Horse stabbed to death (in Limerick)

Roger Hassenforder

Scumbags sink to new low in Limerick
Horse stabbed in row, and bleeds to death. It's not a Limerick bashing thread, it's a city love and have great time for.
Animal cruelty goes on in all levels of society, not just socio-economic deprived areas, but is it time to ban horse ownership in urban areas?

http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/horse-bleeds-to-death-in-limerick-housing-estate-after-being-stabbed-31168049.html

myshirt

No. It's not time. That is an outrageous reaction. This guy was clearly a lunatic, others should not suffer.

Timberrrrrrrr

myshirt wrote: »

No. It's not time. That is an outrageous reaction. This guy was clearly a lunatic, others should not suffer.

The only ones to suffer are the horses, a housing estate is no place for an animal like a horse to be kept.

Kovu

Eh, I'm a bit lost at the part

Unable to move the animal, volunteers watched over it for four hours before it finally passed away.

Why not call a vet to put it down?

iDave

Scumbags gonna scumbag

myshirt

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

The only ones to suffer are the horses, a housing estate is no place for an animal like a horse to be kept.

If there is adequate green area, and everyone is onside, including the horse, then why not?

Mint Aero

They've no business owning horses.

Timberrrrrrrr

myshirt wrote: »

If there is adequate green area, and everyone is onside, including the horse, then why not?

Green areas are not for keeping wildlife on and as for everyone being onside? :rolleyes:

myshirt

Timberrrr, it's not a gazelle we we on about here.

Galwayguy35

Pity they didn't just end up stabbing each other instead of the poor horse, doubt they would be any great loss to society.

OK lads, I've deleted a few posts, it's not that After Hours doesn't appreciate a good giggle, but people [understandably] get fairly upset at the mistreatment of animals, so rather than have people wound up and infracted or banned etc etc. It would be better to keep the thread serious and let everyone continue on with their access to the forum.

Also, please don't slag off the entire county of Limerick - for the same reasons as above.

You know what will wind people up so avoid those kind of posts.

Thanks.

Timberrrrrrrr

myshirt wrote: »

Timberrrr, it's not a gazelle we we on about here.

No you're right, It's a horse, A horse that does not belong in the middle of a housing estate.

eviltwin

myshirt wrote: »

If there is adequate green area, and everyone is onside, including the horse, then why not?

Green areas were not designed for horses. No food, no water, no shelter, no protection from the elements or other people or animals not to mention the risk they pose to children, motorists....if you love your animal you wouldn't make them live like that.

Hans Bricks

And yet this is the norm (in terms irresponsible and inadequate horse ownership) across the country. Every kip of a council estate has at least a few of these poor unfortunate majestics being left tied to a tree with fishing rope on a green area opposite knackerfest villas.

The local councils and Gardai seriously need to put the foot down with regards to idle, feral horses. I actually do know one or two lads who keep their horses in local stables and treat the horse like their own child, but they're a very seldom minority.

Hans Bricks

A fine example of such blatant disregard can or at least could have been seen in Neilstown, where the same horse was left tied to the same tree just over a few hundred feet down from Ronanstown Garda station.

the dark phantom

If they can do that to a poor Horse then they are well capable of doing it to a human, Scum.

myshirt

Are you people for exclusion orders against horses in council areas? That is strange to say the least. Why should the horse suffer? These horses are as much a part of the community as other animal and in fact can be quite an important and positive force for very vulnerable young children who enjoy taking care of their horses.

Now i agree on the wider issue of provision of public services for these horses, but banning ownership in urban areas is uncalled for. The majority of these horses just graze locally during the day and mind their own business. In the very vast majority of cases, these horses are well taken care of; exercised regularly and what have you.

eviltwin

myshirt wrote: »

Are you people for exclusion orders against horses in council areas? That is strange to say the least. Why should the horse suffer? These horses are as much a part of the community as other animal and in fact can be quite an important and positive force for very vulnerable young children who enjoy taking care of their horses.

Now i agree on the wider issue of provision of public services for these horses, but banning ownership in urban areas is uncalled for. The majority of these horses just graze locally during the day and mind their own business. In the very vast majority of cases, these horses are well taken care of; exercised regularly and what have you.

It's not the horses that are the problem, it's the bloody owners. Animals should only be kept by people who are prepared to care for them. You can't let a horse live off grass with no water source or access to veterinary care, proper grooming etc. They destroy green areas with their sh!t, they are never brought indoors or fed appropriate food. It's cruel. Scum like that shouldn't be trusted with a goldfish.

byhookorbycrook

myshirt wrote: »

The majority of these horses just graze locally during the day and mind their own business. In the very vast majority of cases, these horses are well taken care of; exercised regularly and what have you.

A green area where a horse is tethered by a rope is not "grazing locally" in the sense of what a horse needs. "Exercised regularly" where?

I am a horse owner and I don't own land. So I pay for my horse to use a field where he can roam freely, get good grass and water as he needs it. He has shelter from the hedges and trees but more importantly he can be stabled in poor weather or to escape flies on hot days. During the winter he gets good quality fodder as he needs it.

I don't exercise him on the road, I wouldn't submit him to traffic whizzing past and the chance of him getting a fright or injured.

I paid for his passport and to have him micro-chipped. I pay for the vet when he needs it and would be horrified to think someone would allow an animal to suffer as the one above did.

I am by no means wealthy, but my horse is valuable to me and I only have one horse, because that is all I can afford

A green in a housing estate is no place for any horse.

myshirt

eviltwin wrote: »

....if you love your animal you wouldn't make them live like that.

If you have any decent sense of what it means to be humane, you wouldn't have let people live like they did in those areas.

There absolutely needs to be a levy on the earnings of the communities that had the money and opportunity pumped into them over the years, and that levy needs to be ringfenced into these disadvantaged communitues. Developing facilities for horses can be one arm of this. This absolutely needs to be the case if we are going to be sincere in our response, it is not good enough to be looking down one's nose. Stump up the cash.

eviltwin

myshirt wrote: »

If you have any decent sense of what it means to be humane, you wouldn't have let people live like they did in those areas.

There absolutely needs to be a levy on the earnings of the communities that had the money and opportunity pumped into them over the years, and that levy needs to be ringfenced into these disadvantaged communitues. Developing facilities for horses can be one arm of this. This absolutely needs to be the case if we are going to be sincere in our response, it is not good enough to be looking down one's nose. Stump up the cash.

I live in an area that would be classed as deprived, there is nothing wrong with how I live. There is nothing wrong with how the majority here live. I don't believe anyone living in a more affluent area owes me or my neighbourhood anything. The people who live in squalor here are that way largely through their own actions.

Kermit.de.frog

All horses, in my opinion, should be taken from all council estates no questions asked with criminal charges brought against the "owners".

myshirt

@eviltwin

Well you possibly don't understand sociology and the econimics of the issue then. You have been short changed and not know it. Though i do agree personally with you, one has to take ownership for their own situation, and this certainly has it's role.

Read a bit of Des McCaffrey.

Hans Bricks

Theres equine centers in nearly every working class suburb with a horse culture in it. Clondalkin, Cherry Orchard, Finglas, Fettercairn in Tallaght. Theres no excuses for dumping an animal on the local green area.

Yurt2

Caught something on the radio today, from Roscommon Co.Council who claimed they spend more money putting down neglected/abused horses than they do on accommodation/social housing. Outrageous.

Round my area, it's a common enough sight to see malnourished horses kept on scrubland. Had to report it a number of times over the years.

And the sight of a certain clientele 'breaking in' their horses is enough to want you hop out of your car and start clobbering them.

myshirt

Hans, very limited services in Limerick.

eviltwin

myshirt wrote: »

@eviltwin

Well you possibly don't understand sociology and the econimics of the issue then. You have been short changed and not know it. Though i do agree personally with you, one has to take ownership for their own situation, and this certainly has it's role.

Read a bit of Des McCaffrey.

Ah yes us simple folk are being taken advantage of and we don't even know it :rolleyes: Do you realise how condescending that post comes across? We are the authors of our own destiny, we made the same choices as about 80% of the people here, go to college, work hard and take care of your responsibilities. A small amount choose a different path, their choice but stop making excuses for them.

Yurt2

myshirt wrote: »

Hans, very limited services in Limerick.

No excuse to my mind. I don't have facilities for an elephant in my back yard, ergo I don't keep one. And I'm not asking the state to provide for my hobby. To claim then that horses are part of their culture. They don't treat the animals with dignity for the most part.

IamNotNumber

Remember this circus in Finglas..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaoJC7rBlzc

byhookorbycrook

Horses are part of my culture, I grew up in North Cork, Cahirmee horse fair, close to birthplaces of JohnJo O' Neill, Vincent O' Brien, site of the first steeplechase and so on. I didn't get a horse until I could pay for it to be looked after properly. I don't go to pubs, I don't go on foreign holidays, I put my money into my horse, because I want him to have the best life I can give him.

myshirt

eviltwin, don't mean to be condescending, so apolgies. Very much a large sociological and economic policy angle to the whole thing. That's it at it's basics. No one will fault you for charting your own path, well done, genuinely.

Very quick google gave this if of any interest, you really have been short changed for the benefit of others whether you beleive it or not, unfortunately. https://www.google.ie/url?q=http://www.combatpoverty.ie/publications/workingpapers/2011-02_WP_CombatingSocialDisadvantageInSocialHousingEstates.pdf&sa=U&ei=Pn06VZDYE8rC7AaxjYCwCw&ved=0CBIQFjAD&usg=AFQjCNGBa5QaSk2RlHAjxsH0548sc3bBHQ

RobertKK

I think people who do this are not just a danger to other animals, but also to humans.
The mindset needed to do this is one most of us can't comprehend.
If you can do this to an animal for no good reason, then what is stopping a progression to killing a person?

There is something badly wrong mentally for a person to stab a horse to death. It is the sort of behaviour that needs to have the person responsible locked up, they are a danger in society.

monty_python

Ara sure isn't it there tradition to stab horses

Kermit.de.frog

eviltwin wrote: »

Ah yes us simple folk are being taken advantage of and we don't even know it :rolleyes: Do you realise how condescending that post comes across? We are the authors of our own destiny, we made the same choices as about 80% of the people here, go to college, work hard and take care of your responsibilities. A small amount choose a different path, their choice but stop making excuses for them.

They can't look after themselves never mind a bloody horse. It's such a sad existence for both parties. Just looking at that video posted of them out in their PJs in the middle of the day defending the realm and the dragged up scrotes looking on. We put up with too much of it in this country. It's time to force responsibility on people instead of "looking after" them which isn't working.

That does not extend to allowing the abuse of animals and horses (whether the owners realise it is abuse or not). Those horses should be taken and the owners prosecuted.

As for the case in Limerick (sadly not unusual to see these thing about animals in the media) what kind of a maniacal lunatic would you have to be to do something like that?

Ave Sodalis

Kovu wrote: »

Eh, I'm a bit lost at the part



Why not call a vet to put it down?

Not long ago in Limerick a horse collapsed and the vet was threatened with a gun if it went near the dying horse. Animal welfare won't do anything about horses who belong to these people either.

myshirt wrote: »

Are you people for exclusion orders against horses in council areas? That is strange to say the least. Why should the horse suffer? These horses are as much a part of the community as other animal and in fact can be quite an important and positive force for very vulnerable young children who enjoy taking care of their horses.

Now i agree on the wider issue of provision of public services for these horses, but banning ownership in urban areas is uncalled for. The majority of these horses just graze locally during the day and mind their own business. In the very vast majority of cases, these horses are well taken care of; exercised regularly and what have you.

Traveller horses are one of the least well kept horses I've ever seen. They're abused and usually end up useless at a very young age. Most are not well kept. I don't know why you think they are. I live in Limerick. I've seen these horses and it disgusts me. Part of the community and part of the culture.. I don't give a damn. They abuse their horses for the most part. Just one walk around one of their horse fairs and you'll see how badly they're treated.

Also, horse's do not belong in a housing estate. A horse needs at least an acre of land each and that's bare minimum. And the "exercise" they get? Yeah, that usually has them mangled by the time they're even fully grown.

Roger Hassenforder

Why in the name of sweet baby Jesus should the state have to contribute towards the upkeep and welfare of horses in these areas?

fryup

you couldn't get any scummier than inner-city Limerick

Too Tough To Die

That is, as they say, Limerick City.

MRnotlob606

iDave wrote: »

Scumbags gonna scumbag

is that a new taylor swift song. Soouunds classss boyyy

seanaway

scum. some country we live in. politicians are as much t blame as anyone else. They haven;t got the guts to bring in laws that make people like this REALLY pay.

johnny osbourne

i read that as "herself" stabbed to death in limerick

Galwayguy35

Roger Hassenforder wrote: »

Why in the name of sweet baby Jesus should the state have to contribute towards the upkeep and welfare of horses in these areas?

Sure the state pays for everything else for them so it might as well go the whole 9 yards and pay for their animals too.

myshirt

Providing facilities for horses is a good tool to pull up vulnerable kids from a life not otherwise desirible. Most of these kids leave the education system as it does not appeal to their spirit, it's 'boring' to use the vernacular.

We attach too much importance to maths, languages and the arts. What way are our systems set up? They are set up to churn out university professors, with everyone else being a failure. I do think the state need to put the money into what appeals to these kids spirit to get bang for your buck. Much more value than a failing education system that ostracises poor kids and which is more designed to cater for the upper classes. The Arts, who in gods name gives a sh¡t about the arts.

myshirt

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Sure the state pays for everything else for them so it might as well go the whole 9 yards and pay for their animals too.

You are missing the point. The money has to be spent one way or the other. And it is cheaper and more sociologically advantageous to spend it on getting good outcomes for these kids, than to be shackling them up. They love horses. Horses are a great tool to put manners on a young man who'd otherwise be sitting around scratching his stones.

Yurt2

myshirt wrote: »

Providing facilities for horses is a good tool to pull up vulnerable kids from a life not otherwise desirible. Most of these kids leave the education system as it does not appeal to their spirit, it's 'boring' to use the vernacular.

We attach too much importance to maths, languages and the arts. What way are our systems set up? They are set up to churn out university professors, with everyone else being a failure. I do think the state need to put the money into what appeals to these kids spirit to get bang for your buck. Much more value than a failing education system that ostracises poor kids and which is more designed to cater for the upper classes. The Arts, who in gods name gives a sh¡t about the arts.

Horses are not toys for damaged youths. They are not a 'tool'.
Horses are not for urban settings.

Give them an instrument, put them in a boxing club or a judo club. But don't allow them to have a complex, sensitive, high maintenance animal until they are proven to be responsible for it and can pay for it's upkeep in appropriate facilities.

You're putting the 'needs' of these youths above the dignity of the animals.

Ave Sodalis

myshirt wrote: »

Providing facilities for horses is a good tool to pull up vulnerable kids from a life not otherwise desirible. Most of these kids leave the education system as it does not appeal to their spirit, it's 'boring' to use the vernacular.

We attach too much importance to maths, languages and the arts. What way are our systems set up? They are set up to churn out university professors, with everyone else being a failure. I do think the state need to put the money into what appeals to these kids spirit to get bang for your buck. Much more value than a failing education system that ostracises poor kids and which is more designed to cater for the upper classes. The Arts, who in gods name gives a sh¡t about the arts.

I agree! Horses help troubled children extraordinarily. However, the horse doesn't need to be subjected to abuse to do so. It's far far more beneficial if the kids got to go to a riding school with well kept horses and learned to look after them properly and got to spend time with them that way. The horse doesn't have to suffer...

myshirt

What about greyhounds? Aren't there a load of well to do people shooting these on a weekly basis. How come that is not in focus, but instead we have a conversation about marginalused people who do take care of horses, but yes could do with a leg up and more investment.

These horses are valued, taken care of and a positive thing to be involved in in a community. They are entitled to be in the estate and be part of the square, as i said they generally mind their own business and just chew on a bit of grass. The kids love them.

Roger Hassenforder

fryup wrote: »

you couldn't get any scummier than inner-city Limerick

you don't really know Limerick do you?

Ave Sodalis

myshirt wrote: »

What about greyhounds? Aren't there a load of well to do people shooting these on a weekly basis. How come that is not in focus, but instead we have a conversation about marginalused people who do take care of horses, but yes could do with a leg up and more investment.

These horses are valued, taken care of and a positive thing to be involved in in a community. They are entitled to be in the estate and be part of the square, as i said they generally mind their own business and just chew on a bit of grass. The kids love them.

They are not taken care of. They are not entitled to be in estates when it's cruel. They are abused and they suffer. I have seen these animals. I know a lot about horses. There is so much wrong with the way they're kept in housing estates.

This thread isn't about greyhounds, it's about the horse in Limerick that was stabbed.

myshirt

sup_dude wrote: »

I agree! Horses help troubled children extraordinarily. However, the horse doesn't need to be subjected to abuse to do so. It's far far more beneficial if the kids got to go to a riding school with well kept horses and learned to look after them properly and got to spend time with them that way. The horse doesn't have to suffer...

Well let's get the investment in there. But don't for a second think everyone is stabbing horses. They are being taken care of, fair enough not to racehorse level, but they are being taken care of better than some people themselves are. No need to suggest banning ownership.

Ave Sodalis

myshirt wrote: »

Well let's get the investment in there. But don't for a second think everyone is stabbing horses. They are being taken care of, fair enough not to racehorse level, but they are being taken care of better than some people themselves are. No need to suggest banning ownership.

I don't think they're all being stabbed. I know they are living in terrible conditions though. They aren't better looked after than people. The treatment and condition of Traveller horses is on the complete opposite scale to racehorses. It's the lowest of the low. I wouldn't wish a horse the life of those horses in any circumstances.