Wanted - Combi Box with Build-In Hard Disc Recorder

Ernest

My needs are modest: I want to have a satellite system which will receive UK free to air television channels and also Irish channels from Saorview BUT with the facility to record programmes for later viewing. That should be simple, you would think, since SKY and UPC offer this kind of system, though at a high price.

You would reasonably expect that the various satellite installers in the Dublin area would be offering alternative systems to SKY/UPC based on Free to Air and Saorview but apparently not. I have looked at the websites of most of the Irish companies offering to install satellite systems and also checked the main retailers such as DID, Harvey Norman, Power City, Maplins etc and while they all offer "combi boxes" (combining UK channels and Saroview on a single receiver box) none of them really offer this with built-in recording.

Many mention "PVR Ready" (presumably they mean Personal Video Recording possible) where you would attach either an external hard disc drive or some kind of flash drive but that sounds like just half a solution - for instance how would this appear on the on-screen menu, how functional would that really be? Why do the various vendors not offer all of this in one box without fiddly USB connections to external devices??

Recently I came across one possible solution from Walker Technology who offer a twin-tuner (= combi box?) with in-built hard disc recording (model WP6500TTR). At first sight this might be what I am looking for. What bothers me is why this model is not being offered by all (or any) of the satellite installation companies whose websites I have trawled. Is there some problem with it? Does "twin tuner" imply UK and Irish channels or is is just another Saorview box? The only retailer who offers this product seems to be the Expert symbol group whose website mentions a price of €219.95, which seems reasonable - if it really is a combi-box with in-built recording.
Does anybody following these forums know of this product and whether it is any good or whether there is something better that will do what I mention above?

Any advice or feedback would be much appreciated.

Thurston?

Ernest wrote: »

Recently I came across one possible solution from Walker Technology who offer a combi box with in-built hard disc recording (model WP6500TTR). At first sight this seems to offer what I am looking for. What bothers me is why this model is not being offered by all (or any) of the satellite installation companies whose websites I have trawled. Is there some problem with it?

The WP6500TTR isn't a combi, it's terrestrial only - the only Saorview approved PVR. Doesn't seem a well-liked box by any means: try a search of the terrestrial forum if you're still interested.

Ernest

Thurston? wrote: »

The WP6500TTR isn't a combi, it's terrestrial only - the only Saorview approved PVR. Doesn't seem a well-liked box by any means: try a search of the terrestrial forum if you're still interested.

Thanks for that. I had assumed, at first, that the reference to twin tuners meant what I wanted it to mean i.e Irish plus UK stations.

I would imagine, though, that searching the terrestrial forum would be a waste of time as you presumably cannot get UK channels except through a satellite system.

odckdo

Ernest wrote: »

Many mention "PVR Ready"...

Recently I came across one possible solution from Walker....with in-built hard disc recording (model WP6500TTR).

I think the combo type boxes (sat + terrestial) you mention are all only PVR ready i.e. USB stick or externally powered (USB connection) hard-disk.

That Walker box you reference can be got for around €150 in Powercity or www.freetv.ie. As mentioned their are threads about it here: some of the earlier posts people mentioned problems with the series link, some failed recordings but more recent posts mention the series link has got better.

If you are set on boxes with internal drives your best option might be that Walker box for saorview and a freesat+ for the UK (sat) side.

Means having to use a few remotes and switching between systems via the HDMI. More cumbersome than 1 remote and 1 system but better overall recording I think.

Thurston?

Ernest wrote: »

I would imagine, though, that searching the terrestrial forum would be a waste of time as you presumably cannot get UK channels except through a satellite system.

Yeah, it's only limited parts of the country, outside NI, where UK terrestrial reception reaches satellite levels of reliability.

Thread here on a triple-tuner combi (2 sat. + 1 terr.) that takes an internal HDD. These Linux based receivers seem to be popular as a 1 box Saorview + satellite solution.

Ernest

Thurston? wrote: »

Yeah, it's only limited parts of the country, outside NI, where UK terrestrial reception reaches satellite levels of reliability.

Thread here on a triple-tuner combi (2 sat. + 1 terr.) that takes an internal HDD. These Linux based receivers seem to be popular as a 1 box Saorview + satellite solution.

I find it quite puzzling that nobody appears to be offering a complete Combi + Internal HDD recorder as a single unit - as against bits and pieces of equipment that could be connected up together.

If Sky can do it why not other suppliers such as Walker? Is there some technical problem that only Sky and UPC can overcome? Is there some legal constraint and, if so, whatever could that be?
I know the Irish market is relatively small but, judging by the number of entries on threads in this section of Boards, there are lots of people who want give up Sky or UPC and want to find a solution to my own problem outlined above.

decor58

the 4ife sv400 (70 euro from Did) can house a HDD, optional extra, don't know much about the unit, used a combi with usb stick for a while, not to much of an inconvenience.

THE ALM

As Thurston has posted in his link, the Optimus OS3+ will do what you are looking for.

Have been running it for the last few weeks with no problems.

When I set up this box we still had a month before the sky was cancelled and, other than watching a few saved programs that were on the box, it was never switched on, was packed away this morning.

As it has two sat feeds and the saorview you can be recording a sat and saorview program while watching another sat program.

Although it was a bit more than we were looking to spend I figured the better spec was worth it. You may have an old hard drive lying around that you can re-purpose.

It might take a bit of tinkering around to get it looking how you want, there are so many skins out there for it you will eventually settle on one.

Ernest

THE ALM wrote: »

As Thurston has posted in his link, the Optimus OS3+ will do what you are looking for.

Have been running it for the last few weeks with no problems.

When I set up this box we still had a month before the sky was cancelled and, other than watching a few saved programs that were on the box, it was never switched on, was packed away this morning.

As it has two sat feeds and the saorview you can be recording a sat and saorview program while watching another sat program.

Although it was a bit more than we were looking to spend I figured the better spec was worth it. You may have an old hard drive lying around that you can re-purpose.

It might take a bit of tinkering around to get it looking how you want, there are so many skins out there for it you will eventually settle on one.

Many thanks for this helpful information.

I would not be in a position to install any of this stuff myself so I would be employing the services of one of these companies that install satellite dishes etc. The only specific company that I have seen mentioned (on Boards.ie) as supplying the Edison Optimus OS3 seems to be freetvdublin.ie based in Clongriffin Dublin 13 but that company's website is a bit vague and does not mention this particular model or indeed give much technical details of the various "packages" they offer, which is discouraging.

Does anyone know if any others supply the Edison Eptimus OS3 ?
I also wonder why electrical goods retailers like Power City, DID etc do not sell this product off the shelf.

Gerry Wicklow

Ernest wrote: »

Many thanks for this helpful information.

I would not be in a position to install any of this stuff myself so I would be employing the services of one of these companies that install satellite dishes etc. The only specific company that I have seen mentioned (on Boards.ie) as supplying the Edison Optimus OS3 seems to be freetvdublin.ie based in Clongriffin Dublin 13 but that company's website is a bit vague and does not mention this particular model or indeed give much technical details of the various "packages" they offer, which is discouraging.

Does anyone know if any others supply the Edison Eptimus OS3 ?
I also wonder why electrical goods retailers like Power City, DID etc do not sell this product off the shelf.

Details of OS3 box from freetv site

Shops such as Powercity or DID are "flog and forget" dealers. It is unlikely they would ever get involved with anything that required a bit of setting up.

Freetv.ie referred to above is based in co Laois not Dublin (different company).

muffler

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

Details of OS3 box from freetv site

It costs €254.18 :eek:

For that money I would be expecting a hard drive to be included or am I way behind the times?.

Ernest

Gerry Wicklow wrote: »

Details of OS3 box from freetv site

Shops such as Powercity or DID are "flog and forget" dealers. It is unlikely they would ever get involved with anything that required a bit of setting up.

Freetv.ie referred to above is based in co Laois not Dublin (different company).

Yes I had seen that Portarlington Co Laois company website. They seem to be mainly an industry seller rather than a consumer service i.e. they do not install satellite dishes and do cabling installation etc which I need.

I also note that the same website listing for the Edision Optimuss OS3 says "No Hard Drive" which was the whole point of my interest in this product in the first place.
http://www.freetv.ie/edision-optimuss-os-3-plus.html
Upon further inspection, however, there is a drop down box which says 1Tb Hard Drive (+€65.75 - excluding VAT probably) or +€44.51 for 500GB Hard Drive.
So it does have a hard drive as an optional extra.

Thurston?

Ernest wrote: »

... I also now note that the same website says that the Edision Optimuss OS3 does NOT have in internal Hard Disc Drive which was the whole point of my interest in this product in the first place.

It's possible to install an internal drive.

beauf

Ernest wrote: »

....That should be simple, you would think, since SKY and UPC offer this kind of system, though at a high price....

That actually suggests it not simple or cheap to achieve.

I put off moving to a combi last year as I think it still not quite there yet. Well not at the price point I would like.

Tigerandahalf

I have a Triax Tsc 114 combi box to receive saorview and free sat for the English channels. I have a 1TG hardrive plugged in at its usb connection. No need for power source to power the hard drive. I can watch movies, record from the EPG and view photos and files on the hard drive. The only problem with the box is that the English channels are not on a 7 day epg just now and next. The saorview is on a 7 day epg. You also can pause OR rewind live Tv. But you cannnot do both at the same time.

muffler

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

You also can pause OR rewind live Tv. But you cannnot do both at the same time.

No sh!t Sherlock

Tigerandahalf

muffler wrote: »

No sh!t Sherlock

I thought with the Sky plus box you could do both as the hard drive in it is partitioned??

Ok what I meant in the post was that you have to change the settings. If you have set to rewind it won't allow you to pause tv unless you go into settings to change it.

muffler

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

I thought with the Sky plus box you could do both as the hard drive in it is partitioned??

Ok what I meant in the post was that you have to change the settings. If you have set to rewind it won't allow you to pause tv unless you go into settings to change it.

Im not sure what you mean. Why or what settings would you change?

You physically cant pause and rewind at the same time. Thats a bit like saying you would put the car in neutral and reverse at the same time.

Tigerandahalf

You are not getting me. You have to change the settings to go from one to the other.

Also it seems you cannot rewind/pause live tv while in the process of recording something else.
I presume Sky plus allows you to do both. That is what I meant about the hard drive being partitioned.

Here is a good link on how to use the Triax.
http://www.freetv.ie/triax-tsc114-saorview-combo-user-manual.html

muffler

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

You are not getting me. You have to change the settings to go from one to the other.

I have no idea how your box would work.

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Also it seems you cannot rewind/pause live tv while recording something else. I presume Sky plus allows you to do both.

Sky+ boxes will allow pausing and rewinding but not both at the same time. It wouldn't make sense anyhow.

Also on a Sky+ box if you have a channel / programme recording then you can choose to pause OR rewind another channel / programme but not both (pause & rewind) at the same time. Twin feeds from the dish will allow you to do different things with different channels.

Tigerandahalf

If that is the case the sky plus box must have either 2 hard drives or perhaps the hard drive is partitioned to allow two recordings to be made at the same time. That is my take on it anyway. Maybe someone else might clarify.
The triax is a good box anyway. Crazy to be paying upto 30 a month for a basic sky package.

beauf

You can make multiple recordings simultaneously on the same drive.

What would partitions have to do with it?

UPC can do 4 at the same time. Though not that reliably in my opinion.

Tigerandahalf

The triax can record one channel while viewing another. So what difference do the two feeds from the sky dish make to the sky plus? With pause and rewind functions you are just recording onto different parts of the hard drive. So I am wondering why boxes differ. If you can record one channel why not be able to record 2 or 3?

beauf

The tuners.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sky%2B

Twin digital satellite tuners – for connection to identical independent feeds from Astra 28.2°E. Allows simultaneous recording/viewing or recording of 2 channels at once.

I think the UPC box has Horizon has 6 tuners.

Tigerandahalf

Does the triax 114 have twin tuners since I can record and view at the same tine?
The box won't let you record 2 programmes though.

This review gives a bit more info on the Triax 114.
http://pcmechanic.biz/blog/saorview-2/review-of-the-triax-tsc114-–-ireland’s-1st-official-saorview-combo/

beauf

Hard to find info. Not sure. I think it has two tuners one sat and one for saorview.

Tigerandahalf

But I can still record one satellite channel while viewing another satellite channel. That would seem to indicate that the box is getting 2 satellite feeds from the dish, no?

Tigerandahalf

I am after reading the manual in the link I posted. The box does indeed take 2 feeds from the satellite dish plus the Uhf aerial for saorview.

Edit. I watched a youtube video on that link I posted and it only has one satellite feed. So I don't know how it manages to record one satellite channel while viewing another satellite channel.

beauf

I think its called Mutliplexing. I don't really know much about it.

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/record_multiple_channels_from_one_multiplex

This is a feature, referred to commonly as MultiRec and included with MythTV 0.21, which enables more than one channel to be recorded per tuner as long as the channels being recorded are being transmitted on the same DVB digital multiplex

http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/record_multiple_channels_from_one_multiplex#Simple_cases

Tigerandahalf

I read another thread in the satellite forum and it has clarified things. While recording a satellite channel you can view another satellite channel at the same time, but only if it is on the same transponder. For example bbc1 and bbc2 would be on the same transponder. However itv is on a different transponder and thus you cannot view it.
For the OP there is a post in this satellite forum about an Edison box that has twin satellite feeds plus a uhf/saorview feed. That would be the box you need if you want the full functionality of the sky plus box.

For me I don't do much recording so the Triax suits me fine.
Just to clarify with the triax you will be able to watch a saorview programme while recording a satellite programme and vice versa.

Thurston?

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

The triax can record one channel while viewing another. So what difference do the two feeds from the sky dish make to the sky plus?

Try watching or recording other channels outside of those carried in the same multiplex as the 1st one being recorded, & you'll see the difference.

The band of frequencies demodulated by the tuner contains more than 1 digital 'channel' but, all the channels together use a helluva lot more bandwidth than the tuner can handle in one go.

odckdo

Ernest wrote: »

Yes I had seen that Portarlington Co Laois company website. They seem to be mainly an industry seller rather than a consumer service i.e. they do not install satellite dishes and do cabling installation etc which I need.

As a consumer I have got stuff from freetv.ie before.

The advice/videos on their website is good - using that information you can decide what you want and get a rough idea of price.

Since freetv.ie deal with installers aswell they might put you in contact with one?

odckdo

Also forgot to say for installers there is The Irish Satellite & Aerial Association:

http://www.isaa.tv/