Calf coming backwards,

doyleshill

Is there any reason why a calf comes backwards. I had two in the last 12 months ,delivered by vet,both didn't survive. I have only 8 cows.

Bodacious

doyleshill wrote: »

Is there any reason why a calf comes backwards. I had two in the last 12 months ,delivered by vet,both didn't survive. I have only 8 cows.

my old neighbour tells me a non pregnant female with them in oestrus can disrupt the position of calf in late pregnancy if she doing a lot of rising on a bulling cow/heifer.. im not sure on that though

Justjens

That's tough luck, no reason they wouldn't survive especially if calved by a vet.

Have one every two or three years, always call the vet, last time was 3am in Oct.

It's just nature AFAIK, no reason other than it just happens. Hopefully that will be your last one for a good few years.

Kovu

Our last heifer was very lucky to have a backwards calf out alive. The vet mentioned her being quite overfat and it could have restricted the calf turning correctly before presenting for birth.
No idea if he was just waffling on or if it has some bearing on the calves position during birth.

Mad4simmental

You'll generally get one or two a year. Usually no trouble it just means you have to catch it quick and give her a hand with the jack. They rarely calve themselves when the calf cums backwards.

My understanding is in the last few weeks befoure calving the calf turns and presents in the correct position befoure calveing. Your vet may have sume merret to what he says kovu but I suppose you'll all ways get the odd one!

greysides

The problem with a rear presentation is that it takes longer to open up the cows cervix as just legs are poking through. The stretching of the cervix is the stimulus to the cow to strain properly and get on with the job. Consequently calves are 'longer in the barrel' than you'd expect and worn out on arrival. Also the detachment of the cleaning is on a clock once the birth starts and the time is running down whether the cow is straining properly or not.

Remember not to pull the calf down too soon or you may damage the ribs. A flatter pull is needed.

When an animal isn't proceeding as expected it pays to check all is well. If it is, leave her alone for a little longer.

Genghis Cant

I've seen several over the years. Often a big calf that can't turn, very often twins present everyway. Certainly a couple of times a calf that wasn't quite right came backwards. The
I'd always try and hang one up as best I could to drain out the airways on a breach calf
I feel they don't clear themselves as well as a normal birth.

greysides

Navel can get compressed as well if the latter part of the extraction is slow and the blood flow decreased- the brain will be affected.

Once the calf's tail head is out you need to move things on, not to panic, just not to delay.

onyerbikepat

I always thought you were more likely to get one coming backwards if the calf was unable to tun around in the cow. Nunber of reasons for this, calf too big, cow with a longer and tighter body, rather than a deeper looser one, cow too fat etc etc.

ferger1

Id always check what way the hooves are pointing i.e. 'upwards', (if ya know what I mean) and the presentation is probably ok, if the hooves are pointing 'downwards', id be in checking things out and if you meet a tail, the jack is out and plenty of lube

High bike

Had one two yrs ago,massive lim bull ended up paying the vet 350e to do a cesarean but at least the calf and cow were ok

saranac1

greysides wrote: »

The problem with a rear presentation is that it takes longer to open up the cows cervix as just legs are poking through. The stretching of the cervix is the stimulus to the cow to strain properly and get on with the job. Consequently calves are 'longer in the barrel' than you'd expect and worn out on arrival. Also the detachment of the cleaning is on a clock once the birth starts and the time is running down whether the cow is straining properly or not.

Remember not to pull the calf down too soon or you may damage the ribs. A flatter pull is needed.

When an animal isn't proceeding as expected it pays to check all is well. If it is, leave her alone for a little longer.

On a suckler cow how long would you leave the cow when first noticing the bag out and a backwards presentation is showing

raypallas

saranac1 wrote:

On a suckler cow how long would you leave the cow when first noticing the bag out and a backwards presentation is showing

would leave for atleast an hour and keep throwing an eye over her. have you an easy calving bull?

saranac1

raypallas wrote: »

would leave for atleast an hour and keep throwing an eye over her. have you an easy calving bull?

The cow is 3rd time calver but has a bag full of milk for about 2 wks now and no sign of calving, notice her lifting her back leg a lot as if been kicked inside by calf, just a tad worried why she hasn't calves yet and if calve presented inside her is in wrong position, I could be fussing but would it be time to call vet out to investigate or leave her till bag out and legs showing?

sh1tstirrer

My last heifer that calved had the calf coming upside down. She started calving at 5 in the morning.

joejobrien

A cow presenting a breach is likely to be carrying twins. An old wise vet always recommended in a breech situation, to check for another calf once the first is delivered. There invariably is not enough of room for calves to move in correct position thus turned the wrong way OR or too small a calf allowing them to move too freely, thus allowing incorrect position also.
Alway s get a number of breches each year and no vet required thankfully.

saranac1

joejobrien wrote: »

A cow presenting a breach is likely to be carrying twins. An old wise vet always recommended in a breech situation, to check for another calf once the first is delivered. There invariably is not enough of room for calves to move in correct position thus turned the wrong way OR or too small a calf allowing them to move too freely, thus allowing incorrect position also.
Alway s get a number of breches each year and no vet required thankfully.

To me she does not look big enough to have twins

joejobrien

saranac1 wrote: »

To me she does not look big enough to have twins

I would never be suprised at anything anymore:D

Genghis Cant

saranac1 wrote: »

The cow is 3rd time calver but has a bag full of milk for about 2 wks now and no sign of calving, notice her lifting her back leg a lot as if been kicked inside by calf, just a tad worried why she hasn't calves yet and if calve presented inside her is in wrong position, I could be fussing but would it be time to call vet out to investigate or leave her till bag out and legs showing?

You've no reason to believe she going to present the calf backways, she hasn't put ot the feet yet or anything has she?
How many days is she is calf?

saranac1

260 days in calf
No feet yet
I suppose her restlessness would be her big bag of milk but she always tends to lye flat with head down
If feet present and she is struggling say after 1 hr to push calf out I will call vet ASAP

Kovu

260 days would be a bit early for a calf to appear. Have you checked to make sure she hasn't mastitis? That would explain the kicking.

Jb1989

saranac1 wrote: »

To me she does not look big enough to have twins

The thinner a cow may look can often increase the chances of twins as there's two calves feeding of her inside which doesn't let her fatten up as much,

High bike

Had one today 14 days overdue and called fine on her own,nice Sim bull calf

Genghis Cant

saranac1 wrote: »

260 days in calf
No feet yet
I suppose her restlessness would be her big bag of milk but she always tends to lye flat with head down
If feet present and she is struggling say after 1 hr to push calf out I will call vet ASAP

Restlessness would be common enough with heavy incalf cows.
No need to panic yet, she could be a month from calving yet. If she's carrying twins she could calve in a fortnight.
Maybe eliminate that it's not mastitis and then play the waiting game.
As usual, if your not happy, get the Vet to take a look.
Best of luck with her.

Charliebull

Genghis Cant wrote: »

Restlessness would be common enough with heavy incalf cows.
No need to panic yet, she could be a month from calving yet. If she's carrying twins she could calve in a fortnight.
Maybe eliminate that it's not mastitis and then play the waiting game.
As usual, if your not happy, get the Vet to take a look.
Best of luck with her.

i would be off the same opinion

had a big framed cow at the same crack for the last 3 weeks, she fired out a big lump of a CH bull unassisted last night