Waiting times in doctors

Demonique

I had an appointment with a doctor for 5pm

I ended up not being seen until 5.50pm

I first complained to the receptionist when I noticed it was 5.20pm

I am really not happy about this. Every time I go into the practice I am never seen on time

Is there anything I can do about this?

Vorsprung

What kind of setting was it?

What did the doctor say to you when you complained to him/her?

knipex

Demonique wrote: »

I had an appointment with a doctor for 5pm

I ended up not being seen until 5.50pm

I first complained to the receptionist when I noticed it was 5.20pm

I am really not happy about this. Every time I go into the practice I am never seen on time

Is there anything I can do about this?

I assume your talking about a GP ?


Find another Doctor..

Although to be fair emergency cases do occur and cases where priorities are reviewed.

Abby19

As others have said there may have been emergencies earlier during the session that took longer than the allocated appointment time causing things to run late. Or the GP having to run out and make a house call. Or patients turning up late. Or patients booking in for one thing and then bringing up multiple issues. Or overbooking by the GP.

If you wish to stay with this GP you could always request the first appointment of the day or the session, e.g. straight after lunch.

sam34

Demonique wrote: »

I had an appointment with a doctor for 5pm

I ended up not being seen until 5.50pm

I first complained to the receptionist when I noticed it was 5.20pm

I am really not happy about this. Every time I go into the practice I am never seen on time

Is there anything I can do about this?

Yes. You can take into account that the doctor most likely had a myriad of reasons to be behind schedule, such as:

Urgent house calls
Phone call from hospital to clarify something about a patient
Phone calls to/from hospital and family to organise an involuntary psychiatric admission
Dealing with an emergency, such as someone having a heart attack/stroke/anaphylaxis
Dealing with someone who has a multiplicity of conditions and thus is not straight forward
Following up urgent blood results
Calling to a house to certify someone dead and spending a bit of time with the bereaved
Dealing with someone who has received a terrible diagnosis, and the fall out from that
Going through post mortem results with a bereaved family

Etc etc etc
(The above examples pertain to a GP but there are countless other examples that could be applied to a doctor in any specialty)

Not everyone who presents to a doctor is straightforward and can be dealt with in the allotted time.

What you could do in that situation is take into account that some people will need more time, be thankful that you don't and have a bit of compassion for those that do.

Or you could complain and whinge about it.

Gael23

I agree with sam but still I think 50 minutes over is excessive. I was with my GP recently and was kept 15 minutes over. I was his last appointment before lunch so that won't have helped. I was slightly annoyed by it though because the previous patient came out nearly on time but he still didn't call me for more than 10 minutes after

HeidiHeidi

I don't think I have ever been seen exactly on time by my doctor. Sometimes it has run to 45+ minutes, but usually more like 15-20 minutes late.

However it gives me faith that he sees patients for as long as they need, and I'd prefer to wait a bit and have a full and proper consultation rather than be rushed and then turfed out bang on 15 minutes because there's a queue outside.

I also make my appointments with plenty of time to spare at the other end, as I know there's no way I'll be seen on time.

Dingle_berry

Demonique did you discuss the delay with the doctor?
What you can do depends on the details of the situation. You can persue a complaint within the practise and/or shop around for someone who provides the level of service that you want.

sam34 wrote: »

What you could do in that situation is take into account that some people will need more time, be thankful that you don't and have a bit of compassion for those that do.

Or you could complain and whinge about it.

Have you never been pissed off by an unexpected delay or long wait?

Complaints don't have to be completely negative, though they start out as a negative. They should be encouraged as a means to improve services.

Zulu

Firstly I agree with the OP, it's bullcrap. I have never once (to my recallation) been seen on time. In fact, I would believe I'm always waiting about 20mins.

I once had a friendly chat with a GP about it, and to his credit, he explained that nearly every patient that comes through his door come through with "one other thing". That is to say, they book an appointment for a bad cough they have, but once inside get him to look at a corn in their foot, a mole on there back, and question him about their sleeping patterns.

So I can accept why it happens. What I don't understand is then, why they don't either allocate an additional 5/10 mins per person in lue of this, or keep a free slot after every 3/4 patient as buffer. ...well I do understand it, it's a business at the end of the day.

Still though - grinds my gears.

Demonique

sam34 wrote: »

Yes. You can take into account that the doctor most likely had a myriad of reasons to be behind schedule, such as:

Urgent house calls
Phone call from hospital to clarify something about a patient
Phone calls to/from hospital and family to organise an involuntary psychiatric admission
Dealing with an emergency, such as someone having a heart attack/stroke/anaphylaxis
Dealing with someone who has a multiplicity of conditions and thus is not straight forward
Following up urgent blood results
Calling to a house to certify someone dead and spending a bit of time with the bereaved
Dealing with someone who has received a terrible diagnosis, and the fall out from that
Going through post mortem results with a bereaved family

Etc etc etc
(The above examples pertain to a GP but there are countless other examples that could be applied to a doctor in any specialty)

Not everyone who presents to a doctor is straightforward and can be dealt with in the allotted time.

What you could do in that situation is take into account that some people will need more time, be thankful that you don't and have a bit of compassion for those that do.

Or you could complain and whinge about it.

What the **** is your problem? Complain and whinge about it?

You could have left the 'complain and whinge' part out of your reply, it would make you look like less of an asshole.

Abby19

ryanf1 wrote: »

I agree with sam but still I think 50 minutes over is excessive. I was with my GP recently and was kept 15 minutes over. I was his last appointment before lunch so that won't have helped. I was slightly annoyed by it though because the previous patient came out nearly on time but he still didn't call me for more than 10 minutes after

So if the patient before you required referral letters, or tests to be ordered, or phone calls made, or their notes updated when would suggest it be done? Immediately after the appointment while details are fresh or hours later after seeing many more patients and potentially forgetting or mixing up details? There are far more complaints to the Medical Council so unfortunately defensive medicine is on the rise.
Or someone rang the doctor as they were now supposed to be on their lunch break?
Or the doctor wanted to review your notes/results/history before calling you in?
And if you were called in 15 mins late and you were the last appointment you were being seen in their lunch break. It is unlikely the doctor got to start late back after lunch either.
I understand it is frustrating. I've been called in late before, including yesterday at my dentist. But I am also aware of the other side and understand why lists can run late. And as a previous poster has mentioned I have confidence in my health care professionals and appreciate that they may need to spend more time with some patients than others.

Gael23

Abby19 wrote: »

So if the patient before you required referral letters, or tests to be ordered, or phone calls made, or their notes updated when would suggest it be done? Immediately after the appointment while details are fresh or hours later after seeing many more patients and potentially forgetting or mixing up details? There are far more complaints to the Medical Council so unfortunately defensive medicine is on the rise.
Or someone rang the doctor as they were now supposed to be on their lunch break?
Or the doctor wanted to review your notes/results/history before calling you in?
And if you were called in 15 mins late and you were the last appointment you were being seen in their lunch break. It is unlikely the doctor got to start late back after lunch either.
.

This particular appointment was a regular medical review that I have every so often so I wasn't unwell as such. I understand certain things may happen as you describe and 15 minutes isn't that unreasonable once it doesn't happen every time.
I think though in the OP case the secretary should first have apologised and said if the reason for the visit wasn't too urgent could you come back at another time.

Dingle_berry

Abby19 wrote: »

So if the patient before you required referral letters, or tests to be ordered, or phone calls made, or their notes updated when would suggest it be done? Immediately after the appointment while details are fresh or hours later after seeing many more patients and potentially forgetting or mixing up details? There are far more complaints to the Medical Council so unfortunately defensive medicine is on the rise.
Or someone rang the doctor as they were now supposed to be on their lunch break?
Or the doctor wanted to review your notes/results/history before calling you in?

All the reasons for delays sound like they are down to time management. Not time wasting, I repeat I am not saying that the above referral letters, notes maintenance, following up on external factors etc is time wasting. What I am saying is that it seems that the estimated average appointment time is too short. As suggested above, why not extend the time allocated to the average patient or schedule a buffer blank space every 4th appointment? If it ends up that there is no patient at that time all the better, take a breath, review the next patients chart, do some admin work, do some CPD, etc etc
Or do most GPs, dentists etc already use this system?

sam34

Demonique wrote: »

What the **** is your problem? Complain and whinge about it?

You could have left the 'complain and whinge' part out of your reply, it would make you look like less of an asshole.

I don't have a problem. You asked if there was anything you could do about this situation with which you are unhappy and I gave you an answer. You may not like my answer, but I'm entitled to give it.

Mod-hat on: don't dish out personal abuse such as 'asshole' on this forum again. Be civil, or don't bother posting.

sam34

Dingle_berry wrote: »

Demonique did you discuss the delay with the doctor?
What you can do depends on the details of the situation. You can persue a complaint within the practise and/or shop around for someone who provides the level of service that you want.



Have you never been pissed off by an unexpected delay or long wait?

Complaints don't have to be completely negative, though they start out as a negative. They should be encouraged as a means to improve services.

Course I have. I've also had an understanding that it may well be outside the persons control and just sucked it up and gotten on with it. I doubt the doctor was having strawberries and champagne while there were patients waiting.

Dingle_berry

sam34 wrote: »

Course I have. I've also had an understanding that it may well be outside the persons control and just sucked it up and gotten on with it. I doubt the doctor was having strawberries and champagne while there were patients waiting.

So you have never expressed disappointment at an unexpected delay and requested a reason? Or an estimate of when you can expect your appointment to be honoured? You just assume that it's out of control and suck it up? Sat endlessly in the waiting area ques exchanging pleasant smiles with everyone? Your own schedule for the day be damned.

Again, I do not think that any doctor or healthcare worker has strawberries & champagne while patients wait. I don't know where that is coming from, I haven't read it in any post in this thread. What I did suggest is that maybe appointments could be managed better to achieve better customer satisfaction and safer work practises for the staff involved.

sam34

Dingle_berry wrote: »

So you have never expressed disappointment at an unexpected delay and requested a reason? Or an estimate of when you can expect your appointment to be honoured? You just assume that it's out of control and suck it up? Sat endlessly in the waiting area ques exchanging pleasant smiles with everyone? Your own schedule for the day be damned.

Again, I do not think that any doctor or healthcare worker has strawberries & champagne while patients wait. I don't know where that is coming from, I haven't read it in any post in this thread. What I did suggest is that maybe appointments could be managed better to achieve better customer satisfaction and safer work practises for the staff involved.

Honestly, no, I've never queried or complained of asked for reasons etc. I just expect to be delayed and come prepared, with my phone or a magazine, and allow myself a good bit of time so I'm not in a rush and can absorb the delay.

Maybe I'm too passive, but I just assume the delay is for genuine reasons and me asking will not speed things up.

Perhaps there are better ways of managing appointment systems though, I don't know. In a hospital setting, you're balancing the inevitable DNA's along with the urgent appointments, getting people seen as frequently as they need to be seen as well as trying to ensure that the clinic isn't a waste cos of DNA's and you don't have 2 or 3 docs and nurses sitting there doing nothing.

Abby19

Dingle_berry wrote: »

All the reasons for delays sound like they are down to time management. Not time wasting, I repeat I am not saying that the above referral letters, notes maintenance, following up on external factors etc is time wasting. What I am saying is that it seems that the estimated average appointment time is too short. As suggested above, why not extend the time allocated to the average patient or schedule a buffer blank space every 4th appointment? If it ends up that there is no patient at that time all the better, take a breath, review the next patients chart, do some admin work, do some CPD, etc etc
Or do most GPs, dentists etc already use this system?

Dingle_berry wrote: »

What I did suggest is that maybe appointments could be managed better to achieve better customer satisfaction and safer work practises for the staff involved.

sam34 wrote: »

Perhaps there are better ways of managing appointment systems though, I don't know. In a hospital setting, you're balancing the inevitable DNA's along with the urgent appointments, getting people seen as frequently as they need to be seen as well as trying to ensure that the clinic isn't a waste cos of DNA's and you don't have 2 or 3 docs and nurses sitting there doing nothing.

The primary care system has been chronically underfunded for decades, along with the secondary and tertiary care. Ireland has less GPs per head than many other OECD countries. I don't have the figures to hand to cite them, but could probably root out references if people want them.

Some practices run on 10 min appointments (6/hour), some 12 (5/hour), some 15 mins (4/hour). Some who have 10 min appointments leave slots for catching up, but these can then be taken up for emergencies. The patient population is also a factor, kids and young adults may be quick, single issue appointments, but in older practices, older patients tend to have more co-morbidities.

It isn't as simple as better 'time management' - if more time is allocated to each appointment, then it means there are less slots available, and thus you may have to wait to get an appointment. In the UK GP lists are closed and people may have to wait 2 weeks to see their GP. This is one of the concerns that GPs have been raising with the proposed introduction of free GP care for under 6s. If people don't have to pay for appointments, they tend to attend more frequently. Currently ~42% of the population have medical cards (full or GP visit only). The system is seriously struggling. GPs are emigrating, and this is the first year that the GP training scheme had vacancies, and there is a significant proportion of GPs approaching retirement age.

Are there better systems - undoubtedly, but probably not possible without significant investment.

Yes it is a bummer having to wait, but I suppose when one is more aware of what goes on behind the scenes one can understand the delays better and be more prepared.

Zulu

10min slots are ridiculous.
Dont get me wrong - I believe you when you say they exist, I just think giving 10 mins for someone to walk into the room, sit down describe their problem, open their file, review their file, determine and offer a prognosis, prepare and write a script, clean/clear the room for the next patient, is ridiculous. Your simply not going to be able stay on track like that for the day.

...so it boils down to time management (and lack thereof).

L1011

I am aware of a practice that uses 7 minute slots - however, the receptionist usually books two or occasionally three of these. That was an absolute bugger to configure their very antiquated PMR to handle. I also wonder what people think of being given appointment times of "10:27" and so on!

As goes the getting the patient in, file opened, and cleaning up etc - I've had an American GP who was practicing in Ireland for a while tell me that its quite common in US practices for there to be two or even three consultation rooms per GP, with other staff getting the patients in, records (computer or paper) ready and cleaning/sanitizing the room aftewards while the GP moves between them. He found it quite hard to adapt to the single room setup here in terms of time management. Whether it really does make a difference I don't know, and there are extra costs in staffing and quite significantly in capital for premises and equipment.

doolox

The rotating rooms idea would seem to be the way to go and also the junior staff prepping files etc so that the doctor can get on with his job with minimum fuss and doing routine less skilled work that others can do.

I also saw the US doctors use much more dictaphones for their notes, to be typed up and filed later on by their secretaries so that the doctor can get through more patients in less time.

Gael23

As I said before most of my visits to my GP are for medical review as I have a number of different issues and take ongoing medication. With that 7 minutes simply would not be enough. It would mean me going twice as often and taking a second appointment.

0lddog

MYOB wrote: »

...... I've had an American GP who was practicing in Ireland for a while tell me that its quite common in US practices for there to be two or even three consultation rooms per GP, with other staff getting the patients in, records (computer or paper) ready and cleaning/sanitizing the room aftewards while the GP moves between them. .......

I've seen this work very well in a Swiss GP practice..........in the 1960s !

plus ca change

Dingle_berry

sam34 wrote: »

Honestly, no, I've never queried or complained of asked for reasons etc. I just expect to be delayed and come prepared, with my phone or a magazine, and allow myself a good bit of time so I'm not in a rush and can absorb the delay.

Maybe I'm too passive, but I just assume the delay is for genuine reasons and me asking will not speed things up.

Perhaps there are better ways of managing appointment systems though, I don't know. In a hospital setting, you're balancing the inevitable DNA's along with the urgent appointments, getting people seen as frequently as they need to be seen as well as trying to ensure that the clinic isn't a waste cos of DNA's and you don't have 2 or 3 docs and nurses sitting there doing nothing.

I'm not just talking about waiting for a doctors appointment, you've never queried any delay at all?

Without knowing if the OP addressed the issue with the doctor or if the doctor addressed it with the OP (I think OP has been scared off) is it not good service provision, if not common decency, to apologise and explain the delay? I would be appalled to experience an "I'm busy, suck it up" attitude. Some customers, especially in a health care setting could feel bullied into being quiet and completely clam up which I'm sure would be detrimental to the task of providing expedient, efficient healthcare.

I have no idea how a GP, or any doctor etc, could be expected to review history, examine, complete notes and prep for next patient in 10 minutes? Maybe if the patient was just in for vaccination etc but then do you get enough time to explain side effects?

Xeyn

I think a little perspective is needed. People arent cars coming in for a routine check where you can reliably predict the amount of time that is needed to fix a problem. If there is a delay its because people at that practice are not being treated like cattle and the necessary time is being put in to adequately treat someone.
For those that say more time should be allocated to each slot, thats fantastic in an ideal world where patient loads are minimal. But would you rather wait 10mins to an hour on the odd occassions you visit the GP or would you rather wait an extra month or 2 when booking in an appointment because less patients are seen in a day?
Its not about poor time management its about trying to get as much as possible done to as good a standard as possible in the limited amount of hours available in a day.

Dingle_berry

Xeyn wrote: »

I think a little perspective is needed. People arent cars coming in for a routine check where you can reliably predict the amount of time that is needed to fix a problem. If there is a delay its because people at that practice are not being treated like cattle and the necessary time is being put in to adequately treat someone.
For those that say more time should be allocated to each slot, thats fantastic in an ideal world where patient loads are minimal. But would you rather wait 10mins to an hour on the odd occassions you visit the GP or would you rather wait an extra month or 2 when booking in an appointment because less patients are seen in a day?
Its not about poor time management its about trying to get as much as possible done to as good a standard as possible in the limited amount of hours available in a day.

Your post is contradictory. You can't predict the time each patient will require, but it's routine/common enough to be delayed, but that's not a time management issue? At it's most stripped down it is a time management issue. Trying to fit as much work as you can into a given period of time does involve time management.

username123

Drives me mad and was one of the reasons I left the last practice I attended.

The new practice is far more organised and while I have occasionally been subjected to a 10 minute delay, I have also been brought in early when I've arrived early or more often, bang on time.

Xeyn

Dingle_berry wrote: »

Your post is contradictory. You can't predict the time each patient will require, but it's routine/common enough to be delayed, but that's not a time management issue? At it's most stripped down it is a time management issue. Trying to fit as much work as you can into a given period of time does involve time management.

There is absolutely no contradiction. There is a difference between time management and a time management problem. Its not routine to be delayed but it seems common enough. It would be a time management problem if there were gaps between patients for the doctor to do nothing. Delays are the better result for both patient and doctor.
A time management issue would be an ineffective use of the time allocated. You are advocating this to reduce 'inconvenience' of some to the possible detriment of many.
In an ideal world I and im sure most Gp's, would agree with you that more time should be allocated to each slot. We live in a far from ideal world with a very imperfect health system in this country.

sam34

Dingle_berry wrote: »

I'm not just talking about waiting for a doctors appointment, you've never queried any delay at all?

Without knowing if the OP addressed the issue with the doctor or if the doctor addressed it with the OP (I think OP has been scared off) is it not good service provision, if not common decency, to apologise and explain the delay? I would be appalled to experience an "I'm busy, suck it up" attitude. Some customers, especially in a health care setting could feel bullied into being quiet and completely clam up which I'm sure would be detrimental to the task of providing expedient, efficient healthcare.

Quite honestly, no, I've never queried delays. As I said, I tend to hold the view that people aren't twiddling their thumbs while people are waiting, and complaining, or even querying, isn't going to speed them up. I know what it's like to be on both sides, I know how frustrating delays can be, but I also know that for the doctor (or whoever) it only adds to the stress of a busy clinic when you're aware of people outside complaining, and it may lead to mistakes if you try to rush things, so as the consumer I tend to just suck it up and get on with things.

However, when I'm the 'service provider', I do apologise to my patients when things are running late, and I offer the apology as soon as I call them in, without waiting for them to comment on it. I think that's the courteous thing to do.

Lucas Castroman

sam34 wrote: »

Quite honestly, no, I've never queried delays. As I said, I tend to hold the view that people aren't twiddling their thumbs while people are waiting, and complaining, or even querying, isn't going to speed them up. I know what it's like to be on both sides, I know how frustrating delays can be, but I also know that for the doctor (or whoever) it only adds to the stress of a busy clinic when you're aware of people outside complaining, and it may lead to mistakes if you try to rush things, so as the consumer I tend to just suck it up and get on with things.

However, when I'm the 'service provider', I do apologise to my patients when things are running late, and I offer the apology as soon as I call them in, without waiting for them to comment on it. I think that's the courteous thing to do.

What are you apologising for - you've done nothing wrong! Services are massively overstretched but that's not your fault. Too many complicated patients - too few doctors. Generally, the people who complain the most are those who contribute the least to society.

Galbin

IME, it's the good doctors who keep you waiting. They tend to have more patients and will take whatever time is necessary to do consultations properly. Doctors who keep exactly to their schedule tend to be the ones who rush you out the door. That is just with GPs though. It tends to be different with consultants.

Gael23

Galbin wrote: »

IME, it's the good doctors who keep you waiting. They tend to have more patients and will take whatever time is necessary to do consultations properly. Doctors who keep exactly to their schedule tend to be the ones who rush you out the door. That is just with GPs though. It tends to be different with consultants.

That is true.
I had to leave my GP recently, not through choice, and he was just like you describe. I remember on one occasion they put me in see him when there wasn't really room so i was waiting quite a while but i would have had to wait until the next day otherwise.
That was actually the last time I saw him before leaving.

sam34

Lucas Castroman wrote: »

What are you apologising for - you've done nothing wrong! Services are massively overstretched but that's not your fault. Too many complicated patients - too few doctors. Generally, the people who complain the most are those who contribute the least to society.

While I know it's not that I've personally done something wrong, I do think it's polite and courteous to apologise if running late, and I think most people appreciate it. Plus it takes the wind out of the sails of some people who were about to whinge, and gets things off on a better footing.

doctorjohn

I have a notice in the treatment room

"Please do not get cross, if a patient is taking up a lot of the doctor's time. Someday it might be you."

Like Sam I apologise immediately when I am running late, and do not wait for the patient to comment on same.

Most patients are very understanding. Some even say - I wont keep you long, I see you are very busy. They mix up running behind with being busy. They are not the same thing. I immediately down tools and make sure to tell them that

They have waited for their time and they get their time regardless of how many others are waiting.

Also it only takes one patient with a first presentation of depression for me to immediately be running 40 minutes late. There is no way to plan for or predict this. You cannot ask someone who presents unexpectedly , or as an aside, with depression to make another appointment for the next day to ensure those with existing appointments are not going to be held up.

Some day that suicidal patient may be you.

Galbin

Very good point about the suicidal patient. I think I read a few years back that there is research supporting your experience of patients presenting with other complaints and then dropping in the depressed or suicidal statements at the end.

pc11

Demonique wrote: »

I had an appointment with a doctor for 5pm

I ended up not being seen until 5.50pm

I first complained to the receptionist when I noticed it was 5.20pm

I am really not happy about this. Every time I go into the practice I am never seen on time

Is there anything I can do about this?

When I go to the doctor, he is always waiting for me with a coffee and a croissant. He always clears everything he has on to make sure he is free to talk to me for as long as I want. I may have 11 different issues I want to bring up, but it's no problem.

byhookorbycrook

I've had to wait up to 2 hours. But you know what? I take it that the dr isn't in her room playing Candy Crush Saga. She is really, really thorough and really good at the job and I get plenty time when I go in. Drs can't work in ten min slots, there's always the unexpected.

RobFowl

Time keeping is a huge problem in GP especially. I've worked in the UK and Ireland and in the UK they tend to run on time better.
That said they do this by limiting the number of problems dealt with to "one problem per appointment" so complex issues are effectively kicked to touch or else dealt with over a number of consultations.
For various reasons this is harder to do in Ireland and we also have a culture of patients being seen on the day (or within a few days) of requesting to be seen. The waiting time for a routine GP appointment in the UK is up to 3 weeks now.
It's possibly slightly glib to say it but the price paid for same day access to GP's is a likelihood of a wait on the day in the waiting room.

Gael23

If the Dutch system ever gets implemented, your time with your GP will be so short that it will only be one issue per consultation. The result of that will be more demand for appointments of course because it would be impossible to deal with patients who have more complex problems in that time.
It might be a cultural thing about being seen quickly but as a patient, its important to me that if I'm unwell I can see my Doctor maybe not the same day but definitely the next day. I think also that as a GP you are on the front line of patient care so ease of access is quite important.

Sadderday

I always have to wait over 20 mins in my docs office.

Last time was exactly an hour. my app was at 10am.

The receptionist would normally give me a note for my boss to say I got stuck waiting for my appointment.

It is a huge pain in the behind.... but theres nothing you can really do, its worth waiting on a good doctor anyway.

If I go in for a prescription but she checks everything, breast check, the works.

I'd rather that than be rushed in and rushed out I guess

locum-motion

Sadderday wrote: »

... but theres nothing you can really do, its worth waiting on a good doctor anyway...

Why would you wait on the poor doctor? Especially if they're such a good one, why would you treat them so badly?

Personally I would rather wait on a chair; they're far more comfortable than a doctor. Y'know, while I wait for the doctor.

Sadderday

locum-motion wrote: »

Why would you wait on the poor doctor? Especially if they're such a good one, why would you treat them so badly?

Personally I would rather wait on a chair. Y'know, while I wait for the doctor.

................................Theres always one....

bobbysands81

sam34 wrote: »

Yes. You can take into account that the doctor most likely had a myriad of reasons to be behind schedule, such as:

Urgent house calls
Phone call from hospital to clarify something about a patient
Phone calls to/from hospital and family to organise an involuntary psychiatric admission
Dealing with an emergency, such as someone having a heart attack/stroke/anaphylaxis
Dealing with someone who has a multiplicity of conditions and thus is not straight forward
Following up urgent blood results
Calling to a house to certify someone dead and spending a bit of time with the bereaved
Dealing with someone who has received a terrible diagnosis, and the fall out from that
Going through post mortem results with a bereaved family

Etc etc etc
(The above examples pertain to a GP but there are countless other examples that could be applied to a doctor in any specialty)

Not everyone who presents to a doctor is straightforward and can be dealt with in the allotted time.

What you could do in that situation is take into account that some people will need more time, be thankful that you don't and have a bit of compassion for those that do.

Or you could complain and whinge about it.

Granted there may be valid reasons why your appointment may be late but when it happens every time, when it's on occasion 2 hours late and when there's no explanation or apology then really there is no excuse for it and it's no way to run a business.

This happens regularly to my family members with a large practice in Waterford City.

Gael23

bobbysands81 wrote: »

Granted there may be valid reasons why your appointment may be late but when it happens every time, when it's on occasion 2 hours late and when there's no explanation or apology then really there is no excuse for it and it's no way to run a business.

This happens regularly to my family members with a large practice in Waterford City.

I think I know where your talking about and I left there because it's just impossible to get an appointment, with anyone, never mind who you'd like to see.

Galbin

RobFowl wrote: »

Time keeping is a huge problem in GP especially. I've worked in the UK and Ireland and in the UK they tend to run on time better.
That said they do this by limiting the number of problems dealt with to "one problem per appointment" so complex issues are effectively kicked to touch or else dealt with over a number of consultations.

I've lived in the UK and have taken part in various patient support groups, so feel I can speak to this. The service there is only good for people who have acute illness or physical problems like broken bones. People with chronic illnesses who want to try new and innovate solutions or work with their doctor on a regular basis have a very hard time. How can a doctor give proper service to a patient with say four or five conditions (autoimmune conditions for example) when they only have 10 mins? And yes, people get referred to consultant's but there is this weird thing there where GPs have to pay money for each patient they refer.

Galbin

ryanf1 wrote: »

If the Dutch system ever gets implemented, your time with your GP will be so short that it will only be one issue per consultation. The result of that will be more demand for appointments of course because it would be impossible to deal with patients who have more complex problems in that time.
It might be a cultural thing about being seen quickly but as a patient, its important to me that if I'm unwell I can see my Doctor maybe not the same day but definitely the next day. I think also that as a GP you are on the front line of patient care so ease of access is quite important.

I hope to God the Dutch system never gets implemented. A fully socialised medical system like theirs tend to result in much poorer patient care for those with chronic conditions. Again it is fine for people who only present with things like cold's, flu's or acute illnesses, but it creates huge problems for those with chronic conditions. It gets to a point where things like blood tests are rationed (I'm not kidding!) and where idiotic government inspectors who has *zero* medical qualifications try to tell doctors how to do their jobs.

There is a reason why many doctors in the IMO are against this plan.

Gael23

Galbin wrote: »

I hope to God the Dutch system never gets implemented. A fully socialised medical system like theirs tend to result in much poorer patient care for those with chronic conditions. Again it is fine for people who only present with things like cold's, flu's or acute illnesses, but it creates huge problems for those with chronic conditions. It gets to a point where things like blood tests are rationed (I'm not kidding!) and where idiotic government inspectors who has *zero* medical qualifications try to tell doctors how to do their jobs.

There is a reason why many doctors in the IMO are against this plan.

I agree, that will happen. Up to just over a year ago I was a person that only went to my GP 2/3 times a year when I was sick but not anymore. Now I go every 3 months as a matter of routine and more recently started having blood tests at that visit. If this comes in, my 3 monthly review and my bloods will end up being 2 separate visits. That will be an inconvenience to me but also taking up a second appointment with my Doctor

Dingle_berry

Galbin wrote: »

It gets to a point where things like blood tests are rationed (I'm not kidding!)

Off topic but could you elaborate on this? What's their rationale behind it and how is it operated?

Galbin

Dingle_berry wrote: »

Off topic but could you elaborate on this? What's their rationale behind it and how is it operated?

In the UK, each practice is only allowed to do a certain amount of blood tests per quarter/per annum. They actually have a quota. Doctors who "do too many blood tests" get a visit from the local inspector who tells them off for daring to practice medicine in a thorough fashion. This was told to me by a doctor acquaintance in the UK a few years back. Now perhaps times have changed but I doubt it. That story rings true, as I know that HMOs in the US ration blood tests in a similar way. When it comes to patient care, money is more important than optimum care in a socialised medicine system. Also, in my experience with chronic conditions, you get what you pay for.

I think we could vastly improve our health service by subsidising more GP visits and contributing more to people on minimum wage. However, fully socialised medicine systems rarely work. Germany seems to be the exception there, but that is because the government really doesn't interfere much with the doctor's actual medical care the way it does in other countries.

And if the private medical insurance companies pull out because of this plan, I may shoot myself. I've only ever had good care from private consultants and from my GP (again, whom I pay for), simply because they had the time to spend with me. Public medicine puts way too much time pressure on doctors IMO.

Galbin

I know this is anecdotal, but this is the type of thing that happens:

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/a2117970-To-think-giving-doctors-a-quota-of-ultrasound-scans-is-ridiculous