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Some help with my 5x5 revamp

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,161 ✭✭✭tok9


    Definitely a good idea and something I was thinking of using.

    The only reason I haven't used it is because I thought it might give me some extra momentum when pushing back up but definitely something I'll consider.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,802 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    tok9 wrote: »
    Definitely a good idea and something I was thinking of using.

    The only reason I haven't used it is because I thought it might give me some extra momentum when pushing back up but definitely something I'll consider.

    It sounds like a box squat.

    You don't bounce off it so there's no momentum gain.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,308 ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Ok so went to the gym this afternoon and tried to work out my starting weights and got the following results today:

    Barbell Shrugs: 8 rep max = 50kg (Could probably have gotten slightly higher but took the advice from here that it's better to start at lower weights)
    Straight Bar Curls: 8 rep max = 25kg (Really struggled with these)
    Tricep Extension: 8 rep max = 40kg (Barely got the 40, need to focus on my form here and ensure I am using the tricep)
    Cable Pull Through: 8 rep max = 25kg (Again struggled here and think my form may have been bad, these are awkward to do!)
    Cable Crunches: 10 rep max = 65kg (Not sure about these, I followed the video for form but didn't feel it "hitting" my abs if that makes sense? Also the max weight on the cable is 70kg so assuming I need to up the reps when I get here?)

    Inputting the above to a 1rm calculator I came out with the following starting weights:

    Barbell Shrugs: 40kg
    Straight Bar Curls: 20kg
    Tricep Extension: 32.5kg
    Cable Pull Through: 20kg
    Cable Crunches: 55kg

    So does anyone have any comments/advice/criticisms of the above? Especially around the cable crunches?

    With cable crunches I find less is more. I got up to 40kg and found I wasn't feeling it, went back to around 35kg the next session and felt it much more. I think if it's too heavy you end up pulling and moving too much, and it easily turns into a back excersize.

    Try lowering the weight, lock your hips and concentrate on contracting your abs as if you were a prawn cooking on the bbq! Don't pull on the weight with your back or arms. You should be able to move the weight by contracting your core alone.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,308 ✭✭✭✭.ak


    tok9 wrote: »
    Meant to post after my workout yesterday but just left it.

    Anyway, as I said I really went to work on my squat depth yesterday. Got as low as I could and picked a spot in front of me so I'd know I was still getting that low for the squats themselves.

    So I'm down to 80KG on the squats and I have to say I really felt them (although that could also be due to the jog/run I did the day before which really took it out of me)

    So right now for me:

    Squat - 80kg
    Bench - 60kg
    Barbell Row - 52.5kg
    Overhead Press - 40kg (Seriously struggle with this one)
    Deadlift - 80kg

    I think everyone struggles at overheads. I'm on 37.5 and I find it hard, although I'm doing a clean and press in my current routine. I hate it, it's the worst thing ever, it absolutely kills me, especially as it's part of a tri-set... Although on the upside I'm looking forward to going back to my 5x5 alt routine with just the overhead and no clean. Think I'll be able to get over 40kg with that finally.


  • Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    .ak wrote: »
    With cable crunches I find less is more. I got up to 40kg and found I wasn't feeling it, went back to around 35kg the next session and felt it much more. I think if it's too heavy you end up pulling and moving too much, and it easily turns into a back excersize.

    Try lowering the weight, lock your hips and concentrate on contracting your abs as if you were a prawn cooking on the bbq! Don't pull on the weight with your back or arms. You should be able to move the weight by contracting your core alone.

    I really don't like cable crunches, and I agree with some coaches and lifters who say they're not beneficial to strength.

    All of the main lifts require a statically held core to support a neutral lumbar spine; cable crunches promote lumbar flexion, which is exactly the opposite of what's wanted. Weighted planks and roll-outs (with a properly braced core) > crunches.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,802 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    gvn wrote: »
    I really don't like cable crunches, and I agree with some coaches and lifters who say they're not beneficial to strength.

    All of the main lifts require a statically held core to support a neutral lumbar spine; cable crunches promote lumbar flexion, which is exactly the opposite of what's wanted. Weighted planks and roll-outs (with a properly braced core) > crunches.

    IIRC, some people (Hanley) would switch weighted planks and cable crunches in that.

    You'll see people do cable crunches and yes there's a lot of lumbar flexion going on but you'll also see it done properly.

    But then you'll see a lot of good exercises done badly which is no reflection on the exercise itself.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,308 ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Yeah tbh when I first started cable crunches I thought they were useless. But once I found how isolate your core with them the next day I really felt it. I've never had prenounced ab muscles (still don't but they're way better than before!) but I found they've definitely helped to increase my core stability for rugby and other work outs, and after a few weeks I'm starting to see a bit of definition.

    Them, weighted planks, incline leg raises and mountain climbers I find give me the best progression in my core. I will defo by working them and a few other core accessory moves into my 5x5 routine when I restart it again.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭Feenix


    tok9 wrote: »
    Meant to post after my workout yesterday but just left it.

    Anyway, as I said I really went to work on my squat depth yesterday. Got as low as I could and picked a spot in front of me so I'd know I was still getting that low for the squats themselves.

    So I'm down to 80KG on the squats and I have to say I really felt them (although that could also be due to the jog/run I did the day before which really took it out of me)

    So right now for me:

    Squat - 80kg
    Bench - 60kg
    Barbell Row - 52.5kg
    Overhead Press - 40kg (Seriously struggle with this one)
    Deadlift - 80kg

    Been doing 5x5 for months and also cant get anywhere close to completing 40k for overhead press. Perhaps its more normal than I thought.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 347 ✭✭IR1SH RANG3R


    Feenix wrote: »
    Been doing 5x5 for months and also cant get anywhere close to completing 40k. Perhaps its more normal than I thought.

    I had the same problem, the press is HARD!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,588 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    Get a stronger bench.
    Get a stronger back.
    Micro load the press.
    Press more.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,308 ✭✭✭✭.ak


    Mellor wrote: »
    Get a stronger bench.
    Get a stronger back.
    Micro load the press.
    Press more.

    This went over my head. What does a bench have to do with overheads? And what does micro the load mean?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,802 ✭✭✭✭Alf Veedersane


    .ak wrote: »
    This went over my head. What does a bench have to do with overheads? And what does micro the load mean?

    There is a lot of overlap in the muscles used. Assuming form etc is good, then a stronger bench should make for a stronger OH press.

    Micro-loading is just increasing the weight by as small increments as possible. Investing in fractional plates (0.5 kgs) would help with that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,588 ✭✭✭✭Mellor


    .ak wrote: »
    This went over my head. What does a bench have to do with overheads? And what does micro the load mean?
    What Alf said. Increasing one, will increase the other. The two are pretty closely related. Typically a strict OHP will be about 2/3 of your bench.

    As for microloading. It's about relative increases. Take Tok's numbers above.
    Adding 2kg to each of his lifts above equals a 2.5% increase for squat, but a 5% increase for OHP. For the same relative increase you need to add less to OHPs.
    You can do this with either microloading or finding another way to reduce increases.


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