The coaches corner: WEEK 2

pconn062

So I think this thread could be really interesting if we keep it going. This week Ceepo has very kindly agreed to take questions on his coaching. So get your questions in, I'll start!

Could you tell us a little about your sporting background?
Do you come from a running background? Were you ever a competitive runner?
Could you summarise the basics of your coaching methodology for us?
Top coaches in Ireland in your opinion?

Thanks!

Netwerk Errer

How did you get into coaching and what do you enjoy about it?

Most training methodologies funnel down from elite runners and are high mileage manifesto's and rules for them. Do you think the same rules should be applied to the mid to low mileage runners or should they be taken with a grain of salt?

If you could have a Q+A with any coach in history, who would it be and why?

Ceepo

Hi all.

Serious kudos to Ecoli there. Some great answers

Can't help but feel a bit like David Moyes following on from Alex. Not really a keyboard warrior, but I will give it a go anyway.

Sporting background as follows.

Always loved sport but never really played anything until I was a 19 ish. Then played a bit of gaa for a few years. Used to smoke as well so that didn't help. Tried to give them up at about 25. Started to do a bit of running to try to help give them up and got hooked on it. Ran my first 10k about 10 weeks later running since and still of the smokes coming up on 19 year this new year.

Was I competitive.

I would like to think I was competitive but that would depend on what you would call competitive. Weather I was any good well that's a different question.

Ceepo

Coaching methodology

I will come back to that when I have a bit more time.

Top coaches

As Ecoli said, it's a subjective thing really.

I think Pat Hogan is doing a fantastic job with Ennis track club they have really been to the fore over the last number of years

Donie Walsh in Cork also someone who keeps producing a stream of athletes year after year.

I would also have a lot of time for Dick Hooper goes about his business with little or no fuss and gets the job done.

menoscemo

Where/who do you coach ceepo?

ger664

Ceepo wrote: »

I think Pat Hogan is doing a fantastic job with Ennis track club they have really been to the fore over the last number of years

There is a good amount talent been developed by the Juvenile coaches in both Ennis Track and Marian AC, so I would expect to see more coming through in the future under his watchful eye

Ceepo

menoscemo wrote: »

Where/who do you coach ceepo?

Where,

I am based in South Tipp, but i coach athletes in Waterford, Dungarvan, Kilkenny as well as in Tipperary,

Who

Won't name names, as i dont think it woud be fair, but mostly adult (male and female) and 2 Juniors (Triathlete's). Yes i go to the dark side,

Ceepo

How did you get into coaching ?

Bit out of the blue really, I was out running with a friend at the time chatting away as you do, trying to solve all the worlds problem's, and discussing the cross country season ahead, and he asked if i taught he had a chance of winning "The Novice", i said sure but you need to focus a bit more and change a few bit's first, and he asked me to give him a few sessions etc, that was it really.

What do you enjoy about it?.

Everything really. It is a real challenge, Of course it goes without saying, when any athlete you coach hit's targets, sometimes the one's you set but most of all the ones they themselves set.

Most training methodologies funnel down from elite runners and are high mileage manifesto's and rules for them. Do you think the same rules should be applied to the mid to low mileage runners or should they be taken with a grain of salt?

Not quite sure if i understand the question properly, but any training plan/program that i would give the athletes i coach, would be one that takes into account a number of factor's including the what there aims were, some will vary a lot depending on the phase of training, if they were aiming to peak for a specific race (marathon) or if they were planning to race a season (x country, triathlon)

If you could have a Q+A with any coach in history, who would it be and why?


Ha Ha great question and one i never really gave much taught to, i might have to think about it and get bck to you.

I would however like to ask Tim Noaks, if he didnt have a predisposition to been Diabetic would he still advocate for LCHF diet,

Ceepo

Could you summarise the basics of your coaching methodology for us?

Probably to much of a cliche to say i coach athletes not programs, but i have to say its very true in my case,
I coach a varied number of athlete's with different aims and goals, and as such i plan accordingly,
First you have to look for limiting factors that might impede there progress, such as mobility, stibility, core, aerobic capacity, aerobic power etc, and work on these aspects,
It is also important to take into account there family and work/college commitments, most people will have a limited number of hours for training and as such there is an onus on the coach to try to get the best out of the athlete in the time frame that they have available to train,
Some of the athletes will target a specific race, eg 5k, 10k, Marathon, Ironman,
these i would approch a bit differently form an athlete that wants to race a cross country season or a triathlon season, but again this would depend on the athlete.

dna_leri

As a coach do you get enough/any support from the AAI?
What could the AAI do better to support coaches?

Should coaches get paid by clubs/athletes?

Why do you coach?

What do you think of Jon Drummonds 8 year ban for drugs ?
Is it right that the coach gets a heavier ban than the athlete?

ECOLII

What do you feel are the most important personal traits that make a good coach?

If you had you choice of working with any athlete in Ireland who would it be and why?

What discipline do you feel you are able to coach most effectively (or enjoying coaching more than others)

Most influential factor on your own personal coaching style (another coach/personal experience figuring out what works etc.)

Ceepo

dna_leri wrote: »

As a coach do you get enough/any support from the AAI?
What could the AAI do better to support coaches?

Seen as I am not an AAI registered coach I have to say I don't get any support from them.

That said, I have contact the regional development officer regarding a number it squad training sessions and always found him more that willing to accommodate me.

I know also that they have squad training on workshop days (throws etc) that they encourage coaches to attend.

I think there was a great opportunity lost with the Marathon mission. I think that the AAI could have use this a a mentoring system to give new or up and coming coach to work along side more established coaches. To learn on the ground so to speak.

I know that British Athletics have coaching conference/ training days to where they bring in different coaches with different back grounds, not always athletics to give the view on training and on the approach to training.

Ceepo

dna_leri wrote: »

Should coaches get paid by clubs/athletes?

Always a bone of contention. And probably no easy answer.

In a club context. I think if a coach has paid for himself and has to travel to training session then I think they should be paid for there services.

If a club has paid for them to attend courses etc then it maybe a different story. Also I feel the they should not be out of pocket.

Individual coaching is a different and no doubt be between the coach and athletes.would also add I don't see to many rich coaches out there.

Ceepo

dna_leri wrote: »

Why do you coach?

Great question.

I suppose there is no one specific reason.
Times have change since the time I stared running, with the Internet available to almost everybody now information and knowledge is ready available to everyone.
Sometime information and knowledge can be a bad thing as it can be information overload.
There is a lot of noise out there and its not alwas good and sometimes it can be hard to look through it.
Running is a very simple sport but sometimes people make it complicated to make themselves more knowledge. Usually this is has a end purpose like selling a book etc. A lot of what is been written now is like putting something in the microwave and reheating. It's just a rehash.
So you could argue that there is no need for coaches or maybe less need for them.
Some athletes need assurance some need direction. Looking back to when I started running I think it would have been great to that someone to ask questions maybe for the direction maybe for the reassurance. But I felt I was not good enough to to be coach.

It is nice now to be able to turn to athletes and give them the direction or assurance that I would have craved for.

Truthfully, its all about the ego really

Ceepo

dna_leri wrote: »

What do you think of Jon Drummonds 8 year ban for drugs ?
Is it right that the coach gets a heavier ban than the athlete?

Tbh I have not had a chance to look into it to much. But if he was the supplier/dealer then it's only right and proper that he gets a lengthy ban, if not a lifetime ban. I hope it sends out a message to other coaches that it will it is not acceptable. I dont see this been any different that the street corner dealer.

I think as a coach that i have a duty of care to the athletes I coach, and he does not seem to care to much about there care..

Yes athletes should know right from wrong, but if you take the Russian fiasco into account then you can see the pressure that they are under. This is by no way making it right but it may not be as clear cut as it looks from the outside.

I don't think 2 years is enough in general, but for now that's what the powers seem to think is fair.

Ceepo

ECOLII wrote: »

What do you feel are the most important personal traits that make a good coach?

It goes without saying that good communication skills are a given.
You also need good people skills while you might be able to communicate something you don't want to come across as been condescending or a twat.
Honest with yourself and that athlete know what is working and what is not.
Confidential with there information.
Wisdom and knowledge are a must as well. It's one thing have the knowledge but you must have the wisdom to know when to use that knowledge in an appropriate way.
It would also be helpful to be a Physio and phycologist and a taxi driver

Ceepo

ECOLII wrote: »

If you had you choice of working with any athlete in Ireland who would it be and why

A tought one and as this is never going to happen for the obvious reasons. I am going to say Gary O Hanlon.
The reason would be to see if he would run a better marathon if he specifically trained for one.
He probably would disagree with the training but it would be interesting

Ceepo

ECOLII wrote: »

What discipline do you feel you are able to coach most effectively (or enjoying coaching more than others)

I am definitely more in my comfort zone coaching endurance running. But I am also a triathlon coach and would have to say I find that swimming was a challenge at the beginning. Definitely more technical.
At present I coach 3 pool sessions a week with 2 Triathlon clubs and have to say I enjoy it a lot.It has definitely make you focus on movement patterns and how a fluid body in motion can look as opposed to a tight one pulling against itself.
I think all coaches should be taken out of the comfort zone from time to time. It a great learning curve.

Ceepo

ECOLII wrote: »

Most influential factor on your own personal coaching style (another coach/personal experience figuring out what works etc.)

I really like to Cavona approach to Marathon training, but would also like Salazer approch to the shorter distances, I would decribe these as tools in the coaching box,
It well be the case that what works for some may not work for another, and as such a different approach my be needed,

Someone that was a big infulence on my own training was a old friend of mine Myles McHugh, im sure not many on here would have heard of him,
I think he has won National xc at every age group at evey level from o/40 to o/65, he was never much good at giving advice but he would always plant a seed and keep adding a bit until the penny finally dropped,

Somethings you can be taught other things you hve to learn,
There is a science to training, but racing is an ART !

ECOLII

Do you think a coach should have a knowledge of all aspects of an athletes lifestyle (coach, therapist, nutritionist, psychologist, doctor) in order to provide a better all road cohesive plan or should a coach build a good infrastructure around his approach and try not spread themselves too thin by being a jack of all trades?

What do you think has been the biggest breakthrough in coaching methods in the last 15 years?

Who is more nervous on race days athlete or coach?

Ceepo

ECOLII wrote: »

Do you think a coach should have a knowledge of all aspects of an athletes lifestyle (coach, therapist, nutritionist, psychologist, doctor) in order to provide a better all road cohesive plan or should a coach build a good infrastructure around his approach and try not spread themselves too thin by being a jack of all trades?

Personally i think a coaches primary role is to coach in there choosen field, however i do think that they should have some degree knowledge in all of the above, I would think that a coach is better to have a team build around them,
personally i would refer the athletes to a qualified S&C coach and Nutritionist as they are the experts in there field, i dont think a coach should be all things to everyone. I would also state that there views should be in line with yours,


What do you think has been the biggest breakthrough in coaching methods in the last 15 years?

I would think Cavona's approach to marathon training and racing has been a major breakthrough, i think he has taking the rule book and re written it, i would say that it is a risky way of training, but if the athlete can sustain the training the rewards are great, a case of very high risks for very high rewards.
ps i hope they are clean

There is a lot been made S&C and the need to build a stronger core to improve stability and strength to promote better movement which in turn allowes for efficiency and speed, however if you look at the times from races over say a 20yr period spread of nearly all distances the times have got slower, save from a few freaks of nature

Who is more nervous on race days athlete or coach?

In general i am a fairly calm person, so i dont know if i would be very nervous,
thats not to say that i would not be thinking about them, as from there point of view we would usually have a control the controllables discussion a few days prior to discuss the race, course, tactics etc, to help alleviate any nerves that they may have,

Clearlier

Do you ever work on improving runners technique i.e. their skill at running? How do you approach it?

Ceepo

Clearlier wrote: »

Do you ever work on improving runners technique i.e. their skill at running? How do you approach it?

Short answer is yes.

Again this is where I would evaluate each athlete for limiting factors through functional movement screening to access Mobility, stability, core strength,
Some athletes will have a good core strength but bad mobility, some with good mobility but bad stability so you have to treat everyone different.

Also with a series of running drills. High knees, butt kicks, leaps, bounds etc. But only when mobility and Stability are able to take the load

Also running strides on a incline helps to promote good running technique and good running form.

Dubgal72

Any chance we could resurrect this thread?

pconn062

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Any chance we could resurrect this thread?

If you can find another volunteer then go for it!

Dubgal72

pconn062 wrote: »

If you can find another volunteer then go for it!

Haha. What about Clearlier or the two guys who coach Eliud Too? I know they had a thread recently but it was to do with Eliud. Maybe a general coaching Q&A thread from them?