Old people in Hospital.

kneemos

Do they make as big an effort with old people,very ill old people in particular.
I get the impression that there's an attitude of they're an unnecessary investment in time and resources.
I may be wrong.

Menas

It seems to depend on the hospital and even the ward.....

beertons

Sure ya can't put them in the parks. The kids would be drawing on them, thinking they're the new statues. At least they pee on themselves in hospital, they'd go mad if a dog pee'd on them.

keeponhurling

Was just in to visit my wife's granny there in hospital, who is around 90.

Her mind is gone years ago, so she has no idea who or where she is.
The only way she can be fed is by a pipe through her nose to get food into her stomach.
She doesn't have the strength to move her body, so basically lies motionless.
None of this has any prospect of improving.

The family don't even visit much, as frankly it has no benefit. As I said , she has no idea who anybody even is

We do need to care for her ok, but it does kind of make you wonder.

Anita Blow

As someone who has worked plenty with elderly patients in many different hospitals I can tell you you're completely wrong. Elderly patients in general are treated with the utmost respect and compassion

MiskyBoyy

Anita Blow wrote: »

As someone who has worked plenty with elderly patients in many different hospitals I can tell you you're completely wrong. Elderly patients in general are treated with the utmost respect and compassion

...and that's the way it should be.

...for everyone.

Frog Song

Anita Blow wrote: »

As someone who has worked plenty with elderly patients in many different hospitals I can tell you you're completely wrong. Elderly patients in general are treated with the utmost respect and compassion

Perhaps not in Beaumont!

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/geriatric-ward-treatment-for-gerry-feeney-dismaying-1.2119230

clever user name

My grandmother died recently at the age of 93. She was only actually in hospital for s couple of days but I must say that staff at St James hospital treated her (and our family) with respect and compassion. Very professional staff.

The Backwards Man

Depends. Harsh as it may seem, a lot of elderly patients are only coming out of hospital one way, and is it expedient to treat them with the same urgency and attention as someone likely to skip out the front door?

kneemos

Anita Blow wrote: »

As someone who has worked plenty with elderly patients in many different hospitals I can tell you you're completely wrong. Elderly patients in general are treated with the utmost respect and compassion

Not respect and compassion I was on about,it's do they make the same effort in finding a cure.

The Backwards Man

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Depends. Harsh as it may seem, a lot of elderly patients are only coming out of hospital one way, and is it expedient to treat them with the same urgency and attention as someone likely to skip out the front door?

That so wrong, dignity and respect for everyone if you are 9 days old 19 years old or 90 years old.

kneemos

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Depends. Harsh as it may seem, a lot of elderly patients are only coming out of hospital one way, and is it expedient to treat them with the same urgency and attention as someone likely to skip out the front door?

Is it not their job to treat everyone to the best of their ability and not act as jury and executioner?

AndonHandon

kneemos wrote: »

Is it not their job to treat everyone to the best of their ability and not act as jury and executioner?

He's not saying that's what it's like in a hospital but that if it were it wouldn't be that big of a deal.

smash

kneemos wrote: »

Is it not their job to treat everyone to the best of their ability and not act as jury and executioner?

They do treat everyone to the best of their ability. But with a lot of old people there is no prospect of seeing improvement at all, so you don't see the benefits of the staff care.

Thee is no cure for old age, we are all gonging to age and die has that escaped everyone's notice, inside I feel about nineteen, but in reality I am in my fifties.

We are all mortal.

Duggy747

When I was in hospital I was put in a room with 3 other poor old guys, must've been called the Poop Ward because 2 of them had chronic scutter. I'd say the toilet had a sore throat from all the swallowing it did that night.

I was having surgery the next morning but I had to go walkies around the hospital for a while, I couldn't stick the smell which was like burnt rubber mixed with eggy fish.

The Backwards Man

mariaalice wrote: »

That so wrong, dignity and respect for everyone if you are 9 days old 19 years old or 90 years old.

I'm not talking about dignity and respect. I'm talking about getting someone fit and healthy enough to get them home.

The Backwards Man

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I'm not talking about dignity and respect. I'm talking about getting someone fit and healthy enough to get them home.

But the speed you respond to someones need for care is part of dignity and respect, if you need a wash and shave why should your needs be met more slowly that someone who is younger.

smash

mariaalice wrote: »

But the speed you respond to someones need for care is part of dignity and respect, if you need a wash and shave why should your needs be met more slowly that someone who is younger.

Sorry but a wash and a shave isn't high up on the list of priorities for jobs that nurses and doctors provide to patients.

lazybones32

kneemos wrote: »

Do they make as big an effort with old people,very ill old people in particular.
I get the impression that there's an attitude of they're an unnecessary investment in time and resources.
I may be wrong.

Will putting them on courses of antibiotics improve their quality of life or take more out of them which could reduce their quality/quantity of life? Surgery or certain courses of treatment can cause trauma to the body and the likelihood of successful treatment reduces as age increases.
Doctors - I assume -weigh the pros and cons and arrive at their decision. The Insurance Co. or State will pick up the bill, so I doubt it's a case of 'let's save the treatment for someone who needs t more'.

I guess working in a hospital is somewhat like working on a battlefield: triage must be employed.

The Backwards Man

mariaalice wrote: »

But the speed you respond to someones need for care is part of dignity and respect, if you need a wash and shave why should your needs be met more slowly that someone who is younger.

I think we are on different wavelengths here. Very few people are in hospital because they need a wash and a shave. Maybe in Blackrock, but not anywhere else.

gladrags

The health system is increasingly failing all sections of the community.

The facilites for geriatric patients in particular.

Between the private and public nursing homes,home care and hospital care,it is fair to say that the patient is at risk.

It is unfair to point fingers at the majority of care assisstants and nurses,when the provision of health care for the elderly,has disintegrated.

Not that it was a quality service,in the first instance.

There is another horror story in the Irish times this morning.

God help them,they deserve dignity and respect.

smash

smash wrote: »

Sorry but a wash and a shave isn't high up on the list of priorities for jobs that nurses and doctors provide to patients.

I am not talking about doctors and nurses doing something like that it would be nonsense ( HCA ), but for reasons of comfort and dignity they need to be washed and shaved, or are you saying only concentrate on the persons medical need exclusively, older people might have multiply needs in hospital.

smash

mariaalice wrote: »

I am not talking about doctors and nurses doing something like that it would be nonsense ( HCA ), but for reasons of comfort and dignity they need to be washed and shaved, or are you saying only concentrate on the persons medical need exclusively, older people might have multiply needs in hospital.

I'm saying that hospitals are over crowded with people who require medical assistance and have medical needs. Therefore the shaving and bathing needs of some patients might need to be put off for a while. It's not like they're there growing beards and stinking ffs.

Say two people go in to hospital for some procedure one is 30 and one is 80, now after the procedure the 80 year old might need/ will probably need more help/care its not the 80 year old fault they have multiple health care need or are frail and will need more care that the 30 year olds.

smash

mariaalice wrote: »

Say two people go in to hospital for some procedure one is 30 and one is 80, now after the procedure the 80 year old might need/ will probably need more help/care its not the 80 year old fault they have multiple health care need or are frail and will need more care that the 30 year olds.

If they need more care then they'll get it.

smash

smash wrote: »

I'm saying that hospitals are over crowded with people who require medical assistance and have medical needs. Therefore the shaving and bathing needs of some patients might need to be put off for a while. It's not like they're there growing beards and stinking ffs.

I am sorry if a child comes in and sees that while their parent has had good medical care they have been left wet because someone didn't have the time to take them to the loo or that they hadn't been shaved for two day or that they have been left with food dribbling down there chin, then yes the family should complain.

Again its not the falt of the 80 year old that the 30 year old patient can use the loo by themselves and can shave themselves.

The Backwards Man

mariaalice wrote: »

Say two people go in to hospital for some procedure one is 30 and one is 80, now after the procedure the 80 year old might need/ will probably need more help/care its not the 80 year old fault they have multiple health care need or are frail and will need more care that the 30 year olds.

You're talking about something completely different.

Would you give the eighty year old more intensive physio than the thirty year old?
Would you perform an operation on the older person that they would have a much less chance of surviving than the younger, never mind guaranteed a greatly inhibited quality of life?

smash

mariaalice wrote: »

I am sorry if a child comes in and sees that while their parent has had good medical care they have been left wet because someone didn't have the time to take them to the loo or that they hadn't been shaved for two day or that they have been left with food dribbling down there chin, then yes the family should complain.

Again its not the falt of the 80 year old that the 30 year old patient can use the loo by themselves and can shave themselves.

It's up the the 80yr old to call the nurse of they have a need!

libelula

smash wrote: »

It's up the the 80yr old to call the nurse of they have a need!

Because the nurses are sitting around waiting for something to do....
They're so badly run off their feet in so many hospitals that they just haven't got the time to tend to 'small' needs as and when they occur.

The Backwards Man

The Backwards Man wrote: »

You're talking about something completely different.

Would you give the eighty year old more intensive physio than the thirty year old?
Would you perform an operation on the older person that they would have a much less chance of surviving than the younger, never mind guaranteed a greatly inhibited quality of life?

That's in he realms of philosophy and it largely cultural I think, this is just a my view of it, in Ireland culturally we are much more accepting of death ( wakes and the type of funerals and graveyards we have the blessing of the graves and so on, which make decisions about care easier.

Again we are all mortal and are going to die some day.

smash

libelula wrote: »

Because the nurses are sitting around waiting for something to do....
They're so badly run off their feet in so many hospitals that they just haven't got the time to tend to 'small' needs as and when they occur.

That's my point. They don't have the time to be running around checking on old people unless it's a routine check in. If there is a need, then it's up to the patient to tell them and at that point they'll try and sort it, or call a porter to help out.

libelula

smash wrote: »

That's my point. They don't have the time to be running around checking on old people unless it's a routine check in. If there is a need, then it's up to the patient to tell them and at that point they'll try and sort it, or call a porter to help out.

Ah yeah, fair enough. Still though, even at that they often barely have the time to sort things.

I was and was in and our of hospital a lot last year and I do know nurses are run off their feet.

One think I want to know how come some wards and hospitals are better run than other?

Zippie84

Where people experience poor treatment (or good also tbh) in medical care, where it is possible to do so*, I would definitely encourage people to use https://www.patientopinion.ie/

An independent site about your experiences of Irish health services, good or bad.

I'm not sure how widely used / how much of an impact the Irish Patient Opinion has, but in the UK it has been used by many to bring about positive change.

*I know in the case of elderly people access to an online resource may be more difficult, just want to acknowledge that obviously.