I had a tip and now it's snowballed!

Missyelliot2

I had a tip on Thursday- it was 100% my fault. The owner of the other car was really angry (I don't blame her) and she called the guards.
However, it turned out that it was only a paint scrape and I thought that was the end of it. She has just called to say her boot won't close now!

There was a big dent in the boot (nothing to do with me) and that happened prior to Thursday.
I am so upset and don't know what to do - she was quite threatening on the phone. I have taken a photo of the paint scrape, but the boot issue has really knocked me for six.

Thanks in advance

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Let your insurance sort it out thats what its for. Ask the lady not to ring you again and to deal directly with the insurance. It may very well be that the knock did cause damage and you are liable who is to say. You have to assume people are as honest as you are.

Ring insurance, they will send out an assessor and deal with it. You no claims will suffer but stress levels will benefit.

Xennon

You have to assume people are as honest as you are.

Eh???

Might also explain to the insurance that there was previous damage to the car. Also might let the gaurds that attended know.

To Elland Back

The motor engineer will inspect your vehicle as well as the 3rd party's to see if it can be established where the point of impact is. If there isn't a match to the pre-existing damage, you're in with a shout

iwillhtfu

Xennon wrote: »

Also might let the gaurds that attended know.

They won't record any info after the fact. so if it wasn't recorded at the time it's her word against yours.

OP let the insurance company sort it out if she calls again tell her to contact her insurance company and that you no longer wish to receive calls from her. She's entitled to be angry but not threatening.

Tell your insurance company that you suspect she's claiming for previous damage they'll have an assessor look at her car and he'll decide himself whether or not to contest her claim. It's more than likely they won't and will settle if you've admitted liability.

Missyelliot2

To Elland Back wrote: »

The motor engineer will inspect your vehicle as well as the 3rd party's to see if it can be established where the point of impact is. If there isn't a match to the pre-existing damage, you're in with a shout

Thanks so much. Should I arrange this myself, or will my insurance do this?

Sorry about all the questions.

iwillhtfu

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Thanks so much. Should I arrange this myself, or will my insurance do this?

Sorry about all the questions.

Leave it all to your insurance company. These things happen I wouldn't worry about it.

listermint

Hi OP,

just to play devils advocate here, how do you know the damage was older than your incident?

my oh was hit by someone 3 weeks back and the two of them thought the damage was minimal but had waited for the guards. I turned up as it was on my way to work. Took one look at the damage and knew straightaway that it was going to be costly. The girl who hit her looked at me like i had two heads. But i could see the paint and stress creases in the rear. So i knew the damage underneath was substantial.

Tried to open the boot and sure enough it popped out at us with force, then it wouldnt close. This girls 'paint scuff' was a damaged rear bumper, a unrepairable rear crumple bar, a misalligned boot lid and all the associated hangers.

I said on the spot 2,500 Euro. She stood there in tears, i wasnt mean or anything just kinda looked and said, Im sorry but its not small. This is what insurance companies are for.

Went to her Insurers appointed garage sure enough 2500 on the nose. I know car parts when i see them and labour and paint. I was spot on.

Some people opinions may not be correct. So i am interested how you knew the damage was not caused by you ?


This girl was travelling about 25-30kmph as she ran into the back of the car and sent it a car length and a bit forward.

Missyelliot2

Hi listermint...it was a minute tip - really - it actually looked like a bit of gravel had hit the paintwork. The other bang was on the other side of the car and way too high up for my car to damage it.

I was driving home today and saw the car being driven in front of me - luckily I had my phone with me and recorded it - I actually couldn't believe it! This was after being told the boot wouldn't close, so they had to use their spouse's car!

I called my insurance company to let them know the story. I really feel that this person assessed the situation and thought they would get the other bang sorted out (at my cost!)

listermint

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Hi listermint...it was a minute tip - really - it actually looked like a bit of gravel had hit the paintwork. The other bang was on the other side of the car and way too high up for my car to damage it.

I was driving home today and saw the car being driven in front of me - luckily I had my phone with me and recorded it - I actually couldn't believe it! This was after being told the boot wouldn't close, so they had to use their spouse's car!

I called my insurance company to let them know the story. I really feel that this person assessed the situation and thought they would get the other bang sorted out (at my cost!)

Fair enough, leave it with the Insurers. Make a note of what you saw and give them full detail.

That is what we pay them for. Although insurers also make terrible decisions too all in the name of 'cost mitigation' so sometimes they will just pay out to the detriment of your policy

ZENER

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

. . . I was driving home today and saw the car being driven in front of me - luckily I had my phone with me and recorded it - I actually couldn't believe it! This was after being told the boot wouldn't close, so they had to use their spouse's car!

Probably best not to tell your insurance company this or the Guards for that matter ?

Ken

walus

Whatever she says now does not matter. What matters is what the guards have written into their report/notes. Get a copy of it and you will know if she has any stand on claiming what she is.

Missyelliot2

ZENER wrote: »

Probably best not to tell your insurance company this or the Guards for that matter ?

Ken

My daughter (who was with me), actually recorded it on my phone...I am so non-techy, it would take me an age to find the camera button!

goz83

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Hi listermint...it was a minute tip - really - it actually looked like a bit of gravel had hit the paintwork. The other bang was on the other side of the car and way too high up for my car to damage it.

I was driving home today and saw the car being driven in front of me - luckily I had my phone with me and recorded it - I actually couldn't believe it! This was after being told the boot wouldn't close, so they had to use their spouse's car!

I called my insurance company to let them know the story. I really feel that this person assessed the situation and thought they would get the other bang sorted out (at my cost!)

If she doesn't get the second bang paid for, a third one might appear on the back of her neck. Sounds like she wanted to squeeze a few quid out of you.

Missyelliot2

goz83 wrote: »

If she doesn't get the second bang paid for, a third one might appear on the back of her neck. Sounds like she wanted to squeeze a few quid out of you.

Absolutely... Exactly how I feel. Just sorry/angry I had to bang into her as she seems so sneaky.
I actually can't get any sleep thinking of this...

goz83

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Absolutely... Exactly how I feel. Just sorry/angry I had to bang into her as she seems so sneaky.
I actually can't get any sleep thinking of this...

Ignore the toe-rag. Let insurance deal with it. You can pay them back ifnyou want.

Missyelliot2

goz83 wrote: »

Ignore the toe-rag. Let insurance deal with it. You can pay them back ifnyou want.

Thank you so much. I spoke to somebody from the insurance company today...so have handed it over to them. Feel so much better now. They're sending somebody out to check my car too.


Thank you all so much for all the advice, help and listening! really mean that.

Comhrá

Keep us updated if you can. We're interested to see how you get on.
Good luck!

Desolation Of Smug

To Elland Back wrote: »

The motor engineer will inspect your vehicle as well as the 3rd party's to see if it can be established where the point of impact is. If there isn't a match to the pre-existing damage, you're in with a shout

Yeah. They will. Or if they're like any of the ones I've ever dealt with, they'll just about know which end the front is. Just about.

H3llR4iser

iwillhtfu wrote: »

...She's entitled to be angry but not threatening...

Nope, she isn't "entitled" to be absolutely anything. It's not like someone ran into her on purpose, and it's not like they drove away leaving her high and dry. Sh1te happens, and she's going to be compensated for the tip. The "angry" act is a scare tactic.

goz83 wrote: »

If she doesn't get the second bang paid for, a third one might appear on the back of her neck. Sounds like she wanted to squeeze a few quid out of you.

I would 100% expect this. Brace for an injury claim.

mikom

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

I had a tip on Thursday- it was 100% my fault. The owner of the other car was really angry (I don't blame her) and she called the guards.
However, it turned out that it was only a paint scrape and I thought that was the end of it. She has just called to say her boot won't close now!

There was a big dent in the boot (nothing to do with me) and that happened prior to Thursday.
I am so upset and don't know what to do - she was quite threatening on the phone. I have taken a photo of the paint scrape, but the boot issue has really knocked me for six.

Thanks in advance

Yer wan sounds like an absolute scumbag.

Missyelliot2

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Nope, she isn't "entitled" to be absolutely anything. It's not like someone ran into her on purpose, and it's not like they drove away leaving her high and dry. Sh1te happens, and she's going to be compensated for the tip. The "angry" act is a scare tactic.



I would 100% expect this. Brace for an injury claim.

I'm just hoping that when the assessor sees the tiny mark on the grille of my car and the tiny mark on the bumper of hers, that It will all work out. Although I absolutely accept responsibility .....I really don't want to fork out for pre-existing damage and definitely not for a imaginary injury.

cerastes

Desolation Of Smug wrote: »

Yeah. They will. Or if they're like any of the ones I've ever dealt with, they'll just about know which end the front is. Just about.

Id always wondered what training or experience assessors had, the few instances I ever came across them, they always seemd like office types, didnt appear to be from the motor trade background so I assumed someone allocated the job within an insurance company.

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

I'm just hoping that when the assessor sees the tiny mark on the grille of my car and the tiny mark on the bumper of hers, that It will all work out. Although I absolutely accept responsibility .....I really don't want to fork out for pre-existing damage and definitely not for a imaginary injury.

Ive seen cars parked up after accidents in a few cases, one will have folded and the other had no apparent damage, I wouldnt rely on it, but maybe it does point to something in some/most cases.

Missyelliot2

cerastes wrote: »

Id always wondered what training or experience assessors had, the few instances I ever came across them, they always seemd like office types, didnt appear to be from the motor trade background so I assumed someone allocated the job within an insurance company.



Ive seen cars parked up after accidents in a few cases, one will have folded and the other had no apparent damage, I wouldnt rely on it, but maybe it does point to something in some/most cases.

This was school run slow....the traffic was crawling - It couldn't have been more than 5mph.

Missyelliot2

Update: Got a letter -
Damage to my car €60
Bumper of the car I did hit €450 (absolutely, he should replace his bumper)
Assessor cost €500



Personal injury awarded to the other person €13,000

€13,000????????? Soft tissue damage? Ah here.....

johnny osbourne

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Update: Got a letter -
Damage to my car €60
Bumper of the car I did hit €450 (absolutely, he should replace his bumper)
Assessor cost €500



Personal injury awarded to the other person €13,000

€13,000????????? Soft tissue damage? Ah here.....

...

dixiefly

You were right, a scumbag like her was always going to milk it for what it was worth.

No wonder all our insurance costs are going through the roof!!

johnny osbourne

dixiefly wrote: »

You were right, a scumbag like her was always going to milk it for what it was worth.

No wonder all our insurance costs are going through the roof!!

i know it's so unfair,

i mean how are we supposed to avoid hitting the cars in front of us?

CiniO

johnny osbourne wrote: »

no offence but tailgaters should be put off the road all together,

And what does it have in common with this thread discussion?
Was OP tailgating? How do you know?

johnny osbourne wrote: »

i know it's so unfair,

i mean how are we supposed to avoid hitting the cars in front of us?

If accident was at 5mph, then how possibly a person could suffer €13k injury?
There's clearly something wrong with the system.
And you might carry on with your stupid comments until you hit someone once you get distracted for a second.

Voodoomelon

Jesus Christ, how this is allowed continue i'll never know. Raging here reading that. :mad:

johnny osbourne

CiniO wrote: »

And what does it have in common with this thread discussion?
Was OP tailgating? How do you know?




If accident was at 5mph, then how possibly a person could suffer €13k injury?
There's clearly something wrong with the system.
And you might carry on with your stupid comments until you hit someone once you get distracted for a second.

sorry i'm just wound up about tail-gating at the moment, the lad i'm working with at the mo is always driving up the arse of other cars, 10 metres space at 50 mph, drives me spare,

Kristopherus

OP, send her a postcard, anonymously of course, wishing her good luck with her €13,000 & informing her that karma is never far away......

pheelay

Disgraceful that this carry on is allowed to continue with the ever increasing insurance costs. These payouts need to come with conditions to keep them honest. I'm surprised that crash-for-cash scams aren't more common over here given that our insurance system is such an easy target :mad:

johnny osbourne

pheelay wrote: »

Disgraceful that this carry on is allowed to continue with the ever increasing insurance costs. These payouts need to come with conditions to keep them honest. I'm surprised that crash-for-cash scams aren't more common over here given that our insurance system is such an easy target :mad:

sure the poor old tailgaters don't stand a chance,

sure it's awful hard to keep a safe distance, with my 2 litre turbo diesel,

arrah sure faith and begorrah your Honor, twas a grand soft day and didn't your wan in front of me drop the anchors, :rolleyes: sure how should i stop my turbo diesel?

do you know that crowd abroad in germany, the folkswagon , sure they might think up a computer and then i wouldn't be drivin up the back of cars at all, do you know, in a way tis kinda all their fault in a way,

Liam McPoyle

Missyelliot2 wrote: »

Update: Got a letter -
Damage to my car €60
Bumper of the car I did hit €450 (absolutely, he should replace his bumper)
Assessor cost €500



Personal injury awarded to the other person €13,000

€13,000????????? Soft tissue damage? Ah here.....

If ever a post illustrated whats wrong with the insurance industry in Ireland its this.

€510 worth of cosmetic damage to a car = €13k for personal injuries.

Its just going to get worse too I fear.

I dont know if people are aware but last year the caps on awards that courts could award were increased last year.

If memory serves correctly the circuit court cap went from I think €16k to around €30k, the district court (think thats the next level) went from around €30k to €60k.

When there are so many people out there willing to make false and exaggerated claims then all I can suggest is that people install dash cams and hope they dont find themselves on the wrong end of a crook. Id also urge people that know/suspect someone of making a bogey claim to report them to insurance confidential, its the only way we can try and stem the tide.

Missyelliot2

Kristopherus wrote: »

OP, send her a postcard, anonymously of course, wishing her good luck with her €13,000 & informing her that karma is never far away......

My feelings exactly....

Missyelliot2

"When there are so many people out there willing to make false and exaggerated claims then all I can suggest is that people install dash cams and hope they dont find themselves on the wrong end of a crook. Id also urge people that know/suspect someone of making a bogey claim to report them to insurance confidential, its the only way we can try and stem the tide."


You are so right! I did call the insurance company, as the assessor advised me to do so, but the insurance company really don't give a toss- they made that enormous payout - no questions asked. (i had sent in photos etc....)


Anyway, I hope the ill-gotten money brings them joy!:o

To Elland Back

Business Cat wrote: »

If ever a post illustrated whats wrong with the insurance industry in Ireland its this.

It's not all down to the Insurance Industry as you well know BC. The rear end is a slam dunk, the claimant obviously supplied medical 'evidence' from a professional who confirmed soft tissue damage, which doesn't show up on x-rays and a solicitor (on the clock) forced it home, quoting the value of the injury using the menu on the Injury Board's website.

The whole system is wrong and it is becoming an epidemic. The general public have no idea how often this is happening

Brian Scan

johnny osbourne wrote: »

no offence but tailgaters should be put off the road all together,

johnny osbourne wrote: »

i know it's so unfair,

i mean how are we supposed to avoid hitting the cars in front of us?

johnny osbourne wrote: »

sure the poor old tailgaters don't stand a chance,

sure it's awful hard to keep a safe distance, with my 2 litre turbo diesel,

arrah sure faith and begorrah your Honor, twas a grand soft day and didn't your wan in front of me drop the anchors, :rolleyes: sure how should i stop my turbo diesel?

do you know that crowd abroad in germany, the folkswagon , sure they might think up a computer and then i wouldn't be drivin up the back of cars at all, do you know, in a way tis kinda all their fault in a way,

Your high horse would probably be able to jump over a car that stopped in front of you.

Did you even read OP's post?

savagethegoat

it's allowed go on because it's cheaper for the Insurance Company to pay out than to fight it in Court. Time we had an independent claims assessor to weed out bad claims and to decide actual damages in real ones.

Wailin

listermint wrote: »

Hi OP,

just to play devils advocate here, how do you know the damage was older than your incident?

my oh was hit by someone 3 weeks back and the two of them thought the damage was minimal but had waited for the guards. I turned up as it was on my way to work. Took one look at the damage and knew straightaway that it was going to be costly. The girl who hit her looked at me like i had two heads. But i could see the paint and stress creases in the rear. So i knew the damage underneath was substantial.

Tried to open the boot and sure enough it popped out at us with force, then it wouldnt close. This girls 'paint scuff' was a damaged rear bumper, a unrepairable rear crumple bar, a misalligned boot lid and all the associated hangers.

I said on the spot 2,500 Euro. She stood there in tears, i wasnt mean or anything just kinda looked and said, Im sorry but its not small. This is what insurance companies are for.

Went to her Insurers appointed garage sure enough 2500 on the nose. I know car parts when i see them and labour and paint. I was spot on.

Some people opinions may not be correct. So i am interested how you knew the damage was not caused by you ?


This girl was travelling about 25-30kmph as she ran into the back of the car and sent it a car length and a bit forward.

Wow aren't you a tough cookie having a woman in tears, bad enough that she crashed her car in the first place, and an expert on repair costs to boot. Well done.

Kenny Logins

Wailin wrote: »

Wow aren't you a tough cookie having a woman in tears, bad enough that she crashed her car in the first place, and an expert on repair costs to boot. Well done.

What should he have said? "Ah, it'll be grand. There, there"?

Liam McPoyle

To Elland Back wrote: »

It's not all down to the Insurance Industry as you well know BC. The rear end is a slam dunk, the claimant obviously supplied medical 'evidence' from a professional who confirmed soft tissue damage, which doesn't show up on x-rays and a solicitor (on the clock) forced it home, quoting the value of the injury using the menu on the Injury Board's website.

The whole system is wrong and it is becoming an epidemic. The general public have no idea how often this is happening

Oh I know, when I say the insurance industry in don't just mean the vendors, I mean all connected stakeholder's.

vintagevrs

This is disgusting. It would put anyone reading it in bad form. That claim will impact your premium for the next 5 years regardless if it was protected, and to think had it been someone else you tipped they could have just sorted it outside insurance and try and not screw everyone around them.

The "No win no fee" companies spring to mind when reading this, and that culture isn't going to stop.


What is the penalty if the claimant is found guilty of telling tales? Not that it would ever happen?

I would imagine giving the money back would be about the height of it.

m-a-i-

Similar issue happened me years back. Literally kissed the car, no damage done but other driver was claiming he had to go to hospital etc. Best to leave to the insurance company. They were a huge help and everything was resolved fairly quickly

dr.fuzzenstein

vintagevrs wrote: »

This is disgusting. It would put anyone reading it in bad form. That claim will impact your premium for the next 5 years regardless if it was protected, and to think had it been someone else you tipped they could have just sorted it outside insurance and try and not screw everyone around them.

The "No win no fee" companies spring to mind when reading this, and that culture isn't going to stop.


What is the penalty if the claimant is found guilty of telling tales? Not that it would ever happen?

I would imagine giving the money back would be about the height of it.

They can't be found out, ever. That's the problem. You just need to get Dr Nick Riviera and Saul Goodman and together they can bamboozle the average drunk loon on the bench of a circuit court into giving you any amount of money. Judges hand out damages like sweets, one would have to wonder if they're getting a cut of the action. Maybe they do from the solicitors, because that is a never ending cash bonanza to them, remember, whatever the claimant gets, the solicitors get a multitude of that!
If it goes to court, the insurance company will pay not only the damage (and the judge may decide €20k is a more reasonable payout for "ouch my neck hurts a bit"), but also the solicitor's fee and that could be €40k. So your €13k has now snowballed into €60k. Plus a bit on top in court costs.
Now you know why insurance companies immediately throw wads of cash at you if there's even a sniff of a chance of a claim. They're hoping to shut you up with €13k before you come to your senses and decide you want to go for more.

Unless the government decides they want to make claiming a hell of a lot more difficult and cut payouts by at LEAST 50% nothing will change.
And one wonders if the government really is in the mood to spit in the soup of their very good friends and relatives (how many politicians are barristers and solicitors?) of the legal trade? I think not. So a corrupt money racket and an entire country held hostage by a few greedy moneybags will continue and as we have seen by the upping of the award caps, get worse in the future. It's a scam and a racket and it is protected by the government.

I sent a letter to the minsiter of transport, Paschal Donohoe, but have only received a reply that they received my mail.
Will I ever hear anything? Will I fcuk.

CJhaughey

This is the result of the government not reforming the legal system when the Troika was looking to do so.
The legal profession fought tooth and nail against the reform of the system and it appears to have worked.

You can now see they have carte-blanche to do whatever they want, campaign to raise the minimum payout and its done.

What a shambles this is turning into and unless some Government in the future finds a set of balls (unlikely) and starts to break the legal cartel this is going to end up in Insurance and other things being unaffordable to many more people.

The system is broken and relying on the legal profession to act honourably and morally is unlikely to result in a good outcome.

To Elland Back

savagethegoat wrote: »

Time we had an independent claims assessor to weed out bad claims and to decide actual damages in real ones.

If you could identify a person capable of doing that successfully, Insurers would be lining up to employ him/her and pay them more than Lionel Messi

Experience_day

13k?

I had a fellow drive into the side of my car at a junction and rip half the front off. Never even occured to me to claim, even with my sore neck, knees (???) and shoulders.

Either I was a mug or people are just scumbags.

razorblunt

Wow, this is one of the worst posts I read in a while. Awful bad luck it happened to you OP.
It really is disgusting the lengths some folk will go to, karma never seems to catch up to people like this.

I was the 3rd car in a 4 car crash about 10 years ago, the girl who crashed into me wrote her car off, thanfully the damage in 3,2 and 1 was relatively minor, but none of us claimed any injuries. Could have been a nightmare if we all did.

I hope you have NCB and you're not affected too much.

dr.fuzzenstein

Experience_day wrote: »

13k?

I had a fellow drive into the side of my car at a junction and rip half the front off. Never even occured to me to claim, even with my sore neck, knees (???) and shoulders.

Either I was a mug or people are just scumbags.

Either is possible and I know how you feel...
Over the last 10 years or more, I was in 3 accidents that were not my fault.
A car passed a queue of cars on a country road and so ended up on my side of the road 5 meters in front of me and me doing 80k (MASSIVE crash), a young lady driver rear ended me at a traffic lights and shunted me into the car in front and a guy pulled out 5 meters in front of me whilst looking the other way.
I could have gotten payouts from 20 to 60k with the right amount of "proven" injury by the right doctor (some of which seem only too happy to write you up for any injury you want) and the right shyster solicitor, meaning I could have paid off half my fcuking mortgage with that.
There is part of me that thinks "sh*t! why didn't I claim!"
But there's part of me that thinks "because I was not injured even in the slightest in any of those crashes" and I'm basically honest, despite my best efforts.
Of course I got my car fixed up or at least paid for in the first crash (it was a complete write-off), i am honest, but I'm not stupid.
If I was in a crash and I was genuinely injured and maybe unable to work, i would want some compensation and that's the whole point of it, but a lot of people just see it as a free lottery.