Garden Fence and Neighbours

mc81 · 07-05-2014 2:45pm #1

Need some advice!

I share back yard fence with neighbours, i have recently had to put another fence up to protect my children as neighbours children have put nails into it and mine was nearly impalled in them. that so far has been fine. My problem is that we also shared front gardens with a tree separating them. my neighbour dug most off their away and what was left we were cutting and keeping tidy. their kids started leaving their bikes/rubbish etc in our garden and treating it like their own so we decided to fence it off. we fenced down the centre but on our side of the tree leaving them with the tree. i have maintained the fence and painted it etc, and the side off it is looking into neighbours garden. i came home last week to find neighbours had 'nailed' flower boxes onto our fence.

I am very annoyed about this and we spent alot of money on this and technically it is in our garden. i want to approach neighbour but afraid to cause agro but i think this is why they are getting away with doing things like this is because we dont argue etc...

can anyone advise how i should approach this and am i right in thinking i am completely in the right here?

GoodLord · 07-05-2014 3:22pm

mc81 wrote: »

Need some advice!

I share back yard fence with neighbours, i have recently had to put another fence up to protect my children as neighbours children have put nails into it and mine was nearly impalled in them. that so far has been fine. My problem is that we also shared front gardens with a tree separating them. my neighbour dug most off their away and what was left we were cutting and keeping tidy. their kids started leaving their bikes/rubbish etc in our garden and treating it like their own so we decided to fence it off. we fenced down the centre but on our side of the tree leaving them with the tree. i have maintained the fence and painted it etc, and the side off it is looking into neighbours garden. i came home last week to find neighbours had 'nailed' flower boxes onto our fence.

I am very annoyed about this and we spent alot of money on this and technically it is in our garden. i want to approach neighbour but afraid to cause agro but i think this is why they are getting away with doing things like this is because we dont argue etc...

can anyone advise how i should approach this and am i right in thinking i am completely in the right here?

My understanding, and that is all it is, is as the fence is yours at your side of the divide they cannot interfere with it

seagull · 08-05-2014 12:02pm

You might have an issue in the future that you have effectively ceded the land on their side of the fence. How far on your side of the divide is it?

JOSman · 08-05-2014 12:06pm

Wow, what selfish neighbours. Glad I don't live beside them.

Backside · 15-05-2014 12:50pm

Property damage, have them remove it, different if it was 50/50 on the border

Exo · 15-05-2014 1:01pm

Consulting with the neighbours prior would have solved the problem before it actually happened. In my opinion, in regards to the front garden, there is one divider and should be placed along the centre of the two gardens. You brought it upon yourself to divide the gardens, however, you have essentially divided your own land - meaning the other side of the fence should be theirs to use. How about uprooting the fence and placing it along the centre divider of the garden (finding a workaround with the tree)?

I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective.

Backside · 15-05-2014 1:06pm

Exo wrote: »

you have essentially divided your own land - meaning the other side of the fence should be theirs to use..

So if I put a fence in the middle of my garden my neighbour can use the other side as they please?

I dont think so.

OP did right and put it on thier own land instead of the divide, that way the neighbour has no say in what happens to it.

Pat Mustard · 15-05-2014 1:10pm

mc81 wrote: »

I am very annoyed about this and we spent alot of money on this and technically it is in our garden. i want to approach neighbour but afraid to cause agro but i think this is why they are getting away with doing things like this is because we dont argue etc...

can anyone advise how i should approach this and am i right in thinking i am completely in the right here?

What you should do is go and and talk to them. You have to explain that the boundary fence is actually on your property and that the flower boxes have to come down.

If that causes upset, it will be your neighbours' fault, not yours.

You have to defend your property. There isn't really a choice in the matter.

Exo · 15-05-2014 1:11pm

Backside wrote: »

So if I put a fence in the middle of my garden my neighbour can use the other side as they please?

I dont think so.

OP did right and put it on thier own land instead of the divide, that way the neighbour has no say in what happens to it.

Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens.

Backside · 15-05-2014 1:13pm

Exo wrote: »

Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens.

Not everyone is you though. I am sure you would make a fine neighbour. Some people just like to take liberties.

GoodLord · 17-05-2014 2:03pm

Exo wrote: »

, however, you have essentially divided your own land - meaning the other side of the fence should be theirs to use. .

wrong

Exo · 17-05-2014 2:05pm

GoodLord wrote: »

wrong

Right..

17-05-2014 7:40pm

Exo wrote: »

Right..

Ok, so could you point to any statutory provision or case law that backs up your assertion. Because you are wrong. As another poster noted, if you build a fence 1m back from the boundary you don't just cede that land to your neighbour.

Exo · 17-05-2014 9:55pm

234 wrote: »

Ok, so could you point to any statutory provision or case law that backs up your assertion. Because you are wrong. As another poster noted, if you build a fence 1m back from the boundary you don't just cede that land to your neighbour.

"I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective."

"Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens."

Reading the previous posts wouldn't have killed you.

GoodLord · 17-05-2014 10:02pm

Exo wrote: »

"I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective."

"Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens."

Reading the previous posts wouldn't have killed you.

ethical perspective won't be much good in a legal dispute.

Exo · 17-05-2014 10:08pm

GoodLord wrote: »

ethical perspective won't be much good in a legal dispute.

.. over a garden fence. How civilised.

GoodLord · 17-05-2014 10:13pm

Exo wrote: »

.. over a garden fence. How civilised.

this is legal discussion... in case you have not noticed

Exo · 17-05-2014 10:24pm

GoodLord wrote: »

this is legal discussion... in case you have not noticed

Sub-forum, yes. Thread suggests otherwise. It's more of an issue approaching the neighbours to discuss the problem, than anything else.

Backside · 21-05-2014 2:03pm

Exo wrote: »

"
"Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens."

Just for clarification I was referring to the middle of the garden and not the devide

Backside · 21-05-2014 2:04pm

Exo wrote: »

"I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective."

"Middle, as in the centre divider between the two plots of land. Again, consultation prior wouldn't have gone astray. I'd even gladly share the costs of the fencing if my neighbour came to me with the intention of fencing off the front gardens."

Reading the previous posts wouldn't have killed you.

Just for clarification in my previous post I was referring to the middle of the garden , not the devide

DuckSlice · 27-05-2014 12:06am

Exo wrote: »

Consulting with the neighbours prior would have solved the problem before it actually happened. In my opinion, in regards to the front garden, there is one divider and should be placed along the centre of the two gardens. You brought it upon yourself to divide the gardens, however, you have essentially divided your own land - meaning the other side of the fence should be theirs to use. How about uprooting the fence and placing it along the centre divider of the garden (finding a workaround with the tree)?

I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective.

Yes he has divided his own land but he has every right to do this if he wants. I don't see your logic in this to be honest.

GoodLord · 27-05-2014 8:39am

etxp wrote: »

Yes he has divided his own land but he has every right to do this if he wants. I don't see your logic in this to be honest.

exo remarks are not logical

Exo · 27-05-2014 8:46am

Sound lads - read previous posts.

DuckSlice · 27-05-2014 9:40am

Exo wrote: »

Sound lads - read previous posts.

I have. Let me give you an example on a bigger scale. 2 neighbouring houses in the country side. Have 2 massive gardens. About 3 acres each. Neighbour A puts a fence 3 metres inside the border of the 2 gardens. Now using your logic neighbour B owns the other side of that fence. And can do what ever he wants with it but it's still on Neighbour A's land. Where as he actually has no right to that fence at all. Do you see how stupid your logic is now?

GoodLord · 27-05-2014 9:53am

etxp wrote: »

I have. Let me give you an example on a bigger scale. 2 neighbouring houses in the country side. Have 2 massive gardens. About 3 acres each. Neighbour A puts a fence 3 metres inside the border of the 2 gardens. Now using your logic neighbour B owns the other side of that fence. And can do what ever he wants with it but it's still on Neighbour A's land. Where as he actually has no right to that fence at all. Do you see how stupid your logic is now?

I f you follow exo 'logic' then if you put a fence in the middle of your land and put your car at the neighbours side in your land the car is your neighbours

ozmo · 27-05-2014 10:51am

If there is no clear marked boundary - and you put up a fence that close - I would have thought that was accepting those were the new boundaries and you have given the neighbour the strip of land and the tree.

In Uk and usa is called adverse possession if they put up the fence there - you appear to have done this but in reverse. http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-adverse-possession.htm

I would say you would need some clear marker - slabs or stone path or something to mark the land as yours - otherwise how is anyone to know? The maps are usually not very accurate. How would you feel if they removed the tree now?

I would remove or move the fence pronto if its in the wrong place or giving them the impression they now own the land.

27-05-2014 11:02am

ozmo wrote: »

If there is no clear marked boundary - and you put up a fence that close - I would have thought that was accepting those were the new boundaries and you have given the neighbour the strip of land and the tree.

In Uk and usa is called adverse possession if they put up the fence there - you appear to have done this but in reverse. http://www.wisegeek.org/what-is-adverse-possession.htm

I would say you would need some clear marker - slabs or stone path or something to mark the land as yours - otherwise how is anyone to know? The maps are usually not very accurate. How would you feel if they removed the tree now?

I would remove or move the fence pronto if its in the wrong place or giving them the impression they now own the land.

Ireland has AP too. And in the example given there would be no AP either here or in the UK.

Exo · 27-05-2014 11:09am

I never said it was a logical statement - "I'm not sure if there are regulations about this, but I'm looking at it from an ethical perspective.". Null and void.

ozmo · 27-05-2014 11:33am

234 wrote: »

Ireland has AP too. And in the example given there would be no AP either here or in the UK.

Good to know if this is true, but why you think not in this case? There is a clear boundary fence now when there wasn't.

lot of unnecessary bad feelings eitherway.

A simple second wire fence - something to mark the boundary clearly might be useful in order for clarity - but its has to last many years.

If you sold the house you would have a hard time convincing a buyer that land not marked off is yours to sell.

Also- nails coming through the fence could have been cut flush on your side using a dremmil/saw/file/hammer - or removed quietly if its only kids messing - much cheaper option than a whole new fence.

27-05-2014 12:06pm

ozmo wrote: »

Good to know if this is true, but why you think not in this case? There is a clear boundary fence now when there wasn't.

lot of unnecessary bad feelings eitherway.

A simple second wire fence - something to mark the boundary clearly might be useful in order for clarity - but its has to last many years.

If you sold the house you would have a hard time convincing a buyer that land not marked off is yours to sell.

Also- nails coming through the fence could have been cut flush on your side using a dremmil/saw/file/hammer - or removed quietly if its only kids messing - much cheaper option than a whole new fence.

AP requires that you actually go into possession to the exclusion of all others and demonstrate a clear intention to possess. The landowner can't just cede land to his neighbour, the neighbour has to take some positive action and continue it, to the exclusion of all others, for 12 years.

ozmo · 27-05-2014 1:32pm

234 wrote: »

the neighbour has to take some positive action and continue it, to the exclusion of all others, for 12 years.

Sounds right and fair -

But would that not include planting flowers and hanging flower boxes ... as in this case?

and kids playing on it - neighbour mowing it for next 12 years... would that not be classed as this positive action?

Just guessing now - we are probably talking maybe of a strip probably 15cm to 20cm wide (half the width of a tree) now probably ??

I can understand the neighbour thinking (incorrectly or whatever) his side of the fence is his - he probably got the stakes/pillars side as well and wanted to improve how it looked.

27-05-2014 2:22pm

ozmo wrote: »

Sounds right and fair -

But would that not include planting flowers and hanging flower boxes ... as in this case?

and kids playing on it - neighbour mowing it for next 12 years... would that not be classed as this positive action?

Just guessing now - we are probably talking maybe of a strip probably 15cm to 20cm wide (half the width of a tree) now probably ??

I can understand the neighbour thinking (incorrectly or whatever) his side of the fence is his - he probably got the stakes/pillars side as well and wanted to improve how it looked.

Ultimately questions of possession are very fact sensitive and are resolved on a case by case basis. What is considered to indicate exclusive possession in once case may not be sufficient in another. In my opinion the odd flower box, having your kids running around on it and mowing the grass don't really scream "This land is mine and mine alone" to me. Building on the land would definitely be enough. Using it for commercial purposes would probably be. But there are a whole host of reasons why you might mow a lawn that wasn't your own. For example. I might cut the side of my neighbour's hedge as if fronts onto my property, if the boundary was six inches past the hedge on my side this wouldn't be indicative of possession.

Garden Fence and Neighbours

Comments