What about the wildlife

vistafinder

This has been annoyoing me for a few months. I am a converted nature and wildlife lover. I love it like most on this forum. It started by feeding birds here at home and then I actually started looking at things a bit closer while out and about. Have some incredible memories since I started.

When I am at work I go outside to my van for my breaks for a bit of fresh air and a bit of peace and quiet. Plenty of little of birds coming and going around the few trees that are there and there is a river across the next field of rushes so lots of butterflies and herons and stuff so I realy enjoy my breaks There is a flock of starlings living in the building and the swallows which I love waiting to see for the first time in spring.

Now this is the part thats annoying me they sprayed some of the grounds with weed killer a couple of months ago and I have seen the birds collecting this ugly ugly yellow brown grass for nests and the birds seem to spend a lot of time eating insects off this grass and I have seen the birds wash in the puddles of water next to the grass. Do ye guys think this crap is doing harm to our wildlife? I do! Since then I have seen a huge increase in the stuff around the countryside nearly every house,farmers fields and the council are at it now too. Am I missing something here or what?

It never ever crossed my mind to touch this stuff. Fu-cking poisen like! I would rather have weeds and grass 10 feet high than to use the stuff. Now of course the makers of this will say its safe I mean they want money. They are telling lies.I go on the gardening forum a bit too and was shocked at the advice being given thats it safe someone told me or its on the bottle or I know someone who puts it on there veg patch or get this now like.... farmers are spraying fields of barley before harvesting to dry it out so they will get more money for it. What chance has our wildlife got and our childern and theirs too. One near by farmer told my mother about roundup and he said you could drink the stuff safe out infact I dont use gloves or ware a mask or anything. Thats a selling point by the companys that a reps drink it. That bit is a bit funny!

Anyway I have been doing a bit of googleing and its not pretty some of the stuff that can be found. We are going down the wrong road here and I cant do anything about it. The tipping point for me was my next door neighbours done a bit of spraying lately and im just worried about the birds I have been feeding for the last few years and all the enjoyment they have given me.

There dose not seem to be much studies done about wildlife and weedkiller that I can find. I dont know if I want to find them either.

What do you nature lovers think or know?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Weeds killed by herbicides have not been proven to cause any major health problems for birds generally as most don't eat vegetative matter and weeds are usually sprayed before they are in seed. That said, I don't use herbicides or insecticides myself and don't like to see them used - just in case. The loss of wild areas, weed covered verges, clumps of nettles, etc around our homes is a greater threat to wildlife.

I suppose people are entitled to kill weds in their own gardens if they want to: I wouldn't worry about any substantial affect on the birds you feed in you garden?

vistafinder

Treasure Elegant Whirlpool wrote: »

I suppose people are entitled to kill weds in their own gardens if they want to: I wouldn't worry about any substantial affect on the birds you feed in you garden?

Just incase would be my thinking aswell. How did humans get this far without chemicals!

It was the insects and worms that the spray was landing on and then being eaten and taken back to the chicks that Id be worried about.

How can something damage one thing and not effect other things that are a lot more sensitive to things than humans. It does not make sense to me anyway.

Birdnuts

Treasure Elegant Whirlpool wrote: »

Weeds killed by herbicides have not been proven to cause any major health problems for birds generally as most don't eat vegetative matter and weeds are usually sprayed before they are in seed. That said, I don't use herbicides or insecticides myself and don't like to see them used - just in case. The loss of wild areas, weed covered verges, clumps of nettles, etc around our homes is a greater threat to wildlife.

I suppose people are entitled to kill weds in their own gardens if they want to: I wouldn't worry about any substantial affect on the birds you feed in you garden?

i would tend to agree with this - the likes of roundup are pretty benign in that regard. At least compared to some of the stuff that was used a few years back.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Glyphosate such as Roundup is a systemic weedkiller which means plants take the chemical up systemically, through their leaves and stems. It is harmless to animal life and becomes inactive with soil contact. Remember we are talking herbicides here and not pesticides. And only those approved for use in Ireland. Any research online should be done with the clear disregard of any material based on herbicides permitted in other jurisdictions such as the US.

magicbastarder

the biggest concern for wildlife regarding the use of weedkiller would be loss of cover plants and food - i.e. the loss of the plants themselves, rather than the weedkiller used to kill the plants.

vistafinder

magicbastarder wrote: »

the biggest concern for wildlife regarding the use of weedkiller would be loss of cover plants and food - i.e. the loss of the plants themselves, rather than the weedkiller used to kill the plants.

Ok thats one good reason at least for people not to use it.

vistafinder

Birdnuts wrote: »

i would tend to agree with this - the likes of roundup are pretty benign in that regard. At least compared to some of the stuff that was used a few years back.

Would you or do you use it? I wonder how long and how much of the other stuff was used before it was stopped being used?

vistafinder

Treasure Elegant Whirlpool wrote: »

Glyphosate such as Roundup is a systemic weedkiller which means plants take the chemical up systemically, through their leaves and stems. It is harmless to animal life and becomes inactive with soil contact. Remember we are talking herbicides here and not pesticides. And only those approved for use in Ireland. Any research online should be done with the clear disregard of any material based on herbicides permitted in other jurisdictions such as the US.

I am just a bit skeptical about what these companys say their products do.Yes most of the reports I have seen are from the US and it looks like overuse is the problem over there to human health anyway. A great example of the way this country needs to avoid. It and its products being advertised as green and all? I would have thought Monsantos roundup would be the same in the US as it is here.

cameramonkey

Farmers spray roundup on pastures and then soon after allow cattle into those fields to graze the dying grass.

I believe that in many cases they also spray roundup on wheat just before it is harvested. I believe that it lowers the moister content of the cereal, a farmer can correct me if I am wrong.

axe2grind

It seems that Roundup or more accurately Glyphosate is not as benign as I was once led to believe. It has been banned in Netherlands for private use with other countries to follow.
http://sustainablepulse.com/2014/04/04/dutch-parliament-bans-glyphosate-herbicides-non-commercial-use/

I can't help but feel that the huge use of chemicals such as Glyphosate is a significant contributor to negative effects on flora and fauna. I now don't believe as I once did that Glphosate is harmless to animals and becomes inactive in the ground.

Coincidently I was thinking of starting a thread here on what seems to becoming more fashionable. The spraying of roadside verges. Much of it in the name of road safety, but by god it is unsightly and often creates a bigger mess, in that what fills in the void often needs more management.

vistafinder

cameramonkey wrote: »

Farmers spray roundup on pastures and then soon after allow cattle into those fields to graze the dying grass.

I believe that in many cases they also spray roundup on wheat just before it is harvested. I believe that it lowers the moister content of the cereal, a farmer can correct me if I am wrong.

Yes lower moister content =more money. Then the co-ops spray with pesticides aswell. Anyone remember loads of fish being killed in east Cork a few years ago where a co-op either left the spray on or there was a leak or something like that. God only knows whats happening that we dont know about.

I have seen cattle on burnt grass around aswell common practice by all accounts. Is this what they are being told to do in them farming colleges?

vistafinder

axe2grind wrote: »

It seems that Roundup or more accurately Glyphosate is not as benign as I was once led to believe. It has been banned in Netherlands for private use with other countries to follow.

Dont forget there is another chemical in roundup that makes the glyphosate go deep into the (WEEDS). Why not ban it totally I wonder.

cameramonkey

vistafinder wrote: »

Yes lower moister content =more money. Then the co-ops spray with pesticides aswell. Anyone remember loads of fish being killed in east Cork a few years ago where a co-op either left the spray on or there was a leak or something like that. God only knows whats happening that we dont know about.

I have seen cattle on burnt grass around aswell common practice by all accounts. Is this what they are being told to do in them farming colleges?

I think the eating of round up grass is actually encouraged by Teagasc.

fleabag

This is a thread I've been meaning to start myself ever since the small farmer near me sprayed his pasture with herbicide. He sprayed early May when we had rain nearly every day and I imagined the weedkiller to just be washed straight off and into the groundwater. What upset me was that the docks had loads of insect eggs on them and I imagined it would wipe all these out as they wouldn't hatch or they would hatch and have no food.

I watched the pasture for several weeks afterwards and noticed that although meadow and creeping buttercups, cow parsley and docks were immediately affected (that horrible contorted look), the timothy grass withstood it no problem. Less than 2 weeks later the docks were back and about a week after that the dock leaves were eaten into lace by the grubs that had hatched so that population seemed unaffected. The buttercup varieties came more or less straight back also. The nettles and thistles also started to recover but he has recently cut those right back with the tractor. As a previous poster pointed out, the cattle were back grazing the herbicide sprayed pasture within 3 weeks.

All of this made me wonder why bother spraying in the first place?? It only seemed a temporary set-back for most species, it was the mowing with the tractor last week that did for most of them. I also wondered about the use of herbicide vs the effect that the cattle have on the land? I notice way more insects when the cows are around and the cowpats also provide a habitat for some insect larvae and in turn food for birds don't they? I notice also that where the tractor gouged deep ruts in the field last year, there are way more varieties of grass growing than usual due to the soil disturbance. I am really trying to convince myself that the farming isn't all bad I suppose. I really hate to see weedkiller used on verges outside people's houses though. How can they think that a rust coloured bare earth patch looks better than ox-eye daisies and cow parsley??

Squidvicious

Most farmers(not all) will kill every "weed" and "pest" they can regardless of the environmental cost. This attitude undeniably has a devastating effect on wildlife. We only have to look at the huge fall in the number of farmland birds over the last few decades to see proof of this.

That said, you can hardly blame them. They've got to make a living and the bottom line is that the consumer will complain if food prices rise as a result of lower crop yields to help support wildlife. If Irish farmers decided to play ball to support wildlife and prices rises, most consumers would simply switch to cheaper imports. The question is whether the consumer will pay for environmentally responsible farming.

fleabag

I hear ya and often think about where my €1.79 2 litre carton of milk came from. I would pay more, but probably buy less and use everything. I know from my experience that cheap food encourages waste.

I haven't cut the grass around my house for 2 years now and the difference in bird life is amazing. My favourites are the bullfinches - the landlord said there were none around here previously but now there are coal tits, blue tits, great tits, goldcrests, wrens, chaffinches, goldfinches, sparrows and the odd long-tailed tit.

vistafinder

[QUOTE=fleabag;90970270 He sprayed early May when we had rain nearly every day and I imagined the weedkiller to just be washed straight off and into the groundwater. What upset me was that the docks had loads of insect eggs on them and I imagined it would wipe all these out as they wouldn't hatch or they would hatch and have no food.

I watched the pasture for several weeks afterwards and noticed that although meadow and creeping buttercups, cow parsley and docks were immediately affected (that horrible contorted look), the timothy grass withstood it no problem. Less than 2 weeks later the docks were back and about a week after that the dock leaves were eaten into lace by the grubs that had hatched so that population seemed unaffected. The buttercup varieties came more or less straight back also. The nettles and thistles also started to recover but he has recently cut those right back with the tractor. As a previous poster pointed out, the cattle were back grazing the herbicide sprayed pasture within 3 weeks.

All of this made me wonder why bother spraying in the first place?? It only seemed a temporary set-back for most species, it was the mowing with the tractor last week that did for most of them. I am really trying to convince myself that the farming isn't all bad I suppose. I really hate to see weedkiller used on verges outside people's houses though. How can they think that a rust coloured bare earth patch looks better than ox-eye daisies and cow parsley??[/QUOTE]

The problem is it might not have wiped them out but it could be causing damage long term and is by the look of it too and add to that over use.
I suppose some people belive it when its advised to use it I dont know.
https://www.trentu.ca/biology/berrill/Research/Roundup_Poster.htm

Yes its very ugly