being to honest.... or maybe i'm a cheat!

Seve OB

playing partner in bunker the other day, called foul for hitting the sand with his club.

later on he explained, he had the club in his hand behind his back and thought it might have brushed against the sand but he wasn't really sure, so called it anyway just in case. it was nowhere near the ball.

neither myself or other player saw it nor were anywhere near him.

now if it were me, there is no way i would be calling that..... am i a cheat?

it also made a difference as he was in the prizes!

slave1

Being honest I would take the stance that I was not testing the sand and in the interest of equity no penalty based upon the fact the club was behind me and I gained no advantage from the accidental brushing that may not have actually happened.
They have amended the bunkering rules to allow maintenance of the bunker prior to your shot as long as you don't do so in an attempt to 'test' the conditions.

Montgolfier

That's the problem with the game today it's black or white and your expected to call penalties on yourself. Now I'm an honourable man but the other day playing in a 4 ball one guy hit his ball into a waste area and said "What are we calling this tractor marks?" Unplayable lie never came into it. His regular partner agreed gave him a free drop.
I said nothing not wanting to cause tension that may end up effecting my game.
So should I call a penalty one myself for waving the rules?
I think at amateurs should be allowed to use a little discretion and common sense, i.e. Was there an advantage gained?
I'm sure rules are always interpreted differently by different people.

SEORG

Montgolfier wrote: »

That's the problem with the game today it's black or white and your expected to call penalties on yourself. Now I'm an honourable man but the other day playing in a 4 ball one guy hit his ball into a waste area and said "What are we calling this tractor marks?" Unplayable lie never came into it. His regular partner agreed gave him a free drop.
I said nothing not wanting to cause tension that may end up effecting my game.
So should I call a penalty one myself for waving the rules?
I think at amateurs should be allowed to use a little discretion and common sense, i.e. Was there an advantage gained?
I'm sure rules are always interpreted differently by different people.

Was it a competition or casual round?

I would be calling him on it if it was a competition.
He's cheating and gaining an advantage/stroke on the everyone else including yourself.

Seve OB

SEORG wrote: »

I would be calling him on it if it was a competition.

so would I

John Divney

You have to say it with a smile and tell him he's having a laugh, maybe do the Ricky Gervais impression from Extras.

Non competition he can throw the ball off the tee as far as I'm concerned as long as he's not slow or telling me about my swing.

m r c

John Divney wrote: »

You have to say it with a smile and tell him he's having a laugh, maybe do the Ricky Gervais impression from Extras.

Non competition he can throw the ball off the tee as far as I'm concerned as long as he's not slow or telling me about my swing.

Moonboy style golf :-)

Montgolfier

SEORG wrote: »

Was it a competition or casual round?

I would be calling him on it if it was a competition.
He's cheating and gaining an advantage/stroke on the everyone else including yourself.

It was a club competition, his buddy had a low hcp so did't want to argue. I get wound up very easy if I go down that road, it would totally effect my game. Happened me before when I tried to argue my own case for an embedded ball, I was told the ball had to be more than half buried.
I knew it was bull and the guy didn't know the rule as the ball only has to be resting in its own pitch mark.
But I tried to have my say but neither partner knew the rule so I gave in and played it. Then scratched the next 4 holes cause I was upset.
So now I just concentrate on my own game because stuff like that's going on all over with regular groups heading out together. I do believe in a random draw for big competitions, but I don't ever see that happening.

Rikand

Montgolfier wrote: »

So now I just concentrate on my own game

I think this is the best thing to do.

If I'm on one side of the fairway and my playing partner is on the other and calls out " tractor marks here " I just say okay. Golf is a game of integrity. I shouldn't have to check up on my playing partner to make sure he's not cheating.

BenEadir

Rikand wrote: »

If I'm on one side of the fairway and my playing partner is on the other and calls out " tractor marks here " I just say okay. Golf is a game of integrity.

Am I right in saying you can only get free relief from tractor (or any other man made) marks if there is a specific local rule specifying same? Otherwise you play it as it lies or call it unplayable for a one stroke penalty?

Ben

charlieIRL

If I land in tractor marks in the rough I just hit the ball out sideways or whatever way I have a clear line.

If in doubt I just hit it out!

Rikand

charlieIRL wrote: »

If I land in tractor marks in the rough I just hit the ball out sideways or whatever way I have a clear line.

If in doubt I just hit it out!

play the course as you see it
play the ball as it lies

you can break very few rules doing this lol

BenEadir

I find the weekly rule from Barry Rhodes very good, sign up here http://www.rhodesrulesschool.com. He emails you one illustrated rule per week with a little Q&A at the end so you know you know it!!

TrapperChamonix

Rikand wrote: »

I think this is the best thing to do.

If I'm on one side of the fairway and my playing partner is on the other and calls out " tractor marks here " I just say okay. Golf is a game of integrity. I shouldn't have to check up on my playing partner to make sure he's not cheating.

I don't get this. Tractor Marks are not valid reason for a free drop (unless as Ben says there is a specific GUR rule in the club).
So whether you are close or not they are not applicable. Remember as you are signing his card your integrity in on the line every time you sign it.

newuser89

Montgolfier wrote: »

It was a club competition, his buddy had a low hcp so did't want to argue. I get wound up very easy if I go down that road, it would totally effect my game. Happened me before when I tried to argue my own case for an embedded ball, I was told the ball had to be more than half buried.
I knew it was bull and the guy didn't know the rule as the ball only has to be resting in its own pitch mark.
But I tried to have my say but neither partner knew the rule so I gave in and played it. Then scratched the next 4 holes cause I was upset.
So now I just concentrate on my own game because stuff like that's going on all over with regular groups heading out together. I do believe in a random draw for big competitions, but I don't ever see that happening.

What's the rule for a embedded ball.
I couple weeks ago my ball was plugged in a hill and I had to take a unplayable.
It was way below the surface of the hill.
Should this of been accepted as unlucky or should I have got a free drop

mike12

newuser89 wrote: »

What's the rule for a embedded ball.
I couple weeks ago my ball was plugged in a hill and I had to take a unplayable.
It was way below the surface of the hill.
Should this of been accepted as unlucky or should I have got a free drop

If the ball is on the fairway then it's a free drop if not and there is no local rule covering it than too bad.

There is no relief from tractor marks so play the ball unless it is marked as GUR.

blackwhite

newuser89 wrote: »

What's the rule for a embedded ball.
I couple weeks ago my ball was plugged in a hill and I had to take a unplayable.
It was way below the surface of the hill.
Should this of been accepted as unlucky or should I have got a free drop

Was it in the rough or fairway/green?


In the rough, then you can only get a free drop if there is a temporary local rule in place (i.e. at times when the course is unusually wet).

http://www.randa.org/en/Rules-and-Amateur-Status/Guidance-on-Running-a-Competition.aspx?chapter=2&section=5

If it's in the fairway or on the green then you are entitled to relief under Rule 25-2

http://www.randa.org/en/Rules-and-Amateur-Status/Rules-of-Golf.aspx#/rules/?ruleNum=25&subRuleNum=2

Seve OB

newuser89 wrote: »

What's the rule for a embedded ball.
I couple weeks ago my ball was plugged in a hill and I had to take a unplayable.
It was way below the surface of the hill.
Should this of been accepted as unlucky or should I have got a free drop

if a ball is embedded in it's own pitchmark on the fairway, it may be removed and dropped without penalty

in the rough? tough...

newuser89

Ye it was in the rough,and I took it as unplayable so had a penalty drop.
Just reading previous posts I taught I had missed something and should of taken free drop

Rikand

TrapperChamonix wrote: »

I don't get this. Tractor Marks are not valid reason for a free drop (unless as Ben says there is a specific GUR rule in the club).
So whether you are close or not they are not applicable. Remember as you are signing his card your integrity in on the line every time you sign it.

i didn't really mean just tractor marks. I meant any kind of relief. I'm not going to go investigating my partner, if they say they are taking relief for whatever reason, as long as it's within the rules to do so I'm just going to let him have at it without walking the 50 yards over to him to say " Oh yah, that's okay! "

Rikand

TrapperChamonix wrote: »

Remember as you are signing his card your integrity in on the line every time you sign it.

Fair point.

Rikand

I guess if YOU want to "cheat", then I am the perfect person to play with

Alrite Chief

Im not playing golf a long time. A bit over 2 years but iv only ever seen people or been advised you can take relief from tractor marks. I consulted 4 very seasoned golfers today, playing all their lives at top amateur level, and are all shocked by this and would take relief. One of which consulted with his pro and said he rang a friend in the GUI to clarify. All said they'd take relief from tractor marks rough or fairway ball in it or stance in them. Treating them like casual water essentially.

Such a concern that we are all out there not playing on an even field.