Doctor in Ireland that prescribes Natural Desiccated Thyroid?

Under_Graduate

The GP I have been attending was unfamiliar with this.
He did offer to prescribe Eltroxin, but from what I've read on the website
stopthethyroidmadness.com
that often proves insufficient/ineffective.

Anyone know a GP (preferably in the west) that prescribes them with NDT?

locum-motion

Under_Graduate wrote: »

The GP I have been attending was unfamiliar with this.
He did offer to prescribe Eltroxin, but from what I've read on the website
stopthethyroidmadness.com
that often proves insufficient/ineffective.

Anyone know a GP (preferably in the west) that prescribes them with NDT?

(My emphasis)


Why don't you wait and see if is sufficient or effective for you before you throw it out the window based on what some website says? OK, so maybe it isn't the right thing for absolutely everybody, but it is the right thing for the vast majority of people. If you're one of the majority, then great - there's no problem.

The one and only patient I've ever dispensed dessicated thyroid to persuaded her GP to write a script for it based on what she'd read on the internet. She recently switched to plain old Eltroxin instead, and is FAR better on it.

Graces7

Under_Graduate wrote: »

The GP I have been attending was unfamiliar with this.
He did offer to prescribe Eltroxin, but from what I've read on the website
stopthethyroidmadness.com
that often proves insufficient/ineffective.

Anyone know a GP (preferably in the west) that prescribes them with NDT?

I get natural thyroid extract by post for a relative who cannot take eltroxin due to other medical issues. Have a look at the UK Thyroid support groups on line, the case stories which i where I got that idea from. It i classed as a food supplement and needs no prescription. She is very happy and stable on it

locum-motion

Graces7 wrote: »

I get natural thyroid extract by post for a relative who cannot take eltroxin due to other medical issues. Have a look at the UK Thyroid support groups on line, the case stories which i where I got that idea from. It i classed as a food supplement and needs no prescription. She is very happy and stable on it

Thyroid extract is most definitely a medicine*, not a food supplement.

However, there is no product that contains it that is a Authorised Medicinal Product. (ie. no manufacturer has obtained a Product Authorisation from the Health Products Regulatory Agency (formerly IMB))

It therefore falls into a category that is known as EMPs (Exempt** Medicinal Products) which were formerly known as ULMs (UnLicensed Medicines). These are medical products that are imported from abroad especially to satisfy a particular requirement that cannot be satisfied by any currently available Authorised MP.

In Ireland, for a medicine to be available without a prescription, one of two things has to happen:

either

a) The drug is listed in the Medicinal Products (Prescription & Control of Supply) Regulations (as amended) as being exempt from prescription control (Thyroid extract is NOT so listed)

or

b) The HPRA has granted a Product Authorisation that specifies the product is exempt from prescription control.
(By definition, this cannot have occurred in the case of an EMP)

ALL 'EMP's are prescription only in Ireland.

Also, it is an offence to import medicines into Ireland (unless you hold the appropriate license).

Additionally, the Medicinal Products (Prescription & Control of Supply) Regulations makes it an offence to supply or obtain medicines via 'mail order'. In fact, it's even illegal to even send an order for a medicine via the telecommunications network.

Whatever supplier you're using abroad cares nothing about Irish law; they just want to comply with their own local laws, which may be different.

However, what you are doing in Ireland is probably illegal under Irish law for at least six different reasons:

1. Soliciting a supply of medicine via the telecommunications network
2. Obtaining medicines via mail-order
3. Importing medicines without a license
4. Supplying a medicine subject to prescription control without a prescription
5. Supplying a medicine subject to prescription control from a premises that is not a registered Retail Pharmacy Business
6. Supplying a medicine subject to prescription control other than under the direct control and supervision of a registered Pharmacist.

I would suggest you get your relative's Doctor to prescribe it for her, and then get in touch with your local pharmacy.


* A medicine is defined as "(a) Any substance or combination of substances presented as having properties for treating or preventing disease in human beings; or (b) Any substance or combination of substances which may be used in or administered to human beings either with a view to restoring, correcting or modifying physiological functions by exerting a pharmacological, immunological or metabolic action, or to making a medical diagnosis."

** 'Exempt' in this context means 'Exempt from having to have a PA', not 'Exempt from prescription control'.

Emme

Locum-Motion (where did you get that username ) you are correct about the legal end of things. I don't think that NDT should be available as a food supplement. However it should be available through all endocrinologists and GPs as an option for treating thyroid disease. If it were more widely available thyroid patients wouldn't be putting themselves at risk by obtaining it through underground methods without a prescription. Some thyroid patients do well on T4 but if all thyroid patients were happy and feeling well on T4 they would not be seeking other options.

If NDT were more widely available through legitimate routes such as GPs and endocrinologists people would not be forced to find other ways to get it. If thyroid patients report feeling better on NDT than on T4 alone why won't doctors prescribe it? The mantra is "T4 is the gold standard for thyroid treatment" but very few doctors listen to what thyroid patients say about how they feel from day to day. Ideally T4 converts to T3 in the thyroid patient's body but sometimes there are problems with conversion and the patient doesn't benefit from T4 alone. There is anecdotal evidence to back this up. OK, anecdotal evidence isn't taken as seriously as peer reviewed research but that is no reason to dismiss it altogether.

If all endocrinologists and the powers that be in the Irish Medicine Board had thyroid problems the treatment options available might be a lot different.

Carawaystick

[QUOTE=locum-motion;94169241

* A medicine is defined as "(a) Any substance or combination of substances presented as having properties for treating or preventing disease in human beings; or (b) Any substance or combination of substances which may be used in or administered to human beings either with a view to restoring, correcting or modifying physiological functions by exerting a pharmacological, immunological or metabolic action, or to making a medical diagnosis."
[/QUOTE]

That would seem to include coffee, tea, chocolate and nutmeg. Is it an incomplete definition?

locum-motion

Carawaystick wrote: »

That would seem to include coffee, tea, chocolate and nutmeg. Is it an incomplete definition?

That's not my definition. It's the EU's.

http://ec.europa.eu/health/files/eudralex/vol-1/dir_2004_27/dir_2004_27_en.pdf

It's at the bottom of the first column on Pg 3.

Graces7

Yes I expected some of this but in this case the thyroid extract is headed for Canada and I have no qualms re acting as go between. Ok I am holding my hands out for the handcuffs! I read the case histories on the UK thyroid support groups and made a decision which I have never regretted for my family member's care. In her case the other meds are contraindicated and the drs offered no alternative. Whatever works...

armabelle

Under_Graduate wrote: »

The GP I have been attending was unfamiliar with this.
He did offer to prescribe Eltroxin, but from what I've read on the website
stopthethyroidmadness.com
that often proves insufficient/ineffective.

Anyone know a GP (preferably in the west) that prescribes them with NDT?

You can buy from a pharmacy in Andorra without prescription but they sell ERFA only and that has very bad user experience. Armour and ERFA both seem to be tainted at the moment.

Desiccated thyroid helped my wife a lot. she never knew about it until 5 years ago and since starting to take it, she has felt much much better.

stopthethyroidmadness.com is a great site and invaluable resource for anyone with thyroid problems

Gremlinertia

I'll leave the last post but lock the thread as it's a zombie