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Shouting Fore: liability

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78 ✭✭Tommo 76


    I think shouting fore for all pros should be compulsory, 1-2 shot penalty for a no call.

    I'm just wondering, the fact the lady was on the balcony, I don't know the layout but would shouting fore have changed the outcome. Don't get me wrong I'm not taking the golfers side but I'm not sure I think the golfer should be liable, if it happened on the course maybe but the fact this lady was on a balcony, surely this falls under the remit of the clubhouse or buildings, which would imply that this insurance would be liable ie the balcony should be safe from any possible accidents. I could be totally wrong I'm not familiar with the layout, and am 100% totally behind ALL golfers ( including pros) shouting fore. I mean seeing a Marshall wave a flag or holding it right when you are 300 yards up the fairway won't really alert you, a vocal call will get your attention. I wish this lady best wishes for her recovery and hope it works out okay for everyone, I also cannot imagine what the golfer is feeling, no amateur sets out to intentionally hit someone with a golf ball.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭callaway92


    There's no way the person who hit the ball could ever be found to be liable really.

    So many excuses could be made. I thought of numerous ones instantly some of which sound ridiculous but would surely get away with i.e. I thought I saw it go straight so didn't shout fore.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,349 ✭✭✭Wombatman




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,957 ✭✭✭blindside88


    Surely she should be suing the golf club if anyone, as she wasn't on the course itself but in the clubhouse, surely claiming on the public liability insurance would give her the best shot (no pun intended) of a successful claim


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭callaway92


    Wombatman wrote: »

    UK Case though. Are their laws for liability on a golf course the exact same?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,733 ✭✭✭SnowDrifts


    callaway92 wrote: »
    UK Case though. Are their laws for liability on a golf course the exact same?

    It's Scottish and as such, has no bearing on our common law legal system. England operates a common law system the same as our own.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 692 ✭✭✭Dtoffee


    So basically... as I understand it:

    Mrs Brennan, with a golf handicap of 28, had three weeks earlier become a full member of the club.

    I loved playing golf and the club and the interaction and the social evenings. I tried to play golf four or five times afterwards but when somebody shouted fore I threw another lady in front of me. I realised my fear was too big,” she add
    ed.

    They had to cancel a planned Caribbean trip.

    I thought I was going to enjoy the rest of my life playing golf around the world. Mrs Brennan agreed there were photographs of her without her glasses on her husband’s Facebook page while on holiday in Dubai. She said she has to wear glasses all the time but takes them off for photographs.

    Shes 3 weeks a member / gets hit by a golf ball / throws a playing partner in front of her / had her Caribbean holiday cancelled but flies off to Dubai and she has to wear glasses 'all' the time except when posing for facebook photos .... don't you just love facebook, I have a feeling this case is going to get VERY interesting. :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,202 ✭✭✭✭callaway92


    SnowDrifts wrote: »
    It's Scottish and as such, has no bearing on our common law legal system. England operates a common law system the same as our own.

    Cool, thought as much.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3 deBurcaLiam


    The Gordon case is a good example, and I wouldn't be surprised if that Opinion gets a mention at some stage.

    A casual online search would indicate that the plaintiff (Mrs. Brennan) did actually return to golf after this accident, and in fact she has played at Old Conna since.

    The crux of this specific case is that the defendant (Mr.Trundle) was attempting to correct an already bad shot, and was playing the ball from the rough on the first fairway, back out over the parting trees, onto the top of the eighteenth fairway,

    Both holes are parallel, one running away from the club (the 1st) and one running towards the club (the 18th).

    The veranda was in his sightline, and he was presumably aware that there were spectators sitting out. The ball was travelling in the direction of the veranda, and he failed to shout fore or give any reasonable warning.

    If there were any arguments put forward that he didn't know or didn't see where the ball had gone, then he still should have shouted fore as a precaution.

    Judge Peart is hearing this case, it'll be interesting to see what the outcome is.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 692 ✭✭✭Dtoffee


    Reading Liams post above, it appears that the 18th green is beyond the clubhouse veranda and if thats the case the maybe the club could be exposed to risk as their clubhouse is endangering members with its location. Especially if it could be established that golf balls have landed there before, I can't think of too many places where the veranda or viewing area is actually putting members at risk.

    Sounds like Mrs Brennan's solicitor is hungry and it will be a can of worms if the defence examines preceedent in terms of balls hitting the veranda. Should preceedent be established, it would bring all sorts of issues into play including the architect who designed the clubhouse and what health and safety actions were in place at the time of the incident.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    Play golf witha guy regularyly who never shouts fore, it's the most frustrating thing in the world, when he does it's at a barely whisper level. Eejit, I've started shouting for him now which gets his back up but I'm not the one in the wrong.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,695 ✭✭✭ForeRight


    razorblunt wrote: »
    Play golf witha guy regularyly who never shouts fore, it's the most frustrating thing in the world, when he does it's at a barely whisper level. Eejit, I've started shouting for him now which gets his back up but I'm not the one in the wrong.



    Have you said anything to him about it?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,308 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/woman-hit-by-golf-ball-sues-after-suffering-stroke-1.1812778
    She was taken to St Vincent’s Hospital where a scan came back normal, she said. She went home but felt the inside of her head “wanted to burst”. She started vomiting eight days later and had double vision and headaches, she said. She was admitted to St Vincent’s Hospital and was told she had had a stroke.
    Did she tell her doctors this?
    Dtoffee wrote: »
    So basically... as I understand it:

    Mrs Brennan, with a golf handicap of 28, had three weeks earlier become a full member of the club.

    I loved playing golf and the club and the interaction and the social evenings. I tried to play golf four or five times afterwards but when somebody shouted fore I threw another lady in front of me. I realised my fear was too big,” she add
    ed.

    They had to cancel a planned Caribbean trip.

    I thought I was going to enjoy the rest of my life playing golf around the world. Mrs Brennan agreed there were photographs of her without her glasses on her husband’s Facebook page while on holiday in Dubai. She said she has to wear glasses all the time but takes them off for photographs.

    Shes 3 weeks a member / gets hit by a golf ball / throws a playing partner in front of her / had her Caribbean holiday cancelled but flies off to Dubai and she has to wear glasses 'all' the time except when posing for facebook photos .... don't you just love facebook, I have a feeling this case is going to get VERY interesting. :rolleyes:
    Agree totally.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,750 ✭✭✭allybhoy


    One of my big pet hates on a course is playing with guys who dont shout Fore or a ball landing close to you and not hearing a shout. If im playing with someone i dont know and they dont shout, i always call on their behalf and say it to them afterwards that they should have called it and if a ball comes close to me without a shout ill try and find out who hit it and politely ask them to shout fore in future...its the worst thing you can do on a course. We all hit bad shots so its nothing to be embarrassed about, imagine how "embarrassed" you would feel if you split someones head open.


    Unrelated, I dont watch a huge amount of golf on telly apart from the majors and ryder cup, however I was watching Lowry at Wenworth on the 18th on Sunday when he hit a wayward second shot, he shouted Fore and it occurred to me that i dont think ive ever seen a pro on telly call fore before. Ive heard the rumours like most have that some pro's arent too upset when they hit spectators as they think if it hits someone it will be more preferable etc etc but is their any basis or truth to this?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    ForeRight wrote: »
    Have you said anything to him about it?

    Yeah, same spiel every time made worse by his wicked slice. He's often just looking at it peel to the right. You shout "fore" he responds with "it's nowhere near them".

    He improves his conduct for a bit but, creeps back to so shouting fore and looking away so the folks on the flight path dont know which direction (we've had to signal the direction of the fore).

    He'll be getting the buck up or you're not being included in the groupings anymore speech soon enough.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,865 ✭✭✭TRS30


    allybhoy wrote: »
    Unrelated, I dont watch a huge amount of golf on telly apart from the majors and ryder cup, however I was watching Lowry at Wenworth on the 18th on Sunday when he hit a wayward second shot, he shouted Fore and it occurred to me that i dont think ive ever seen a pro on telly call fore before. Ive heard the rumours like most have that some pro's arent too upset when they hit spectators as they think if it hits someone it will be more preferable etc etc but is their any basis or truth to this?

    I have heard some of the Sky pundits say this.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    TRS30 wrote: »
    I have heard some of the Sky pundits say this.

    In defence of the pros, I don't think Sky alluded to them being happy with the hit, just the lack of respect of not doing it.
    Ewen Murray makes a point of calling out and praising those that do it, most notably Poulter at Sawgrass.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,244 ✭✭✭rrpc


    allybhoy wrote: »
    Unrelated, I dont watch a huge amount of golf on telly apart from the majors and ryder cup, however I was watching Lowry at Wenworth on the 18th on Sunday when he hit a wayward second shot, he shouted Fore and it occurred to me that i dont think ive ever seen a pro on telly call fore before. Ive heard the rumours like most have that some pro's arent too upset when they hit spectators as they think if it hits someone it will be more preferable etc etc but is their any basis or truth to this?
    I've heard McIlroy shout Fore as well, but he does the full 'Fore right' or 'Fore left' and sticks out his club to indicate the direction as well.

    A few just stick out the club instead of shouting.

    Maybe we should start a blacklist ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 998 ✭✭✭John Divney


    Lowry is a beast when he shouts it, absolutley correct.

    I was watching Faldo and Norman on Shell's WWOG from the early 90's, people were closer to fairway and the lads would smash it into the crowd and just mumble to themselves.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 446 ✭✭unattendedbag


    I paid an extra €20 for some sort of Gui insurance when taking out membership this year, presumably to cover incidents of damage and injury I may cause. Not sure if the defendant in this case had the same. I imagined they would have settled out of court if he had.


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