Managing Fatigue

Felexicon

What do you do to stop the onset of fatigue during a round?

I always seem to start feeling it around the 15th or 16th hole and my shots start going way left.

What food/drinks to you consume before/during your rounds to keep the energy up?

John Divney

Yeah, I carry and this weather has seen me score massive on the front 9 and then fatigue mentally blow scores late on.

Drink more water before you leave the house helps big time, for me anyway.

BraveDonut

Continually hydrate during your round.
Make sure you eat too.
Fruit and chocolate for me.

Helps keep up concentration levels

First Up

Felexicon wrote: »

What do you do to stop the onset of fatigue during a round?

I always seem to start feeling it around the 15th or 16th hole and my shots start going way left.

What food/drinks to you consume before/during your rounds to keep the energy up?

The question must also be asked - how fit are you? The average golf round involves walking about four miles and involves spending about four hours on your feet - most of it just standing. Of course a hilly course is more demanding and its harder to carry your clubs than to use a battery powered trolly, but it still is not exactly like doing a marathon.

Nuts, fruit, chocolate, hydration etc all help but if someone is unfit or overweight, nutrition alone is not going to stop you getting tired.

Halfprice

when you start to feel hungry its to late, probably need to snack every few holes to keep the hunger away and plenty of water also to keep hydrated.

ShivasIrons

BraveDonut wrote: »

Continually hydrate during your round.
Make sure you eat too.
Fruit and chocolate for me.

Helps keep up concentration levels

Fruit and chocolate have high sugar levels, blood sugar will spike and crash leading to more concentration problems. Something with protein would help maintain a constant blood sugar level, nuts with raisins or beef jerky are good options or even a chicken sandwich.

Be careful with drinking too much water as it washes electrolytes out of the system causing the body to dehydrate more. Avoid sports drinks, i.e. Lucosade sport etc which claim to have electrolytes, they don't have that many and are laced with sugar.

Best thing is to add a little pinch of unrefined sea salt to your water to replenish the electrolytes.

Increased cardio vascular capacity also helps. Sprinting is the best for golf.

GreeBo

Bananas!


Ok, and granola bars.

But don't try to stuff the last bit of one into your mouth before you hit...recipe for an woeful shot.

cairny

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Increased cardio vascular capacity also helps. Sprinting is the best for golf.

Sprinting better than distance? That's interesting, what's the thinking behind that?

digginz

If you are carrying your bag. Try a round with a trolley.

I used to get tired and sore back after 12-14holes, now I can play a full 18 no problem

FixdePitchmark

GreeBo wrote: »

Bananas!


Ok, and granola bars.

But don't try to stuff the last bit of one into your mouth before you hit...recipe for an woeful shot.

Lol,

happened to me at weekend - had a beef sandwich handed to me (not a real golf lad, but nice sambo made by his lovely wife) on a par 3 - had a quarter to go, the sambo that is - didn't know what to do with it, everything I looked at to put it down, looked fairly mank - so just put the quarter of it in my mouth - can eat quick , was from a big family - if you didn't eat quick , some other ****er would eat your dinner.

So standing over this par 3 (5th cahir park) - chewing the sambo - had to stop chewing to swing (lol) - was thinking how do I breath when I swing , do I need a mouth in my shot .

Bang - PW - 9 feet.

I think the sambo did it - but a bit of an awkward pre shot routine to bring into my game - not to mention , your man's wife would be a bit pissed off , If I asked for 10 sambos a round.

Dealerz

Don't have children or if you messed that one up, apparently ( I have no science to back this up) bananas take an hour to release the good stuff, and plenty of water.

Dealerz

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Lol,

happened to me at weekend - had a beef sandwich handed to me (not a real golf lad, but nice sambo made by his lovely wife) on a par 3 - had a quarter to go, that sambo that is - didn't know what to do with it, everything I looked at to put it down, looked fairly mank - so just put the quarter of it in my mouth - can eat quick , was from a big family - if you didn't eat quick , some other ****er would eat your dinner.

So standing over this par 3 (5th cahir park) - chewing the sambo - had to stop chewing to swing (lol) - was thinking how do I breath when I swing , do I need a mouth in my shot .

Bang - PW - 9 feet.

I think the sambo did it - but a bit of an awkward pre shot routine to bring into my game - not to mention , your man's wife would be a bit pissed off , If I asked for 10 sambos a round.

I know it's early but that's post of the day for me! Well done fix.

FixdePitchmark

"Give us a sandwich" -
"A Sandwedge ?"
"No a bleeding Sambo." "This is a serious shot"

Ciaranra

Nuts fruit and water

mike12

Eat on the 9th it's too late by the time you feel hungry on the 16th. Drink plenty. Chicked sambo is perfect.

FixdePitchmark

Felexicon wrote: »

What do you do to stop the onset of fatigue during a round?

I always seem to start feeling it around the 15th or 16th hole and my shots start going way left.

What food/drinks to you consume before/during your rounds to keep the energy up?

I drink plenty plenty of fluids - as in every 3 or 4 holes.

I don't eat anything - but always have had something before I start. But always have a bit of chocolate if feel low.

A push trolley - without falling into the trap of too much in it - as I do.
I guess the amount you play makes you golf fit too.

And - back to basics, if you are unfit - that is the first point to look at.

The amount of golf I play - can't see myself carrying a bag - not to mention - I watch my back a bit. I honestly think carrying a bag is for young men.

Have an event coming up in September 36 holes over 24 hours , but we are drinking about 40 pints as well - now that is fatigue - I've won 2 years in a row

Another extreme sport is the Atlantic Coast Challenge.

ShivasIrons

cairny wrote: »

Sprinting better than distance? That's interesting, what's the thinking behind that?

The golf swing is closer to a sprint then a marathon. Also sprinting is more efficient at improving cardio vascular fitness, try 20 seconds on and off sprinting for 4 minutes over jogging for 30 minutes.

First Up

ShivasIrons wrote: »

The golf swing is closer to a sprint then a marathon. Also sprinting is more efficient at improving cardio vascular fitness, try 20 seconds on and off sprinting for 4 minutes over jogging for 30 minutes.

I think you are confusing two things here:

Cardio-vascular endurance is about maintaining an elevated heart rate for a sustained period. That is not a requirement for golf, nor is it achieved through sprinting. If you want to improve c-v endurance, you work on aerobic capacity by training in bursts at 80-85% of max. This is best achieved through interval training - say 400 meter repeats or fartlek runs of 30+ minutes.

There is a case for sprinting to build speed and explosive strength and that can help the golf swing but it isn't the solution for someone getting tired 3/4 through a round.

ForeRight

Played recently with a man who was very friendly and offered me a home made chicken sandwich. Delicious I thought thank you very much.

Took one bite and nearly puked. I looked inside the sandwich and there was indeed chicken in there although there was also lumps of skin, grizzle, black bits of meat to name just a few. What sort of animal just breaks up a cooked chicken and throws the lot into a sambo?

The thoughts of it now is making me gag....

Anyway moral of the story is don't take sweets off old men I suppose.



Now I just have a litre of water with small sips regular and those nature valley bars. They are in dunnes for €2 and I think you get 8 in that. A pro shop charges €1 for one.

Dealerz

What's the nut thing about? Don't get it- don't nuts just make you poo, which is a seriously low priority for me on a golf course.

ShivasIrons

First Up wrote: »

I think you are confusing two things here:

Cardio-vascular endurance is about maintaining an elevated heart rate for a sustained period. That is not a requirement for golf, nor is it achieved through sprinting. If you want to improve c-v endurance, you work on aerobic capacity by training in bursts at 80-85% of max. This is best achieved through interval training - say 400 meter repeats or fartlek runs of 30+ minutes.

There is a case for sprinting to build speed and explosive strength and that can help the golf swing but it isn't the solution for someone getting tired 3/4 through a round.

http://youtu.be/n086-FkuF1E

Dealerz

Dealerz wrote: »

What's the nut thing about? Don't get it- don't nuts just make you poo, which is a seriously low priority for me on a golf course.

There's a lot of calories in them, good for keeping you going.

Dealerz

Dakota Unsightly Martian wrote: »

There's a lot of calories in them, good for keeping you going.

Boom boom!

First Up

ShivasIrons wrote: »

http://youtu.be/n086-FkuF1E

There are better sources of information than a guy flogging a stepping gadget on an Infomercial.

I'm not decrying sprinting - it has its place and I've done plenty of it as part of training for racing distances between 200m and 1500m. However it does not contribute much in a thread about managing fatigue in golf.

snaphook

I've ordered this book from Phil Maffetone, one of the pioneers for HR cardio training.
http://www.philmaffetone.com/healthy-golfer

Will be interesting to read it.

Dr_Colossus

ForeRight wrote: »

Played recently with a man who was very friendly and offered me a home made chicken sandwich. Delicious I thought thank you very much.

Took one bite and nearly puked. I looked inside the sandwich and there was indeed chicken in there although there was also lumps of skin, grizzle, black bits of meat to name just a few. What sort of animal just breaks up a cooked chicken and throws the lot into a sambo?

The thoughts of it now is making me gag....


Now I just have a litre of water with small sips regular and those nature valley bars. They are in dunnes for €2 and I think you get 8 in that. A pro shop charges €1 for one.

LoL, that sounds seriously disgusting, I thought you were going to say you nearly gagged due to the amount of salt he had in his "chicken" sambo. It reminds me of another story where I was playing with an occasional golfer a couple of years ago who told me he lent his golf clubs to a "then" friend of his. A few months later he got the clubs back and decided to go play a round during which he lost a ball and reached into the pocket of his golf bag for another. While rooting in the pocket he felt some sort of sluggish goo and upon revoltingly retracting his hand discovered it covered in a kind of florescent green mould. Closer inspection found the remains of a bag of chicken wings in the pocket of his golf bag that had been festering for a couple of months in the heat. Seriously who eats chicken wings on a golf course?

This time of year I'd generally consume 2 litres of water and a banana over 18 holes. Occasionally I'd also have one of those nature valley bars on the back nine if feeling peckish which as you said can be bought in various stores when on offer for €2 per box of 6.
The odd time I play a 36 hole comp I'd prepare a few sandwiches or roll the night before with my filling of choice usually being egg with a sprinkling of salt to help replenish electrolytes. This would be in addition to breakfast before the round and a lunch between the two 18 holes. I'd also ensure to have plenty of water at hand to restock at half time along with a liter of cordial which I find gives a little extra kick.

Dealerz

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

LoL, that sounds seriously disgusting, I thought you were going to say you nearly gagged due to the amount of salt he had in his "chicken" sambo. It reminds me of another story where I was playing with an occasional golfer a couple of years ago who told me he lent his golf clubs to a "then" friend of his. A few months later he got the clubs back and decided to go play a round during which he lost a ball and reached into the pocket of his golf bag for another. While rooting in the pocket he felt some sort of sluggish goo and upon revoltingly retracting his hand discovered it covered in a kind of florescent green mould. Closer inspection found the remains of a bag of chicken wings in the pocket of his golf bag that had been festering for a couple of months in the heat. Seriously who eats chicken wings on a golf course?

This time of year I'd generally consume 2 litres of water and a banana over 18 holes. Occasionally I'd also have one of those nature valley bars on the back nine if feeling peckish which as you said can be bought in various stores when on offer for €2 per box of 6.
The odd time I play a 36 hole comp I'd prepare a few sandwiches or roll the night before with my filling of choice usually being egg with a sprinkling of salt to help replenish electrolytes. This would be in addition to breakfast before the round and a lunch between the two 18 holes. I'd also ensure to have plenty of water at hand to restock at half time along with a liter of cordial which I find gives a little extra kick.

Where the wings spicy or plain?

Senna

I got an electric trolley a couple of months ago and I can feel the difference by the end of the round. I played 18 holes last week then worked a 10 hour shift on my feet all day, before I would have been wrecked half way through the shift, now with the electric trolley nowhere near as bad.

I would usually have a litre of water and either bananas or "breakfast bake" bars, find those bars are perfect for golf. Always eat after the 8th hole as there is a bit of a walk to the 9th tee.

PARlance

I try to ensure that my levels of pig don't get too low.

Stock up on it in advance, then maybe a black pudding / hash brown sambo along the way.
Salty rashers are a curse though. Beware of them if you're taking this diet stuff seriously, they can cause you to take on way too much tea.

TheDoc

I am milling water into me and having a banana and some nature valley bars through the round.

Fatigue was a big part of my last 4 nightmare I had for a while, as well as mental stuff.

I had tried this energy paste stuff, you get in a little pack. You'll see a lot of footballers use them nowadays. They are really good, but a bit pricey tbh and I wasn't overly fond of the expense, although there was a noticeable difference.

Then again, I normally have a big dirty coffee before I play golf at the weekend mornings, so no doubt I have a serious comedown during the round

GreeBo

TheDoc wrote: »

I have a serious comedown during the round

I have the duck-hooks for that.

I try not to eat anything too sugary until late in the round to avoid the slump when it wears off.
Those energy pastes can be great for a quick rush but Iwouldnt be taking them early on

ShivasIrons

First Up wrote: »

There are better sources of information than a guy flogging a stepping gadget on an Infomercial.

I'm not decrying sprinting - it has its place and I've done plenty of it as part of training for racing distances between 200m and 1500m. However it does not contribute much in a thread about managing fatigue in golf.

Actually there's not many better sources of information on training for golf then Dr. Mark Smith the guy in the infomercial. I put up the link as not having much time to answer the thread earlier.

As for sprinting not belonging in a thread about managing fatigue, increasing cardio vascular capacity will help manage fatigue. The most efficient way to do this is with sprint interval training, whether it's on a bike, threadmill, sprinting or on a stepper for an infomercial. There's plenty of research to show 5 minutes of this has the same or more benefits of jogging for 30 minutes or more.

Here's a link to the start of a paper by Mark Smith.

http://thejagr.com/issue/issue-1-spring-2011/article/sprint-interval-training-it-s-a-hiit

First Up

ShivasIrons wrote: »

Actually there's not many better sources of information on training for golf then Dr. Mark Smith the guy in the infomercial. I put up the link as not having much time to answer the thread earlier.

As for sprinting not belonging in a thread about managing fatigue, increasing cardio vascular capacity will help manage fatigue. The most efficient way to do this is with sprint interval training, whether it's on a bike, threadmill, sprinting or on a stepper for an infomercial. There's plenty of research to show 5 minutes of this has the same or more benefits of jogging for 30 minutes or more.

Here's a link to the start of a paper by Mark Smith.

http://thejagr.com/issue/issue-1-spring-2011/article/sprint-interval-training-it-s-a-hiit

I have no objection to sprinting as part of a fitness regime but presenting it as the basis for managing fatigue in golf is simplistic and downright dangerous.

"Fit" derives from "fit for purpose". The fundamental principle behind all training programmes is to prepare the body for the specific sport of the trainee. If we are just advocating "fitness" for otherwise sedentary people, then a brisk walk or a slow jog will contribute an improvement. If we are talking about "fitness" as it applies to athletic performance (including golf), then the programme has to be tailored to the demands of the event. The science behind that is well established - as seen is the drastically different training regimes for 100 meter sprinters and 10,000 meter runners as an illustration.

The best training for spending four to five hours on your feet, is to spend long periods of time on your feet. That is true for golf and for running marathons. Are you suggesting short sprints as the basis for marathon training too?

The other big problem I have with this advice is that sprinting is a demanding activity and cannot and should not be seen in isolation. I would only advise sprinting to someone who is already fairly fit and whose muscles and ligaments are able for the stress. Many golfers (I suspect including most of those who get tired after 15 holes) are in the 30's,40's, 50's and beyond. Advising them to go out and start sprinting is a recipe for injury and maybe worse and in my view constitutes highly irresponsible advice.

shaneon77

A flask of strong coffee for each and every round.

Felexicon

Cheers for the replies lads.

So all I need to do is drink 2 liters of water and eat a chicken sambo, a half dozen nature valley bars, a couple of bananas and a bar or two of chocolate.

All this as well as making sure I keep the round under 3 hours so I don't get named and shamed in the slow play thread.

Should be grand.





*seriously though, cheers for the pointers

ShivasIrons

First Up wrote: »

I have no objection to sprinting as part of a fitness regime but presenting it as the basis for managing fatigue in golf is simplistic and downright dangerous.

"Fit" derives from "fit for purpose". The fundamental principle behind all training programmes is to prepare the body for the specific sport of the trainee. If we are just advocating "fitness" for otherwise sedentary people, then a brisk walk or a slow jog will contribute an improvement. If we are talking about "fitness" as it applies to athletic performance (including golf), then the programme has to be tailored to the demands of the event. The science behind that is well established - as seen is the drastically different training regimes for 100 meter sprinters and 10,000 meter runners as an illustration.

The best training for spending four to five hours on your feet, is to spend long periods of time on your feet. That is true for golf and for running marathons. Are you suggesting short sprints as the basis for marathon training too?

The other big problem I have with this advice is that sprinting is a demanding activity and cannot and should not be seen in isolation. I would only advise sprinting to someone who is already fairly fit and whose muscles and ligaments are able for the stress. Many golfers (I suspect including most of those who get tired after 15 holes) are in the 30's,40's, 50's and beyond. Advising them to go out and start sprinting is a recipe for injury and maybe worse and in my view constitutes highly irresponsible advice.

I didn't present sprinting as the basis for managing fatigue in the golf swing. I said it was the best cardio vascular exercise for golf. This would also include sprint intervals on a bike or other equipment. I didn't say that everyone should start sprinting immediately for their golf fitness program, naturally every program should be tailored for the individual.

The golf swing is a dynamic, complex, fast, ballistic movement. It takes less then 2 seconds, it's nothing like running a marathon. In fact it's much closer to olympic lifting, which is also a dynamic, fast, ballistic, complex movement. It's a great exercise for golfers, but there's no way a golfer should olympic lift without going through extensive training.

There's is no elite golfer training like a marathon runner. Who would you prefer to hit a golf ball? Usain Bolt or Rob Heffernan? Elite golfers are training much closer to sprinters then marathon runners. Most golfers have no problem spending 4 hours on their feet, the golf swing can take a quite a bit out of a person. Which is harder walking for 30 minutes or hitting balls for 30 minutes? You train for the golf swing, not the walking.

the greatest game

Monster Engery drink for me..

I started using a fancy push trolly for a couple of months, I ditched it about 2 months ago, an awful energy drainer..back to electric..

FixdePitchmark

the greatest game wrote: »

Monster Engery drink for me..

I started using a fancy push trolly for a couple of months, I ditched it about 2 months ago, an awful energy drainer..back to electric..

I've a push trolley.

Feel it keeps me fit . So is that not an ironic fatigue avoider ?

First Up

ShivasIrons wrote: »

I didn't present sprinting as the basis for managing fatigue in the golf swing. I said it was the best cardio vascular exercise for golf. This would also include sprint intervals on a bike or other equipment. I didn't say that everyone should start sprinting immediately for their golf fitness program, naturally every program should be tailored for the individual.

The golf swing is a dynamic, complex, fast, ballistic movement. It takes less then 2 seconds, it's nothing like running a marathon. In fact it's much closer to olympic lifting, which is also a dynamic, fast, ballistic, complex movement. It's a great exercise for golfers, but there's no way a golfer should olympic lift without going through extensive training.

There's is no elite golfer training like a marathon runner. Who would you prefer to hit a golf ball? Usain Bolt or Rob Heffernan? Elite golfers are training much closer to sprinters then marathon runners. Most golfers have no problem spending 4 hours on their feet, the golf swing can take a quite a bit out of a person. Which is harder walking for 30 minutes or hitting balls for 30 minutes? You train for the golf swing, not the walking.

You train for both but I would be prepared to bet that the OP's question/problem related to the walking more than the swing.

I had an interesting conversation with Padraig Harrington a few years ago when we were both using the UCD gym. He was doing small weights for wrist/arm strength. I asked him about it and he said he had a very specific programme designed for strength hitting from thick rough.

But he spent most of the gym session doing steady pace running - not sprinting. But then, he probably hadn't seen the infomercial.

PARlance

I get tired of playing bad golf...

I would say the average club golf gets "fatigued" due to bad golf moreso than their diet or (lack of) training regime.

80% mental, 20% physical in my eyes.
I've never seen a guy being dragged off the 18th with 44 points

ForeRight

PARlance wrote: »

I get tired of playing bad golf...

I would say the average club golf gets "fatigued" due to bad golf moreso than their diet or (lack of) training regime.

80% mental, 20% physical in my eyes.
I've never seen a guy being dragged off the 18th with 44 points

Couldn't agree more.

When I'm playing well I'm buzzing, feel great leaving the 18th and want to play another 18.

When playing bad I feel lethargic and want to just finish up

Dr_Colossus

PARlance wrote: »

I get tired of playing bad golf...

I would say the average club golf gets "fatigued" due to bad golf moreso than their diet or (lack of) training regime.

80% mental, 20% physical in my eyes.
I've never seen a guy being dragged off the 18th with 44 points

True but in the case above he should be dragged off by the bandit police for questioning after scoring such a disproportionate round. 40 points would be an exceedingly good round but all too frequently it no longer features due to the generosity of some handicaps.

FixdePitchmark

There is no way you should be "fatigued" . During a round of golf.

If you are get fitter. Or play more.

GreeBo

PARlance wrote: »

I get tired of playing bad golf...

I would say the average club golf gets "fatigued" due to bad golf moreso than their diet or (lack of) training regime.

80% mental, 20% physical in my eyes.
I've never seen a guy being dragged off the 18th with 44 points

Thats because tired golfers never shoot 44 points!

PARlance

GreeBo wrote: »

Thats because tired golfers never shoot 44 points!

Nah, I'd certainly look at it the other way around.
Fitness helps, getting fitter is only a good thing obv but in general a lot of fatigue is caused by bad golf. Not the other way around imo.

On a similar note, I've never met someone that has hit a great shot and proclaim their luck because their concentration levels weren't what they should have been Nothing like a bad strike to retrofit a concentration problem.

We (I) love/need our excuses

yettie1701

GreeBo wrote: »

Bananas!


Ok, and granola bars.

But don't try to stuff the last bit of one into your mouth before you hit...recipe for an woeful shot.

Try a mouthful if dentures and a granola bar before a shot. Bad bad idea. A great way to scratch a hole for sure. Bananas great for sure. Lots of uisce too I find that helps. Just keep sipping the whole way round.

SaveOurLyric

Not sure that you should be feeling any fatigue after the relatively mild exertion of 15 holes of golf. Possible an underlying health issue ? Or is it just lately in the hot weather ? Rehydration is important if you are perspiring, although some research suggests the reduction in cognitive-motor function performance is linked more with a centrally mediated mechanism of thirst perception rather than the actual loss of water. Either way - if you feel you need a drink, have one !

PARlance

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

the reduction in cognitive-motor function performance

That's what it was, had 4 of them the last day myself (scratches)

First Up

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

Not sure that you should be feeling any fatigue after the relatively mild exertion of 15 holes of golf. Possible an underlying health issue ? Or is it just lately in the hot weather ? Rehydration is important if you are perspiring, although some research suggests the reduction in cognitive-motor function performance is linked more with a centrally mediated mechanism of thirst perception rather

than the actual loss of water. Either way - if you feel you need a drink, have one !

Sometimes I feel the need for a drink after a round. A stiff one at that.

yettie1701

PARlance wrote: »

That's what it was, had 4 of them the last day myself (scratches)

Classic

ShivasIrons

First Up wrote: »

You train for both but I would be prepared to bet that the OP's question/problem related to the walking more than the swing.

I had an interesting conversation with Padraig Harrington a few years ago when we were both using the UCD gym. He was doing small weights for wrist/arm strength. I asked him about it and he said he had a very specific programme designed for strength hitting from thick rough.

But he spent most of the gym session doing steady pace running - not sprinting. But then, he probably hadn't seen the infomercial.

Would you think that Harrington has the same gym routine now as he had a few years ago? If you ask him now about sprint interval training he would know all about it.

If you asked any golfer to walk 6 or 7 miles over the course of 3-4 hours they would have no problem doing it, the swing part of golf uses up a lot of energy. It's swinging the golf club is the main cause of tiredness at the end of the round.