Hedge cut - no permission

recipio

People,
I hope this is the right section but need a little advice.
I have a building site which is a long rectangle , about 100yards on the long side.
I planted a hawthorn hedge about 5 years ago inside a wire fence and it was growing nicely ,up to three metres in some places. This is a rural site with farming land on one side and a house on the other.
I was mighty annoyed last Easter to find the farmer had used a mechanical hedge cutter to cut it all down to about a metre. The cuttings were simply left on my site and he had clearly reached in over the fence to cut all the trees.
I'm determined not to let this happen again but what is the legal position.?
Have I a right to let the hedge grow naturally up to its usual height or have farmers the right to trim boundary hedges ?

Norfolk Enchants_

recipio wrote: »

People,
I hope this is the right section but need a little advice.
I have a building site which is a long rectangle , about 100yards on the long side.
I planted a hawthorn hedge about 5 years ago inside a wire fence and it was growing nicely ,up to three metres in some places. This is a rural site with farming land on one side and a house on the other.
I was mighty annoyed last Easter to find the farmer had used a mechanical hedge cutter to cut it all down to about a metre. The cuttings were simply left on my site and he had clearly reached in over the fence to cut all the trees.
I'm determined not to let this happen again but what is the legal position.?
Have I a right to let the hedge grow naturally up to its usual height or have farmers the right to trim boundary hedges ?

Legally speaking he is entiltied to cut anything that encroaches/overhangs his property and by law he is supposed to return the cuttings back to the owner, without photos it's impossible to tell if that is or isn't the case in your case.
That's legally speaking of course, but why don't you try the old fashioned way and talk to him resonably first before you threaten him with law.

magicbastarder

sounds like they were planted inside the fence, so the farmer chopped trees which were not on his property.

i'd go with the 'talk to him' approach though.

recipio

Thanks all.
Yes, I will try and talk to him and really want to avoid the legal route at all costs. I planted them just inside the fence - with hindsight I should have planted them about 2 metres inside to allow for growth. We are being urged by the County Councils to plant native hedges but I wonder if there is some antipathy towards the standard high hawthorn hedge. ?

lgk

Go talk to him, he's entitled to cut what crosses over the boundary, but nothing on your side of it. He may have thought he was doing you a favour.

looksee

In the long run you will probably get better growth, but nonetheless it is your hedge and he had no right to cut it. Have a chat with him.

rje66

recipio wrote: »

People,
I hope this is the right section but need a little advice.
I have a building site which is a long rectangle , about 100yards on the long side.
I planted a hawthorn hedge about 5 years ago inside a wire fence and it was growing nicely ,up to three metres in some places. This is a rural site with farming land on one side and a house on the other.
I was mighty annoyed last Easter to find the farmer had used a mechanical hedge cutter to cut it all down to about a metre. The cuttings were simply left on my site and he had clearly reached in over the fence to cut all the trees.
I'm determined not to let this happen again but what is the legal position.?
Have I a right to let the hedge grow naturally up to its usual height or have farmers the right to trim boundary hedges ?

Is it possible that a hedge cutting contractor trimmed the hedge and not the landowners?

rje66

recipio wrote: »

People,
I hope this is the right section but need a little advice.
I have a building site which is a long rectangle , about 100yards on the long side.
I planted a hawthorn hedge about 5 years ago inside a wire fence and it was growing nicely ,up to three metres in some places. This is a rural site with farming land on one side and a house on the other.
I was mighty annoyed last Easter to find the farmer had used a mechanical hedge cutter to cut it all down to about a metre. The cuttings were simply left on my site and he had clearly reached in over the fence to cut all the trees.
I'm determined not to let this happen again but what is the legal position.?
Have I a right to let the hedge grow naturally up to its usual height or have farmers the right to trim boundary hedges ?

Is it possible that a hedge cutting contractor trimmed the hedge and not the landowners?

Gerobrien25

Had this problem before, farmers are required to keep hedging cut back (even if not planted in their land, but grows into their land) under EU subsidy laws. I talk to farm advise body at time and got same answer. I came to an agreement with the farmer to consult with me before cutting.

recipio

rje66 wrote: »

Is it possible that a hedge cutting contractor trimmed the hedge and not the landowners?

Thanks. This hadn't occurred to me. Do farmers contract hedge cutters to keep the hedges trimmed ?
I have no problem with having the branches overhanging the farmers land cut. Can they do that instead of cutting the whole lot down ?
I get the feeling that a 15 foot high hawthorn is a bit 'too wild' for the farmer but of course I planted it to ensure some privacy when I eventually build there.

baaba maal

Just echoing the suggestions to have a chat with the farmer.

One thing to maybe do a bit of research on is to establish that your fence is the actual legal boundary. If your site was part of his field he may feel that the boundary fence "creeped" a bit and he is asserting his landowning.

This is obviously unlikely but I had a difference of opinion with a neighbouring farmer and when I checked with the land registry map it turns out that he owned ALL of the hedge and boundary ditch that I had assumed was shared between us.

Well done on the hedging initiative OP- you are doing the right thing and hopefully you will have a lovely mature native hedge in a few years.

rje66

rje66 wrote: »

Is it possible that a hedge cutting contractor trimmed the hedge and not the landowners?

Also have a Google search for REPS hedge cutting..

To answer your question above, yes some farmers get in contract hedge cutting contractors and it's possible he/she may not realize it's not the farmers hedge.😵😵😵

Miall108

recipio wrote: »

People,
I hope this is the right section but need a little advice.
I have a building site which is a long rectangle , about 100yards on the long side.
I planted a hawthorn hedge about 5 years ago inside a wire fence and it was growing nicely ,up to three metres in some places. This is a rural site with farming land on one side and a house on the other.
I was mighty annoyed last Easter to find the farmer had used a mechanical hedge cutter to cut it all down to about a metre. The cuttings were simply left on my site and he had clearly reached in over the fence to cut all the trees.
I'm determined not to let this happen again but what is the legal position.?
Have I a right to let the hedge grow naturally up to its usual height or have farmers the right to trim boundary hedges ?

Horse into it with a strimmers and say no more

Paulownia

Miall108 wrote: »

Horse into it with a strimmers and say no more

Be careful how you approach it but have a friendly chat with the farmer and explain that you don't want it cut again, did he have a contracter in?

Miall108

Paulownia wrote: »

Be careful how you approach it but have a friendly chat with the farmer and explain that you don't want it cut again, did he have a contracter in?

This all seems a bit unnecessary over a hedge to be fair. I knows theres boundaries and all that but it seems the farmer is being an ar"sehole and making a mountain out of a molehill. Most normal reasonable people wouldnt have a problem with it. If the hedge was affecting me I would cut it and tell the farmer where to stick it if I was him seeing as he wont cut it himself. I would be very quick in telling him to cop onto himself over a small piece of hedging

baaba maal

Miall108 wrote: »

This all seems a bit unnecessary over a hedge to be fair. I knows theres boundaries and all that but it seems the farmer is being an ar"sehole and making a mountain out of a molehill. Most normal reasonable people wouldnt have a problem with it. If the hedge was affecting me I would cut it and tell the farmer where to stick it if I was him seeing as he wont cut it himself. I would be very quick in telling him to cop onto himself over a small piece of hedging

The OP planted the hedge and doesn't want it cut.

Mattie500

You will have a much better hedge after this even though it wasn't your intention to cut it. Could be a mistake by a contractor that the farmer had hired. Quick chat and it might work out well in the long run (you get your hedge kept tidy in future years).

Miall108

baaba maal wrote: »

The OP planted the hedge and doesn't want it cut.

Did he not fence it off properly?

Green farmer

I'm a farmer. It's most likely that he has to keep hedges cut each year in order to get his farm payments etc from the department of agriculture. very few farmers cut it themselves as requires an expensive hedge cutters and get a contractor to do this work for them, so the farmer may or May not been aware that your hedge was even cut. If the farmer did know and was cutting the whole field, he might have though he was being neighbourly doing you a favour by cutting yours as well in the process.
Forget the legal stuff and talk to the man first. Most ( but not all ) farmers are approachable normal people.

zagmund

Miall108 wrote: »

Did he not fence it off properly?

Fence off a hedge?

z

Miall108

zagmund wrote: »

Fence off a hedge?

z

Fence off the boundary where the hedge is. Makes it easier on everyone. Its just asking for trouble leaving it out in the open like that

recipio

Miall108 wrote: »

Fence off the boundary where the hedge is. Makes it easier on everyone. Its just asking for trouble leaving it out in the open like that

Thanks all.
The site has a meter high post and wire fence which I put in after the site was bought. There is no dispute about the boundary. Due to inexperience I put the hawthorn hedge just a foot inside this.
I appreciate all the advice, I will approach the farmer and have a friendly chat.
I don't want to be known as a crank before I even try to build there.!
I just hope he will agree to let the hawthorn grow as nature intended and not maintain a trim privet type hedge.

Kevwoody

Miall108 wrote: »

Fence off the boundary where the hedge is. Makes it easier on everyone. Its just asking for trouble leaving it out in the open like that

Ffs did you read the op at all?

OP, it's great that you're going to go and talk to the farmer to try to sort this out in a friendly manner.

I just wanted to mention though, that you've said that this is a site you plan to build on in the future - it sounds like you're not actually living there at the moment?

In that case, had the farmer wanted to consult you about the hedge, he hasn't really had any way to get in touch with you while watching the hedge grow bigger and bigger for 5 years. In your mind you were trying to grow it, but he might have gotten the impression that you had planted it and then not cared enough to maintain it.

Paulownia

Farmers are different, I bought a house with some land from a farmer and renovated the house which had been derelict and he continued to put cattle on the land, when I asked him to remove them he wasn't a bit happy and said he thought he was doing me a favour keeping the grass down.
When one of his cattle fell into the hole we had dug for our new septic tank he threatened to sue me although he had cut the fence between his field and mine to let his cattle in on my land.
Twenty years later we are friendly neighbours but he took a long time to get used to the idea that I had rights too!

SILVAMAN

lgk wrote: »

He may have thought he was doing you a favour.

You're taking the piss, right?

lgk

SILVAMAN wrote: »

You're taking the piss, right?

What in there would suggest that? I've heard of it happening before. Farmer has contractors on site doing work, tells them to do one of the neighbour's as well while they're at it to save them the hassle. Costs the farmer nothing or close to it and he thinks he's doing the hedge owner a favour. Used to be the way in the country back in the good low days...

Also, you do know pruning each year is recommended for healthy growth, right? Actually, for hawthorn, twice annually is best.

SILVAMAN

OK...like the farmer is painting his house and tells his contractors to go in and paint his neighbours too...as a favour?
I'd love to meet the farmer who will put his hand in his own pocket to fund activities on his neighbour's farm not to mention ignore the legal implications of trespass/damage.
I'd say he did it to suit himself, and not of any altruistic bent.
As for the twice annual prune of hawthorn....

lgk

SILVAMAN wrote: »

OK...like the farmer is painting his house and tells his contractors to go in and paint his neighbours too...as a favour?
I'd love to meet the farmer who will put his hand in his own pocket to fund activities on his neighbour's farm not to mention ignore the legal implications of trespass/damage.

Totally different scenario, but I grew up in an area surrounded by plenty of farmers like that! It's an approach that is fast dieing out in the country due to this attitude, not so many years ago, neighbours would all have looked out for each other, mending fences or the likes here and there without giving it a second thought. And a short section of hedge in a field a contractor's already working in is likely not to involve extra cost.

SILVAMAN wrote: »

I'd say he did it to suit himself, and not of any altruistic bent.

And your wild speculation is better than anyone else's because?

SILVAMAN wrote: »

As for the twice annual prune of hawthorn....

You're right of course, sure what do the RHS know about plant health! :rolleyes:

Mattie500

Fully agree lgk, there was a time when living in the country entailed looking out for your neighbour just as they would look out for you. Unfortunately this is being diluted.
Believe it or not people do help each other in the country, tree needs falling, load of stone needs spreading, timber needs to be split.., farmer will have the equipment and can be called on to help out.

GreeBo

lgk wrote: »

Also, you do know pruning each year is recommended for healthy growth, right? Actually, for hawthorn, twice annually is best.

I dont think taking 2/3rd off the height is pruning under any definition.

sconhome

GreeBo wrote: »

I dont think taking 2/3rd off the height is pruning under any definition.

Pruning would be 1/3 off, coppicing is the method of butting or close to butting, hedgerows to encourage young fresh growth.

OP - An approach would be to ask the farmer was there a particular reason he cut the hedge so tight / low etc and then from there handle I would have preferred to know or been involved.

You've asked his opinion and doffing the hat to his knowledge gained a non-aggressive approach that may get the point accross without falling out.

Paulownia

Hawthorn if left alone grows into a tree and makes a hopeless hedge, one way to avoid that is to half cut branches and place them laterally. Used to be commonplace practice to ''lay'' a hedge but it has probably all but disappeared with the advent of mechanical hedge cutters. The laterals will continue to grow and the wounds will heal giving you an impenetrable barrier. Google it, there is actually a hedge laying association here in Ireland. I'm sure their version is very posh but anyone can do it in a less sophisticated way and it will work.

Mattie500

Did not know the correct term (lay a hedge) but it is something my Dad has taught me when planting a hedge. I planted a white thorn hedge about 4 years ago and it was a nasty job to do last year. Worked very well though. This method can also be used to "spread" a white thorn tree. Cut a branch (not all the way through) and leave it fall on the ditch, it will shoot new branches which can fill a gap in the Dutch.

Paulownia

Mattie,
you should join the tree laying club, sounds like you are half way there already

Mattie500

Ha ha, tree laying club would probably need references from 10 existing members before admission.... anyway.... I am much more of a beech hedge person myself... Spectacular this time of year.

Paulownia

How right you are, beech hedges are magic at this time of year

Paulownia

OP, read today's Irish Times about the man who is in court for allegedly threatening a neighbour who objected to him cutting a hedge!

Miall108

Paulownia wrote: »

OP, read today's Irish Times about the man who is in court for allegedly threatening a neighbour who objected to him cutting a hedge!

Bit extreme isnt it from both sides that is

Paulownia

Miall108 wrote: »

Bit extreme isnt it from both sides that is

The things people do to each other.
We had a neighbour once who tried to establish a right of way through our garden