eVision Rip Off Cooling Off Period

Zardoz16

On the 10^th of October 2014 we ordered to Eircom eFibre and eVision Bundle for our home.
On the 28^th of October 2014, 18 days later the eFibre and eVision equipment and service was installed at our home.


On the 29^th of October 2014 we decided that we did not wish to keep the eVision service and I phoned the Eircom Loyalty team to cancel the eVision service.


I was told that I could not cancel it without incurring a fee of €150 because we had surpassed our 14 day cooling off period with the ‘verbal contract’, which was apparently agreed upon on the 10^th of October 2014. I was told that this 14 day cooling off period clause began once I ordered the eVision service on the 10^th of October, not upon the receipt and installation of the service on the 28^th of October.


I was told by Glen, the supervisor of the Loyalty team that this was mentioned to me on October 10^th 2014 over the phone, that once the cooling off period terminates, I could not cancel the service without incurring a fee.


This was not made very clear to me at all. If it had been I would have cancelled the eVision part of my order. The concept of not being able to try a service first before deciding to keep it or not without a cancellation fee is very unfair, and normally not the practice in consumer transactions.
In the 2 confirmation emails I received form you on the 10^th of October it did not mention that the duration of 14 day cooling off period commences immediately. In the link to the Eircom terms and conditions, (The link which expires), there is no mention of the immediate commencement of the cooling off period.


My wife and I have been a loyal customer with Eircom for over 20 years and have never encountered issues with your services until now.
I wish to withdraw from the eVision service but I feel that it is grossly unfair to charge me a cancelation fee.


Normally under European consumer law, the consumer has a period of 14 days to cancel a product or service after the consumer has received the goods or service, or when the service has been installed and made available to them.


The National Consumer Agency advised me to inform you of the EU Consumer Rights directive; Chapter 3 Article 6, which stipulates that if a consumer has not been made very aware of any cooling off period term in a contract that their rights for cancellation of a service is extended to 12 Months:


(43)
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
(40)‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
 
The National Consumer Agency insists that I should not be charged a cancellation fee because the cooling off period should commence upon first receipt of the services and goods. Our cooling off period should expire on the 11^th of November 2014.


The National Consumer Agency told me today that there is nothing they can do about an individual case like mine. But surely I said that thee must be more than one person in Ireland that has experienced this nonsense?



As mentioned, we wish to cancel our eVision subscription. Can anyone inform me now as how to proceed without a cancelation fee?

eircom: Aisling

Zardoz16 wrote: »

On the 10^th of October 2014 we ordered to Eircom eFibre and eVision Bundle for our home.
On the 28^th of October 2014, 18 days later the eFibre and eVision equipment and service was installed at our home.


On the 29^th of October 2014 we decided that we did not wish to keep the eVision service and I phoned the Eircom Loyalty team to cancel the eVision service.


I was told that I could not cancel it without incurring a fee of €150 because we had surpassed our 14 day cooling off period with the ‘verbal contract’, which was apparently agreed upon on the 10^th of October 2014. I was told that this 14 day cooling off period clause began once I ordered the eVision service on the 10^th of October, not upon the receipt and installation of the service on the 28^th of October.


I was told by Glen, the supervisor of the Loyalty team that this was mentioned to me on October 10^th 2014 over the phone, that once the cooling off period terminates, I could not cancel the service without incurring a fee.


This was not made very clear to me at all. If it had been I would have cancelled the eVision part of my order. The concept of not being able to try a service first before deciding to keep it or not without a cancellation fee is very unfair, and normally not the practice in consumer transactions.
In the 2 confirmation emails I received form you on the 10^th of October it did not mention that the duration of 14 day cooling off period commences immediately. In the link to the Eircom terms and conditions, (The link which expires), there is no mention of the immediate commencement of the cooling off period.


My wife and I have been a loyal customer with Eircom for over 20 years and have never encountered issues with your services until now.
I wish to withdraw from the eVision service but I feel that it is grossly unfair to charge me a cancelation fee.


Normally under European consumer law, the consumer has a period of 14 days to cancel a product or service after the consumer has received the goods or service, or when the service has been installed and made available to them.


The National Consumer Agency advised me to inform you of the EU Consumer Rights directive; Chapter 3 Article 6, which stipulates that if a consumer has not been made very aware of any cooling off period term in a contract that their rights for cancellation of a service is extended to 12 Months:


(43)
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
(40)‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
 
The National Consumer Agency insists that I should not be charged a cancellation fee because the cooling off period should commence upon first receipt of the services and goods. Our cooling off period should expire on the 11^th of November 2014.


The National Consumer Agency told me today that there is nothing they can do about an individual case like mine. But surely I said that thee must be more than one person in Ireland that has experienced this nonsense?



As mentioned, we wish to cancel our eVision subscription. Can anyone inform me now as how to proceed without a cancelation fee?

Hi Zardoz16

Would you like to PM me your account no & I will look into this for you.

Thanks

Ash

Zardoz16

eircom: Aisling wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

On the 10^th of October 2014 we ordered to Eircom eFibre and eVision Bundle for our home.
On the 28^th of October 2014, 18 days later the eFibre and eVision equipment and service was installed at our home.


On the 29^th of October 2014 we decided that we did not wish to keep the eVision service and I phoned the Eircom Loyalty team to cancel the eVision service.


I was told that I could not cancel it without incurring a fee of €150 because we had surpassed our 14 day cooling off period with the ‘verbal contract’, which was apparently agreed upon on the 10^th of October 2014. I was told that this 14 day cooling off period clause began once I ordered the eVision service on the 10^th of October, not upon the receipt and installation of the service on the 28^th of October.


I was told by Glen, the supervisor of the Loyalty team that this was mentioned to me on October 10^th 2014 over the phone, that once the cooling off period terminates, I could not cancel the service without incurring a fee.


This was not made very clear to me at all. If it had been I would have cancelled the eVision part of my order. The concept of not being able to try a service first before deciding to keep it or not without a cancellation fee is very unfair, and normally not the practice in consumer transactions.
In the 2 confirmation emails I received form you on the 10^th of October it did not mention that the duration of 14 day cooling off period commences immediately. In the link to the Eircom terms and conditions, (The link which expires), there is no mention of the immediate commencement of the cooling off period.


My wife and I have been a loyal customer with Eircom for over 20 years and have never encountered issues with your services until now.
I wish to withdraw from the eVision service but I feel that it is grossly unfair to charge me a cancelation fee.


Normally under European consumer law, the consumer has a period of 14 days to cancel a product or service after the consumer has received the goods or service, or when the service has been installed and made available to them.


The National Consumer Agency advised me to inform you of the EU Consumer Rights directive; Chapter 3 Article 6, which stipulates that if a consumer has not been made very aware of any cooling off period term in a contract that their rights for cancellation of a service is extended to 12 Months:


(43)
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
(40)‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
 
The National Consumer Agency insists that I should not be charged a cancellation fee because the cooling off period should commence upon first receipt of the services and goods. Our cooling off period should expire on the 11^th of November 2014.


The National Consumer Agency told me today that there is nothing they can do about an individual case like mine. But surely I said that thee must be more than one person in Ireland that has experienced this nonsense?



As mentioned, we wish to cancel our eVision subscription. Can anyone inform me now as how to proceed without a cancelation fee?

Hi Zardoz16

Would you like to PM me your account no & I will look into this for you.

Thanks

Ash

Did you receive the PM?

Zardoz16

Obviously I'm the only person in Ireland that has been affected by this!

So imagine that you order a camera or a smartphone online and it takes 20 days to get to you, but before you get a chance to even use it, you have no rights whatsoever to return it if you are not happy with it. Your 'cooling off' period expired 6 days before you received the physical item.

Now that's illegal isn't it?

Now how many of you would stand for that?


That's what Eircom are doing with their over the phone ' verbal contracts'.

Beware quiet sleepy people of  Ireland.

chatterbox

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

eircom: Colm

chatterbox wrote: »

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

Hi zardoz

I have just checked with my colleague and we did not receive a PM from you. Would you like to forward it to me and also confirm how you ordered the service and I will look into this for you.

thanks
Colm

Zardoz16

eircom: Colm wrote: »

chatterbox wrote: »

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

Hi zardoz

I have just checked with my colleague and we did not receive a PM from you. Would you like to forward it to me and also confirm how you ordered the service and I will look into this for you.

thanks
Colm

Hi Colm I will send you  PM

jay1988

chatterbox wrote: »

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

Pretty sure thats against European law. You really should contact comreg regarding this.

Zardoz16

jay1988 wrote: »

chatterbox wrote: »

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

Pretty sure thats against European law. You really should contact comreg regarding this.

Comreg do not deal with television, only Broadband and Telephone. Another Eircom Loophole!!!

eircom: Colm

Hi zardoz16

I have just replied to your PM in relation to this.

thanks
Colm

Zardoz16

The reply from the Eircom representative said that:


'I do know that the 14 day cooling off period is not a 14 day trial period and does not apply from the date the service is active.'


What exactly does he mean by this?


And he further suggested that If there was a technical issue with the service that the cancellations team will take the box back.

There is a technical issue with the eVision service, it slows down my eFibre speeds considerably.


However I think that the cancellations team will still charge me €150 to return the equipment and cancel the service.

I'm stuck in an absurd limbo created entirely by Eircom.

The eVision Box now sits under my TV, unplugged and disconnected, gathering dust for the next 18 months until I can hand it back.

Eircom's answer really didn't help much. I think it's a deliberate ploy to get people to keep the service with no way of returning the equipment so it looks like there are more people using it.  This of course looks good for sales figures and projections for the year ahead etc.

Charlatans!

dub45

Its not up to the Eircom representative to interpret the law as in statements like "I do know" - If the representative wishes to make such statements then they should state the basis in law for the statement.

Zardoz16

I would love to see exactly how Eircom interpret European legislation and consumer rights, particularly EU Consumer Rights directive, Chapter three Article six.

They are breaking European consumer rights laws. The only problem is that in this country there is nobody that can or will challenge what they are doing with this Cooling Off period nonsense.

Everyone I tell this story to reacts in the same way; they laugh out loud and then find it unbelievable that it is happening.

I wonder what Joe Duffy would say?

Jesper

chatterbox wrote: »

The way eircom implement the cooling off period rule is scandalous. In my case my installation took over 5 weeks to complete as they continously had no show or late cancellations.. I lost 4 days work waiting for them to arrive... In the end I did want the service.. But way they implement the rule meant I would have had pay to cancel. I think it's a tactic to delay installation as much as possible so they can force people to stay for 12 months regardless of service quality.

I completely agree. I will never use Eircom again even if my life depended on it. see my other posts for the outrageously bad (I believe practically criminal) service. It sickens me that i have to continue contacting them to get a refund for money they have wrongly taken from my account. 

eircom: Alan

Zardoz16 wrote: »

The reply from the Eircom representative said that:


'I do know that the 14 day cooling off period is not a 14 day trial period and does not apply from the date the service is active.'


What exactly does he mean by this?


And he further suggested that If there was a technical issue with the service that the cancellations team will take the box back.

There is a technical issue with the eVision service, it slows down my eFibre speeds considerably.


However I think that the cancellations team will still charge me €150 to return the equipment and cancel the service.

I'm stuck in an absurd limbo created entirely by Eircom.

The eVision Box now sits under my TV, unplugged and disconnected, gathering dust for the next 18 months until I can hand it back.

Eircom's answer really didn't help much. I think it's a deliberate ploy to get people to keep the service with no way of returning the equipment so it looks like there are more people using it.  This of course looks good for sales figures and projections for the year ahead etc.

Charlatans!

Hi Zardoz16

I would like to clarify that Colm had intended to advise you that the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.


I appreciate your views on this although I can assure you that In accordance with the terms & conditions of service the evision has not created technical issues as speeds are sold & provided on the terms of 'up to' the provided speed.

I understand that this can be interpreted to different levels and apologise for the inconvenience this has caused. Should you have any concerns on the nature of what Colm or I have explained you are free to express your concerns to the compliance regulator.

Thanks
Al

dub45

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

The reply from the Eircom representative said that:


'I do know that the 14 day cooling off period is not a 14 day trial period and does not apply from the date the service is active.'


What exactly does he mean by this?


And he further suggested that If there was a technical issue with the service that the cancellations team will take the box back.

There is a technical issue with the eVision service, it slows down my eFibre speeds considerably.


However I think that the cancellations team will still charge me €150 to return the equipment and cancel the service.

I'm stuck in an absurd limbo created entirely by Eircom.

The eVision Box now sits under my TV, unplugged and disconnected, gathering dust for the next 18 months until I can hand it back.

Eircom's answer really didn't help much. I think it's a deliberate ploy to get people to keep the service with no way of returning the equipment so it looks like there are more people using it.  This of course looks good for sales figures and projections for the year ahead etc.

Charlatans!

Hi Zardoz16

I would like to clarify that Colm had intended to advise you that the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.


I appreciate your views on this although I can assure you that In accordance with the terms & conditions of service the evision has not created technical issues as speeds are sold & provided on the terms of 'up to' the provided speed.

I understand that this can be interpreted to different levels and apologise for the inconvenience this has caused. Should you have any concerns on the nature of what Colm or I have explained you are free to express your concerns to the compliance regulator.

Thanks
Al

Can you provide the legal basis for this interpretation?

eircom: Alan

dub45 wrote: »

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

The reply from the Eircom representative said that:


'I do know that the 14 day cooling off period is not a 14 day trial period and does not apply from the date the service is active.'


What exactly does he mean by this?


And he further suggested that If there was a technical issue with the service that the cancellations team will take the box back.

There is a technical issue with the eVision service, it slows down my eFibre speeds considerably.


However I think that the cancellations team will still charge me €150 to return the equipment and cancel the service.

I'm stuck in an absurd limbo created entirely by Eircom.

The eVision Box now sits under my TV, unplugged and disconnected, gathering dust for the next 18 months until I can hand it back.

Eircom's answer really didn't help much. I think it's a deliberate ploy to get people to keep the service with no way of returning the equipment so it looks like there are more people using it.  This of course looks good for sales figures and projections for the year ahead etc.

Charlatans!

Hi Zardoz16

I would like to clarify that Colm had intended to advise you that the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.


I appreciate your views on this although I can assure you that In accordance with the terms & conditions of service the evision has not created technical issues as speeds are sold & provided on the terms of 'up to' the provided speed.

I understand that this can be interpreted to different levels and apologise for the inconvenience this has caused. Should you have any concerns on the nature of what Colm or I have explained you are free to express your concerns to the compliance regulator.

Thanks
Al

Can you provide the legal basis for this interpretation?

Hi dub45

If Zardoz16 requires the legal basis they are welcome to contact the compliance regulator or take necessary legal action.

Al

Zardoz16

No Colm did not advise me on anything! 

Your Quote:
'..the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.'

This statement repeats the absurd and illegal clause that Eircom have set out completely on their own, which is a flagrant abuse of European consumer Law. So in general terms, if it's outside the law it's therefore illegal.

So by that logic if tomorrow, I order a 2015 BMW series 5 from any reputable BMW dealer, my cooling off period expires in 14 days time, before I even get to sit in the the thing.

That's what Eircom is peddling and you know it's wrong and you know it's unfair and you will be found out and this practice will cease.

By the way Al...where does one contact the the compliance regulator?

Zardoz16

I am only going on what was told to me by Geraldine from the National Consumer agency. She stated that this practice does go against the most recent European act. I can't post URLs here but this is what I can paste here. From the National Consumer Agency Site:

dub45 wrote: »

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

New EU laws have given you additional consumer rights to protect you when you buy online. The Consumer Rights Directive only covers purchases from businesses based in the EU.
 
In reading the article mentioned on the site: Consumer Rights Directive, Chapter 111, Article 6. Particularly as mentioned before:
 
(43)
 
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
 
(40)
 
‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
There is a muddle between receiving a service where this ceases 14 days after the contract begins, surely the service was initiated on the day the eFibre and e Vision service was installed at my premises? However, the eVision service relies on the eVision box  which is in fact a piece of electronic equipment that I believe to be sub-standard. As a European citizen I should be able to return the electronic goods and cease a service that I am unsatisfied with.
 
The majority of new customers to this eVision service will, I believe, think that their service commences on the first day of having it in their home.

eircom: Alan

Zardoz16 wrote: »

No Colm did not advise me on anything! 

Your Quote:
'..the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.'

This statement repeats the absurd and illegal clause that Eircom have set out completely on their own, which is a flagrant abuse of European consumer Law. So in general terms, if it's outside the law it's therefore illegal.

So by that logic if tomorrow, I order a 2015 BMW series 5 from any reputable BMW dealer, my cooling off period expires in 14 days time, before I even get to sit in the the thing.

That's what Eircom is peddling and you know it's wrong and you know it's unfair and you will be found out and this practice will cease.

By the way Al...where does one contact the the compliance regulator?

The compliance regulator (Comreg) can be contacted on 1890 229 668.

I will be unable to debate the ethical nature of the terms and conditions of service Zardoz16

Thanks
Al

1890 229668*
1890 229668*

Zardoz16

I am only going on what was told to me by Geraldine from the National Consumer agency. She stated that this practice does go against the most recent European act. I can't post URLs here but this is what I can paste here. From the National Consumer Agency Site:

dub45 wrote: »

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

New EU laws have given you additional consumer rights to protect you when you buy online. The Consumer Rights Directive only covers purchases from businesses based in the EU.
 
In reading the article mentioned on the site: Consumer Rights Directive, Chapter 111, Article 6. Particularly as mentioned before:
 
(43)
 
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
 
(40)
 
‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
There is a muddle between receiving a service where this ceases 14 days after the contract begins, surely the service was initiated on the day the eFibre and e Vision service was installed at my premises? However, the eVision service relies on the eVision box  which is in fact a piece of electronic equipment that I believe to be sub-standard. As a European citizen I should be able to return the electronic goods and cease a service that I am unsatisfied with.
 
The majority of new customers to this eVision service will, I believe, think that their service commences on the first day of having it in their home.

COMREG will not deal with eVision because it is a  Television product. That's what they told me about 2 weeks ago. So again Eircom are getting away with it!

Zardoz16

COMREG will not deal with eVision because it is a  Television product. That's what they told me about 2 weeks ago. So again Eircom are getting away with it!

dub45

eircom: Alan wrote: »

dub45 wrote: »

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

The reply from the Eircom representative said that:


'I do know that the 14 day cooling off period is not a 14 day trial period and does not apply from the date the service is active.'


What exactly does he mean by this?


And he further suggested that If there was a technical issue with the service that the cancellations team will take the box back.

There is a technical issue with the eVision service, it slows down my eFibre speeds considerably.


However I think that the cancellations team will still charge me €150 to return the equipment and cancel the service.

I'm stuck in an absurd limbo created entirely by Eircom.

The eVision Box now sits under my TV, unplugged and disconnected, gathering dust for the next 18 months until I can hand it back.

Eircom's answer really didn't help much. I think it's a deliberate ploy to get people to keep the service with no way of returning the equipment so it looks like there are more people using it.  This of course looks good for sales figures and projections for the year ahead etc.

Charlatans!

Hi Zardoz16

I would like to clarify that Colm had intended to advise you that the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.


I appreciate your views on this although I can assure you that In accordance with the terms & conditions of service the evision has not created technical issues as speeds are sold & provided on the terms of 'up to' the provided speed.

I understand that this can be interpreted to different levels and apologise for the inconvenience this has caused. Should you have any concerns on the nature of what Colm or I have explained you are free to express your concerns to the compliance regulator.

Thanks
Al

Can you provide the legal basis for this interpretation?

Hi dub45

If Zardoz16 requires the legal basis they are welcome to contact the compliance regulator or take necessary legal action.

Al

Can Eircom not tell us as interested customers obviously what they are basing this interpretation on?  Such an answer is not very reassuring to customers is it?  The compliance regulator can hardly give us Eircom's interpretation can they?

And companies know very well that the ordinary person cannot afford to take legal action so they cynically exploit this inability with their corporate behaviour.

dub45

eircom: Alan wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

No Colm did not advise me on anything! 

Your Quote:
'..the cooling off period does not start from when the service (evision in this case) is activated but rather when first ordered.'

This statement repeats the absurd and illegal clause that Eircom have set out completely on their own, which is a flagrant abuse of European consumer Law. So in general terms, if it's outside the law it's therefore illegal.

So by that logic if tomorrow, I order a 2015 BMW series 5 from any reputable BMW dealer, my cooling off period expires in 14 days time, before I even get to sit in the the thing.

That's what Eircom is peddling and you know it's wrong and you know it's unfair and you will be found out and this practice will cease.

By the way Al...where does one contact the the compliance regulator?

The compliance regulator (Comreg) can be contacted on 1890 229 668.

I will be unable to debate the ethical nature of the terms and conditions of service Zardoz16

Thanks
Al

1890 229668*
1890 229668*

Who exactly is asking any Eircom employee to debate the "ethical nature of the terms and conditions of service"?  This is a legal matter - Surely Eircom should know that??

Zardoz16

As said before the Compliance Regulator Al keeps referring to Is the Commission for Communications Regulation, ComReg, Telecommunication Regulation Ireland, Radiocommunications Regulation Ireland, Postal Regulation.

THEY DO NOT DEAL WITH TELEVISION!

Another smoke screen pointing the consumer to a dead end.

I love to know how many people have been affected by this. Consumer affairs don't take on individual cases like mine, but it must be a collective issue now, in the interest of the Irish Nation.

MarkAnthony

If you're sure Eircom are in breach of Irish law (as opposed to the wording of a directive) then simply return the equipment and let them pursue you. There's probably very little you can do in relation to the fibre contract as they are suppling that service. If you remain with them though they are likely to terminate both services.

I don't know why you're getting your knickers in a twist here. There's no point telling people to avoid Eircom, if you'd done even the most cursory research you'd have seen the eVision product is universally lambasted, rejected as a viable technical solution in other countries and simply plain rubbish. All people see is '€X per month' and BUNDLE and jump at it. You get what you pay for - unless of course you just don't pay for it and go with Saorview/Freesat.

Kristopherus

Zardoz16 wrote: »

As said before the Compliance Regulator Al keeps referring to Is the Commission for Communications Regulation, ComReg, Telecommunication Regulation Ireland, Radiocommunications Regulation Ireland, Postal Regulation.

THEY DO NOT DEAL WITH TELEVISION!

Another smoke screen pointing the consumer to a dead end.

I love to know how many people have been affected by this. Consumer affairs don't take on individual cases like mine, but it must be a collective issue now, in the interest of the Irish Nation.

Is E-vision not free for the first 12 months of your initial 18-month contract? Or is  the E-vision impacting overbearingly on your fibre bb? Can they not increase your fibre mbps?

Zardoz16

MarkAnthony wrote: »

If you're sure Eircom are in breach of Irish law (as opposed to the wording of a directive) then simply return the equipment and let them pursue you. There's probably very little you can do in relation to the fibre contract as they are suppling that service. If you remain with them though they are likely to terminate both services.

I don't know why you're getting your knickers in a twist here. There's no point telling people to avoid Eircom, if you'd done even the most cursory research you'd have seen the eVision product is universally lambasted, rejected as a viable technical solution in other countries and simply plain rubbish. All people see is '€X per month' and BUNDLE and jump at it. You get what you pay for - unless of course you just don't pay for it and go with Saorview/Freesat.

Sorry but I don't wear Knickers and I never told anybody to AVOID Eircom. In today's climate all most people are doing is trying to save money somehow and I wanted to try the eVision service, that's all.

I think the eFibre broadband is acceptable and do not want to cease that service. What is really at stake here is the fact that I can't return it without incurring a fee of €150.

MarkAnthony

Zardoz16 wrote: »

MarkAnthony wrote: »

If you're sure Eircom are in breach of Irish law (as opposed to the wording of a directive) then simply return the equipment and let them pursue you. There's probably very little you can do in relation to the fibre contract as they are suppling that service. If you remain with them though they are likely to terminate both services.

I don't know why you're getting your knickers in a twist here. There's no point telling people to avoid Eircom, if you'd done even the most cursory research you'd have seen the eVision product is universally lambasted, rejected as a viable technical solution in other countries and simply plain rubbish. All people see is '€X per month' and BUNDLE and jump at it. You get what you pay for - unless of course you just don't pay for it and go with Saorview/Freesat.

Sorry but I don't wear Knickers and I never told anybody to AVOID Eircom. In today's climate all most people are doing is trying to save money somehow and I wanted to try the eVision service, that's all.

I think the eFibre broadband is acceptable and do not want to cease that service. What is really at stake here is the fact that I can't return it without incurring a fee of €150.

Then you have two options:

Run with it and hand it back at the end of the contract. I assume the massive, and well reported, drag on bandwidth ceases when the thing is plugged out (but that is, as I say an assumption).

Actively pursue the matter yourself through the district court.

Expecting the reps here to be able to comment on the legalities of their contracts is a bit naive. Assuming they even know they're not going to enter into that sort of discussion are they.

Zardoz16

I don't think anyone from Eircom can really discuss the legalities of it all. Their telesales staff just keep spouting the same mantra..."I'm sorry but you have passed the cooling off period... I know...I know... but you have passed the cooling off period." That was 3 weeks ago today!

The box sits unplugged switched off until It gets taken back from Eircom.

It seems that nobody has any idea how to resolve this.

Zardoz16

Kristopherus wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

As said before the Compliance Regulator Al keeps referring to Is the Commission for Communications Regulation, ComReg, Telecommunication Regulation Ireland, Radiocommunications Regulation Ireland, Postal Regulation.

THEY DO NOT DEAL WITH TELEVISION!

Another smoke screen pointing the consumer to a dead end.

I love to know how many people have been affected by this. Consumer affairs don't take on individual cases like mine, but it must be a collective issue now, in the interest of the Irish Nation.

Is E-vision not free for the first 12 months of your initial 18-month contract? Or is  the E-vision impacting overbearingly on your fibre bb? Can they not increase your fibre mbps?

eVision is free for the first 6 months. It does drag the speed down. They cannot increase the Mbps

MarkAnthony

Zardoz16 wrote: »

I don't think anyone from Eircom can really discuss the legalities of it all. Their telesales staff just keep spouting the same mantra..."I'm sorry but you have passed the cooling off period... I know...I know... but you have passed the cooling off period." That was 3 weeks ago today!

The box sits unplugged switched off until It gets taken back from Eircom.

It seems that nobody has any idea how to resolve this.

My inflammatory posting aside I do sympathise.

Most companies will have a policy of X until Y. In the case of going legal this will usually require a solicitors letter before it's taken seriously. Try FLAC and see if they can be of any help but I doubt they will issue correspondence.

For pure devilment you could try the Small Claims Procedure, I assume you want shot of it as it's not working correctly. Obviously there's not much can be done if it's working correctly and it's just crap. That said the registrar might be willing to hear it based on the cooling off etc.

Best of luck with it.

macmurph

Zardoz16 wrote: »

On the 10^th of October 2014 we ordered to Eircom eFibre and eVision Bundle for our home.
On the 28^th of October 2014, 18 days later the eFibre and eVision equipment and service was installed at our home.


On the 29^th of October 2014 we decided that we did not wish to keep the eVision service and I phoned the Eircom Loyalty team to cancel the eVision service.


I was told that I could not cancel it without incurring a fee of €150 because we had surpassed our 14 day cooling off period with the ‘verbal contract’, which was apparently agreed upon on the 10^th of October 2014. I was told that this 14 day cooling off period clause began once I ordered the eVision service on the 10^th of October, not upon the receipt and installation of the service on the 28^th of October.


I was told by Glen, the supervisor of the Loyalty team that this was mentioned to me on October 10^th 2014 over the phone, that once the cooling off period terminates, I could not cancel the service without incurring a fee.


This was not made very clear to me at all. If it had been I would have cancelled the eVision part of my order. The concept of not being able to try a service first before deciding to keep it or not without a cancellation fee is very unfair, and normally not the practice in consumer transactions.
In the 2 confirmation emails I received form you on the 10^th of October it did not mention that the duration of 14 day cooling off period commences immediately. In the link to the Eircom terms and conditions, (The link which expires), there is no mention of the immediate commencement of the cooling off period.


My wife and I have been a loyal customer with Eircom for over 20 years and have never encountered issues with your services until now.
I wish to withdraw from the eVision service but I feel that it is grossly unfair to charge me a cancelation fee.


Normally under European consumer law, the consumer has a period of 14 days to cancel a product or service after the consumer has received the goods or service, or when the service has been installed and made available to them.


The National Consumer Agency advised me to inform you of the EU Consumer Rights directive; Chapter 3 Article 6, which stipulates that if a consumer has not been made very aware of any cooling off period term in a contract that their rights for cancellation of a service is extended to 12 Months:


(43)
‘If the trader has not adequately informed the consumer prior to the conclusion of a distance or off-premises contract, the withdrawal period should be extended. However, in order to ensure legal certainty as regards the length of the withdrawal period, a 12-month limitation period should be introduced.’
 
Furthermore the directive states
(40)‘the withdrawal period should expire after 14 days from the day on which the consumer or a third party other than the carrier and indicated by the consumer, acquires physical possession of the goods’
 
The National Consumer Agency insists that I should not be charged a cancellation fee because the cooling off period should commence upon first receipt of the services and goods. Our cooling off period should expire on the 11^th of November 2014.


The National Consumer Agency told me today that there is nothing they can do about an individual case like mine. But surely I said that thee must be more than one person in Ireland that has experienced this nonsense?



As mentioned, we wish to cancel our eVision subscription. Can anyone inform me now as how to proceed without a cancelation fee?

Hi
I was told by the Eircom genius that called to my house that it was 14 days from the installation date. 
Does not make sense that it starts before you receive the proiduct.
I cancelled after a few days from installation, girl on phone tried the same trick, she even tried to tell me that I was wrong about the installation date. Then she tried to convince me to cancel tv and try the phone and broadband for a little bit longer even the whole thrust of the conversation was about the cooling off period. I stood my ground and wouldnt get off the phone until I got what I what I wanted. They are absolute scammers. 
Dont take no fro an answer and get out as soon as possible. they are a nightmare to deal with.
Good Luck
 

Zardoz16

Kristopherus wrote: »

Zardoz16 wrote: »

As said before the Compliance Regulator Al keeps referring to Is the Commission for Communications Regulation, ComReg, Telecommunication Regulation Ireland, Radiocommunications Regulation Ireland, Postal Regulation.

THEY DO NOT DEAL WITH TELEVISION!

Another smoke screen pointing the consumer to a dead end.

I love to know how many people have been affected by this. Consumer affairs don't take on individual cases like mine, but it must be a collective issue now, in the interest of the Irish Nation.

Is E-vision not free for the first 12 months of your initial 18-month contract? Or is  the E-vision impacting overbearingly on your fibre bb? Can they not increase your fibre mbps?

eVision is free for the first 6 months. It does drag the speed down. They cannot increase the Mbps

Zardoz16

Thanks to all the well wishers.  Anybody want an eVision Box?