Dangers of cannabis to teenagers

I Heart Internet

A new piece of research, published in The Lancet, points to the dangers of cannabis use by young people:

• Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60 per cent less likely to finish school or get a degree compared with those who have never used the drug

Daily users of cannabis in adolescence are:

• seven times more likely to attempt suicide
• 18 times more likely to become dependent on the drug
• eight times more likely to use other drugs in later life

The study is based on a review of 4,000 cannabis users and their peers.

These effects were found even after researchers controlled for factors such
as age, gender, ethnic background, socio-economic status, use of other drugs and
mental illness. The risks increased relative to dose, with daily cannabis users
showing the strongest effects.

More info in the Irish Times today: http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/teen-cannabis-users-less-likely-to-finish-school-get-a-degree-1.1923398

My opinion is that it is a harmful substance and it is right that it be controlled. Teenagers should be warned against using it - it's not a harmless alternative to "harder" drugs.

The Purveyor of Truth

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60

I stopped reading here because that is just patently untrue.

I Heart Internet

The Purveyor of Truth wrote: »

I stopped reading here because that is just patently untrue.

OK. It'd be great if you could explain why you're so certain of this? This peer reviewed journal article seems to suggest it is true.

cloud493

The Purveyor of Truth wrote: »

I stopped reading here because that is just patently untrue.

I see what you did there :pac:

biko

Legalise cannabis for people with a finished Masters degree only.

I Heart Internet

cloud493 wrote: »

I see what you did there :pac:

I didn't

Interceptor

I Heart Internet wrote: »

My opinion is that it is a harmful substance and it is right that it be controlled. Teenagers should be warned against using it - it's not a harmless alternative to "harder" drugs.

Yes, it should be controlled but it is less harmful than alcohol which is freely available and socially acceptable.

cloud493

I Heart Internet wrote: »

I didn't

He said 60, as in the age 60, not 60% of people.

preston johnny

#

DLMA23

Ladies & gentlemen of boards.ie, I present to you...I Heart Internet, boards.ie's very own anti-cannabis lobby crusader

A round of applause please...

bennyl10

lots of information that can be used against alcohol and cigarettes also, but we freely allow them

It's also a,'fact' that it's a less harmfully drug than both alcohol and nicotine, but sure the state and papers have no problems with them once there's a warning slapped on the box!!

The Netherlands has a lower drop out rates than us and the UK.. So to say that weed is a reason for this is just BS..

"Kids with blue eyes are 99.9% more likely to drop out than kids with grey" Look anything can create silly stats thst seem shocking..

Most teenagers experiment with weed..it doesn't lead to drop outs anymore than not liking the colour red!

renegademaster

in my mind the most dangerous thing concerning cannabis and teenagers is what will happen to them if they get caught using it by the ngardaí

nxbyveromdwjpg

As usual, even if taken at face value, the same can be for alcohol and more.

How many teenage daily drinkers finish school?

Prohibition doesn't work or make any difference at all.

Except for maybe adding to people lying about their use in these surveys skewering the results.

Shenshen

There is no such thing as a harmless drug, that much goes without saying.

The question always needs to be how much harm, and what kind of harm?

And while the study did deliver some good statistical figures, they're not exactly saying anything much new. Most of the effects they mentioned have been known for a good while.

What I'm finding amusing time and again is how cannabis gets the stick for demotivating people, being dangerous to mental health and hightening the risk of suicide - which, in fairness, is not too disimilar to the effects of overuse of alcohol.

renegademaster

I Heart Internet wrote: »

A new piece of research, published in The Lancet, points to the dangers of cannabis use by young people:

• Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60 per cent less likely to finish school or get a degree compared with those who have never used the drug

Daily users of cannabis in adolescence are:

• seven times more likely to attempt suicide
• 18 times more likely to become dependent on the drug
• eight times more likely to use other drugs in later life

The study is based on a review of 4,000 cannabis users and their peers.



More info in the Irish Times today: http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/teen-cannabis-users-less-likely-to-finish-school-get-a-degree-1.1923398

My opinion is that it is a harmful substance and it is right that it be controlled. Teenagers should be warned against using it - it's not a harmless alternative to "harder" drugs.

i bet 100% of the 4000 studied drank tea as children

Shenshen

I think it's only fair to point out that the phrase "using cannabis regularly" refers to daily use of the drug (they interviewed one of the researchers on Newstalk this morning), not someone who might partake twice a year at music festivals.

Tombo2001

Interceptor wrote: »

Yes, it should be controlled but it is less harmful than alcohol which is freely available and socially acceptable.

Two wrongs dont make a right....

I would debate whether its less harmful than Alcohol.

The two drugs damage the body in completely different ways.

Psychosis led suicide is a pretty alarming side effect, and to argue that its "less harmful than alcohol".......both can do huge amounts of damage, and both should be tackled for what they are.

o1s1n

I Heart Internet wrote: »

A new piece of research, published in The Lancet, points to the dangers of cannabis use by young people:

• Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60 per cent less likely to finish school or get a degree compared with those who have never used the drug

Daily users of cannabis in adolescence are:

• seven times more likely to attempt suicide
• 18 times more likely to become dependent on the drug
• eight times more likely to use other drugs in later life

The study is based on a review of 4,000 cannabis users and their peers.



More info in the Irish Times today: http://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/teen-cannabis-users-less-likely-to-finish-school-get-a-degree-1.1923398

My opinion is that it is a harmful substance and it is right that it be controlled. Teenagers should be warned against using it - it's not a harmless alternative to "harder" drugs.

Correlation does not imply causation etc.

A higher percentage of people who consume cannabis would be more likely to come from poorer socio/economic groups of society.

Everything you've listed there are symptoms of being among those worst off in society.

Folks from that group tend to rely on drugs more.

tigger123

If you're going to make an argument for using cannabis, stop comparing it to alcohol and nicotine. There's nothing in the OP about alcohol and nicotine.

Make an argument on what it is, not what it isn't.

Barely There

I Heart Internet wrote: »

Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60 per cent less likely to finish school or get a degree compared with those who have never used the drug
Daily users of cannabis in adolescence are:

• seven times more likely to attempt suicide
• 18 times more likely to become dependent on the drug
• eight times more likely to use other drugs in later life

Some people are very easily confused between correlation and causation.

There are probably a lot of factors which influence the behaviours of the group of people they surveyed - cannabis use being only one.

You might as easily say;
100% of the kids who didn't finish school were found to drink water - Correlation ,
So drinking water contributes to people not finishing school? - Bolloxy Causation which media reports on.

bennyl10

tigger123 wrote: »

If you're going to make an argument for using cannabis, stop comparing it to alcohol and nicotine. There's nothing in the OP about alcohol and nicotine.

Make an argument on what it is, not what it isn't.

But surely the fact that we legalise and fully accept two more harmful drugs, is completely relevant to the discussion?!

"oh no cannabis might not be all that bad, let's just stop taking about the only legally available comparable substances, even through they're more harmful, so I can go back to saying how evil it is"

Tombo2001

o1s1n wrote: »

Correlation does not imply causation etc.

A higher percentage of people who consume cannabis would be more likely to come from poorer socio/economic groups of society.

Everything you've listed there are symptoms of being among those worst off in society.

Folks from that group tend to rely on drugs more.

Come off it.....

There are hundreds of studies that show that cannabis use leads to psychosis ...... This has absolutely nothing to do with socio economic background and everything to do the effects of cannabis on the brain.

Stop making it up as you go along.......flat earth merchant.

Berserker

I Heart Internet wrote: »

My opinion is that it is a harmful substance and it is right that it be controlled. Teenagers should be warned against using it - it's not a harmless alternative to "harder" drugs.

It is gateway drug. I was watching a programme on the women's prison on the television the other night and cannabis was consistently listed as the starting drug for all the people who had hardcore drug problems. It was also pretty clear that drug abuse had resulted in those women ending up in prison.

I lived in Amsterdam and nobody in their right mind would want any part of the RoI to end up like the centre of Amsterdam after dark. A horribly, tacky and dangerous city centre. The locals avoid it like the plague, which says it all.

Tombo2001

bennyl10 wrote: »

But surely the fact that we legalise and fully accept two more harmful drugs, is completely relevant to the discussion?!

"oh no cannabis might not be all that bad, let's just stop taking about the only legally available comparable substances, even through they're more harmful, so I can go back to saying how evil it is"

Is it worth pointing out that it is illegal to sell alcohol and cigarettes to teenagers, under 18 anyway, and that teenagers are the vulnerable group that is the principal focus of this study.

Suryavarman

tigger123 wrote: »

If you're going to make an argument for using cannabis, stop comparing it to alcohol and nicotine. There's nothing in the OP about alcohol and nicotine.

Make an argument on what it is, not what it isn't.

Cannabis IS far safer than the most widely used drugs; alcohol and nicotine. So therefore it makes sense to compare cannabis to those two drugs.

Tombo2001

Berserker wrote: »

It is gateway drug. I was watching a programme on the women's prison on the television the other night and cannabis was consistently listed as the starting drug for all the people who had hardcore drug problems. It was also pretty clear that drug abuse had resulted in those women ending up in prison.

I lived in Amsterdam and nobody in their right mind would want any part of the RoI to end up like the centre of Amsterdam after dark. A horribly, tacky and dangerous city centre. The locals avoid it like the plague, which says it all.

It is a gateway drug, but some people use that as a kind of defence for Cannabis, that somehow if you just smoke weed and leave it at that, then thats ok.....

Its not ok, because cannabis is far more damaging that people realise. Some folks seem to think its not much different to smoking a cigarette.

srsly78

Lots of studies have shown drugs are harmful to kids, noone is advocating giving them drugs legally. However the same studies show there is no harm to adults, so the same restrictions should apply as with alcohol.

The gateway drug thing is bull****, and only comes about because of prohibition. If it was legal there would be no visiting dodgy drug dealers.

Tombo2001

Suryavarman wrote: »

Cannabis IS far safer than the most widely used drugs; alcohol and nicotine. So therefore it makes sense to compare cannabis to those two drugs.

It is not far safer. That is just nonsense.

The mental health side effects of cannabis are very extensive, in a way that you certainly dont get with tobacco; and that are far worse than those associated with alcohol.

Berserker

Tombo2001 wrote: »

It is a gateway drug, but some people use that as a kind of defence for Cannabis, that somehow if you just smoke weed and leave it at that, then thats ok.....

Its not ok, because cannabis is far more damaging that people realise. Some folks seem to think its not much different to smoking a cigarette.

Absolutely agree. Case in point is the post above by Suryavarman.

o1s1n

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Come off it.....

There are hundreds of studies that show that cannabis use leads to psychosis ...... This has absolutely nothing to do with socio economic background and everything to do the effects of cannabis on the brain.

Stop making it up as you go along.......flat earth merchant.

WTF are you on about. I'm not making anything up as I go along, I'm a data analyst as part of my profession.

There is a basic bad argument when analyzing data and that is assuming correlation implies causation.

It can be very effective when the two things 'appear' to be linked, but as Barely There pointed out, if you substitute it for sillier things you can clearly see how it's bad analysis.

Another famous one is shark attacks and ice cream. When ice cream sales go up, so do shark attacks. Therefore ice cream consumption results in shark attacks. Sounds stupid, doesn't it? That's because it is.

It has absolutely everything to do with socio economic background, but feel free to continue to bury your head in the sand.

By the way, I'm not a cannabis smoker, I was growing up. I attended and finished 3rd level education.

Why? Because my upbringing put emphasis on the importance of 3rd level education. If I was from a poorer/worse off family, then the chances of me not going to 3rd level education would have increased dramatically.

Neither have anything to do with cannabis consumption.

srsly78

Tombo2001 wrote: »

It is not far safer. That is just nonsense.

Cannabis is much safer, there are many studies out there showing this. Go do some research.

tigger123

bennyl10 wrote: »

But surely the fact that we legalise and fully accept two more harmful drugs, is completely relevant to the discussion?!

"oh no cannabis might not be all that bad, let's just stop taking about the only legally available comparable substances, even through they're more harmful, so I can go back to saying how evil it is"

Its not relevant at all. The article in the OP is about cannabis and its effects, which are pretty clear.

The abuse of alcohol by teenagers is also a serious issue, but it's not related in anyway.

It's a pretty thin argument tbh if it's based on "yeah, well, alcohol is legal, so shut up".

srsly78

The research also shows it's harmless to adults, but everyone ignores that part for some reason.

MadYaker

Did you really need to start a new thread could you not have just posted your OP in one of the many cannabis threads already in AH??

You've been here since 2011, do you not get sick of seeing the same threads over and over?

Tombo2001

srsly78 wrote: »

Cannabis is much safer, there are many studies out there showing this. Go do some research.

What you are referring to is physical health. And yes it is probably true, that over the long term, alcohol use is more damaging to the body.

However, as I mentioned earlier, the mental health side effects of consisten cannabis use are far more extensive than alcohol or tobacco.

This is well documented.

So how do you weigh up physical health risks versus mental health risks?

Maybe you think alcohol is more damaging, you might be right.

By would never for a minute underestimate the risks of cannabis, they can be extremely severe.

And for my mind....to be saying "well cannabis is less damaging than alcohol, and alcohol is legal and cannabis isnt........." So bloody what. Tell that to someone whose kid has comitted suicide after a cannabis led bout of depression, see what they think.

Davarus Walrus

srsly78 wrote: »

Cannabis is much safer, there are many studies out there showing this. Go do some research.

Yes. Research published in The Journal of Quackery by Dr. Cheech and Dr. Chong from the University of North-East Alaska shows it's harmless. These findings were carried out by conducting rigorous trials amongst a controlled group of their peers.

srsly78

Nope, the studies show that it can have bad effects on people with pre-existing mental health conditions - just as with most other psychoactive substances. The whole "it causes schizophrenia" thing turned out to be alarmist bull****.

Cuddlesworth

The focus here should be on the "daily" part. If you're using cannabis daily, you're addicted to it and it will have negative effects on your life.

If you drink booze daily, you're addicted to it and it will have negative effects on your life.

This whole study is a exercise in pointing out the obvious. I don't see how people can justify keeping it illegal. I graduated secondary school 12 years ago and at least 90% of my year had smoked weed at some point. Prohibition doesn't work. Why not tax cannabis usage and use the money to treat those who develop addictive behaviours.

Amirani

Berserker wrote: »

It is gateway drug. I was watching a programme on the women's prison on the television the other night and cannabis was consistently listed as the starting drug for all the people who had hardcore drug problems. It was also pretty clear that drug abuse had resulted in those women ending up in prison.

That's the base rate fallacy.

The majority of cannabis users don't go on to develop addictions to harder drugs. Regarding it being a "gateway drug", the same could be said of alcohol or tobacco or caffeine. I'm pretty sure a higher percentage of those in the women's prison you saw consumed those drugs prior to moving onto heavier drugs. The likelihood is, if cannabis wasn't available they'd just use something else in the early days of their drug taking.

Shenshen

Tombo2001 wrote: »

It is a gateway drug, but some people use that as a kind of defence for Cannabis, that somehow if you just smoke weed and leave it at that, then thats ok.....

Its not ok, because cannabis is far more damaging that people realise. Some folks seem to think its not much different to smoking a cigarette.

I think to compare one joint to one cigarette is certainly not a good comparison.
Compare it to 20 fags a day, though....

And yes, cannabis will affect your mental health rather than you physical health the way tobacco does.
Alcohol, on the other hand, affects you both mentally and physically.

All drugs are dangerous, and ALL drugs are gateway drugs. You can't tell me that the people in the documentary you mentioned weren't smoking cigaretted and drinking alcohol before they started with cannabis.

endacl

Interceptor wrote: »

Yes, it should be controlled but it is less harmful than alcohol which is freely available and socially acceptable.

That's a false equivalency that's trotted out every time this topic comes up. Each is harmful to different people in different ways.

Apples and oranges, and all that?

Tombo2001

srsly78 wrote: »

Nope, the studies show that it can have bad effects on people with pre-existing mental health conditions - just as with most other psychoactive substances. The whole "it causes schizophrenia" thing turned out to be alarmist bull****.

You are seeing what you want to see, and you are wrong.

Amirani

endacl wrote: »

That's a false equivalency that's trotted out every time this topic comes up. Each is harmful to different people in different ways.

Apples and oranges, and all that?

In terms of effects on users, perhaps. When looking at the negative externalities associated with each, alcohol is clearly more harmful.

I think the primary focus of drug control should be to protect non-users from the negative effects of drugs. After that you should focus on doing something to help the users, if necessary. Take tobacco regulation as a comparison - the smoking ban is far more important to society than plain packaging.

srsly78

Tombo2001 wrote: »

You are seeing what you want to see, and you are wrong.

No, you just haven't kept up with the research. Please stop spouting nonsense from years ago.

Jimoslimos

Suryavarman wrote: »

Cannabis IS far safer than the most widely used drugs; alcohol and nicotine. So therefore it makes sense to compare cannabis to those two drugs.

Define "safer". Sure it's less likely to result in lung cancer or cirrhosis of the liver but risks to mental health can be ignored (not like it's a proper illness anyway).:rolleyes:

Anyway if we're going on your "safer" angle can we bring heroin into the discussion?

Ken Shamrock

I Heart Internet wrote: »

A new piece of research, published in The Lancet, points to the dangers of cannabis use by young people:

• Young people who take cannabis regularly are over 60 per cent less likely to finish school or get a degree compared with those who have never used the drug

Daily users of cannabis in adolescence are:

• seven times more likely to attempt suicide
• 18 times more likely to become dependent on the drug
• eight times more likely to use other drugs in later life

The study is based on a review of 4,000 cannabis users and their peers..

I started smoking it when i was 14, i smoked a lot back then, i finished school and college and now i'm an Account Manager for an aviation recruitment company, i still smoke it to this day albeit every few weeks or so, but from 14-19 i was smoking every week, i've never contemplated suicide i'm not dependent on the drug and i've never touched any other drug nor would i ever want to.

It's funny how all these stats and figures and sh1t never seem to include me or anyone i know? "55% of people named Bob in Ireland like coffee" Well how do they know that because they never fcuking asked me!?

Tombo2001

Bob.Carcass wrote: »

I started smoking it when i was 14, i smoked a lot back then, i finished school and college and now i'm an Account Manager for an aviation recruitment company, i still smoke it to this day albeit every few weeks or so, but from 14-19 i was smoking every week, i've never contemplated suicide i'm not dependent on the drug and i've never touched any other drug nor would i ever want to.

It's funny how all these stats and figures and sh1t never seem to include me or anyone i know? "55% of people named Bob in Ireland like coffee" Well how do they know that because they never fcuking asked me!?

Yes, and guess what, so-and-so's Grandad smoked 50 a day until he was 96 years old and he died of a fall down the stairs, so really cigarettes arent bad for you either.

Tombo2001

srsly78 wrote: »

No, you just haven't kept up with the research. Please stop spouting nonsense from years ago.

This is the current information on the subject from the Royal College of Psychiatrists website in the UK .


<li class="MsoNormal">Psychoses - schizophrenia and bipolar disorderThere is now sufficient evidence to show that those who use cannabis particularly at a younger age, such as around the age of 15, have a higher than average risk of developing a psychotic illness, such as schizophrenia or bipolar disorder.


http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mentalhealthinformation/mentalhealthproblems/alcoholanddrugs/cannabisandmentalhealth.aspx

Ken Shamrock

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Yes, and guess what, so-and-so's Grandad smoked 50 a day until he was 96 years old and he died of a fall down the stairs, so really cigarettes arent bad for you either.

You seem to have missed my point, i'm arguing the accuracy of the figures, they "ask" who they want to ask and they use the "results" they want to use, Cigarettes,Alcohol,Weed,Caffeine,Sugar etc it's all bad for you it all kills you etc so what was your point apart from trying to be a smart ass?

srsly78

Tombo2001 wrote: »

This is the current information on the subject from the Royal College of Psychiatrists website in the UK .


<li class="MsoNormal">Psychoses - schizophrenia and bipolar disorderThere is now sufficient evidence to show that those who use cannabis particularly at a younger age, such as around the age of 15, have a higher than average risk of developing a psychotic illness, such as schizophrenia or bipolar disorder.


http://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/mentalhealthinformation/mentalhealthproblems/alcoholanddrugs/cannabisandmentalhealth.aspx

This does not say that cannabis causes schizophrenia. It is known to aggravate pre-existing conditions. Mentally ill people should not use drugs!

There is no causal relationship. Consider that despite skyrocketing rates of cannabis use, there has been no increase in rates of schizophrena.

Go read this: http://psychcentral.com/news/2013/12/10/harvard-marijuana-doesnt-cause-schizophrenia/63148.html

Berserker

Diego Simeone wrote: »

That's the base rate fallacy.

The majority of cannabis users don't go on to develop addictions to harder drugs. Regarding it being a "gateway drug", the same could be said of alcohol or tobacco or caffeine. I'm pretty sure a higher percentage of those in the women's prison you saw consumed those drugs prior to moving onto heavier drugs. The likelihood is, if cannabis wasn't available they'd just use something else in the early days of their drug taking.

Right, can you show me the statistical proof or any example of a person who started off by consuming caffeine, smoking cigarettes or drinking alcohol and they progressed onto heroin from that? I can give you a plethora of examples to show that cannabis use leads to heroin. Also, cannabis is far more widely available than any other drug. The simple fact is that you progress from cannabis to harder drugs.