Motorbikes on inter city train?

IsaacWunder

Is it possible to bring a (small) motorbike on Irish Rail inter city trains? Specifically the Dublin-Limerick and Cork-Dublin routes?

foggy_lad

No.

http://www.irishrail.ie/travel-information/luggage

Not Permitted in Stations or on Trains

Items deemed to be illegal
Loaded firearms, explosive or inflammable articles or materials
Radioactive or corrosive products, cylinders containing compressed or liquefied gases
Motor cycles and motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour
Poisonous or infectious materials which may be harmful to health
See our section on Travelling with Animals
Go to our find your station section for information on left luggage facilities

IsaacWunder

foggy_lad wrote: »

No.

http://www.irishrail.ie/travel-information/luggage

Surely that means the fuel tank must be empty, not no motorbikes?

foggy_lad

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Surely that means the fuel tank must be empty, not no motorbikes?

Irish Rail do not carry small freight items which a motorcycle would be. It is not a bicycle which can be carried and even if it was allowed there are only a few trains each day that could accommodate it to Cork or as far as Limerick Junction.

http://www.irishrail.ie/travel-information/bicycle-information

If you are travelling with your bicycle, please note the following:

Customers should walk with their bicycles when they are in the station. It is not permitted to cycle in stations or on platforms
Customers should use ramps and lifts rather than stairs within stations to gain access to platforms
Customers should stay with their bicycles onboard trains
Unaccompanied children cannot bring bicycles onto trains
No motorised bicycles are allowed on trains
No bicycles with attached trailers are allowed on trains
Always use available bicycle storage spaces provided
Never obstruct exits or passageways

IsaacWunder

foggy_lad wrote: »

Irish Rail do not carry small freight items which a motorcycle would be. It is not a bicycle which can be carried and even if it was allowed there are only a few trains each day that could accommodate it to Cork or as far as Limerick Junction.

http://www.irishrail.ie/travel-information/bicycle-information

That rule is under the bicycle section. A "motorised bicycle" is not a motorbike.

I'm not stupid, and I can use Google. Anything you've posted is either general knowledge or just pulled off the Irish Rail website (which I checked before posting, obviously) and isn't anything that could be considered an answer to my question. I know only a few trains could accommodate a motorbike (it's hardly going to be allowed in a rail car) and I realise they're not going to let a bike on a train with a full tank of petrol as is a fire risk.

Captain Chaos

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I'm not stupid, and I can use Google. Anything you've posted is either general knowledge or just pulled off the Irish Rail website (which I checked before posting, obviously) and isn't anything that could be considered an answer to my question. I know only a few trains could accommodate a motorbike (it's hardly going to be allowed in a rail car) and I realise they're not going to let a bike on a train with a full tank of petrol as is a fire risk.

Then why bother to start a thread here then if you already looked up the answer? It's very black and white with no grey area at all.

IsaacWunder

Captain Chaos wrote: »

Then why bother to start a thread here then if you already looked up the answer? It's very black and white with no grey area at all.

I started a thread in order to get a straight answer from someone who actually knows, as the Irish Rail customer service phone line is only open Monday to Friday. They used to carry motorbikes on trains, and I was hoping that they still do. Nowhere on the website does it say they don't carry them, all it says is (as you posted) you can't have fuel in one.

Tzardine

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I started a thread in order to get a straight answer from someone who actually knows, as the Irish Rail customer service phone line is only open Monday to Friday. They used to carry motorbikes on trains, and I was hoping that they still do. Nowhere on the website does it say they don't carry them, all it says is (as you posted) you can't have fuel in one.

Regarding the fuel. It also states that there should be no vapour. Even if you empty the tank I am sure they will argue that there is vapour left.

I can't see them letting it on to be honest.

foggy_lad

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I started a thread in order to get a straight answer from someone who actually knows, as the Irish Rail customer service phone line is only open Monday to Friday. They used to carry motorbikes on trains, and I was hoping that they still do. Nowhere on the website does it say they don't carry them, all it says is (as you posted) you can't have fuel in one.

They used to carry motorbikes on trains, yes. And you didn't even have to drain the fuel out of them as they were carried in the "guard's van", but trains in service nowadays do not have a guard's van.

Some of the Cork trains and the enterprise services do have a carriage which houses the power unit for the lighting and heating for the train and this carriage also has space set aside for bycicles and larger items of luggage but this is also used for storing foodstuffs to stock the Kitchen, catering trolley and the catering car so carrying a motorcycle in the same vehicle would never be allowed for obvious health and safety as well as food hygiene reasons.

Nowhere on the website does it state that they do not carry motorcycles but there is no train currently in use which can accommodate a motorcycle

IsaacWunder

foggy_lad wrote: »

They used to carry motorbikes on trains, yes. And you didn't even have to drain the fuel out of them as they were carried in the "guard's van", but trains in service nowadays do not have a guard's van.

Some of the Cork trains and the enterprise services do have a carriage which houses the power unit for the lighting and heating for the train and this carriage also has space set aside for bycicles and larger items of luggage but this is also used for storing foodstuffs to stock the Kitchen, catering trolley and the catering car so carrying a motorcycle in the same vehicle would never be allowed for obvious health and safety as well as food hygiene reasons.

Nowhere on the website does it state that they do not carry motorcycles but there is no train currently in use which can accommodate a motorcycle

So, despite being carried on trains for decades, motorbikes suddenly became an "obvious" health and safety issue? Give over.

As for your food safety argument, in what way do motorbikes pose unique risks to the food (which is presumably sealed, in any event) compared to push bikes? Cyclists travel on the same oil stained, filthy roads as the rest of us.

Hilly Bill

Motorbikes are not allowed on trains regardless of fuel in the tank or not.

end of the road

IsaacWunder wrote: »

So, despite being carried on trains for decades, motorbikes suddenly became an "obvious" health and safety issue? Give over.

As for your food safety argument, in what way do motorbikes pose unique risks to the food (which is presumably sealed, in any event) compared to push bikes? Cyclists travel on the same oil stained, filthy roads as the rest of us.

they threw away all the older intercity stock which would be able to carry a motor bike. i'm unsure about the mark 4 and belfast stock but probably whatever space they have is smaller so wouldn't be able to fit a motor bike. irish rail have a habbit of deciding something is an issue at will also. are you traveling before monday? if not you could contact the station your traveling from or contact customer services. you could also ask on their facebook or twitter if you have access to any of those

Hilly Bill

end of the road wrote: »

they threw away all the older intercity stock which would be able to carry a motor bike. i'm unsure about the mark 4 and belfast stock but probably whatever space they have is smaller so wouldn't be able to fit a motor bike. irish rail have a habbit of deciding something is an issue at will also. are you traveling before monday? if not you could contact the station your traveling from or contact customer services. you could also ask on their facebook or twitter if you have access to any of those

The answer has already been given. Foggy gave it. It's clearly there. NO MOTOR CYCLES.

n97 mini

IsaacWunder wrote: »

They used to carry motorbikes on trains,

Where? Was it in the "guards van" at the back? I don't think many trains have these any more.

Hilly Bill

IsaacWunder wrote: »

That rule is under the bicycle section. A "motorised bicycle" is not a motorbike.

I'm not stupid, and I can use Google. Anything you've posted is either general knowledge or just pulled off the Irish Rail website (which I checked before posting, obviously) and isn't anything that could be considered an answer to my question. I know only a few trains could accommodate a motorbike (it's hardly going to be allowed in a rail car) and I realise they're not going to let a bike on a train with a full tank of petrol as is a fire risk.

If its got 2 wheels and an engine then its a motor bike/cycle. Still not allowed.

IsaacWunder

Hilly Bill wrote: »

If its got 2 wheels and an engine then its a motor bike/cycle.

Not so. There are plenty of motorised bicycles (e-bikes) on the road that are definitely not classed as motorbikes.

Hilly Bill

Well your motorbike is still not allowed on the train either way. Foggy gave you the correct answer in the second post.

IsaacWunder

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Well your motorbike is still not allowed on the train either way. Foggy gave you the correct answer in the second post.

I don't think any of the answers given are credible due to a complete absence of cogency. I'll ring the station tomorrow.

Hilly Bill

Like what was asked earlier? why bother asking when you ignore the answers given?

When you are told NO on the phone tomorrow will you believe them?

n97 mini

@OP, when motorbikes were carried in the past, where were they carried?

IsaacWunder

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Like what was asked earlier? why bother asking when you ignore the answers given?

And, as I said earlier, because I tried ringing the information line, but they're closed on the weekend.

I haven't ignored the answers given, I just don't think they have any credibility due to the reasons given. You might all be right, and they do no longer take motorbikes, but that is also my feeling, and was before I ever asked this question. I was hoping I was wrong and wouldn't have to pay crazy money to a courier to move a bike down the country, but if I wasn't, and they do indeed no longer take bikes, at least, I thought, someone on here would be able to tell me when they stopped, and why. Instead all I've received is idle speculation about food safety and an argument over the legal definition of motorbike.

The only person who had been helpful was the poster who pointed out I could ring the station, which I didn't think you could do. So I'll ring Heuston tomorrow.

IsaacWunder

n97 mini wrote: »

@OP, when motorbikes were carried in the past, where were they carried?

I haven't a notion. I never even saw a motorbike on a train, but a buddy of mine swears they used to do it. I said I'd ring Irish Rail to ask them, but in their grand tradition of not doing customer service,they don't answer phones on the weekend, so I said I'd check their website: nothing on there, so I googled it, and nothing on there. So, I thought, maybe they still do bikes on the trains? Why not. They still do it in plenty other countries.

Would it not be handier (and more fun) to just ride the bike to it's destination?


Presumably that's not an option, but I can't recall ever seeing a motorbike on a train (or anything similar to one).

n97 mini

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I haven't a notion. I never even saw a motorbike on a train, but a buddy of mine swears they used to do it. I said I'd ring Irish Rail to ask them, but in their grand tradition of not doing customer service,they don't answer phones on the weekend, so I said I'd check their website: nothing on there, so I googled it, and nothing on there. So, I thought, maybe they still do bikes on the trains? Why not. They still do it in plenty other countries.

You may ask your buddy where, as it's most likely the guards van which is pretty much a thing of the past.

Irish Rail's twitter account seems to be fairly well staffed, if nothing else apart from the press monitoring section is.

IsaacWunder

Deleted User wrote: »

Would it not be handier (and more fun) to just ride the bike to it's destination?


Presumably that's not an option, but I can't recall ever seeing a motorbike on a train (or anything similar to one).

It isn't, alas. Either way you'd have to be hardy to be out in this weather.

IsaacWunder

n97 mini wrote: »

You may ask your buddy where, as it's most likely the guards van which is pretty much a thing of the past.

Irish Rail's twitter account seems to be fairly well staffed, if nothing else apart from the press monitoring section is.

That fella wouldn't know a guard's van from a Garda Station

Hilly Bill

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I haven't a notion. I never even saw a motorbike on a train, but a buddy of mine swears they used to do it. I said I'd ring Irish Rail to ask them, but in their grand tradition of not doing customer service,they don't answer phones on the weekend, so I said I'd check their website: nothing on there, so I googled it, and nothing on there. So, I thought, maybe they still do bikes on the trains? Why not. They still do it in plenty other countries.

Just ring the station that you want to board at. It would have saved a thread of not believing when someone tells you that you cant take a motorbike on a train.

Hilly Bill

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I haven't a notion. I never even saw a motorbike on a train, but a buddy of mine swears they used to do it. I said I'd ring Irish Rail to ask them, but in their grand tradition of not doing customer service,they don't answer phones on the weekend, so I said I'd check their website: nothing on there, so I googled it, and nothing on there. So, I thought, maybe they still do bikes on the trains? Why not. They still do it in plenty other countries.

Its on their website and has been highlighted for you its just they use the word Cycle and you use the word Bike.

IsaacWunder

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Just ring the station that you want to board at. It would have saved a thread of not believing when someone tells you that you cant take a motorbike on a train.

You're absolutely right, complete waste of my time. I might as well have posted this on after hours. At least some of the responses there would have been funny.

beauf

He asked was it possible not was it permitted.

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Is it possible to bring a (small) motorbike on Irish Rail inter city trains? Specifically the Dublin-Limerick and Cork-Dublin routes?

It could be suggested that they alter the wording on the website to mention there is no guards van anymore.

I actually remember getting in a goods wagon or something similar from Connolly during heavy snow about 15 yrs ago. Think it was the last train or such. Is that what was considered the guards van. There used to be another different carriage to that for parcels and such. Maybe that's what you mean by a guards van.

Even bicycles were uncommon then on trains. Never seen a motor bike on one.

tom_tarbucket

jaysus op, you sound like an awful argumentative pain in the hole.


this was all sorted in the very first reply to you ( below )

what bloody more do you want, a written letter from the head of irish rail !!




Not Permitted in Stations or on Trains. Items deemed to be illegal

Loaded firearms, explosive or inflammable articles or materialsRadioactive or corrosive products, cylinders containing compressed or liquefied gases

Motor cycles and motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour

beauf

There's dead parrot sketch in this somewhere.

IsaacWunder

tom_tarbucket wrote: »

jaysus op, you sound like an awful argumentative pain in the hole.


this was all sorted in the very first reply to you ( below )

what bloody more do you want, a written letter from the head of irish rail !!

Not Permitted in Stations or on Trains. Items deemed to be illegal

Loaded firearms, explosive or inflammable articles or materialsRadioactive or corrosive products, cylinders containing compressed or liquefied gases

Motor cycles and motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour

Read it again: Charged with means containing. So if it's not got any fuel in it then, logically it is permitted on a train. Ditto an unloaded gun is permitted on a train.

foggy_lad

IsaacWunder wrote: »

I haven't a notion. I never even saw a motorbike on a train, but a buddy of mine swears they used to do it. I said I'd ring Irish Rail to ask them, but in their grand tradition of not doing customer service,they don't answer phones on the weekend, so I said I'd check their website: nothing on there, so I googled it, and nothing on there. So, I thought, maybe they still do bikes on the trains? Why not. They still do it in plenty other countries.

I remember regularly seeing an auld fella loading his honda 90 into the guard's van on the sligo train in Maynooth, think he lived in Mullingar or Enfield and came into Maynooth once or twice a week to do some shopping and visit the mart.

I thought, someone on here would be able to tell me when they stopped, and why. Instead all I've received is idle speculation about food safety and an argument over the legal definition of motorbike.

You were told when they stopped, when they changed from loco-hauled sets which were required to have a guard's van to the push-pull sets and rail-cars which have no appropriate accommodation for motorcycles

the main reason they stopped taking them when the guard's vans started to vanish is for safety as they would have to ensure that the motorcycle was tied down properly and could not cause injury to passengers staff or the train as well as ensuring that all hazardous materials were removed, generally they would only take a motorbike anyway if it could be loaded quickly and easily into the guards van otherwise it would have to be packed in a crate and sent as freight!

Another reason they stopped taking them is when they started running longer trains than the platforms at some stations could handle as the guard's van was not always stopped at the platform to load/unload the motorcycle.

tom_tarbucket

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Read it again: Charged with means containing. So if it's not got any fuel in it then, logically it is permitted on a train. Ditto an unloaded gun is permitted on a train.

sure try draining the fuel then and let us know how you get on. good man.

elastico

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Read it again: Charged with means containing. So if it's not got any fuel in it then, logically it is permitted on a train. Ditto an unloaded gun is permitted on a train.

Don't be so childish. It's far from logical that a motorbike with an empty petrol tank will be allowed. Ring irish rail if you like, but the answer will be no as stated here for you in the first reply.

n97 mini

foggy_lad wrote: »

Another reason they stopped taking them is when they started running longer trains than the platforms at some stations could handle as the guard's van was not always stopped at the platform to load/unload the motorcycle.

Aye, I often boarded the guards van via the ditch at Castleknock in the 1990s. It was so overcrowded it was called the Calcutta Express.

Slippin Jimmy

Op, if I tell you that they DO allow you bring you motorbike on the train will you believe me and thank my post?

Or

Will you argue saying they won't let you bring.

cast_iron

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Read it again: Charged with means containing. So if it's not got any fuel in it then, logically it is permitted on a train. Ditto an unloaded gun is permitted on a train.

I charge my phone with a plug in phone charger. That does not mean there is a plug in phone charger contained in my phone.

"Charged with" would generally refer to how an item is powered.

"Motor cycles and motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour" clearly means two things:
1. No motor cycles
2. No motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour.

The word "and" is critical here. If "or" was used instead, then the "charged with..." would refer to both 1 and 2.

n97 mini

cast_iron wrote: »

I charge my phone with a plug in phone charger. That does not mean there is a plug in phone charger contained in my phone.

"Charged with" would generally refer to how an item is powered.

"Motor cycles and motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour" clearly means two things:
1. No motor cycles
2. No motor scooters charged with electricity, gas, oil or other inflammable liquid or vapour.

The word "and" is critical here. If "or" was used instead, then the "charged with..." would refer to both 1 and 2.

In fairness to the OP, these are policies, not laws. *If* he/she were to stumble across a train with a guards van I wouldn't rule out them accepting something which contravened that policy.

beauf

n97 mini wrote: »

In fairness to the OP, these are policies, not laws. *If* he/she were to stumble across a train with a guards van I wouldn't rule out them accepting something which contravened that policy.

Do they have any of them left?

cast_iron

n97 mini wrote: »

In fairness to the OP, these are policies, not laws. *If* he/she were to stumble across a train with a guards van I wouldn't rule out them accepting something which contravened that policy.

That's true. I would imagine whether it was law or not, you could potentially find someone in charge at a particular station that allowed it regardless. But I would have thought it to be highly unlikely.

Hilly Bill

IsaacWunder wrote: »

Read it again: Charged with means containing. So if it's not got any fuel in it then, logically it is permitted on a train. Ditto an unloaded gun is permitted on a train.

The main word there is Motorcycles meaning its not possible for you to take your Motorcycle on the train.

Hilly Bill

n97 mini wrote: »

In fairness to the OP, these are policies, not laws. *If* he/she were to stumble across a train with a guards van I wouldn't rule out them accepting something which contravened that policy.

I would. Try sticking one in the van of the Beller and see what happens

Victor

IsaacWunder wrote: »

That rule is under the bicycle section. A "motorised bicycle" is not a motorbike.

There are two categories of motorised bicycle:

Ped-elecs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedelec

Legal status of pedelecs worldwide

It is important for a pedelec to be legally classed as a bicycle in each country or jurisdiction rather than classed as a moped or motorcycle. The danger is that if a pedelec is classed as a moped or motorbike then it may not be allowed in bike lanes or on bike paths; the pedelec may have to be registered; the rider may have to wear a motorcycle helmet; and/or vehicle insurance may have to be paid for.

This means it is important to legally distinguish between pedelecs and other e-bikes (including S-Pedelecs) as these are likely to 1) have a more powerful motor than 250 W, 2) they may be able to attain a higher speed than 25 km/h before the electric motor assistance cuts out (if it cuts out at all), and/or 3) may have the ability to travel via electric motor alone (i.e. without pedalling). If any of those three conditions are true, then the bike is therefore more likely to be legally classed as a moped or motorcycle rather than as a bicycle.

Motorbikes: everything else

@OP

@OP, Why don't you just get a man & van service to collect the bike in their van and hitch a lift (in the van) to the destination.

Hilly Bill

I do that with my take away. Ring an order for delivery and get a lift home ;-).