Castration question

morebabies

Quick question - Is it possible to castrate 6 wk old calves using rubber rings in the same way that lambs are castrated?

Thanks

Genghis Cant

morebabies wrote: »

Quick question - Is it possible to castrate 6 wk old calves using rubber rings in the same way that lambs are castrated?

Thanks

It is.

greysides

The question might also be... is it legal?



The Animal Health and Welfare Act 2013 has been commenced and came in to force on 6th March 2014.

C: Castration

Farmers (or Veterinary Practitioners/Nurses) may perform, without the use of anaesthesia or analgesia, castration of:
bulls up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 6 months of age by use of a burdizzo;
sheep up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 3 months of age by use of a burdizzo;
goats up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 2 months of age by sue of a burdizzo;
deer up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band;
pigs up to 8 days of age by a method that does not involve tearing of tissue;
Irrespective of the allowance not to use local anaesthesia, for animal welfare reasons use of local anaesthesia and appropriate analgesia should be encouraged by veterinary practitioners.
Outside of these allowances only a Veterinary Practitioner may castrate an animal, and must by law, use appropriate anaesthesia and analgesia “so as to prevent or relieve any pain during or arising from the operation or procedure”. The type and duration of anaesthesia or analgesia will depend on the technique being employed, amongst other considerations.

Greengrass1

Q for you grey sides.
I've about 6 bull calves kept this year. Father normally castrates them around July other yrs.
Is there a best age to castrate bulls at?

MayoSalmon

What other methods are possible for pig castration that do not involve cutting the skin??

Oldtree

greysides wrote: »

The question might also be... is it legal?



The Animal Health and Welfare Act 2013 has been commenced and came in to force on 6th March 2014.

C: Castration

Farmers (or Veterinary Practitioners/Nurses) may perform, without the use of anaesthesia or analgesia, castration of:
bulls up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 6 months of age by use of a burdizzo;
sheep up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 3 months of age by use of a burdizzo;
goats up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 2 months of age by sue of a burdizzo;
deer up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band;
pigs up to 8 days of age by a method that does not involve tearing of tissue;
Irrespective of the allowance not to use local anaesthesia, for animal welfare reasons use of local anaesthesia and appropriate analgesia should be encouraged by veterinary practitioners.
Outside of these allowances only a Veterinary Practitioner may castrate an animal, and must by law, use appropriate anaesthesia and analgesia “so as to prevent or relieve any pain during or arising from the operation or procedure”. The type and duration of anaesthesia or analgesia will depend on the technique being employed, amongst other considerations.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/2014/en/si/0107.html

Oldtree

MayoSalmon wrote: »

What other methods are possible for pig castration that do not involve cutting the skin??

I think the implication is that only a vet can carry out the castration:

http://www.alternativepig.eu/partnership/legislation.html

ganmo

MayoSalmon wrote: »

What other methods are possible for pig castration that do not involve cutting the skin??

I think I remember someone saying that there's a chemical castration availabe for pigs...I'll try and dig up something on it

EDIT: http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2010/jan/24/pork-chemical-castration-pfizer-improvac

http://www.improvac.co.nz/sites/improvac/en-NZ/Pages/betterwayforward.aspx

Oldtree

ganmo wrote: »

I think I remember someone saying that there's a chemical castration availabe for pigs...I'll try and dig up something on it

They appear to be moving in the direction of breeding out boar taint and plan to voluntarily end surgical castration of pigs in Europe by 1 January 2018. Thay may have had some success with vaccines (but with risks to the handler). There also appears to be concerns about chemical residues if chemical castration is used.

http://ec.europa.eu/food/animal/welfare/farm/initiatives_en.htm

http://boars2018.com/

http://boars2018.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Boars-on-the-way.herzien-11-2-2014.pdf

ganmo

In Ireland the normal practice isn't to castrate, just slaughter at a lighter weight(100kg) vs the continent's 120kg. Simple way of avoiding the welfare issue

mikeoh

Any tips on castrating weanlings......Ive started doing them myself this year for the first time and despite cheaking the cord was still in position when clamp closed I still seem to have missed a few .....they all swelled up so I taught I was ok but 1 or 2 starting to get full bags again ......do you have to hear that crunch each time?

J.O. Farmer

mikeoh wrote: »

Any tips on castrating weanlings......Ive started doing them myself this year for the first time and despite cheaking the cord was still in position when clamp closed I still seem to have missed a few .....they all swelled up so I taught I was ok but 1 or 2 starting to get full bags again ......do you have to hear that crunch each time?

I would like to hear the crunch every time. Is your burdizzo working right. It should cut a baling twine in a paper bag without damaging the bag. We had an old one that we were using one year. We couldn't hear the crunch so went and bought a new one (while the weanling was still in the crush). We heard the crunch with the new one and it also felt like it was closing more solidly.

moy83

J.O. Farmer wrote: »

I would like to hear the crunch every time. Is your burdizzo working right. It should cut a baling twine in a paper bag without damaging the bag. We had an old one that we were using one year. We couldn't hear the crunch so went and bought a new one (while the weanling was still in the crush). We heard the crunch with the new one and it also felt like it was closing more solidly.

Same here , the last couple of years we were having a few left with a nut working and we never had that trouble . So we got the vet to do a few the last day and I tried the two burdizzos closing . There was a massive difference in the vets and ours . Time for a new one or just get the vet .

mikeoh

moy83 wrote: »

Same here , the last couple of years we were having a few left with a nut working and we never had that trouble . So we got the vet to do a few the last day and I tried the two burdizzos closing . There was a massive difference in the vets and ours . Time for a new one or just get the vet .

Bought a brand new one for the job .....I might need practice!!......would ye advise doing him twice if you can't hear crunch the first time

Genghis Cant

mikeoh wrote: »

Bought a brand new one for the job .....I might need practice!!......would ye advise doing him twice if you can't hear crunch the first time

I always do them twice each side. Bang bang no hanging about, no counting to ten or any such thing.
Do you inject with antibiotic at castration?

mikeoh

Genghis Cant wrote: »

I always do them twice each side. Bang bang no hanging about, no counting to ten or any such thing.
Do you inject with antibiotic at castration?

5cc alamycin la each .......and a shot for myself !!

moy83

mikeoh wrote: »

Bought a brand new one for the job .....I might need practice!!......would ye advise doing him twice if you can't hear crunch the first time

The father is the squeezer here , he gives it a quick second close and he never had any done wrong ( bar one years ago when he caught his pee pee ) .
We got the ai man to do a few last year and he gave the burdizzo a small pull when it was clamped and no second squeeze . They sere fine too

munkus

mikeoh wrote: »

Bought a brand new one for the job .....I might need practice!!......would ye advise doing him twice if you can't hear crunch the first time

Doing it twice only involves opening it a crack and then closed again. Also, always give the ball a slight pull upwards when it's closed, just to be sure.

Green farmer

greysides wrote: »

The question might also be... is it legal?



The Animal Health and Welfare Act 2013 has been commenced and came in to force on 6th March 2014.

C: Castration


sheep up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 3 months of age by use of a burdizzo;



What does this mean to the store lamb trade next autumn ,Where margins can be waffer thin ?

J.O. Farmer

Green farmer wrote: »

greysides wrote: »

The question might also be... is it legal?



The Animal Health and Welfare Act 2013 has been commenced and came in to force on 6th March 2014.

C: Castration


sheep up to 8 days of age by use of a rubber band or up to 3 months of age by use of a burdizzo;



What does this mean to the store lamb trade next autumn ,Where margins can be waffer thin ?

Lambs will have to hav been castrated under 3 months (so before they're sold) or the buyer if he wants to comply with the law will have to pay a vet to do the job. That of course will cost a few quid and I don't know how many buyers will want to give it.

greysides

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Q for you grey sides.
I've about 6 bull calves kept this year. Father normally castrates them around July other yrs.
Is there a best age to castrate bulls at?

In the past a neighbour used to put on rubber rings in the second week once the calves were doing well before letting them off to grass with their mothers. The males performed well and were well-shaped. I could see no major difference between them and non-castrated males up to weaning when they were sold. They sold well.

So I've always liked that method.

For older calves I like them to be big enough for there to be something to squeeze i.e. not baby calves. Around weanling time seems a good time. Calves are strong physically, the procedure has less side-effects than when they are done later and it's easier restrain they at that size than later.

Using the Calicrate bander on older animals was a fad that seems to have passed in my area. I think there were complications with the procedure and with Tetanus.


One tip about Burdizzo's ............. don't store with the jaws clamped shut.... weakens the spring of the metal.

mikeoh

One tip about Burdizzo's ............. don't store with the jaws clamped shut.... weakens the spring of the metal.[/quote]

Just looked at the new burdizzo there is a little bit of daylight between the jaws when in closed position maybe a mm or 2 is that my problem or are they all like that

Base price

mikeoh wrote: »

One tip about Burdizzo's ............. don't store with the jaws clamped shut.... weakens the spring of the metal.

Just looked at the new burdizzo there is a little bit of daylight between the jaws when in closed position maybe a mm or 2 is that my problem or are they all like that[/QUOTE]

There should be no gap/daylight between the jaws when closed. We test ours by placing a piece of dry straw between two sheets of newspaper and clamping down on the straw - one clamp only. If the straw is cut clean then it is working.

mikeoh

It failed ur straw test .....wouldnt even catch the straw!!!!.... I took it back to coop shop and he said a lot of them faulty (ffs).....now my problem is where to get a good one for same money €125 and are any of my bulls squeezed ....

J.O. Farmer

mikeoh wrote: »

It failed ur straw test .....wouldnt even catch the straw!!!!.... I took it back to coop shop a he said a lot of them faulty (ffs).....now my problem is where to get a good one for same money €125 and are any of my bulls squeezed ....

The straw test is the same principle as my twine test. It replicates what you're doing with the bulls in a way you can see.
As you can probably see the bulls probably aren't done right. I would think that the safest thing is to assume they aren't done right.
€125 should get you one just make sure it closes fully and you should be able to test before you buy (with straw not bulls).