Why do no public buses cross the Quincentennial Bridge?

Worn Out

With all the crazy traffic in the city I have always wondered why no public buses cross the main bridge around the city.
Surely there is demand for an "outer ring" type service that circles the city and main business parks on both the east and west sides.

Any reason this has not happened? Surely travelling through the city centre puts many off using the bus.

Eogclouder

Worn Out wrote: »

With all the crazy traffic in the city I have always wondered why no public buses cross the main bridge around the city.
Surely there is demand for an "outer ring" type service that circles the city and main business parks on both the east and west sides.

Any reason this has not happened? Surely travelling through the city centre puts many off using the bus.

That would require common sense on the part of whoever designed the bus routes :P

what_traffic

Worn Out wrote: »

With all the crazy traffic in the city I have always wondered why no public buses cross the main bridge around the city.
Surely there is demand for an "outer ring" type service that circles the city and main business parks on both the east and west sides.

Any reason this has not happened? Surely travelling through the city centre puts many off using the bus.

Even if it was just for the hours of 07h00 -> 10h00 and 16h00->19h00 for the typical commuting times it would on paper seem to be a good proposal.

Perhaps contact the NTA (www.nationaltransport.ie) about this? They have responsibility for the bus routes.

Eogclouder

what_traffic wrote: »

Even if it was just for the hours of 07h00 -> 10h00 and 16h00->19h00 for the typical commuting times it would on paper seem to be a good proposal.

Perhaps contact the NTA (www.nationaltransport.ie) about this? They have responsibility for the bus routes.

I'd love a route like this. I live in knocknacarra but work in Parkmore, the commute can be as long as two hours with traffic, and you have to get 4 busses a day.

Iwannahurl

A very interesting question, OP, and one which I hope you will pursue energetically.

As you may know, development and implementation of transportation policy occurs at a glacial pace in this country.

It can take years just to get a bus shelter erected, for example. Which is why all over the city bus passengers are left standing in the rain on a day like today, quite possibly waiting for a bus delayed by traffic.

The reason for the lack of buses on the Quincentenary Bridge is traffic congestion. In Galway cars, despite their massive inefficiency, take the lion's share of road space.

Bus operators would love to use the Q Bridge, but there is absolutely no point in doing so because they will be stuck in traffic.

Despite all their outward moaning, motorists are actually willing to sit in traffic congestion of their own making every day. If they weren't, they would switch to another mode of travel.

Bus passengers are not similarly willing, and rightly so.

The solution, I would suggest, is a bus lane over the bridge. However, that is not, and perhaps never has been, on the cards, for obvious political reasons.

Here's another question for your consideration, OP: why is there only one bus service operator on the East side of the city?

Eogclouder wrote: »

I'd love a route like this. I live in knocknacarra but work in Parkmore, the commute can be as long as two hours with traffic, and you have to get 4 busses a day.

A succinct description of the core problem.

I used to do a Knocknacarra-Parkmore commute by bike several years ago. It took me 45 minutes, and I was told that was slow!

Two hours on a bus to travel 12-13 km is insane -- no offence to yourself, I'm referring to the traffic madness. That's little better than walking speed.

A QBC stretching from Knocknacarra to Ballybrit/Parkmore would be a huge asset for commuters and a goldmine for bus operators. But none exists. You have to ask why Knocknacarra bus users are forced to go through the city centre, while motorists take up all the space on the most direct route.

I would also suggest asking the "National Transport Authority" why they license bus operators in this manner. Whose interests are they serving?



.

Eogclouder

Iwannahurl wrote: »

A very interesting question, OP, and one which I hope you will pursue energetically.

As you may know, development and implementation of transportation policy occurs at a glacial pace in this country.

It can take years just to get a bus shelter erected, for example. Which is why all over the city bus passengers are left standing in the rain on a day like today, quite possibly waiting for a bus delayed by traffic.

The reason for the lack of buses on the Quincentenary Bridge is traffic congestion. In Galway cars, despite their massive inefficiency, take the lion's share of road space.

Bus operators would love to use the Q Bridge, but there is absolutely no point in doing so because they will be stuck in traffic.

Despite all their outward moaning, motorists are actually willing to sit in traffic congestion of their own making every day. If they weren't, they would switch to another mode of travel.

Bus passengers are not similarly willing, and rightly so.

The solution, I would suggest, is a bus lane over the bridge. However, that is not, and perhaps never has been, on the cards, for obvious political reasons.

Here's another question for your consideration, OP: why is there only one bus service operator on the East side of the city?




A succinct description of the core problem. A QBC stretching from Knocknacarra to Ballybrit/Parkmore would be a huge asset for commuters and a goldmine for bus operators. But none exists. You have to ask why Knocknacarra bus users are forced to go through the city centre, while motorists take up all the space on the most direct route.

I would also suggest asking the "National Transport Authority" why they license bus operators in this manner. Whose interests are they serving?

By the way, I used to do a Knocknacarra-Parkmore commute by bike several years ago. It took me 45 minutes, and I was told that was slow! Two hours on a bus to travel 12 km is insane -- no offence to yourself, I'm referring to the traffic madness.

.

Two hours is the wrost of the worst but it happened to me this morning, I'm looking to relocate closer, somewhere like Roscam.

I agree with everything you're saying above aswell, it's quite bizzare that there isnt a bus that by-passes the city given all the retail and technology parks on the east side.

youngrun

This would be a great and badly needed service , cannot understand why such routes are not in place, bus lanes on SQR etc should be used way more and will give some speed advantage . Should be 15 min services .
No idea how many people commute K/carra/rahoon /salthill to parkmore/ballybrit but it must be 2000+ cars morning ? Ok maybe half of them are doing drop offs and /or wont change but the rest could possibly switch ...

Webbs

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Despite all their outward moaning, motorists are actually willing to sit in traffic congestion of their own making every day. If they weren't, they would switch to another mode of travel.
.

Agree with your post hurl, however, I am a motorist who drives from oranmore across town each day and I for one would love to get a bus service that was reasonably frequent and cost effective.
I would much prefer a bus driver take the strain of the traffic while I sat and read a book. The situation I am sure whilst slightly better still exists for west side residents

For me and I am sure you agree the govt both national and local seem to have public transport policy backwards in saying there is no demand for it so we will keep only a skeleton service going in a limited area. Rather than put the transport in place and the people will come

Iwannahurl

I'm thinking more of commuting within the city.

For example, there is regular moaning from certain quarters about the bus lanes on the Seamus Quirke Road. From time to time there are demands for the bus lanes to be opened up to cars (the most recent from the Environment correspondent of the Irish Independent on Galway Bay FM, iirc!).

There seems to be a perception among motorists that bus lanes in Galway City are underutilised and inefficient, when in fact the opposite is the case.

The SQR bus lanes are heavily used, and it makes absolutely no sense for motorists sitting in traffic on that route to be complaining about half empty buses passing them by!

It is obvious that if buses could use the Q Bridge there would be a massively convenient route from the residential ares in the west to the industrial areas in the east. QBCs are needed to make it work, however.

WRT to Oranmore, that town has its own traffic problems due to the usual bad planning and endemic car dependence.

I noticed recently that the new train station is well outside the town. How easy is it to get to the station on foot or by bike? Is there a local bus service linking to the station?

Mrs OBumble

My guess is that no one has introduced an outer-orbiter service becuase the city population isn't perceived as large enough to justify a frequent-enough service to make it work.

The current 405 route is doing pretty well, because it links
the B&Q area of Knocknacarra
Westside / hostpital / university
courthouse
Eyre Square
Cemetery Cross (populary of this may change once Coláiste na Coiribe finally move west)
Liosban
Mervue industrial
New Mervue residents
GMIT
Ballybrit industrial

Lots and lots of people use it for only a portion of this journey.

A service that didn't have most of those popular-with-current-bus-user-demographic people intermediate stops, would likely become popular - if someone was to invest enough to run it until workers copped on. What we've seen on the 405 is that took a couple of years to happen: the number of people hopping off the 405 and walking up to Boston, HP and the other employers there took quite a while to build, and is still growing. IMHO this type of service needs to be a minimum of ever 20 minitues, preferrably every 15, so that if one bus doesn't come (breakdown, crash, driver sick, whatever) the next one isn't too far behind.

I would run it from Salthill via southern Knocknacarra/Joyces, northern Knocknacarra B&Q, Newcastle, Westside, the Quin bridge, Terryland (if they could figure somewhere to put a stop), Wellpark, Mervue Industrial, Ballybrit industrial, Briarhill and then Parkmore industrial. And maybe even on to Oranmore via Carnmore.

There might be some fear that this would cannabilise the current 405/403/409 - but I don't think this would be significant. And I know (form emails I get) that there is unmet demand for certain portions of that route.


The NTA are indeed the people to be lobbying about bus routes - they might perceive Galway as being sorted now, and be focussing on other areas.

The most logical existing bus operator to do it would be City Direct. But I don't know if they would have the capital and marketing nous to make it work: you may notice they've just introduced a new Moycullen commuter service, but that's just one new-to-them coach running twice a day in each direction AFAIK.

MarysCurtins

Iwannahurl wrote: »

The reason for the lack of buses on the Quincentenary Bridge is traffic congestion. In Galway cars, despite their massive inefficiency, take the lion's share of road space.

Bus operators would love to use the Q Bridge, but there is absolutely no point in doing so because they will be stuck in traffic.

Buses operate on other routes that suffer from congestion though, If bus operators are not using the bridge because "they will be stuck in traffic" then why are they using other routes where they are stuck in traffic? Which company has said they would use the bridge but don't due to congestion?

The bridge isn't being used for one reason imo, poor planning / management of the public transport network. Ironically if a regular service was introduced and people started to use it then there would be less cars on that route thus less congestion which would make public transport more efficient. With the service in place then and only then could we think about a bus lane stretching the whole way to the east side industrial estates. The service could be quiet quick. The reduced capacity on the road for private transport would encourage more people to use public transport, at least you would hope. In order to reduce car usage in the city public transport must be sorted out first, routes etc expanded / added to suit everyone no matter where they are going to / from. Trying to reduce car usage by making it more awkward for them won't work on it's own. If a very good network was in place and people still didn't use it then they could take other measures like charges for cars.

Eogclouder

MarysCurtins wrote: »

Buses operate on other routes that suffer from congestion though, If bus operators are not using the bridge because "they will be stuck in traffic" then why are they using other routes where they are stuck in traffic? Which company has said they would use the bridge but don't due to congestion?

The bridge isn't being used for one reason imo, poor planning / management of the public transport network. Ironically if a regular service was introduced and people started to use it then there would be less cars on that route thus less congestion which would make public transport more efficient. With the service in place then and only then could we think about a bus lane stretching the whole way to the east side industrial estates. The service could be quiet quick. The reduced capacity on the road for private transport would encourage more people to use public transport, at least you would hope. In order to reduce car usage in the city public transport must be sorted out first, routes etc expanded / added to suit everyone no matter where they are going to / from. Trying to reduce car usage by making it more awkward for them won't work on it's own. If a very good network was in place and people still didn't use it then they could take other measures like charges for cars.

Getting from the square to NUIG between half four and half five can take as long as half an hour, it's torture. Traffic congestion is definitely not the reason why.

It makes me long for that bypass out to easy galway with a bus lane all the way there!

Iwannahurl

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

My guess is that no one has introduced an outer-orbiter service becuase the city population isn't perceived as large enough to justify a frequent-enough service to make it work.

The current 405 route is doing pretty well, because it links
the B&Q area of Knocknacarra
Westside / hostpital / university
courthouse
Eyre Square
Cemetery Cross (populary of this may change once Coláiste na Coiribe finally move west)
Liosban
Mervue industrial
New Mervue residents
GMIT
Ballybrit industrial

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a Knocknacarra-Parkmore bus service along the SQR and over the Q Bridge would also link:

Rahoon
Westside
Shantalla
NUI Galway
Newcastle
Dun na Coiribe
Galway Shopping Centre
Terryland Shopping Centre.

Depending on the rest of its route from the Q Bridge to Parkmore, it could also take in Moneenageisha, Liosbaun, Tuam Road etc.

A report in the current edition of the Galway Independent (page 12) says that less than 2% of Galway City workers use public transport. Why would an East-West bus service not be viable, given the size of the untapped market?

MarysCurtins

Iwannahurl wrote: »

WRT to Oranmore, that town has its own traffic problems due to the usual bad planning and endemic car dependence.

Car dependence caused by lack of public transport options for a long time. Sure there is a city bus that runs out there now and the citylink /bus eireann / gobus services can be used but if someone wanted to get to say parkmore again then it's at least 2 buses and a longer commute than hopping into a car and going direct even in heavy congestion

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a Knocknacarra-Parkmore bus service along the SQR and over the Q Bridge would also link:

Rahoon
Westside
Shantalla
NUI Galway
Newcastle
Dun na Coiribe
Galway Shopping Centre
Terryland Shopping Centre.

Depending on the rest of its route from the Q Bridge to Parkmore, it could also take in Moneenageisha, Liosbaun, Tuam Road etc.

It could and would be handy for some people i'd imagine, it could run in conjunction with a direct commuter service that goes Knocknacarra ->SQR-> QB -> B Na dtreabh

what_traffic

Iwannahurl wrote: »

A report in the current edition of the Galway Independent (page 12) says that less than 2% of Galway City workers use public transport. Why would an East-West bus service not be viable, given the size of the untapped market?

The CSO stat's would have a higher figure than that. Guess would need to find out the sample for the report the Chamber of Commerce did?

youngrun

It might be useful to take a census on one or two days a year of traffic flows east /west am and vice versa pm for such a route proposal , ie count cars, buses , bikes and people in cars/buses and see what the market size is for travel across bridge . May be done already ,? .Could form basis for analysis of viability of any service.

cgcsb

Similarly the M50 junction between Blanch and Tallaght is possibly the busiest road in the state, yet there is no public transport alternative along that corridor. The NTA needs to have a proper bash at fixing these issues. The beauty of the NTA is they can decide that a certain place needs a bus lane and local busybody politicians can't interfere on behalf of the people who like traffic congestion.

ratracer

Could you imagine the uproar in the council chambers, let alone the public, if someone came up with a revolutionary idea of removing one traffic lane and putting in a bus lane on each side of the QB. Then people might use a regular, reliable bus service if it were available.

Iwannahurl

ratracer wrote: »

Could you imagine the uproar in the council chambers, let alone the public, if someone came up with a revolutionary idea of removing one traffic lane and putting in a bus lane on each side of the QB. Then people might use a regular, reliable bus service if it were available.

Elections are essentially popularity contests, so unless all 18 Councillors unite to support such a proposal then only those individuals brave and principled enough to stand up against the self-interest of the motoring majority will risk losing votes.

As for the Executive, they are highly unlikely to propose such a measure, since they have no vision and no leadership qualities and are in thrall to certain vested interests.

Such is the way our city is run.

I wonder if we could pass a by-law mandating everyone in City Hall to wear a t-shirt bearing an image like the one below? Translation from the original Romanian entirely unnecessary.

Worn Out

So there is no clear reason as to why there is no bus lane. After 12 years of cycling across the QCB I was always curious as to why there was even talk of a bus route, not even a dedicated lane.
Given the slow pace that the traffic and council move at it will be many years before a bus is spotted on the bridge.
Buses move fast enough along the SQR so a little delay on the bridge would not be a problem. I'd rather sit on a bus reading in traffic on the bridge than burning oil in my own car.

Crumbs868

Would be ideal especially with the advent of the leap card in galway in terms of hopping on and off.

Dublin bus have extended fare caps on multiple journies via leap which will hopefully be extended to bus eireann some day

Iwannahurl

Worn Out wrote: »

So there is no clear reason as to why there is no bus lane. After 12 years of cycling across the QCB I was always curious as to why there was even talk of a bus route, not even a dedicated lane.
Given the slow pace that the traffic and council move at it will be many years before a bus is spotted on the bridge.
Buses move fast enough along the SQR so a little delay on the bridge would not be a problem. I'd rather sit on a bus reading in traffic on the bridge than burning oil in my own car.

Irish buses are notoriously unpunctual, but I suspect bus operators would not be willing to put a service on the QB that could not be timetabled even approximately.

The delays would occur on the bridge in both directions, and on all traffic-choked roads leading to the bridge.

Rumour has it that there are moves afoot to implement measures for buses on streets close to the SQR. Nothing on the City Council website though.

antoobrien

Worn Out wrote: »

So there is no clear reason as to why there is no bus lane.

Physical space.

In order to add bus lanes there are three options:
1) widen the bridge & approaches
2) take space off the current cycle lanes/footpaths
3) take space off the general traffic lanes

For various reasons none of the above are runners. Option (1) faces the same difficulties as the GCOB in that it directly affects an SAC and for bonus awkwardness, Terryland Castle.

Option (2) might be possible, but it'd be a very tight fit, if a combined bus/cycle lane could be incorporated into a reconfigured roadspace that would use the current raised cyclepath. It'd be a very narrow combined cycle/buslane and like many narrow buslanes in Dublin buses might be held up by cyclists.

However, I don't think the existing footpaths are wide enough to support the existing foot traffic, so we'd need to add footpath space outside the current footpaths.

Option (3) is a non runner because it halves the capacity of the road, making an already bad situation much worse. Just to keep the current traffic situation in check would require a minimum two new bus routes, completely fitted out with double decker busses, running at 100% capacity. That suggestion is so bad it should only be published on April 1st.

Iwannahurl

It turns out that there is indeed a proposal to have bus lanes on the QB. The Galway Strategic Bus Study 2007 includes an "Orbital Corridor".

Orbital Corridor
The Orbital Corridor will link the residential areas around Salthill and Knocknacarragh to the Industrial/ Business Parks to the north and east, via the Seamus Quirke Road and the existing N6, and is indicated in Figures 5.13 and 5.14 A/B. This will effectively link the main residential area to a principal employment area of the City, which is currently not well served by public transport. To the east the orbital will run from the industrial estates and the business parks to Oranmore, via Doughiska Road and the Old Dublin Road.

The proposed measures for the Orbital Corridor were to include a "with-flow bus lane on the N6, over Quincentenary Bridge, and Sean Mulvoy Road by converting one of the traffic lanes in each direction to a bus lane."

With regard to a possible bypass, the Study had this to say:

The implementation of this scheme [Orbital Corridor] is dependent on the completion of the Outer Bypass, however it is understood that the Seamus Quirke Road section is to be advanced to design stage in the coming months.

As I have stated elsewhere, I am very sceptical about that perspective on the proposed "bypass".

The following paragraph is also very interesting, in my view. I wonder whether it still applies, given that the original "bypass" plan was ultimately scuppered by the ECJ.

It is the NRA’s intention to declassify all roads within the proposed Galway City Outer Bypass, once the bypass is operational. This means that they will no longer have a strategic road traffic function and the local authorities will be able to reallocate road space to buses, pedestrians, cyclists and local traffic, as they see fit.

antoobrien wrote: »

[Putting bus lanes on the Quincentenary Bridge] is a non runner because it halves the capacity of the road, making an already bad situation much worse. Just to keep the current traffic situation in check would require a minimum two new bus routes, completely fitted out with double decker busses, running at 100% capacity. That suggestion is so bad it should only be published on April 1st.

Evidence please, for the part in bold.

.

antoobrien

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Evidence please, for the part in bold.

.

Doesn't take a genius to do the math.

Capacity of the 1 double decker buses in Galway ~ 90 people.

Halving the capacity of the QB means the buses need a minimum of 17,500 spaces (actually higher as these figures assuming 1 vehicle = 1 person).

17,500 people / 90 ~ 195 bus journeys, so take 190 for variations in capacity.

61 buses one way on route 409 (most frequent in city) - making it 122 total.

We'd need a second route with the frequency of the 401 to make up the difference.

All of the above is assuming fully occupied double decker buses, with no wheelchairs or buggies.

Also bear in mind that the 409 caries 1.1m passengers per year and is estimated to carry 1/3 of the bus passengers in Galway. That works out at an average of 3014 people per day. What we need to see for this plan to come off is a passenger route that exceeds uptake of the busies route in Galway by almost 600%.

Iwannahurl

antoobrien wrote: »

Halving the capacity of the QB means the buses need a minimum of 17,500 spaces (actually higher as these figures assuming 1 vehicle = 1 person).

I'm not sure what you mean by "17500 spaces".

antoobrien

Iwannahurl wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean by "17500 spaces".

Given the context of buses & journeys, I'll let you figure it out.

galwaycyclist

I seem to recall that at one point a proposal was being discussed for "tidal" traffic lanes.

Might be a technical/legal challenge but the idea was as follows. If the dominant flow in the morning is west-east then three of the lanes on the bridge would flow west-east i.e one of the lanes would change direction during peak hours.

In the evening you could do the reverse and give three lanes to the east-west flow.

It would likely make no difference for car journeys since they would overload the junctions - all you would be doing is relocating the queues.

But if one of the three lanes became a bus lane at the same time............?

Crumbs868

galwaycyclist wrote: »

I seem to recall that at one point a proposal was being discussed for "tidal" traffic lanes.

Might be a technical/legal challenge but the idea was as follows. If the dominant flow in the morning is west-east then three of the lanes on the bridge would flow west-east i.e one of the lanes would change direction during peak hours.

In the evening you could do the reverse and give three lanes to the east-west flow.

It would likely make no difference for car journeys since they would overload the junctions - all you would be doing is relocating the queues.

But if one of the three lanes became a bus lane at the same time............?

Great idea having tidal lanes.

http:// youtu.be/dl0Q2bDnBUc

Iwannahurl

galwaycyclist wrote: »

I seem to recall that at one point a proposal was being discussed for "tidal" traffic lanes.

Might be a technical/legal challenge but the idea was as follows. If the dominant flow in the morning is west-east then three of the lanes on the bridge would flow west-east i.e one of the lanes would change direction during peak hours.

In the evening you could do the reverse and give three lanes to the east-west flow.

It would likely make no difference for car journeys since they would overload the junctions - all you would be doing is relocating the queues.

But if one of the three lanes became a bus lane at the same time............?

There seems to be an implicit assumption (see previous posts above) that car passenger "spaces" have to be replaced with an equivalent number of bus "spaces".

Why?

antoobrien

galwaycyclist wrote: »

Might be a technical/legal challenge but the idea was as follows. If the dominant flow in the morning is west-east then three of the lanes on the bridge would flow west-east i.e one of the lanes would change direction during peak hours.

In the evening you could do the reverse and give three lanes to the east-west flow.

Sounds like a good idea, but there isn't enough of a differential between the flows to justify 3/1 & 1/3. The differential would have to be approaching 2/1 to make it work, from reading the numbers in the part 8 for the redesign of the junction, it's nowhere near that.

antoobrien

Iwannahurl wrote: »

There seems to be an implicit assumption (see previous posts above) that car passenger "spaces" have to be replaced with an equivalent number of bus "spaces".

The o.p.

Worn Out wrote: »

With all the crazy traffic in the city I have always wondered why no public buses cross the main bridge around the city.
Surely there is demand for an "outer ring" type service that circles the city and main business parks on both the east and west sides.

is specifically talking about buses.

Iwannahurl

galwaycyclist wrote: »

I seem to recall that at one point a proposal was being discussed for "tidal" traffic lanes.

Might be a technical/legal challenge but the idea was as follows. If the dominant flow in the morning is west-east then three of the lanes on the bridge would flow west-east i.e one of the lanes would change direction during peak hours.

In the evening you could do the reverse and give three lanes to the east-west flow.

It would likely make no difference for car journeys since they would overload the junctions - all you would be doing is relocating the queues.

But if one of the three lanes became a bus lane at the same time............?

Two lanes of cars plus one bus lane? Why?

Crumbs868

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Two lanes of cars plus one bus lane? Why?

There isn't bus route, what do you propose cordoning off a lane for ducks?

galwaycyclist

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Two lanes of cars plus one bus lane? Why?

So that you could have a competitive bus service crossing the bridge? I would also envisage bus priority or bus pre-emption at the traffic lights.

Mrs OBumble

Crumbs868 wrote: »

There isn't bus route, what do you propose cordoning off a lane for ducks?

Iwannahurl

Crumbs868 wrote: »

There isn't bus route, what do you propose cordoning off a lane for ducks?

Allocating all the road space to the most inefficient users of that road space is simply quackers. Bus users, cyclists and pedestrians should be higher up the pecking order. It's no wonder this city is goosed, traffic-wise. Etc.

galwaycyclist wrote: »

So that you could have a competitive bus service crossing the bridge? I would also envisage bus priority or bus pre-emption at the traffic lights.

Why can that not be achieved using the existing lanes? Really what I'm trying to question is this assumption:

antoobrien wrote: »

Halving the [car] capacity of the QB means the buses need a minimum of 17,500 spaces (actually higher as these figures assuming 1 vehicle = 1 person).

galwaycyclist

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Why can that not be achieved using the existing lanes? Really what I'm trying to question is this assumption:

Ah ok. I am one of those who argue that the other three bridges should be closed to private motor traffic. In my view private motor traffic that wants to cross the city should be directed via the Quincentenial bridge instead of using the city centre.

So that implies a need to keep some capacity on the Quincentenial for that purpose.

Iwannahurl

Fair enough.

TBH I can't recall having heard of a proposal such as the one you've outlined.

But at face value it makes sense. The QB could be kept as is, and general efficiency maximised by other measures. For example, I believe the bus service providers would like to see major Park & Ride provision, with at least one P&R on each side of the city.

If buses were to be kept off the QB, I wonder whether there would still be scope for implementing a High Occupancy Vehicle lane?

KevR

Buses should be going across the QB - there must be a market for it. They should at least trial it for 6 months and see what the uptake is like. If they can run a heavily subsidised seasonal P&R (racecourse to city centre), then they should have the resources to try this out. There is no evidence to suggest that traffic is the reason why bus operators are not running buses on this route. As people have already pointed out, traffic affects every single existing bus route in Galway.

I think some people are forgetting that the N6 in Galway City is the biggest people mover in the West of Ireland. Suggesting that a general traffic lane in each direction be converted into a bus lane is complete pie in the sky. There is more chance of the 2015 All Ireland Final being played in my back garden!

Anyhow, here is a practical suggestion for improving efficiency of the N6 and the roads which feed it:

Why not convert the SQR bus lanes into HOV lanes? Any vehicle with 3 or more passengers would be allowed to use the HOV lanes. The SQR is one of the main feeders for the Quincentenary Bridge (and the N6 in general). Incentivising lift sharing along the SQR will have knock-on benefits for the QB/N6.

From Iwannahurl's Wikipedia link:

In 2005, the two lanes of this HOV 3+ facility carried during the morning peak hour (6:30 am to 9:30 am) a total of 31,700 people in 8,600 vehicles (3.7 persons/veh), while the three or four general-purpose lanes carried 23,500 people in 21,300 vehicles (1.1 persons/veh)

HOV lanes should definitely be trialled on the SQR. If it doesn't work, by all means switch the lanes back to bus use only. If it does work, make it permanent and maybe look at widening some other roads in the city to add HOV lanes so that lift sharing is encouraged even further. I would not be in favour of converting existing general purpose lanes into HOV lanes - if new HOV lanes or bus lanes for that matter are to happen, spend some friggin money and widen roads to add them as extra lanes.