looking for Monitors and Interface?

da_hambo

Hi lads. Finally upgrading my aging Sony Hifi which was doubling as a monitor.

Going to get a set of speakers and an interface for ease of volume control and amplification (if possible).

Any suggestions or even anyone getting rid of an old set? I'm looking at 150 to 200 eur hopefully which should be an major improvement on my hifi! Plus the extra space on desk will be great!

For use with Ableton Live production and occasionally 1210s vinyl playback and mixes.

Thanks in advance.
David.

da_hambo

These look the business!

http://touch.adverts.ie/speakers/behringer-studio-monitors-sound-card/7053261

mordeith

da_hambo wrote: »

These look the business!

http://touch.adverts.ie/speakers/behringer-studio-monitors-sound-card/7053261

Looks decent for that price alright

Freedom Square

Hey mate, I actually have a pair of M-Audio BX5a for sale, also a Novation Nio which is perfect for djing and offers a lot of freedom in terms of ways you can set it up to suit your own preference.

The monitors are 5 years old but cosmetically and functionally in mint condition, still with box. The Novation is a sturdy little buggar which is also part of it's attraction, again in perfect working and cosmetic order.

Monitors were 350 new, Novation was 155. I'd be happy to let both go for your top end budget. I'm in Donegal. You would need your own transport to collect.

Failing that, I recommend these two pieces of gear for your specific use. The Novation is a very versatile soundcard that is made for DJing with computers but is an excellent all around soundcard.

da_hambo

Cheers mate. Might be a bit far though Wexford to Donegal but let me think about it. The gear looks ideal!

Freedom Square

Wexford, jaysus ya couldn't be faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarther away man. Never mind mine, I'll hang onto it sure, but the Novation Nio is what you want, I'm sure of it. Others will do the job of course but for versatility for DJing and as an interface, there's no match really. I'm used to it now but I remember being pleasantly surprised at the upgrade in clarity. I would actually recommend buying it new just to get one of them and getting the speakers again somewhere else. I know you don't want one without the other though so....... It's a tough choice.

Then again, you could take the any ould thing will do approach and that works too.

da_hambo

Freedom Square wrote: »

Wexford, jaysus ya couldn't be faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarther away man. Never mind mine, I'll hang onto it sure, but the Novation Nio is what you want, I'm sure of it. Others will do the job of course but for versatility for DJing and as an interface, there's no match really. I'm used to it now but I remember being pleasantly surprised at the upgrade in clarity. I would actually recommend buying it new just to get one of them and getting the speakers again somewhere else. I know you don't want one without the other though so....... It's a tough choice.

Then again, you could take the any ould thing will do approach and that works too.

out of curiosity where in Donegal are you? North West or South East closer to me?

Freedom Square

I'm in Letterkenny mate, serious treck and you'll probably need a new suspension to get home with Donegal roads and all.

da_hambo

Will maybe go to Dublin on Thursday to get myself a set of speakers. Any recommendations for shops in Dublin that stock these?

paulo6891

2nd hand or headphones. Don't bother with cheap ones in my opinion. You won't get anything worthwhile for 150.

edit : although, these got a good review

http://www.xmusic.ie/PRESONUS-ERIS-4.5-STUDIO-MONITORS.html

http://www.musictech.net/2014/08/presonus-eris-series-review/

da_hambo

paulo6891 wrote: »

2nd hand or headphones. Don't bother with cheap ones in my opinion. You won't get anything worthwhile for 150.

edit : although, these got a good review

http://www.xmusic.ie/PRESONUS-ERIS-4.5-STUDIO-MONITORS.html

http://www.musictech.net/2014/08/presonus-eris-series-review/

Thats great, thanks. May go for these on Thursday.

Was looking at these until I saw your post.

http://musicmaker.ie/25551-tannoy-reveal-402-active-studio-monitor-50w-5035866176700.html

paulo6891

da_hambo wrote: »

Thats great, thanks. May go for these on Thursday.

Was looking at these until I saw your post.

http://musicmaker.ie/25551-tannoy-reveal-402-active-studio-monitor-50w-5035866176700.html

Heres a review for those

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun14/articles/tannoy-reveal.htm

Here's the Eris ones on the same site, slightly diff model

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/oct13/articles/presonus-eris.htm

Check out prices on thomann.

I'd still probably recommend headphones though

mordeith

paulo6891 wrote: »

Heres a review for those

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun14/articles/tannoy-reveal.htm

Here's the Eris ones on the same site, slightly diff model

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/oct13/articles/presonus-eris.htm

Check out prices on thomann.

I'd still probably recommend headphones though

If the OP is primarily looking into production why would you go with headphones (out of curiosity)?

paulo6891

There are headphones that are designed for producing with. The bass response is often better than monitors, especially at this price point. The cheap monitors are so small that they will not provide as accurate a representation of the bass. then there is the whole lack of room treatment issue. And a lack of a decent interface. 150 will buy excellent headphones, it will not buy excellent monitors. Plus, if he ever really gets into it, he will always have them for ABing with.

mordeith

paulo6891 wrote: »

There are headphones that are designed for producing with. The bass response is often better than monitors, especially at this price point. The cheap monitors are so small that they will not provide as accurate a representation of the bass. then there is the whole lack of room treatment issue. And a lack of a decent interface. 150 will buy excellent headphones, it will not buy excellent monitors. Plus, if he ever really gets into it, he will always have them for ABing with.

Hmmm, I'd be interested myself as most of my production is initially done on headphones (Sennheiser) but I always have to hook up to my stereo speakers (Wharfdales) to get an alternative perspective. There is usually a few things that need to be changed as there is sometimes a big difference between the headphones and speakers. Plus any prolonged session on the phones doesn't do my head any favours :rolleyes:

paulo6891

mordeith wrote: »

Hmmm, I'd be interested myself as most of my production is initially done on headphones (Sennheiser) but I always have to hook up to my stereo speakers (Wharfdales) to get an alternative perspective. There is usually a few things that need to be changed as there is sometimes a big difference between the headphones and speakers. Plus any prolonged session on the phones doesn't do my head any favours :rolleyes:

Are they headphones designed for djing, producing or casual listening though? There's a big difference. I'd guess they're not for producing.

I agree with the whole overexposure. But at the same time, one has to be careful about volumes as well. The op could always use his existing system for non crucial tasks.

And you say that you need to tweak when listening to your
Speakers... How do you know that the newly tweaked sound is more correct than the original?

Stab*City

Seeing as though production and djing are all about what comes out of the speakers id push your budget as high as possible. A cheap and cheerful option would be the krk's. You might be able to pick up a second hand set in decent condition for around the 175-200 mark. Quick search on adverts and saw these:

http://www.adverts.ie/speakers/rokit-rp6-g2-x-2/7158808

260 O.N.O (Looking at the ad he accepted an offer of 200 but may not have sold them)

As for the soundcard the novation nio is a nice little entry level device but it is just that. I had one and as soon as i got it i was looking to upgrade. Very limited settings on that device. Handy for djing.

Something like the native instruments soundcards would be a step up from the nio http://www.adverts.ie/recording-equipment/native-instruments-komplete-audio-6/6675803

Freedom Square

Please explain why you think the Nio is an entry level device and what is limiting about it. I'm absolutely baffled by that remark.

To the OP - if you are starting to produce and are using an untreated room there is absolutely no point in using monitors, none whatsoever, and as a result of that fact, there is even less point in upping your budget to buy the best monitors possible, zero.

I would recommend buying the best headphones you can afford and just using the audio jack on your computer until you feel you need to upgrade. As for DJing, there is nothing entry level about the Novation Nio, it is a very versatile interface but you need to know how to use it.

Stab*City

Freedom Square wrote: »

Please explain why you think the Nio is an entry level device and what is limiting about it. I'm absolutely baffled by that remark.

The key is in the name 2 inputs. Hence it limits you to two inputs. Either the two rca inputs or the xlr and the jack.

When using the fx rack it takes up usage of one of the stereo buses by default which then only leaves you with one.

Limited input and output latency settings.

You only have one meter for the 4 outputs so you can only visually see the signal for inputs 1/2 and output 1/2 but not output 3/4

When using another soundcard you do not have access to the fx.

And yes by all means get a decent set of headphones. But i dont know about the previous poster after hours of having cans on my ears id be praying for some speakers so i could take them off. But i guess thats just me. Also have monitors and headphones gives you two points of reference regarding sound of end product.

I think 90% of producers are producing in untreated rooms. So i guess all those people have wasted money on monitors if you were to listen to the previous poster.

The nio is very entry level compared to say the likes of the NI audio 8 which has 8 high-gain outputs & 8 inputs and very high sound quality. This includes many meters for visual comparison of signals.

Hope you are a little less baffled now

Freedom Square

Only 2 inputs? How many inputs does a DJ/producer want, in your opinion? If you're using decks you don't need a sound card, you need a mixer. If you're using software, you don't need inputs, you need outputs. You have to get creative with the Nio to make it work for you, but it can be done.

The FX rack is adjunct, it's just a gimmick, hardly something to used to pick fault with the device. If I were to tell you that other soundcards don't even have effects, would you still pick fault with the ones that this soundcard does have?

As far as the meters go, you should be looking at your mixer or your DAW, it's not a complaint that the little soundcard doesn't have 10 meters.

As far as the monitoring situation goes, if you work in a bad room you will be correcting the room in your mix and it will never sound up to scratch on another system. You're essentially mixing the room, not the track. To beginners this might sound like it's being fussy but trust me, it's not. The room itself is a speaker so if you make it sound good in your untreated room, it will "only" sound good in your untreated room.

A good middle ground is to have monitors and use the monitors to create the track and arrange it roughly etc. and then switch to headphones to do the mix. To try and mix in an untreated room is a battle you're never going to win.

More is not always better.

Stab*City

Freedom Square wrote: »

Only 2 inputs? How many inputs does a DJ/producer want, in your opinion? If you're using decks you don't need a sound card, you need a mixer. If you're using software, you don't need inputs, you need outputs. You have to get creative with the Nio to make it work for you, but it can be done.

The FX rack is adjunct, it's just a gimmick, hardly something to used to pick fault with the device. If I were to tell you that other soundcards don't even have effects, would you still pick fault with the ones that this soundcard does have?

As far as the meters go, you should be looking at your mixer or your DAW, it's not a complaint that the little soundcard doesn't have 10 meters.

As far as the monitoring situation goes, if you work in a bad room you will be correcting the room in your mix and it will never sound up to scratch on another system. You're essentially mixing the room, not the track. To beginners this might sound like it's being fussy but trust me, it's not. The room itself is a speaker so if you make it sound good in your untreated room, it will "only" sound good in your untreated room.

A good middle ground is to have monitors and use the monitors to create the track and arrange it roughly etc. and then switch to headphones to do the mix. To try and mix in an untreated room is a battle you're never going to win.

More is not always better.

In my opinion this dj/producer wants as many inputs as I need. I use one input for a 1210. I use two inputs for rack synths. I use another input for the synths I have on my iPad. A microphone input. Shall I go on? Should I want to record a live mix from my mixer that's another one.

The fx rack that comes with the nio was one of their selling points when the card was on the market. These are unusable without the card itself. Not a big deal but again a limitation. And yes it is a fault. There are plenty of sound cards and midi controllers and hardware that come with vst's and the only one I came across that you had to actually use the card in conjunction with the vst was the nio.

As for the meters why only give two meters on the nio and not the third? Because it's a budget card that's why. Certain things get left out at that price range.

You point about the monitoring is fair enough but there are thousands of producers creating good sounding music in untreated rooms. This is not a reason to not buy monitor speakers. I know very little producers with treated rooms but I know lots who have monitors and good music.

Ideally we would all like to have the perfect environment but that is a big ask. The op asked what would be a good option for his budget and I was saying if he could spend a little more he would get more for his money.

You basically said don't bother buying monitors because the track will never sound right without a treated room which is bull. Lots of tracks sound great that were made in all kinds of rooms. I say get the monitors and get decent one. Also get headphones if you can afford it.

Freedom Square

Your soundcard is a junction box for the gear you have, and it works. The Nio is a junction box for what I do, and it works very very well. A sound card is not meant to be interactive, it's meant to sit quietly in the corner and do it's job.

If you're friends are making music in an untreated room and it sounds good to you, I'm going to suggest two possibilties - you don't make music, your friends are using loops.

If I make something sound good in an untreated room (and I can), when I take it away and listen somewhere else it will inevitably sound terrible because it's the room that's been mixed and not the track. That's not superstition, it's truth.

Stab*City

Freedom Square wrote: »

Your soundcard is a junction box for the gear you have, and it works. The Nio is a junction box for what I do, and it works very very well. A sound card is not meant to be interactive, it's meant to sit quietly in the corner and do it's job.

If you're friends are making music in an untreated room and it sounds good to you, I'm going to suggest two possibilties - you don't make music, your friends are using loops.

If I make something sound good in an untreated room (and I can), when I take it away and listen somewhere else it will inevitably sound terrible because it's the room that's been mixed and not the track. That's not superstition, it's truth.

Yes and the nio a very limited junction box. Entry level. Entry level price. You get what you pay for.

I'm going to suggest two things. You are talking pure bull and you are happy with the nio because it's perfect for your limited setup.

Yes I do make music. In an untreated room and released on labels in the UK. My friends make music in untreated rooms again released on some of the biggest
labels in Europe. A good producer can compensate for the environment and adjust to improve overal listening on many mediums.

That's not superstition either just pure fact.

Freedom Square

Stab*City wrote: »

Yes and the nio a very limited junction box. Entry level. Entry level price. You get what you pay for.

I'm going to suggest two things. You are talking pure bull and you are happy with the nio because it's perfect for your limited setup.

Yes I do make music. In an untreated room and released on labels in the UK. My friends make music in untreated rooms again released on some of the biggest
labels in Europe. A good producer can compensate for the environment and adjust to improve overal listening on many mediums.

That's not superstition either just pure fact.

Who are you to assume what other people need? If the Nio is an entry level sound card, is it not perfect for the OP who is a self-confessed beginner? You contradict yourself you clown!

I'm done talking to you.

Freedom Square

Actually he hasn't confessed to being a beginner, what he said was,

For use with Ableton for producing (so basically a volume knob) and occasionally with 1210s (the Nio's "limited" 2 inputs are enough for a set of 1210s).

Just because you're a fanboy doesn't mean you have to go passing out bad advice to others to get stuff that's beyond their actual needs.

Stab*City

Freedom Square wrote: »

Who are you to assume what other people need? If the Nio is an entry level sound card, is it not perfect for the OP who is a self-confessed beginner? You contradict yourself you clown!

I'm done talking to you.

You are the clown. Is that what you do insult people who give an opinion? All I was saying was get a decent soundcard and monitors if he could afford them. I even supplied links for more affordable stuff.

All you did was harp on about a budget soundcard being the best thing since sliced bread. When I supplied you with its limitations you refuse to accept them even after I explained my reasoning.

Then you claim that anyone who does not have a treated room can not make good music. Yet people are doing that everyday. I'm glad your done talking bull to me.

Stab*City

Freedom Square wrote: »

Actually he hasn't confessed to being a beginner, what he said was,

For use with Ableton for producing (so basically a volume knob) and occasionally with 1210s (the Nio's "limited" 2 inputs are enough for a set of 1210s).

Just because you're a fanboy doesn't mean you have to go passing out bad advice to others to get stuff that's beyond their actual needs.

Haha. Talking to me again. Now who is backtracking and contradicting themselves. Take a hike buddy.

da_hambo

Dj'd since 1998. Now in my twilight (ha), I've been delving deeper into Ableton for last couple of years. Arrangement melody making all that I'm Ok. Mixing, EQing not so Ok. Getting there though. So speakers for arrangement, creating melodies and general dancing around to your creations. Then need something more more expensive for giving that pro sheen (basically being able to judge and fix muddy mixes)in mixing and EQing. This is just a hobby and progression of my love for music since I don't DJ live anymore. As for my record collection and 1210's, I'd need to hook mixer up to speakers /laptop on occasion to use as monitors and record mixes as Wav or Mp3.

Thanks for the advice guys. Will check them all out.

Stab*City

da_hambo wrote: »

Dj'd since 1998. Now in my twilight (ha), I've been delving deeper into Ableton for last couple of years. Arrangement melody making all that I'm Ok. Mixing, EQing not so Ok. Getting there though. So speakers for arrangement, creating melodies and general dancing around to your creations. Then need something more more expensive for giving that pro sheen (basically being able to judge and fix muddy mixes)in mixing and EQing. This is just a hobby and progression of my love for music since I don't DJ live anymore. As for my record collection and 1210's, I'd need to hook mixer up to speakers /laptop on occasion to use as monitors and record mixes as Wav or Mp3.

Thanks for the advice guys. Will check them all out.

Sorry about all the stuff on the thread mate. Was only trying to help. Hope you found some useful info out of anything that was said.

Ya i agree if only to dance around to/wake the neighbors speakers come in handy!