"Petrol Stretching" In East Mayo

mayo.mick

Serious number of people at the meeting tonight in Gateway Hotel Swinford about #petrolstretching in Swinford. Over 70 claims to one insurance company from Swinford area alone. On a survey from people coming to the meeting tonight, 29 affected from 1 garage and 19 from another garage. There were people there from Roscommon, Foxford, Charlestown Ballina and numerous other towns, I could not hear. I only got as far as the hallway! Figures quoted are from the chairman of the committee who gathered the names and is handing them into An Garda.

1st report was on 8th of August last, but contamination was going on since June/July. Seems to be mostly newer cars, 08 upwards. Also motorbikes, quads, lawnmowers and strimmers.

An Garda was present but not customs & excise or revenue. There was also a representative from two petrol stations present as well as Cllr Michael Smyth, Cllr Annie Mae Reape, Michelle Mulhern TD, Dara Callery TD were some of the elected representitives present. This is going to get bigger, a lot more counties affected also, mostly in the BMW region.

Some insurance companies have paid out but they have now refused to cover the costs, according to numerous victims speaking from the floor.

There was a reporter and photographer from the Western People there at the meeting also.

More info on the motors thread;

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057278358

yop

Mod Note: No naming of any petrol stations please

irishgeo

would it be possible to bring the stations in question to the small claims court?

oscarBravo

irishgeo wrote: »

would it be possible to bring the stations in question to the small claims court?

Dubious. Could you prove that they were guilty? If the proof is there, there's a criminal case to answer; if there's no proof, you'll probably lose.

yop

irishgeo wrote: »

would it be possible to bring the stations in question to the small claims court?

There was a section about it there on Midwest this morning, have a listen. That was brought up but there was no evidence since the fuel was probably sold in June/July and the issues with the engines didn't appear til after, so the problem fuel is gone out of the tanks. Trying to prove it seems impossible.

Carson10

Drove though Ballyhaunis this week. Didnt notice any petrol stretching **Irrelevant to the topic.**

Buona Fortuna

yop wrote: »

There was a section about it there on Midwest this morning, have a listen. That was brought up but there was no evidence since the fuel was probably sold in June/July and the issues with the engines didn't appear til after, so the problem fuel is gone out of the tanks. Trying to prove it seems impossible.

There was a similar thing with a supermarket in England that sold petrol. The fuel damaged the cat converters. I believe that after some time they paid out.

It obviously needed people to be able to prove where they filled up and how often and to get together with other similarly affected.

Personally I fill up anywhere I feel like it so probably wouldn't have any chance of any rederess.

irishgeo

more petrol stretching has occurred in foxford.

TopTec

irishgeo wrote: »

more petrol stretching has occurred in foxford.

When? Where? How do you know? I was in Foxford this PM and nearly used the station in Chapel Road.

TT

irishgeo

TopTec wrote: »

When? Where? How do you know? I was in Foxford this PM and nearly used the station in Chapel Road.

TT

A lad from work told me who is from foxford, i am not allowded name names

the last few weeks apparently.

Paul Ryan

I have just setup facebook page "Petrol Stretching Victims Ireland" to share info with other people effected.

mayo.mick

Another discussion on this over on politics.ie here,

http://www.politics.ie/forum/transport/230145-petrol-stretching.html

woody1

pulled into one of the petrol stations in foxford yesterday and all the petrol pump handles were tied up with out of use written on them,

runawaybishop

woody1 wrote: »

pulled into one of the petrol stations in foxford yesterday and all the petrol pump handles were tied up with out of use written on them,

common occurrence over the last while.

mayo.mick

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/provo-gangs-run-petrol-stretching-fuel-scam-30674899.html

The petrol "stretching" scam that has destroyed hundreds of new car engines this year is controlled by former IRA gangs based in south Armagh, the Sunday Independent has learned.

The same gangs turned away from the once highly profitable "washing" of dye from smuggled diesel after Irish and UK governments agreed on the introduction of a fail-safe radioactive isotope dye at the start of this year.

They are now smuggling and selling huge amounts of adulterated petrol, which is destroying engines in new- model, high-efficiency cars at a cost of around €4,000 to €5,000 in repairs or engine replacement a time. Industry sources say it takes up to a week to clean an engine gummed up with the residue from the kerosene and methanol adulterants.

The south Armagh IRA smugglers are now lacing petrol with what gardai say is "Northern kerosene", the clear kerosene or paraffin which they buy cheaply in Northern Ireland and mix along with methanol to "stretch" legitimate petrol.

The current "stretch" is said to be 20pc kerosene and 5pc methanol per litre of "petrol".

At current filling station rates, it is estimated the Provos are undercutting the legitimate market by around 45c to 47c a litre and making €15,000 clear profit per 3,000- litre tanker delivery.

Customs and gardai have identified a number of filling stations around the country that were bought up by the south Armagh gangs with their multi-millions in profits from diesel washing.

Gardai say the bulk of the smugglers' income is now composed of the adulterated petrol and the simple smuggling of diesel northwards across the Border. With the decline in value of the euro against Sterling, straightforward smuggling is netting the south Armagh gangs profits similar to that being made on the adulterated petrol.

The Sunday Independent last week witnessed fuel tankers being filled in south Armagh and one driving - illegally - across the Border. The area where the main fuel smuggling operations are contained is known locally as "Shatt al-Arab" after the main oil terminal in the Persian Gulf, due to the number of fuel operations there.

The latest slew of damaged car engines is in Mayo, where gardai say they have passed 86 complaints on to the Customs Service for analysis.

Despite the massive costs involved in damage to car engines and the loss of revenue to the State, no prosecutions have taken place so far, though gardai and customs are aware of most of the outlets where the adulterated petrol is being sold.

Mayo Fine Gael TD Michelle Mulherin has called on Justice Minister Francis Fitzgerald to take action against the gangs responsible for causing such huge costs to car owners, who are finding that their insurance does not cover damage caused by the adulterated petrol.

Last month, Ms Mulherin accused Sinn Fein of avoiding a public meeting in Swinford, Co Mayo, attended by 400 people angered by the damage being caused by the adulterated petrol.

Speaking in the Dail later, Ms Mulherin said: "It begs the question whether Sinn Fein condones the practice. I ask if it could be intrinsically associated with the fact that the IRA has been oft associated with fuel laundering. We know of the very close ties of Sinn Fein with the IRA. I wondered with great interest on the night [of the public meeting]whether it is condoning what is going on."

Sinn Fein denied Ms Mulherin's accusation and accused her of "blatant electioneering". It also pointed out that one of its local representatives did attend the Swinford meeting.

Customs sources have told the Sunday Independent that over the past decade the south Armagh fuel gangs have bought well over 100 filling stations around the country, and they suspect many of these are now being used to sell the adulterated petrol.

The damage caused by the adulterants happens when the gum forms into a harder crust inside the engine, causing the engine to fail. Industry sources said it takes a full day's labour to disassemble one of the modern engines, another full day to clean it by hand and another day at least to put it back together again.

Mechanics are telling car owners it would be cheaper and more efficient to simply dump the engine and buy a second-hand engine from a damaged car as a replacement.

mayo.mick

Another meeting regarding petrol stretching in east Mayo next Monday 27th October in the Gateway Hotel Swinford at 8.30.

A second public meeting on the issue of petrol stretching takes place next Monday, October 27th, in the Gateway Hotel in Swinford at 8.30p.m.
This meeting is a follow up on the previous meeting which was held on the Sept 16th when almost 400 people attended.
Local politicians, gardai, forecourt attendants, Customs and Revenue and the general public are all invited.
Anyone affected by Engine Failure due to contaminated petrol is encouraged to attend as the organisers of the meeting believe that in numbers, the matter will have to be addressed at national level.
Steve Cawley is one of the organisers of the meeting and told Midwest News that 5 weeks down the line – most people impacted by petrol stretching remain concerned and at a significant financial loss.
For further information you can Contact Steve on Bernard on or or Paddy McNulty on PM FOR THE NUMBERS

mayo.mick

At the meeting last night (of over 300) in the gateway hotel in Swinford, the garda said there were 167 statements taken from people in the Swinford area, whose cars were destroyed by petrol stretching. Yet the revenue representative said there were only 15 cases reported in Mayo!

One petrol station operator caught up in this has said that the delivery he got which might have been the cause, was a "split load". The same tanker delivered to Tulsk and Foxford also, those stations are also affected.

mayo.mick

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/petrol-stretching-revenue-arent-doing-enough-about-this-at-all-295983.html

90 cases reported to Revenue????? There were 167 cases reported to Swinford Gardai alone, and that was up to last week, more cases since then.

Another thread over in the motors section, http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057278358

irishgeo

mayo.mick wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/petrol-stretching-revenue-arent-doing-enough-about-this-at-all-295983.html

90 cases reported to Revenue????? There were 167 cases reported to Swinford Gardai alone, and that was up to last week, more cases since then.

Another thread over in the motors section, http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057278358

and surprisingly they are not going to f all about it.

how are the insurance companies allowed to weasel their way out of covering it.

mayo.mick

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1106/657341-petrol-fuel/

hfallada

Why does Petrol Stretching and washed Diesel only really occur in the West. I have never heard of everyone in Dublin talk about either. But my Uncle is always on about washed Diesel in Sligo. Is it due to the fact, the west has more independent garages? Where as they are all chains in Dublin?

mayo.mick

http://www.mayonews.ie/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=21086:tourist-latest-victim-of-swinford-petrol-stretching&catid=23:news&Itemid=46

The Oireachtas Joint Committee on Transport and Communications has this morning raised grave concerns around the prevalence of petrol stretching, and its impact on families in Border, Midlands and Western counties in particular.

3 December 2014

Officials from the Revenue Commissioners were appearing before the Committee to discuss recent trends of the practice that involves the adding of kerosene to petrol. Revenue officials told the Committee that they have found no evidence of a systemic problem with regard to the practice, but are aware of localised instances in certain parts of the country.

Chairman of the Committee John O’Mahony TD says: “This morning’s meeting with Revenue Officials was a valuable opportunity to assess the prevalence of this form of fuel fraud, which has left drivers with huge repair bills from damaged engines. Anecdotal evidence presented by Committee Members from range of constituencies would indicate a worrying trend across Border, Midland and Western counties. Members outlined how in many cases, two cars in the one household might have been damaged by petrol from the same filling station, leaving families with a heavy financial burden.

“While we take on board assurances that Revenue believe they are adequately equipped to tackle the problem, Committee Members are nonetheless gravely concerned at the prevalence of the practice on the ground. The Committee heard that complaints to Revenue about the practice have tapered off recently, but of course this provides little consolation to those drivers adversely impacted by the crime this year. Fuel laundering is a longstanding concern of the Committee, and we will continue to explore how to ensure this particular practice might be curbed over a series of hearings in the coming weeks.”

irishgeo

Is it not possible to bring cases to the small claims court?

mayo.mick

There is no major update on the Customs Service investigation into petrol stretching.
That’s according to Mayo Fianna Fail Deputy Dara Calleary.
Deputy Calleary raised the issue of petrol stretching during a recent Dail debate on the reform of the Customs Service.
However he was informed by Minster Simon Harris that there is no update on the investigation.
Deputy Calleary says that many people affected by the issue have been left in limbo, 6 months on from the first reports of petrol stretching.
While many motorists have received insurance payments for damage sustained to their cars, some have lost their no-claims bonuses.

corsav6

mayo.mick wrote: »

There is no major update on the Customs Service investigation into petrol stretching.
That’s according to Mayo Fianna Fail Deputy Dara Calleary.
Deputy Calleary raised the issue of petrol stretching during a recent Dail debate on the reform of the Customs Service.
However he was informed by Minster Simon Harris that there is no update on the investigation.
Deputy Calleary says that many people affected by the issue have been left in limbo, 6 months on from the first reports of petrol stretching.
While many motorists have received insurance payments for damage sustained to their cars, some have lost their no-claims bonuses.

Branding has been removed from a petrol station in foxford, a cheap sign has been put up displaying the owners name instead. This is the same place that had their pumps tied up a few months ago.

nuac

mayo.mick wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/provo-gangs-run-petrol-stretching-fuel-scam-30674899.html

All "good republicans" no doubt, as defined by Gerry Adams

mass_debater

In fairness the Sindo have a huge anti Sinn Fein agenda, greedy garage owners are to blame, trying to maximise their profits

runawaybishop

corsav6 wrote: »

Branding has been removed from a petrol station in foxford, a cheap sign has been put up displaying the owners name instead. This is the same place that had their pumps tied up a few months ago.

Those pumps are still tied up.

nuac

mass_debater wrote: »

In fairness the Sindo have a huge anti Sinn Fein agenda, greedy garage owners are to blame, trying to maximise their profits

So nothing at all at all to do with those who ran the diesel laundering scams?

Is it all down to "greedy garage owners"?

mass_debater

nuac wrote: »

So nothing at all at all to do with those who ran the diesel laundering scams?

Is it all down to "greedy garage owners"?

You have no proof of where it came from only an idea from gathered evidence of where it was sold so yes we are dealing with the greedy garage owners who created the market for it. Sindo as usual are trying to turn it into a political stick to beat SF with, they have no proof and neither do you, all conjecture.

nuac

mass_debater wrote: »

You have no proof of where it came from only an idea from gathered evidence of where it was sold so yes we are dealing with the greedy garage owners who created the market for it. Sindo as usual are trying to turn it into a political stick to beat SF with, they have no proof and neither do you, all conjecture.

That stuff did not fall from the sky.

I have heard of one group only who were engaged in fuel laundering.

Therefore imho there is some basis for at least suggesting that that group be investigated about these crimes

mass_debater

nuac wrote: »

That stuff did not fall from the sky.

I have heard of one group only who were engaged in fuel laundering.

Therefore imho there is some basis for at least suggesting that that group be investigated about these crimes

You heard, well that settles that then! FFS

nuac

mass_debater wrote: »

You heard, well that settles that then! FFS

What is the "FFS" about.?

Anybody who reads the papers or listens or watches the news has read or heard about the activities of these gentlemen

mass_debater

nuac wrote: »

What is the "FFS" about.?

Anybody who reads the papers or listens or watches the news has read or heard about the activities of these gentlemen

That's the problem, RTE is even more politically biased than the Sindo who all have an blatant agenda in their reporting. It's one of the many criminal gangs but they spin it for political gain. You never hear them ever reporting about anything being a result of ethnic minority gang or people of a certain race or nationality because it doesn't suit.

mayo.mick

Latest news; https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2015-01-28a.119&s=petrol+stretching#g120.q

Denis Naughten (Roscommon-South Leitrim, Independent)

50. To ask the Minister for Finance further to meeting the Minister of State and senior officials, the progress to date on investigations into petrol stretching; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [4022/15]


52. To ask the Minister for Finance the number of complaints of petrol stretching received by Customs and Excise in each of the past seven months; the number which were investigated; the number which are ongoing; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [4024/15]

Michael Noonan (Minister, Department of Finance; Limerick City, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source
I propose to take Questions Nos. 50 and 52 together.

I am advised by the Revenue Commissioners, who are responsible for tackling fuel fraud, that they are very aware of the risks posed to consumers' vehicles, legitimate businesses and the Exchequer by all forms of fuel fraud.

Revenue has, since last summer, received reports from a variety of locations around the country of problems relating to petrol quality, and suggestions that these problems are attributable to petrol stretching. The total number received to date is 134, and the numbers received in each month since July 2014 are set out in the following table.

Numbers received in each month since July 2014
July 2014 August 2014 September 2014 October 2014 November 2014 December 2014 January 2015
1 12 28 34 42 11 6


Revenue investigates all complaints of this kind and Revenue officers have visited and taken samples from every filling station about which a complaint has been made about fuel contamination, and these samples have been referred to the State Laboratory for scientific analysis. Despite extensive testing by the State Laboratory, evidence of a prohibited stretching agent has been found in only two samples, both taken from one site. The conclusive results received in that particular case resulted in seizure of the product and a file is being prepared with a view to prosecution.

Following a series of further tests conducted by the state laboratory, results were received which indicated the presence of traces of road diesel in several samples taken from a variety of locations. This could indicate that petrol was contaminated with road diesel at some point in time. There is no rational economic reason or fraudulent incentive for anyone to mix normal road diesel with petrol. This contamination could have taken place well ahead of the problems related to fuel quality that manifested themselves in vehicles.

If the problems that have come to light were caused by unintended contamination resulting from diesel being inadvertently mixed with petrol at some point along the supply chain, there would be no Revenue offence involved. In any instances where the analysis of petrol samples by the State Laboratory indicates the presence of illegal stretching agents in petrol, Revenue will take robust action and pursue prosecutions against offenders where possible. Revenue will also continue to work closely with An Garda Síochána and to share information and intelligence with them on this issue.

I am also advised by the Revenue Commissioners that they undertake, on an ongoing basis, an extensive programme of compliance and enforcement actions to ensure adherence to the legal requirements governing the supply and sale of mineral oil and to allow action to be taken against fraud. This involves, among other things, carrying out analysis of the monthly oil movement returns that oil traders are required to make, and of other supply chain data. In addition, Revenue officers conduct control or compliance visits to mineral oil traders, during which they examine transport and movement documentation and take samples of fuel for analysis.

I am assured by the Revenue Commissioners that action on this matter continues to be a priority. They will, accordingly, take all possible steps to identify the problem, to challenge any instance of identified fuel fraud and, where possible, to prosecute anyone found to be involved in fraudulent activity of that kind.

mayo.mick

More info here;

https://www.kildarestreet.com/committees/?id=2015-01-21a.1282&s=petrol+stretching#g1294

Waerobic Woxajack

mass_debater wrote: »

That's the problem, RTE is even more politically biased than the Sindo who all have an blatant agenda in their reporting. It's one of the many criminal gangs but they spin it for political gain. You never hear them ever reporting about anything being a result of ethnic minority gang or people of a certain race or nationality because it doesn't suit.

RTE, the Sindo, etc. are all the same organisation owned by the very same shareholders. Their aim is to promote a sinful, arrogant, godless, uncaring, vulgar society. Note the first 3 letters in SINdo.

irishgeo

Waerobic Woxajack wrote: »

RTE, the Sindo, etc. are all the same organisation owned by the very same shareholders. Their aim is to promote a sinful, arrogant, godless, uncaring, vulgar society. Note the first 3 letters in SINdo.

rte doesnt have shareholders, its owned by the taxpayer.

mayo.mick

http://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/car-news/how-scandal-of-petrol-stretching-has-ruined-at-least-2000-engines-30999998.html

mayo.mick

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/crime/fuel-smuggling-thugs-taking-courses-5599589