Psychiatric Nursing in Ireland

curly0106

Hello all

Long time lurker on this site. Just wondering if anyone here is able to offer some advice. I’m a psychiatric nurse, from England. In the very early stages of considering a move to Ireland.

I ‘qualified’ in 2008 and since this have worked continuously, initially as a staff nurse in an inpatient rehab service (for circa 10 months) and after this as a community psychiatric nurse (CPN) in a community mental health team, where I continue to work to this day. Both these services are NHS.

To cut to the chase, I fancy a change of scenery. The stress in my current role is near on intolerable. All the old rhetoric; budget cuts, staff shortages, dangerously high workloads and far, far too much emphasis put on paperwork. Added to the fact that the pay is dreadful when considering the responsibility I (and others in my position) are expected to hold. Having said this, I wouldn’t mind the current pay I receive if it wasn’t for the fact that I am completely priced out of buying a house in this part of England (I recently turned 29 and still live with the parents with absolutely no prospect of being able to buy a house of my own anytime soon).

This is leading me to consider a possible move to Ireland. I’m sure of course there is plenty of work related stress in Irish psychiatric services too, but I would welcome the personal developments that a possible move bring. My parents are Irish and I am a regular visitor. This is obviously very different from living and working there, but from what I see, the standard of living seems better than what I am currently experiencing. Particularly, less overcrowding than what we have here in England and housing that actually seems affordable (particularly outside of Dublin).

Is there anyone on this forum who has first hand experience of working as MH Nurse in both England and Ireland? I’d be keen to hear your take on how they differ? Is it a reasonable transition to make?

I’d obviously need to brush up on the Irish Mental Health Act.

One big worry is that i don’t hold a degree. My qualification is a diploma. Although I qualified relatively recently, nursing was not an all degree profession in England when I started, in fact the university I studied at did not offer a degree course in mental health nursing for trainee nurses thus I undertook the diploma. I know that nursing has been an all degree profession in Ireland for some time. Would this make it extremely difficult, despite my experience?

What are the independent hospitals like to work for?

I take it that it would be near on impossible to secure a job in a HSE hospital at this current time? (i know the embargo was lifted last year, but would assume that preference would, rightly, go to Irish trained nurses?).

Any advice, no matter how honest, would be much appreciated.

Thank you.

ali1971

You could look at contacting NMBI to register as a nurse here as that can possibly take a good few months.
Jobs I'd say would be mostly in Dublin currently but this may change as there had been a recruitment ban for a few years. There are a few psychiatric private hospitals as well in Dublin. Keep an eye out for vacancies on the HSE website. There was a national recruitment nearly 3 years ago for jobs down in the country hospitals etc and I believe another one a few months ago. I know someone who is on that panel nearly 3 years ago for a job in the north west! Newly qualified staff are being employed in the hospitals they trained in too.

There are still plenty of nurses around with the diploma qualification here so don't let that worry you. You have good experience. Accommodation is expensive in Dublin, perhaps you have relatives there or could travel in.
Anyway good luck what ever you decide to do.

curly0106

ali1971 wrote: »

You could look at contacting NMBI to register as a nurse here as that can possibly take a good few months.
Jobs I'd say would be mostly in Dublin currently but this may change as there had been a recruitment ban for a few years. There are a few psychiatric private hospitals as well in Dublin. Keep an eye out for vacancies on the HSE website. There was a national recruitment nearly 3 years ago for jobs down in the country hospitals etc and I believe another one a few months ago. I know someone who is on that panel nearly 3 years ago for a job in the north west! Newly qualified staff are being employed in the hospitals they trained in too.

There are still plenty of nurses around with the diploma qualification here so don't let that worry you. You have good experience. Accommodation is expensive in Dublin, perhaps you have relatives there or could travel in.
Anyway good luck what ever you decide to do.

ali1971, many thanks for taking the time to reply. Very useful info.

Regards

Kristopherus

To add to Ali 1971's advice, get cracking on the registration straight away There are 1000 nurses due to retire by next June. The arising shortage of staff will be affected mostly in the Mental Health Service. In Ireland Psychiatric nurses can retire at 55yrs of age and most actually do retire.

http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/generation-emigration/emigrant-nurses-would-you-return-to-ireland-1.2073945

curly0106

Kristopherus wrote: »

To add to Ali 1971's advice, get cracking on the registration straight away There are 1000 nurses due to retire by next June. The arising shortage of staff will be affected mostly in the Mental Health Service. In Ireland Psychiatric nurses can retire at 55yrs of age and most actually do retire.

Thanks Kristopherus, good advice. Cheers for sharing that link, really interesting stuff. This has been a pipe dream of mine for a while but it sounds like the coming year could be a great opportunity to make the move.

Frito

I qualified under the project 2000 scheme in 2001, worked in NHS for a few years before moving here.

An bord Altranais were slow with my accreditation, took about five months and an aunt who knew a TD before I was registered! I had my job already organised and my manager employed me as a care assistant for three months until I got my registration. It didn't matter too much as I was new to the tax system so paid very little for the first few months.

You will find some difference in service provision and structure - there's no crisis resolution, early intervention, rehabilitation directorate etc state-wide, although there are some local teams. There is (acute psych obviously-different services for under and over 65s although not always a formal transition/graduation), liaison psychiatry, CAMHS, drug and alcohol treatment. Rehab and CMHT comes under acute psych-same consultant. Only one forensic centre in Dundrum. The skill mix here is usually centred around qualified staff so you're unlikely to be in charge of a team of care assistants (dunno how long that will continue, there are always efficiency drives). Advanced nurse practitioners have emerged within last four/five years approx.

Do check with the psych nurses association (PNA) as there is a current dispute with an bord Altranais regarding retention fees payable by members, that are over the amount agreed under the Haddington road agreement (public sector pay review). An bord Altranais are the only registering body that have increased their fees above the agreed amount (iirc). Not sure if this will affect you as a new entrant but check on the PNA website.

Regarding the mental health act, you can research it for interview but the HSE has online learning for staff and the MHA is one of the topics. I have some experience but out of the loop for a while so the info I'm about to give may not be upto date. The MHA is broadly similar to the UK, main differences are no differentiation between assessment and treatment orders-although consent to treatment has been initiated, no restriction on voluntary status, automatic right of appeal (nurses don't usually give reports). Nurses ARE NOT responsible for accepting and faxing paperwork to the mental health commission (MHC). No social workers involved in detention process. No reams of paperwork for section 17 equivalent, and no 117-no CPA!!!! There is a coordinator role in some approved centres (legal definition of institution where patients are detained) but I'm not sure if the MHC have made this mandatory. My recollection is the paperwork was nowhere near as bad as CPA.
There are minor differences in prescribing, NICE guidelines obviously aren't mandatory but are often considered (in my experience). I don't think formal seclusion is widely used, but where it is used, it's monitored by the MHC rather than the HsE.
There is no capacity legislation - there is a bill drawn up but I don't think it has been enacted yet.

Again, I've given info to the best of my knowledge but please double-check!

curly0106

Frito, thats really useful stuff. Thanks very much for taking the time to write such a detailed reply. I shall look into those issues to see if they are still the case.

CNurse

Hi there,

I know that this was originally posted in 2014 but I was wondering if you moved to Ireland and if so how did it go? I have just qualified from the UK and have moved back to Ireland with the intention of registering as an RPN here. I will be starting my job as a HCA until my registration comes through. I have completed the online training for the Irish MHA and seem to have somewhat got my head around the differences. Any other tips? Also how long did the registration take? Did they ask you to complete any further training?

Thanks