20 years ago today

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 4:21pm #1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOhQp8ENmzs

http://www.the42.ie/lansdowne-roads-riots-921125-Feb2015/

Fair play to how the Gardai reacted to it. They sure as fcuk didn't hold back when it came to giving those BNP supporting, Neo-Nazi retards what they deserved.

anncoates · 15-02-2015 4:23pm

To be fair, I think anybody coming out of that away end just got bashed that day, not just the lads that wrecked the stand.

You could just picture police forces all over Europe looking with disbelief at where the Gardai and FAI situated English away supporters at an Ireland natch.

corner of hells · 15-02-2015 4:26pm

I had two cousins in that stadium that night, neither of them would of the shy retiring type , both earned their wages that night as young Gardai.

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 4:27pm

anncoates wrote: »

You could just picture police forces all over Europe looking with disbelief at where the Gardai and FAI situated English away supporters at an Ireland natch.

Also the fact that they turned down assistance from the UK's NCIS, and failed to act on intel handed to them.

I still think they reacted to trouble on the night well though

anncoates · 15-02-2015 4:30pm

My name is URL wrote: »

I still think they reacted to trouble on the night well though

Id be more of the intelligent containment school of football policing rather than breaking the heads of anybody trying to come out of the away end.

Not that I care about the NF and C18 types that got a hiding, mind you.

Ruu · 15-02-2015 4:31pm

Love that Network 2 logo!

Good summary of events at the link, could have been much worse had the Garda not stepped in.

A friend of mine and his son were there that night as well, thankfully unharmed.

SEPT 23 1989 · 15-02-2015 4:32pm

Did they actually arrest the handfull who started it?

Tugboats · 15-02-2015 4:32pm

Come along away since those scenes. In May we will have half n half scarves and selfies

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 4:34pm

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Did they actually arrest the handfull who started it?

Gardai arrested 40 people and dozens more were arrested and charged when they arrived back in England. Some were banned from attending football matches for life.

The_Valeyard · 15-02-2015 4:34pm

Remember as a young lad watching it on tv. Also remembering my dad saying there will be trouble as the fans coming over had no intention of watching a match, out to cause mayhem.

English soccer fans had a terrible reputation back then.

Gardai did what had to be done.

Donkey Oaty · 15-02-2015 4:36pm

I reckon that video is a hoax.

For a start, what is this "Lansdowne Road" stadium that they speak of? Any international would be played at Croke Park or the Aviva.

Also, there is no ferry service from Dun Laoghaire.

Thirdly, there's a disgracefully rude word audible at around 3.40-3.45 which RTE would not allow in a news bulletin.

Menas · 15-02-2015 4:37pm

That was my first ever international match. We were in the stand opposite so not in danger, but it was a mad evening all together.

Tugboats · 15-02-2015 4:40pm

Trigger Happy wrote: »

That was my first ever international match. We were in the stand opposite so not in danger, but it was a mad evening all together.

Are you still waiting for a refund from the FAI?

Menas · 15-02-2015 4:44pm

Tugboats wrote: »

Are you still waiting for a refund from the FAI?

There was none offered from what I remember. Still have the ticket stub.

pipelaser · 15-02-2015 4:58pm

I love Paul McGraths reaction, typical Paul..

Frynge · 15-02-2015 5:03pm

Jack charlton grabbing your man by the scruff of the neck.

Ahhh classic jack.

eh i dunno · 15-02-2015 5:14pm

Was at the game and sitting below the English that night. Was only 15 and remember the coins coming down first, then the metal bars from under the seats. I ended up on the pitch to get away from them. Still remember looking up at them and the look of pure hatred in their eyes. Shameful stuff

Son Of A Vidic · 15-02-2015 5:16pm

corner of hells wrote: »

I had two cousins in that stadium that night, neither of them would of the shy retiring type , both earned their wages that night as young Gardai.

There was a news clip of a Garda sitting on his motorbike, watching some scumbags make their way towards the ferry. Three/four guys had passed him by and one of them shouted something back at him. The Garda hops of his bike, pulls out a baton, chases him down and cracks him over the head. Brought tears of joy to my eyes it did.

Venus In Furs · 15-02-2015 5:24pm

Jesus, 20 years ago - I remember it being a very stormy night too. How symbolic.

The guards' reaction was haphazard and frenzied. As said, it got to the point where innocent people who got in the way got a clobbering across the head.
Eventually it just looked like a bunch of guards going on a rampage with their batons because they *could*, not like an organised, carefully orchestrated operation, which is what riot police intervention should be, no matter how vile the scummers were (and they were damn vile).

If I, a 16-year-old girl at the time with a vague knowledge of football culture, predicted there would be a lot of trouble, how in the blazes did An Garda Siochána/FAI not?

A vocal minority of England away supporters were notorious at that very time for hooliganism, sometimes politically motivated. It was known that some of them had connections to the National Front/Combat 18, which in turn had connections to loyalist paramilitaries. It wasn't six months after the IRA ceasefire, and not two years since the Warrington bombing.
It was a no-brainer that there was going to be trouble from a collection of scumbags, and it was utterly stupid and reckless for this not to be prepared for.

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 5:27pm

Trigger Happy wrote: »

There was none offered from what I remember. Still have the ticket stub.

I'm not sure if this is the reason that no refunds were offered but the FAI were pressing hard for an apology from the English FA citing that they shouldn't have supplied tickets to known hooligans and political groups, which they did.

The FA never did accept responsibility for that, but perhaps if the FAI had offered refunds it would have been seen as them accepting responsibility for what happened.

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 5:38pm

Venus In Furs wrote: »

The guards' reaction was haphazard and frenzied.

In your opinion. Gardai and stewards had warned supporters to stay in their section, which they didn't. If Gardai hadn't mounted a baton charge then the trouble makers would have dispersed into the wider crowd and god knows how many more people would have got caught up in it.

If so many innocents were targeted then how come there were never any complaints made or charges pressed against Gardai?

Haphazard my bollix tbh. Look at the London riots a few years ago when police sat on their hands and done nothing to tackle rioters for 3 days, and the amount of people injured and killed, and property damaged as a result of their failure to deal with it effectively.

Hitchens · 15-02-2015 5:59pm

Garda bashing is alive and well then

Venus In Furs · 15-02-2015 6:02pm

Hitchens wrote: »

Garda bashing is alive and well then

Wrong thread I'd say, seeing as people are defending the garda on this one.

Venus In Furs · 15-02-2015 6:02pm

My name is URL wrote: »

In your opinion. Gardai and stewards had warned supporters to stay in their section, which they didn't. If Gardai hadn't mounted a baton charge then the trouble makers would have dispersed into the wider crowd and god knows how many more people would have got caught up in it.

If so many innocents were targeted then how come there were never any complaints made or charges pressed against Gardai?

Haphazard my bollix tbh. Look at the London riots a few years ago when police sat on their hands and done nothing to tackle rioters for 3 days, and the amount of people injured and killed, and property damaged as a result of their failure to deal with it effectively.

Fair points, if a little unnecessarily hostile.

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 6:10pm

Venus In Furs wrote: »

Fair points, if a little unnecessarily hostile.

Sorry if it appeared hostile. That wasn't my intention. I need to choose my words more carefully!

coopdog85 · 15-02-2015 6:21pm

I was there with my dad & brother that night. I was 10 & didn't really understand what was happening at the time as we were right up the back of the lower stand, directly below the English. I can vividly remember the hatred in the English voices before & after the national anthems. I can remember the coins & missiles hitting people about 50 feet in front of us & I will always remember the roar that went up & the noise of their feet as they jumped up & down like animals above us. My dad still maintains that if any of the English had ventured down the stairs into our section there would have been deaths. The stairs leading from the upper west stand to our section was completely free of any police/stewarding. They could have just waded into a full section of irish that was full of men & children.

A horrible evening & one that thankfully didn't result in more serious injuries or deaths. Although, one man died of a heart attack in the seats behind the goal.

tomwaterford · 15-02-2015 6:25pm

Hitchens wrote: »

Garda bashing is alive and well then

from a famil which has its own issues with gaurdsd going back generations....nothing serious as such (have cousins gaurds etc..just wary of em)

the grandmother said at the time....it was the first time she was ever really proud of the gaurds in her life....they got a lot of respect that day

Super-Rush · 15-02-2015 6:31pm

It was the first game i ever went to and it was fairly terrifying that night.

We never realised what was going on until a piece of a seat cracked a guys head 3 or 4 rows in front of us. Stewards were urging us out of the area telling us we needed to give the Gardai room to get a good swing at them.

A lot of the blame was laid at the feet of Combat 18 that night, but several firms from England traveled over for the game as well to cause trouble.

Berserker · 15-02-2015 7:02pm

The_Valeyard wrote: »

English soccer fans had a terrible reputation back then.

Going to games in England was a nightmare back in those days and the national team was an extension of that. To their credit, the English FA and police have done an excellent job cleaning things up and football in England is a far more pleasant experience nowadays. Passports are checked at ports and fans have to collect their tickets when they reach their destination.

My name is URL wrote: »

I'm not sure if this is the reason that no refunds were offered but the FAI were pressing hard for an apology from the English FA citing that they shouldn't have supplied tickets to known hooligans and political groups, which they did.

Bit cheeky of the FAI to point the finger of blame at another association regarding ticketing. Tickets were not sold to any political group. They were sold on a first come, first served basis from the club ticket offices. I know a West Ham fan who was present that day and he got his via his club. That was the fashion in which tickets were distributed in those days.

Menas · 15-02-2015 7:07pm

My name is URL wrote: »

I'm not sure if this is the reason that no refunds were offered but the FAI were pressing hard for an apology from the English FA citing that they shouldn't have supplied tickets to known hooligans and political groups, which they did.

The FA never did accept responsibility for that, but perhaps if the FAI had offered refunds it would have been seen as them accepting responsibility for what happened.

I always thought that the reason there were no refunds was that the match was not cancelled until after 60 minutes....and there was some 60 minute rule in place.... But I am not 100% sure.

saintsaltynuts · 15-02-2015 7:08pm

Me Da still has his ticket wanting a refund.He's a miserable fecker altogether.

tomwaterford · 15-02-2015 7:09pm

saintsaltynuts wrote: »

Me Da still has his ticket wanting a refund.He's a miserable fecker altogether.

be probably worth way more to sell on ebay now id say

Berserker · 15-02-2015 7:11pm

Trigger Happy wrote: »

I always thought that the reason there were no refunds was that the match was not cancelled until after 60 minutes....and there was some 60 minute rule in place.... But I am not 100% sure.

It was abandoned in the first half.

saintsaltynuts · 15-02-2015 7:12pm

26 Minutes i think.

Menas · 15-02-2015 7:16pm

Berserker wrote: »

It was abandoned in the first half.

Yup, you are right. My memory is not what it shoudl be!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lansdowne_Road_football_riot

Dyr · 15-02-2015 7:29pm

I remember being told years later that the gardai deputized a lot of stewards into their ranks, basically gave them batons and told them not to spare the timber

another rumour was a lot of england fans got a bit of a send off afterwards from locals around the north wall/ dublin port

My name is URL · 15-02-2015 7:30pm

Berserker wrote: »

Going to games in England was a nightmare back in those days and the national team was an extension of that. To their credit, the English FA and police have done an excellent job cleaning things up and football in England is a far more pleasant experience nowadays. Passports are checked at ports and fans have to collect their tickets when they reach their destination.

Bit cheeky of the FAI to point the finger of blame at another association regarding ticketing. Tickets were not sold to any political group. They were sold on a first come, first served basis from the club ticket offices. I know a West Ham fan who was present that day and he got his via his club. That was the fashion in which tickets were distributed in those days.

I haven't been to an international game abroad in years, but is that not still how tickets are allocated and sold to away fans? There's a responsibility for clubs and other ticket agents to take steps to ensure that known hooligans or groups are not supplied with tickets.

English authorities knew that such groups and individuals were buying tickets so there's no reason to assume that agents or clubs didn't. This was at a time when there was already a big crackdown going on against allowing hooligans to travel to away matches.

Neither football association was without fault imo, but the responsibility ultimately lies with individuals who traveled for no other reason than to cause trouble.

Bambi wrote: »

another rumour was a lot of england fans got a bit of a send off afterwards from locals around the north wall/ dublin port

They were also met off the boat by Welsh police who thought that Christmas had come early for them! Anyone still mouthing off at that point were treated to an extra round of what they had received in Dublin.

PoxyBollock · 15-02-2015 7:34pm

Shambolic would be the words I'd use to describe the Gardai and FAI concerning the event. It was like the perfect mix of ignorance and arrogance. Especially the Gardai. And some people are congratulating them? This was certainly avoidable. There was advanced knowledge from the British authorities that something was going to take place.

Why weren't more Gardai in place from the get go? And why were the English fans in a upper tier?

Here's a great quote from Bernard O' Byrne, formerly of the FAI, a chief executive before he got the wrong end of Delaney, talking complete ****ing bollock:

“That night is etched in my memory. I had the dubious distinction of being the head of security for the match. We had a lot of meetings with the Gardaí and with the English FA. We expected a small amount of dubious fans to come from England. We had about three of four times the amount of meetings, preparations and rehearsals that we would have before any other match. There had been some tensions before. We expected some kind of incident but we still expected a good sporting occasion.”

Berserker · 15-02-2015 7:36pm

My name is URL wrote: »

I haven't been to an international game abroad in years, but is that not still how tickets are allocated and sold to away fans? There's a responsibility for clubs and other ticket agents to take steps to ensure that known hooligans or groups are not supplied with tickets.

They are allocated through the official association and the fans have to collect them in the city where the game is taking place. They have to bring passport id when collecting them. That is the way it is done, unless it has changed recently.

Even for RoI away tickets, you have to submit a passport number and personal details for each ticket you apply for. If you travel with a travel agent you don't need to do the above, of course.

Citizen2011 · 15-02-2015 7:38pm

The Cavan men still discussing if they can get a refund 20 years later.

Citizen2011 · 15-02-2015 7:39pm

Trigger Happy wrote: »

I always thought that the reason there were no refunds was that the match was not cancelled until after 60 minutes....and there was some 60 minute rule in place.... But I am not 100% sure.

The Cavan men still discussing if they can get a refund twenty years later

anncoates · 15-02-2015 10:00pm

My name is URL wrote: »

If so many innocents were targeted then how come there were never any complaints made or charges pressed against Gardai?
.

It wouldn't do any good to complain abut getting bashed in the wrong. Most people will just assume everybody in the away end deserved it.

if memory serves, it looked like were bashing away supporters randomly as they filtered out. It's probably one of the rare times you know you won't get into trouble for battering anybody in there.

Like I said though, any NF and C18 types that got battered that night, or anybody throwing stuff down, I'm happy with that.

It was a bit of an embarrassment that it was allowed to happen in the first place.

SharpshooterTom · 15-02-2015 10:19pm

England still have these elements in their ranks, especially their away support, which would still be quite anti-Irish, you could see that when they played Scotland at Celtic park with all the IRA stuff unnecessarily brought up.

I don't have a problem wishing Britains Olympic teams, England's cricket team or England's rugby team well, since their fans are dead on, but the football team I still feel uncomfortable wishing well given their strong links to ulster loyalism and anti-Irish sentiment overall which still exists within some of their support.

hidinginthebush · 15-02-2015 10:30pm

Ah I remember it surprisingly well. An 11 year old me and my 14 year old brother in the south end schoolboy terrace, perfect vantage point for the shenanigans, but far away enough that they didn't target our section. The Bedlam going on, 20 foot sections of seats being thrown into the lower stand below them. Never been so happy than seeing the Garai absolutely mill into the pack of animals and beating the living shite out of them.

Truth be told we were very relieved when we met our dad later, he was in the east stand with the grown ups.

kfallon · 15-02-2015 10:36pm

The RTE coverage, Ger Canning talking about the 'fantastic atmosphere' :pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBeDSFGzShg

A Dub in Glasgo · 15-02-2015 10:44pm

The video in the OP is only 240p :eek:

BBJBIG · 15-02-2015 10:47pm

Jayz - will yis look at de Nardai wallopin de shoite ourra dem ... :P

Cienciano · 15-02-2015 11:04pm

While it's great seeing english knackers getting their heads cracked, you have to wonder why the gardai ignored the info the english police were offering? And why did they refuse extra help on it? And considering they knew a large hooligan contingent were coming over for the match, maybe it wouldn't be a good idea to put them in the upper tier?