worthwhile.
I booked my seat online and had an email of the details and a printout in the event there was some problem with displaying this.
I went to the stop near me, and at the designated time a bus turned up but it was a standard bus, not the expressway service I booked through the expressway site.

I tried to enquire off the driver but he barely grunted at me and didnt seem to understand, I didnt want to hold up the bus and it seemd to me that no expressway bus was going to arrive, so if I didnt board, there wouldnt be another bus for hours, Id be late arriving and late returning.

I can see nothing about the service being retracted or altered, only the offer of 7.99.
There is no talk to Bus Eireann, probably for good reason.

The service itself wasnt too bad, but the wifi was pretty poor, mainly I booked the bus as there was a toilet on board and while the bus stopped along the route, Im unhappy the service was altered, I saw no expressway bus out the point we turned off the motorway.

Its not like the car, its not better, I expect to get what I pay for, and while its only 7.99, its not the money I want to reclaim really, but it puts me off the service in the future, expressway says it has isofix for child seats, so if a standard bus turns up, then what? we cant get on? or just lug a child seat pointlessly and have no safety for them?

I intend to follow this up, but Im sure it will go nowhere, is there a better way to make my complaint that doesnt go into the ether of Bus Eireann?

L1011

What routing and stop was this?

cerastes

Not sure what the route/stop makes a difference? The timetable says the bus stops where it did and its on the timetable, anyway it was to Sligo, the stop is in Lucan, the bus eireann bus turned up at the exact time the expressway bus was meant to arrive, for a lot of the drive out before turning off I saw no sign of an expressway bus, what's the point in offering a service and selling that if there is no chance the service will be there.

I couldn't take the chance there was no other bus, and if I knew I was getting the bus eireann standard bus I wouldn't mind, but the purpose of my ticket was an expressway bus which I also thought was to go direct.
I dont see the point in them not making it abundantly clear that an expresswaybus will not be turning up on certain routes at certain times as they probably know in advance what the passengernumbers will be, the bus was not even a quarter full but other people got on Ad off further along.

But they are selling this service based on it being a separate and better service?
Obviously this isn't better than the car as you cannot plan a journey if you have children and a child seat or even may want to use the toilet yourself,

LXFlyer

Not all routes have toilets, nor are Bus Eireann saying that they do.

The fleet is currently being rebranded to separate the PSO and Expressway businesses, and the new coaches are now being rolled out, but not every route will have brand new vehicles immediately. This is an ongoing project.

Expressway is simply a brand of Bus Eireann - the two are the same business. I'm not quite sure why you think they are different.

The "Bus Eireann" bus as you refer to it would be part of the existing fleet that they use for Expressway services - it just hasn't been rebranded yet.

Banjoxed

1. Don't believe adverts

And

2. Take the train from Maynooth to Sligo.

cerastes

lxflyer wrote: »

Not all routes have toilets, nor are Bus Eireann saying that they do.

The fleet is currently being rebranded to separate the PSO and Expressway businesses, and the new coaches are now being rolled out, but not every route will have brand new vehicles immediately. This is an ongoing project.

Expressway is simply a brand of Bus Eireann - the two are the same business. I'm not quite sure why you think they are different.

The "Bus Eireann" bus as you refer to it would be part of the existing fleet that they use for Expressway services - it just hasn't been rebranded yet.

I purchased ticket on the expressway site, it was reported in the Irish times as an advertising blurb all the benefits, and that it is a separate service from the parent company, I didn't mind getting the ordinary bus if thays what i was told i was paying for but there are not even saying there might not be a bus on said service, its timetabled.but what if I had a child on the journey with me and then couldn't fix the seat, aside from the waste of effort its a claim they make in the advertising blurb, a misleading and false one which could be a safety issue, otherwise where do you fi. The child seat to? Why include the service has ISO fix capability if they dont even have the bus?

Just have it easily accessible online which route and times will be expressway, simple you'd think?

cerastes

Banjoxed wrote: »

1. Don't believe adverts

And

2. Take the train from Maynooth to Sligo.

I'll just drive in future, but the train is much dearer and I thought I was getting an equal level if not a significantly better service, if I knew it wasn't what they claimed then I'd have at least known what I was paying for.

LXFlyer

cerastes wrote: »

I purchased ticket on the expressway site, it was reported in the Irish times as an advertising blurb all the benefits, and that it is a separate service from the parent company, I didn't mind getting the ordinary bus if thays what i was told i was paying for but there are not even saying there might not be a bus on said service, its timetabled.but what if I had a child on the journey with me and then couldn't fix the seat, aside from the waste of effort its a claim they make in the advertising blurb, a misleading and false one which could be a safety issue, otherwise where do you fi. The child seat to? Why include the service has ISO fix capability if they dont even have the bus?

Just have it easily accessible online which route and times will be expressway, simple you'd think?

Again, Expressway is a brand of Bus Eireann. It is NOT a separate service.

The bus that you caught was just not repainted into the new Expressway colours, but I can assure you that the vehicle was purchased by Bus Eireann specifically for its commercial services, which are branded "Expressway". They have only recently restored the brand to their vehicles and the vehicles are being repainted over time.

At the same time new buses are being rolled out across the network but that will take time to filter down across every route.

Banjoxed

cerastes wrote: »

I'll just drive in future, but the train is much dearer and I thought I was getting an equal level if not a significantly better service, if I knew it wasn't what they claimed then I'd have at least known what I was paying for.

It's a bus. I think that says everything necessary about it.

foggy_lad

cerastes wrote: »

I purchased ticket on the expressway site, it was reported in the Irish times as an advertising blurb all the benefits, and that it is a separate service from the parent company, I didn't mind getting the ordinary bus if thays what i was told i was paying for but there are not even saying there might not be a bus on said service, its timetabled.but what if I had a child on the journey with me and then couldn't fix the seat, aside from the waste of effort its a claim they make in the advertising blurb, a misleading and false one which could be a safety issue, otherwise where do you fi. The child seat to? Why include the service has ISO fix capability if they dont even have the bus?

Just have it easily accessible online which route and times will be expressway, simple you'd think?

What you bought was a ticket on an expressway service! this does not guarantee that one particular bus or type of bus will be used on the service you booked or on any other expressway service, the use of newer buses with toilets and power points etc will always be subject to availability and this will be mentioned somewhere on the bus eireann site.

You were also very luicky that the driver allowed you to use your promotional ticket from that stop as the rules of the promotion state that tickets are only valid from the stops listed and can not be used from any stop not listed on the ticket. From Dublin the only two boarding points for your journey are Dublin Airport and Busaras.

_Kaiser_

foggy_lad wrote: »

What you bought was a ticket on an expressway service! this does not guarantee that one particular bus or type of bus will be used on the service you booked or on any other expressway service, the use of newer buses with toilets and power points etc will always be subject to availability and this will be mentioned somewhere on the bus eireann site.

You were also very luicky that the driver allowed you to use your promotional ticket from that stop as the rules of the promotion state that tickets are only valid from the stops listed and can not be used from any stop not listed on the ticket. From Dublin the only two boarding points for your journey are Dublin Airport and Busaras.

I don't think you are getting his point though...

He bought a ticket based on advertising which promised a certain level of service, and that service wasn't delivered.

Trying to then add that "he's lucky" he was let on at all isn't exactly the way to win converts either, something BE badly needs to do if it plans to make this a viable alternative to the car and motorways... or does it? It's hard to determine just how "seriously" the CIE companies take their remit given their history, union/staffing issues, and of course the fact that most of their sites, vehicles and funding came from the taxpayer in the past and still do to a significant extent.

Bottom line:

cerastes wrote:

I'll just drive in future, but the train is much dearer and I thought I was getting an equal level if not a significantly better service, if I knew it wasn't what they claimed then I'd have at least known what I was paying for.

and...

Banjoxed wrote:

It's a bus. I think that says everything necessary about it.

... are not goIing to win any new customers and indeed are even more damaging if - as in this case - the customer was one who DID decide to try it again only to be let down by "fine print" :rolleyes:

foggy_lad

The only thing advertised/promised is "performance guaranteed to cut your fuel costs", "contoured custom fitted interior" and "integrated broadband connectivity".

http://www.buseireannexpressway.com/

All these are provided on all expressway coaches,

• They all have Wi-Fi but Bus Éireann can not and will never be able to guarantee a good signal especially in areas which have poor mobile internet coverage!
• All buses cut your fuel costs as you are not using your own car.
• All coaches have contoured custom fitted interiors based on the type and series of bus it is.

end of the road

your obviously sure OP it was an expressway service you boarded and not a regular service which the driver just let you on to prevent you from waiting ages for the next bus? admittedly i'm not familiar with expressway services so i'm just asking.

foggy_lad

end of the road wrote: »

your obviously sure OP it was an expressway service you boarded and not a regular service which the driver just let you on to prevent you from waiting ages for the next bus? admittedly i'm not familiar with expressway services so i'm just asking.

Those seat sale tickets are also only valid from a limited number of stops and the only stops for Dublin to Sligo are Dublin Airport, Busaras, Longford station and Sligo bus station so it would appear that the driver was doing the OP a favour taking the ticket?

http://www.buseireannexpressway.com/

5. Tickets can only be redeemed from the stop, date and time of travel you selected when purchasing your ticket online. Journey must be taken from point of origin and at time selected when booking. Failure to do so will result in tickets not being honoured when boarding bus.

stehyl15

God BE must make Dublin Bus look like a fantastic service.

schemingbohemia

So the OP expected a direct service - but was happy to get on at Lucan?

cerastes

Banjoxed wrote: »

It's a bus. I think that says everything necessary about it.

foggy_lad wrote: »

What you bought was a ticket on an expressway service! this does not guarantee that one particular bus or type of bus will be used on the service you booked or on any other expressway service, the use of newer buses with toilets and power points etc will always be subject to availability and this will be mentioned somewhere on the bus eireann site.

You were also very luicky that the driver allowed you to use your promotional ticket from that stop as the rules of the promotion state that tickets are only valid from the stops listed and can not be used from any stop not listed on the ticket. From Dublin the only two boarding points for your journey are Dublin Airport and Busaras.

Its like a fifth column,
The stop I got on is listed as a valid pickup and when you link to the expressway timetable it shows it as such, the bus driver did me no favour as i was at a valid stop and had a valid ticket, bus eireann should at least identify the bus by some sign.when the bus was arriving I wasn't even sure if I was to wait for the expressway bus.
I dont really care that the service wasn't direct but I thought it was meant to be and wondered had I not seen the expressway bus pass in the event it didn't take the same route.
If anything is clear its that what you are getting isn't clear, fortunately at least one poster understands what I'm saying.

My biggest gripe is the misleading advertising, I dont expect a service to be completely up and running overnight, but on the same hand it shouldn't be promoted as if it is already running, I suppose its unreasonable to turn up expecting an isofix connection given they advertise that too?
I could find no disclaimer to what service would or would not be provided and there seems to be uneccesary layers in the bus eireann site to find information.

At no point did I fault the driver for what I thought was the expected bus not turning up and I got on with the minimum of disruption, although he was unable to provide me with any information. It is rich for you foggy lad to be critical of me when I recal your stubborn opinions on a previous thread about how you deal with not having a reserved seat on a train.

foggy_lad

OK just to be clear the bus and ticket you bought are not a new product or service! It is the same long winding Dublin to Sligo bus that students and others have got for years. The only difference now is that bus Eireann are doing a seat sale promotion to try to sell the service and advertise some improvements in the overall service.

Nowhere do they promise toilets or isofix seating on any service because it would be stupid to do such a thing without the addition of the usually "subject to availability of suitably equipped vehicles"

When a person gets the train to Sligo they are sometimes greeted with a commuter railcar rather than the intercity trains but even this is different to the situation on the buses!

Bus Eireann are providing a suitable vehicle for inter city expressway service as long as they use certain types of coach with reclining seats and heating etc. Toilets are not part of the service and neither are isofix fittings or plug sockets at your seat but these are available on some services with the newer buses. Your issue appears to be that they only got enough new buses to meet demand rather than get enough to replace the entire expressway fleet at the same time.

cerastes

foggy_lad wrote: »

OK just to be clear the bus and ticket you bought are not a new product or service! It is the same long winding Dublin to Sligo bus that students and others have got for years. The only difference now is that bus Eireann are doing a seat sale promotion to try to sell the service and advertise some improvements in the overall service.

Nowhere do they promise toilets or isofix seating on any service because it would be stupid to do such a thing without the addition of the usually "subject to availability of suitably equipped vehicles"

When a person gets the train to Sligo they are sometimes greeted with a commuter railcar rather than the intercity trains but even this is different to the situation on the buses!

Bus Eireann are providing a suitable vehicle for inter city expressway service as long as they use certain types of coach with reclining seats and heating etc. Toilets are not part of the service and neither are isofix fittings or plug sockets at your seat but these are available on some services with the newer buses. Your issue appears to be that they only got enough new buses to meet demand rather than get enough to replace the entire expressway fleet at the same time.

No, you clear!y havent read my posts,
my issue is that they are advertising the service as expressway, some superior level of service to the standard service which has been promoted as a seperate commercial entity, a service level which isn't available and to which I could find no exclusions, I specifically metioned the isofix seat capability as they advertise that feature as par of the service.
Anyone wishing to turn up and avail of that service is not to going to be able to know in advance if it's available, at the least with the numbers of new buses they should at least make it clear which have isofix and toilets, ie the newer buses, and when these will be running.
The bus was adequate for getting to the destination, what I'm unhappy about is how misleading the advertising is in that the reality doesn't meet it to the extent it could present serious problems.
There is such ardent defense of BE its kind of suspicious. What has suited students for generations bears no resemblence to meeting current needs/demands that BE are selling themselves in their own advertising and has even been promoted by the govt.
By your logic cars didn t have seat belts or other safety features and that suited for years so why complain today if I come across someone selling a car today without seat belts, especially if they advertise it as having seat belts.

foggy_lad

I was reading and understood your posts and it is clearly the advertising you take issue with but that is just advertising. Afaics they make no claims or guarantees if any particular service level above that of expressway service which is what you got. A bus was provided at the expected time and the accommodation was adequate. It was not a minibus with small schoolchild seats which were used on some routes for a while.

You want something which no company can provide. A guarantee of a particular type of bus. They can't give a timetable based on what bus you will get because there are too many variables that dictate what buses are available.

Most companies engage in this same type of advertising and you are not up in arms over it? Take the WiFi on the bus for example, it was poor because of the mountains and remote areas the bus passed through but you blamed bus Eireann rather than all the mobile operators. The mobile operators advertise countrywide reception but they must have forgotten to tell us that remote areas will only get minimal coverage.

MOH

I can see the OP's point.
If this is what the OP was going by, I certainly find it misleading.

BE wrote:

Introducing a whole new departure in travel, we are pleased to announce the launch of 28 new vehicles operating on Expressway and intercity routes. The new vehicles all feature Free Wi-Fi, extra comfort seats, and have power sockets. They also include ISOFIX attachment points, allowing child safety seats to be installed on vehicles making it easier to travel with small children.

It's not particularly clear that these buses are only in service on some routes at some times.

LXFlyer

MOH wrote: »

I can see the OP's point.
If this is what the OP was going by, I certainly find it misleading.

It's not particularly clear that these buses are only in service on some routes at some times.

With only 28 vehicles it would be a tad difficult to operate the entire Expressway network I would suggest?


This is a work in progress.

_Kaiser_

lxflyer wrote: »

With only 28 vehicles it would be a tad difficult to operate the entire Expressway network I would suggest?


This is a work in progress.

That may be so, but how is a customer unfamiliar with the inner workings of BE going to know that?

Looking at that page it doesn't say that these (extra) features are ONLY on these buses - one could reasonably assume that these are just the latest additions (as they in fact are) and that these services are standard.. especially when you remember the big deal made of them on the RTE News not that long ago.

Maybe what BE need is a disclaimer on that page - some features are vehicle dependent - but that's probably not as "sexy" as big new shiny buses and photoshop images.

cerastes

foggy_lad wrote: »

I was reading and understood your posts and it is clearly the advertising you take issue with but that is just advertising. Afaics they make no claims or guarantees if any particular service level above that of expressway service which is what you got. A bus was provided at the expected time and the accommodation was adequate. It was not a minibus with small schoolchild seats which were used on some routes for a while.

You want something which no company can provide. A guarantee of a particular type of bus. They can't give a timetable based on what bus you will get because there are too many variables that dictate what buses are available.

Most companies engage in this same type of advertising and you are not up in arms over it? Take the WiFi on the bus for example, it was poor because of the mountains and remote areas the bus passed through but you blamed bus Eireann rather than all the mobile operators. The mobile operators advertise countrywide reception but they must have forgotten to tell us that remote areas will only get minimal coverage.

I remarked the wifi was poor but I was hardly up in arms over it, I didn't blame BE, it was a remark, it was no the crux of my problem. Neither is this about other companies and if BE takes even part of the view by some posters here then not listening to actual feedback about concerns or issues of the new service then how do they ever expect to make it work.
Neither do I want a Guarantee of a bus on very route, only that BE specify when the bus is planned to be on notwithstanding some mechanical fault, if its just a few buses then surely they know when they are planned to be used?they have enough other useless and incorrect information on the expressway site.

lxflyer wrote: »

With only 28 vehicles it would be a tad difficult to operate the entire Expressway network I would suggest?


This is a work in progress.

But very easy to specify where this handful of buses will operate ie on what routes and at what times,at least a customer knows and can choose the service the want if its available or not booked out. aside from the safety issue which would be handled if you knew you were getting a bus with isofix capability, not that I ever suggsted BE should have or need to have brand spanking new buses on every route, why the need to pull the wool over customers eyes? I never suggested that what you are saying and it makes me think people like you are the sort that dont listen or are somehow connected to BE and dont listen, otherwise, why the ardent and head buried in the sand defense?

What's wrong with BE being upfront about the service level? Customer chooses to accept it or not, I couldn't even find an exclusion in the websites although the layers seem to aid making it difficult to find if its there.

end of the road

cerastes wrote: »

I remarked the wifi was poor but I was hardly up in arms over it, I didn't blame BE, it was a remark, it was no the crux of my problem. Neither is this about other companies and if BE takes even part of the view by some posters here then not listening to actual feedback about concerns or issues of the new service then how do they ever expect to make it work.
Neither do I want a Guarantee of a bus on very route, only that BE specify when the bus is planned to be on notwithstanding some mechanical fault, if its just a few buses then surely they know when they are planned to be used?they have enough other useless and incorrect information on the expressway site.




But very easy to specify where this handful of buses will operate ie on what routes and at what times,at least a customer knows and can choose the service the want if its available or not booked out. aside from the safety issue which would be handled if you knew you were getting a bus with isofix capability, not that I ever suggsted BE should have or need to have brand spanking new buses on every route, why the need to pull the wool over customers eyes? I never suggested that what you are saying and it makes me think people like you are the sort that dont listen or are somehow connected to BE and dont listen, otherwise, why the ardent and head buried in the sand defense?

What's wrong with BE being upfront about the service level? Customer chooses to accept it or not, I couldn't even find an exclusion in the websites although the layers seem to aid making it difficult to find if its there.

the problem is we don't know for sure that that particular bus was infact an expressway service and not a regular service. did it make a lot of stops for example?

LXFlyer

cerastes wrote: »

But very easy to specify where this handful of buses will operate ie on what routes and at what times,at least a customer knows and can choose the service the want if its available or not booked out. aside from the safety issue which would be handled if you knew you were getting a bus with isofix capability, not that I ever suggsted BE should have or need to have brand spanking new buses on every route, why the need to pull the wool over customers eyes? I never suggested that what you are saying and it makes me think people like you are the sort that dont listen or are somehow connected to BE and dont listen, otherwise, why the ardent and head buried in the sand defense?

What's wrong with BE being upfront about the service level? Customer chooses to accept it or not, I couldn't even find an exclusion in the websites although the layers seem to aid making it difficult to find if its there.

I have no connection with Bus Eireann whatsoever. I'm merely someone with a particular interest in public transport. I'm not defending anything - I'm trying to explain to you why things are the way they are.

I'm trying to explain to you that "Expressway" is simply a brand, and one that has been used constantly since the 1970s. You kept referring to it as something completely new and separate from Bus Eireann, which it is not.

The bus service from Dublin to Sligo is route 23 (http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1415360590-023.pdf), which is a commercially operated service by Bus Eireann, branded Expressway.

The coaches are being gradually introduced across the network but are not religiously allocated to particular departures. Expressway services can be operated by any bus from their commercial fleet. Some are brand new, others are older. The older ones are being repainted into the new Expressway colours on a rolling basis.

Perhaps they could make a clearer statement about where the new buses operate, but being honest about it they frequently juggle the coaches around services so it would be a moving feast. It would be very difficult to adhere to.

MOH

lxflyer wrote: »

With only 28 vehicles it would be a tad difficult to operate the entire Expressway network I would suggest?
.

How is someone who rarely uses BE supposed to know how many buses are needed to cover the expressway network?

lxflyer wrote: »

Perhaps they could make a clearer statement about where the new buses operate, but being honest about it they frequently juggle the coaches around services so it would be a moving feast. It would be very difficult to adhere to.

It would be extremely simple to make it clear that not all features of the new buses are available on all services. Maybe by adding a line to that page saying something like "Not all of these features are available on all services"

schemingbohemia

MOH wrote: »

How is someone who rarely uses BE supposed to know how many buses are needed to cover the expressway network?



It would be extremely simple to make it clear that not all features of the new buses are available on all services. Maybe by adding a line to that page saying something like "Not all of these features are available on all services"

Sorry but anyone with any cop-on at all should realise that Bus Éireann have more than 28 buses!

If you added a line for every idiotic assumption that people might make then you'd have no room for the nice pictures!

MOH

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Sorry but anyone with any cop-on at all should realise that Bus Éireann have more than 28 buses!

If you added a line for every idiotic assumption that people might make then you'd have no room for the nice pictures!

I've no idea how many buses Bus Eireann have, I gave up using them years ago. Quite a lot I'd imagine.
But in their page describing the Expressway service they're trumpeting on about their brand spanking new buses with a raft of features which presumably you aren't actually going to travel on for most of the services.

It'd make far more sense to stick up a press release article all about the new buses, and refer to it from the Expressway page, with a line about how the current Expressway service is getting even better with these spanking new buses.

But as it is it's completely unclear as to what features are available on all/some buses

LXFlyer

MOH wrote: »

I've no idea how many buses Bus Eireann have, I gave up using them years ago. Quite a lot I'd imagine.
But in their page describing the Expressway service they're trumpeting on about their brand spanking new buses with a raft of features which presumably you aren't actually going to travel on for most of the services.

It'd make far more sense to stick up a press release article all about the new buses, and refer to it from the Expressway page, with a line about how the current Expressway service is getting even better with these spanking new buses.

But as it is it's completely unclear as to what features are available on all/some buses

I don't think anyone would argue with that.


I think it would have to be a general disclaimer due to the nature of the fleet being moved around, rather than specifying services being operated by new vehicles.