County council want to put skate park next to my house!! Please help!!

PGirl

I live on a very quiet residential road where most of the residents are elderly. The county council want to put a skate park on the road - right beside my house!! Has anyone any experience of a skate park being near their house? Or can you help me to identify what negative side effects could result from it such as noise? The council have, in my opinion, a much better site they could use in the centre of town which is not near any residential places. I need to convince them that my road is not suitable - any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

Paulw

Talk to your councillors, and have your friends and neighbours do that too.

There should be a planning phase, where objections can be lodged. Be constructive with any objections.

Best of luck.

PGirl

Thanks for your input. We have requested a meeting with the councillors but they have not come back to us yet. They already have the plans drawn up!! We were never invited or notified so that we could provide input/objections at the planning phase!

moleyv

If it is a LA project the planning phase would be done via a Part 8 process.

There would normally be a public presentation or place you can view the plans.

There is a statutory process for public submissions. They would have to draw up plans first to do this.

A part 8 isn't like a normal planning application as it is essentially the LA giving themselves permission to do something.

This is assuming of course that it is a part 8 project.

Your councillors or planning dept could advise you better on how to have your input into the process.

PGirl

Thank you for that. I will query the public presentation/viewing of the plans asap. Have you any ideas of how I can object to the skatepark in a residential area e.g traffic, noise?

dori_dormer

You could also bring up the probability of loitering and antisocial behaviour. Also increased rubbish, graffiti etc. is it going to be locked at night?

moleyv

PGirl wrote:

Thank you for that. I will query the public presentation/viewing of the plans asap. Have you any ideas of how I can object to the skatepark in a residential area e.g traffic, noise?

Have a quick look at the LA website, they would normally announce there in news/announcements section. This would tell you where when etc you can view and how to make submissions.

It is difficult for me to say exactly any issues that you should bring forward etc as I don't know any detail of what is proposed.

I suppose generally what you should query is opening hours and management, will it be open 24/7. If not, how would it be secured, and who will be responsible.

Will there be facilities for rubbish. Monitoring anti social behavior is not just the responsibly of whoever manages it or the authorities. Good design can help prevent it.

Is it just going to be a mass of concrete or will there be efforts to 'soften' it.

How would noise be managed to protect residential amenity... Opening hours, screening etc.

I would say bringing these issues up with councillors is very important, also as you say if there is a better available site you should put this forward, and query if alternative locations were considered.

If the LA are putting this forward, it is reasonable to assume they want it done there. And you will have to make sure you know how to have your say.

It might be worth meeting with the residents in close proximity to go through what you might think would damage your residential amenity, bring it together and present it as one group.

As you say it would be next to you, it would probably also be worthwhile making an individual submission with concerns specific to yourself.

If the project is going through the Part 8 process, they will have to assess any concerns you put forward.

PGirl

Thanks a million for all that info. Yes, we have a resident's committee and we are all aghast and heartbroken over it. It's seems it's not a phase 8 and that the decision is going above the local councillors heads. The council official is making the decision. The resident's committee will continue writing letters to the council and I will make an individual complaint also - great idea thank you. Yes it'll just be a mass of concrete, not soundproofed apparently. I am truly devastated over this whole thing.

moleyv

PGirl wrote:

Thanks a million for all that info. Yes, we have a resident's committee and we are all aghast and heartbroken over it. It's seems it's not a phase 8 and that the decision is going above the local councillors heads. The council official is making the decision. The resident's committee will continue writing letters to the council and I will make an individual complaint also - great idea thank you. Yes it'll just be a mass of concrete, not soundproofed apparently. I am truly devastated over this whole thing.

So it is just being done as a normal planning application?

littlejp

I live about 5 minutes from Bushy Park in Dublin. There is a big skate park in Bushy Park. I actually see it as a very positive thing in the area. It gives kids and teenagers a place to practice a healthy, active hobby which in my opinion goes some way to lowering anti social behaviour as it gives them something to do.
There is no graffiti and it is locked up at night. Noise would never be an issue.

Before you object try to see the positive side.

handlemaster

Great to see skate parks been builth the kids & some adults need them.

MouseTail

Ive been involved on the other side, lobbying for and getting skateparks. There are inevitably always objections from neighbours. Equally inevitably neighbours say after the fact its not troublesome to have a skatepark nearby. Skateparks don't tend to attract antisocial behaviour, and its self policing, older skaters look after younger ones and put a stop to messing. Playgrounds after dark are much more likely to attract anti social behaviour unfortunately. Make sure bins are provided, litter tends to be the largest problem.

PGirl

I'm not sure if it's just normal planning permission - trying to find out! The skateboarding committee have seen the plans but the residents have not. I'm not against skateboarding in anyway but don't feel the small green space beside my house is appropriate. The residents committee met with the skateboarding committee and they feel this site is not appropriate also. They are going to relay this to the council and recommend that the council move on to other alternative sites. My fear is that the council will say it's this or nothing.

Stereomaniac

Perhaps you should try to open up a dialogue with the skateboarders, and see if you can find some sort of common ground. If they feel the site is unsuitable you can surely band together. I live in Waterford and there are 2 skate parks in my area. There never seems to be any issue with antisocial behaviour but one of the parks is in the middle of a public park.

L1011

The "alternative sites" are likely to have objecting residents associations too.

Sports facilities for teenagers are badly needed across the country, and as said above skateparks are rarely problematic

PGirl

There are two alternative sites which are not near any residents. One is beside a sports club and the other is near the town shopping centre. The skateboarding committee are not keen on these sites and we don't have a public park so I'm not sure where else it can go.

MarkR

They put up one in Limerick a few years back, on steamboat quay, and that seems to be having no issues. Saying that, it's a stones throw from the garda station!

PGirl

No Garda station near my house! Just our family and very elderly residents!

runawaybishop

PGirl wrote: »

There are two alternative sites which are not near any residents. One is beside a sports club and the other is near the town shopping centre. The skateboarding committee are not keen on these sites and we don't have a public park so I'm not sure where else it can go.

So why do you think they are more suitable, given that the committee directly involved in their use does not? Do you just not want it near you?

PGirl

The committee directly involved with their use also do not feel the site beside my house is appropriate.

I don't think it should be on anyone's doorstep. It should be somewhere that there is parking, open space etc

runawaybishop

PGirl wrote: »

The committee directly involved with their use also do not feel the site beside my house is appropriate.

I don't think it should be on anyone's doorstep. It should be somewhere that there is parking, open space etc

I asked why you think the other sites are more suitable when the committee does not?
How much parking do you think local kids need?

MouseTail

You don't need parking for a skate park, that's certainly not a valid objection.

Pat Mustard

littlejp wrote: »

I live about 5 minutes from Bushy Park in Dublin. There is a big skate park in Bushy Park. I actually see it as a very positive thing in the area. It gives kids and teenagers a place to practice a healthy, active hobby which in my opinion goes some way to lowering anti social behaviour as it gives them something to do.
There is no graffiti and it is locked up at night. Noise would never be an issue.

Before you object try to see the positive side.

That's a reasonable point but there is a fairly big difference between five minutes walk and living next door.

If you were living next door, you would want assurances that it would be locked up in the evening, and that antisocial behaviour would be curbed.

PGirl

Because the other sites are not near residents.

iguana

Surely a residential amenity should be in a residential area? What's the point in a kid's play area if the kids can't get to it?

Pat Mustard

I know of a skate park in a woodland/park amenity. It's not right next to peoples' houses, it's fenced off, locked up at night and it seems to be working okay.

I don't see the need to have a skate park in a housing estate. Seems a little too close to people's houses to me.

iguana

Pat Mustard wrote: »

I know of a skate park in a woodland/park amenity. It's not right next to peoples' houses, it's fenced off, locked up at night and it seems to be working okay.

I don't see the need to have a skate park in a housing estate. Seems a little too close to people's houses to me.

Maybe so the majority of people who want to use it, ie kids who are too young to drive, can actually be able to use it regularly rather than on the rare treat of an occasion that they can get an adult to drive them there. It's a strange idea to put a kids' amentity (because as much as they wouldn't think of themselves as kids, most of the users I've ever seen in skate parks are still a way off adulthood) somewhere that kids can't freely access. It smacks of paying lipservice to providing amenities without ever having to actually make the effort of making serious, meaningful provision for those children.

I lived in London for a long time and you can't walk for 5 minutes through a high density housing area without coming across a myriad of amenties for people. I spent a couple of years in one of the 'worst' areas of the city and within a few minutes walk from my house there were about 10 tennis courts, 5 basketball courts, 3 kids. playgrounds, 1 older kids' adventure playground, a skate park, soccer and rugby pitches, chess/draughts tables, 2 paddling pools, etc. All sitting cheek by jowel with rose gardens, wildlife preservation areas, historical landmarks, London ring routes, etc. And they were never ever locked up at night as locking public areas is much more likely to encourage antisocial behaviour as a gated fence will only keep out people with legitimate reason to be there. I also found similar to be the case in Swansea when I lived there. I don't see what's so awful about Irish teens compared to their English and Welsh peers that means they are denied access to amenities their 'neighbours' take for granted.

Pat Mustard

I'm not suggesting that amenities should be situated in areas where they cannot be accessed. Clearly, as public amenities, they should be accessible to the public.

I agree that there are not enough sports facilities in this country.

expectationlost

PGirl wrote: »

I live on a very quiet residential road where most of the residents are elderly. The county council want to put a skate park on the road - right beside my house!! Has anyone any experience of a skate park being near their house? Or can you help me to identify what negative side effects could result from it such as noise? The council have, in my opinion, a much better site they could use in the centre of town which is not near any residential places. I need to convince them that my road is not suitable - any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

where are they planning to put the skatepark exactly?

antoinolachtnai

I would look at the bigger perspective too.

If the current occupiers are elderly, then you will see an influx of new families over the next 5 or 10 years. The young kids will hang around and scream at each other and have fights. This is just something that happens, and you can't stop it. It's just the cycle of life. It can happen on the poshest road.

The problem that can happen is that green areas that were previously no trouble at all can turn into trouble spots with all sorts of hanging around and aggro. It is very difficult for the local authority to deal with this sort of low-level behaviour in an open space.

So a skateboard park, which closes at a certain time, and is subject to some sort of management, might be much preferable to this sort of situation.

I am not saying the Council is right, just that what they are doing may make sense for your community.

The council has obviously not done a very good job of the communications. You really need to sit down with the officials and go through it with them. They are usually very earnest people and they take their jobs and their responsibilities seriously, but sometimes they are not the greatest of communicators.

jimmycrackcorm

littlejp wrote: »

I live about 5 minutes from Bushy Park in Dublin. There is a big skate park in Bushy Park. I actually see it as a very positive thing in the area. It gives kids and teenagers a place to practice a healthy, active hobby which in my opinion goes some way to lowering anti social behaviour as it gives them something to do.
There is no graffiti and it is locked up at night. Noise would never be an issue.

Before you object try to see the positive side.

I concur as I live a few minutes from the skate park in Lucan and every time I've been around there it has always struck me as being a great facility. As it's part of the park it gets locked up so late night loitering is not an issue. Incidentally there are also a few walls beside it specifically for graffiti art.

El_Duderino 09

If fairness it isn't a methadone clinic. It's likely to attract the 'right sort' of youths. Is there any research on the social impact of skate parks?

As a matter of interest, is this about actual likelihood of antisocial behaviour or is it about yourself vs the council?

the_syco

When you say "right next" to your house, are you talking feet, meters of kilometers?

duckcfc

PGirl wrote: »

I live on a very quiet residential road where most of the residents are elderly. The county council want to put a skate park on the road - right beside my house!! Has anyone any experience of a skate park being near their house? Or can you help me to identify what negative side effects could result from it such as noise? The council have, in my opinion, a much better site they could use in the centre of town which is not near any residential places. I need to convince them that my road is not suitable - any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

People complain when kids have nothing to do or places to go. Is it really that bad having this beside you.

desertcircus

PGirl wrote: »

Thanks a million for all that info. Yes, we have a resident's committee and we are all aghast and heartbroken over it. It's seems it's not a phase 8 and that the decision is going above the local councillors heads. The council official is making the decision. The resident's committee will continue writing letters to the council and I will make an individual complaint also - great idea thank you. Yes it'll just be a mass of concrete, not soundproofed apparently. I am truly devastated over this whole thing.

Why is everyone so aghast when, as you say, you're uncertain whether there will actually be ill effects? Assuming as a matter of course that having it near you will automatically be a negative isn't exactly a productive starting point.

moleyv

Skateparks are generally a great amenity, and can help reduce anti social behaviour if done correctly and managed well.

From the OP it seems that the proposal is right up beside their house. That is not a good location. No matter how well managed it would be a likely source of noise nuisance. The constant drone of skate board wheels is a lot noisier than a swing or jungle gym.

OP can you describe the area a bit more. Type of houses, density of houses. The proposal in relation to its surroundings.

eviltwin

There is a skate park in Blanchardstown in one of the parks. It's beside the playground so I'd be over there quite a bit. I've never seen anything remotely anti social, the kids who use it respect it. The only thing is the noise, I'd imagine it might be annoying if it was next door.