Shortlist of project options to address future transport needs in Fingal/North Dublin

Iwannahurl

Public views on six shortlisted options sought by January 19th.

The six proposed options are:

Two heavy rail options:
A DART link from Clongriffin to the airport and Swords (Option HR2);

Two Luas/metro options:
A Luas line from Cabra to the airport and Swords via a tunnel under Glasnevin (Option LR3);

One Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) Option:

One Combination Option:
A DART link from the Maynooth Railway Line to the airport and Swords via a tunnel under Glasnevin (Option HR8);
A metro proposal from St. Stephen’s Green to the Airport and Swords (Option LR7);
A combination of a number of proposed Bus Rapid Transit services (Option BRT 5); and
A combination of a DART link from Clongriffin to the airport and a Luas line from Cabra to Swords (Option C1).

Population and employment growth in Fingal/North Dublin will stimulate increased travel across the region over the medium term that cannot be catered for by car. Extra public transport capacity will be required, supplemented by cycling and walking for shorter journeys.

Submissions can be made here: http://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/public-consultation-on-the-north-dublin-transport-study/

Grandeeod

Classic politics. Re-invent the wheel.

I'm also curious about some of the proposals. I'm fairly sure some of them were suggested on the internet by interested parties as opposed to stake holders.

Chris_5339762

Its a shame they are trying to water down Metro North a bit, but I am happy to see there being assurances of Dart Underground, at some stage. Needs to happen sooner.

monument

Ding dong Metro North is dead.

n97 mini

Five options will cost possibly as much as a billion euro. The sixth could be done for a fraction. What's the point in this.

Grandeeod

monument wrote: »

Ding dong Metro North is dead.

Absolutely and not really a shock either. It will be BRT all the way, IMO.

cgcsb

It's already been established that BRT on it's own isn't possible, the demand is too great. The non metro options were considered before and rejected as unworkable/ with low merit. It's groundhog day it seems.

Grandeeod

A DART link from the Maynooth Railway Line to the airport and Swords via a tunnel under Glasnevin (Option HR8);

This idea was definately knocked off from someone else. It was never more than an idea on a website and now its an official option.

But while I'm repeating myself, this latest shortlist is merely another example of re-inventing the wheel, a strategy used by successive Governments over the last 40 odd years, to avoid actually doing something. DU won't be built either.

Grandeeod

cgcsb wrote: »

It's already been established that BRT on it's own isn't possible, the demand is too great. The non metro options were considered before and rejected as unworkable/ with low merit. It's groundhog day it seems.

But surely you realise that BRT will be "stage one" of a grand plan that will never happen. BRT will be made a reality and left to fend for itself. This kind of "thinking" has a whole raft of history stretching back decades, to back it up.

monument

Direct link to the PDF of the report:

http://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Appraisal_Report_19112014_final.pdf

Grandeeod

monument wrote: »

Direct link to the PDF of the report:

http://www.nationaltransport.ie/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Appraisal_Report_19112014_final.pdf

Just read it in detail. HR8 and HR9 are stolen ideas for sure. Not that they are financially feasible.

In general this document looks like an attempt to undo T21s Dublin plans for Northside of the city which means Metro North is for the chop. But hey, thats Irish politics for you!

Personally, I'm sickened by this document. Its an insult to those lay people that took the time over 10 years ago to speak to consultants and attend public consultatons. Its a fudge to push real investment and progress further down the road.

Just look at the original DART plans from the early 70s and the subsequent development, changes, political interference, T21 and blah blah blah! Same old story.

the dark phantom

Letting culchies run our country means Dublin will never have a European style transit system..If buses are good enough for the folk in the country then they're good enough for the Dubs.

hfallada

the dark phantom wrote: »

Letting culchies run our country means Dublin will never have a European style transit system..If buses are good enough for the folk in the country then they're good enough for the Dubs.

I hate hearing "why does Dublin have a Luas and not Cork or Galway". TDs from outside Dublin fail to understand the size of the city and the importance of public transport for large cities. If you have spent your life in tiny village, I suppose you dont know the importance of public transport.

If TDs were lived in Dublin Suburbs and spent over an hour on a bus journey, that would take 15 mins on a DART. They might realise the importance of upgrading Dublins public transport. They can always find money to bypass a glorified village, but cant afford the DART underground

Grandeeod

The last two posts have hit the nail on the head. This "rural politician" aspect has been pointed out here before. Its a huge issue that holds Dublin back and has done for many years. It's impossible for a rural politcian to get their head around a city's transport problem, when they themselves move from a car dominated environment to an urban environment that's dependent on public transport to survive.

the dark phantom

hfallada wrote: »

I hate hearing "why does Dublin have a Luas and not Cork or Galway". TDs from outside Dublin fail to understand the size of the city and the importance of public transport for large cities. If you have spent your life in tiny village, I suppose you dont know the importance of public transport.

If TDs were lived in Dublin Suburbs and spent over an hour on a bus journey, that would take 15 mins on a DART. They might realise the importance of upgrading Dublins public transport. They can always find money to bypass a glorified village, but cant afford the DART underground

The "Dubs get everything" mentality is alive and well unfortunately, Growing up I could never understand the hatred to Dublin till it dawned on me that tribalism, clannishness, ignorance and most of all jealousy still thrives in rural Ireland. Obviously not amongst all people but a large proportion of them.

n97 mini

the dark phantom wrote: »

Letting culchies run our country means Dublin will never have a European style transit system..If buses are good enough for the folk in the country then they're good enough for the Dubs.

And too much of Dublin's money goes on rural projects, money that Dublin really needs to be spent in Dublin.

Unfortunately a lot of Dublin residents are also from "down the country" and still vote in a way that serves their parents better than them, as one day they hope to "move home", despite the lack of employment and other reasons that have them living in Dublin in the first place.

hfallada

n97 mini wrote: »

And too much of Dublin's money goes on rural projects, money that Dublin really needs to be spent in Dublin.

Unfortunately a lot of Dublin residents are also from "down the country" and still vote in a way that serves their parents better than them, as one day they hope to "move home", despite the lack of employment and other reasons that have them living in Dublin in the first place.

Its so true. So many people from the country move and live in Dublin for several years. But go home to the country to vote. Which I think its seriously funny, that they are more concerned to supporting their rural TD, than one that effect theirs life

Hungerford

cgcsb wrote: »

It's already been established that BRT on it's own isn't possible, the demand is too great.

I suspect that the fix is in - why else wasn't passenger capacity utilized in the NTA's screening criteria?

xper

First sentence in the report:

The overall objective of this Fingal/North Dublin Transport Study is to identify the optimum long term public transport solution to connect Dublin City Centre, Dublin Airport and Swords

OK so ...
Step 1: Select straightest route possible from Swords to Airport to City Centre.
Step 2: Select mode that provides required initial/future capacity and best speed.
Step 3: Select construction method/locations that least compromises living environment and other infrastructure in the long term.
Bonus Step 4: Check drawer for existing 'shovel-ready' plan that already matches what you just came up with.

Invest in the damn capital city already!

ClovenHoof

Crayola Transport Planning strikes again.

cgcsb

IR.PNG
one of my favourite parts of the report. Classic

thomasj

Apparently public transport is hunky dorey in Dublin 15 (part of fingal) ?

Given its part of the fingal area should it not be included in this?

LXFlyer

thomasj wrote: »

Apparently public transport is hunky dorey in Dublin 15 (part of fingal) ?

Given its part of the fingal area should it not be included in this?

This study is quite specific to the central corridors - there are other areas left out too.

D15 would need a completely different study.

schemingbohemia

thomasj wrote: »

Apparently public transport is hunky dorey in Dublin 15 (part of fingal) ?

Given its part of the fingal area should it not be included in this?

A brilliant example of the "culchieism" referred to earlier in the thread, well done!