UK uses ugly stick on long term unemployed

Kermit.de.frog

Unemployed forced to sign on every day


I see the merits on the work shy.

However seems a bit humiliating for those who are on tough times not for lack of their own effort.

What do ye reckon?

Xios

Like with everything else.

It depends.

NipNip

That would be an awful pain in the rear end. What happens if you've to go somewhere and can't sign?

Hande hoche!

Wonder what the effects are on administration costs?

bumper234

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Unemployed forced to sign on every day


I see the merits on the work shy.

However seems a bit humiliating for those who are on tough times not for lack of their own effort.

What do ye reckon?

Brilliant idea that should be bought in here too.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater

I don't see anything wrong with it if they're genuinely unemployed, as long as they're within a reasonable distance of their local Job Centre. I don't know why people see it as humiliating. If my mate sees me in the Dole office every day, that means he's there too.

aidan24326

Don't see what that's going to achieve really.

kneemos

Bus fares to the Jobcentre every day?

Bubbaclaus

Good idea

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Hande hoche! wrote: »

Wonder what the effects are on administration costs?

They could well see it as a money saving exercise as you're never going to get 100% of people to sign on every single day.

Super-Rush

Whoop another dole thread.

Great way to start the week.

TimeToShine

"Mass emigration is expected as a result"

jester77

Why not, gives you a reason to get up in the morning plus you can stop by the offie on the way home.

Alf. A. Male

Hande hoche! wrote: »

Wonder what the effects are on administration costs?

I'm guessing they anticipate savings as it'll lead to a number of fraudulent and absentee claims being closed.

Bubbaclaus

600,000 available jobs in the UK yet people still sit at home on their arses collecting the dole. Unbelievable.

The same problem here in Ireland. The sooner this bring this in here the quicker all these available jobs will be filled.

doolox

Amid overworked officials and job placement people will lead to riots eventually.

Many places in Britain are unemployment blackspots but the job-rich areas suffer from high living costs for beginner workers, high rental and commuter costs.

The govt need to move on these barriers so that people will move from the job starved areas to the job rich areas.

Maphisto

Iain Duncan Smith really is a warm cuddly guy.

Tasden

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

600,000 available jobs in the UK yet people still sit at home on their arses collecting the dole. Unbelievable.

The same problem here in Ireland. The sooner this bring this in here the quicker all these available jobs will be filled.

Yeah because you can just stroll in off the street and take up these "available" jobs regardless of your experience/ qualifications.

the_syco

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

600,000 available jobs in the UK yet people still sit at home on their arses collecting the dole. Unbelievable.

The same problem here in Ireland. The sooner this bring this in here the quicker all these available jobs will be filled.

Requirement; PHD and 5 years work experience needed.

Explain how a student can fill this post, will ya? A fecking load of jobs ask for similar requirements

The Diabolical Monocle

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

600,000 available jobs in the UK yet people still sit at home on their arses collecting the dole. Unbelievable.

The same problem here in Ireland. The sooner this bring this in here the quicker all these available jobs will be filled.

Not unless theres more on offer than C++ programmer with 20 years experience or care assistant.

uck51js9zml2yt

Tasden wrote: »

Yeah because you can just stroll in off the street and take up these "available" jobs regardless of your experience/ qualifications.

Don't forget all those It jobs we keep hearing about that conveniently forget to say you need to be fluent in a second language

Maphisto

the_syco wrote: »

Requirement; PHD and 5 years work experience needed.

Explain how a student can fill this post, will ya? A fecking load of jobs ask for similar requirements

Totally agree - even kitchen porter jobs want at least 2 years experience.

whats newxt

I reckon they should provide everyone with a basic income and get it over with.

Collie D

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

600,000 available jobs in the UK yet people still sit at home on their arses collecting the dole. Unbelievable.

The same problem here in Ireland. The sooner this bring this in here the quicker all these available jobs will be filled.

Thanks. You had me worried that we'd get to the end of the first page before somebody spoke sh*te in a thread about unemployment

bumper234

whats newxt wrote: »

I reckon they should provide everyone with a basic income and get it over with.

They already do this, It's called the dole.

suicide_circus

If this was targeted at people on the dole 4/5+ years I would see the point

irishejit

A return bus fare from my home town to the nearest Job Centre would equate to around £4 a day. Take that £20 a week out of the weekly benefit which is about £60 I think and its plain to see there's not a pile left.

Even if there was a scheme put into place where this money could be claimed back I can still see major problems for people whilst waiting to get this back.

jon1981

Again tarring all with one big brush!! I'm not an advocate of people choosing long term employment as a vocation by any means, however a degree of common sense is needed here.

what's the cost of all this? Dole queues i hear can be huge, so effectively you're asking people to stand in a queue every day?

boombang

If you have a job you have to get up and turn up every day.

While I see downsides, including unnecessary travel costs, I think this is a good thing. I'd have a system whereby everybody would have to sign on before 10am and pass a breathalyser test.

bumper234

jon1981 wrote: »

Again tarring all with one big brush!! I'm not an advocate of people choosing long term employment as a vocation by any means, however a degree of common sense is needed here.

what's the cost of all this? Dole queues i hear can be huge, so effectively you're asking people to stand in a queue every day?

It does state "long term unemployed" Now weather they mean 1 year 5 years or 10 years is another thing. It would also stop those who are working and claiming at the same time.

mikom

whats newxt wrote: »

I reckon they should provide everyone with a basic income and get it over with.

Looking that way..........

Almost half of all jobs could be automated by computers within two decades and "no government is prepared" for the tsunami of social change that will follow, according to the Economist.

That report too pointed out the change will affect jobs of all kinds - from a Chinese factory Hon Hai which has announced plans to replace 500,000 workers with robots in three years, to lawyers, surgeons and public sector workers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/01/17/rise-of-the-machines-economist_n_4616931.html?just_reloaded=1

Graces7

i hear what the charities are saying re voluntary work but they are missing the point. they would be helping the unemployed.

could use a volunteer here a few hours now and then to do the work i am not able for. eg digging.

we should here bring back national service.

irishejit

jon1981 wrote: »

Dole queues i hear can be huge, so effectively you're asking people to stand in a queue every day?

Good point...there are that many claimants dole offices have been offering people the chance to sign on once a month instead of every 2 weeks for a number of years because they couldn't cope with the volumes of people!!

Not very clear thinking going on here at all!!

doolox

While there is huge demand for it here in Ireland and in the UK there is not the money to go into it and keep up with the demand. Forcing people into the job without a vocation or desire to do the work will result in sloppy standards or at worst, victimisation of the people under care by disgruntled workers in their new enforced positions. This will lead to a need fro more supervision and increased costs and undermine the intentions of the scheme. Perhaps there is a need to sort out the unemplyable from the potentially employable and concentrate on the people where there is a realistic hope of a return on the givts investment of time and effort.

dpofloinn

Before every one gets carried away it applies to approx 200,000 people who have been out of work 3 years or more. This strikes me a genuine attempt to rid the system of the career welfare claimants and the fraudulant. Now having said that if the figures are to belived that there are 600,000 job vacancies and a total of 6million unemployed in the UK then that means there are 10 people for every job, not great odds really for getting a job.

The next question is how many of these supposed 600,000 jobs are genuine jobs? How many are 0 hour contracts? How many are internships?. Alot would be my guess by the fact that as an alternative to signing on everyday the claimant can do 6 months voluntary service. Surely if work was as readily available then there would be no need to have voluntary service.

And for those who say ''we should do that in Ireland'' you can relax safe in the knowledge that we will have it here before too long, just as soon as the UK realise that it doesnt work our government will implement a similar but more expensive and equally disasterous system, becuase as we all know career claimants will always find a way to beat the system.

Maphisto

irishejit wrote: »

Good point...there are that many claimants dole offices have been offering people the chance to sign on once a month instead of every 2 weeks for a number of years because they couldn't cope with the volumes of people!!

Not very clear thinking going on here at all!!

Maybe they'll take on extra staff at the dole, thus reducing unemployment. :cool:

Boombastic

boombang wrote: »

If you have a job you have to get up and turn up every day.

While I see downsides, including unnecessary travel costs, I think this is a good thing. I'd have a system whereby everybody would have to sign on before 10am and pass a breathalyser test.

before 10am, is that because the offies open at 10?

padd b1975

whats newxt wrote: »

I reckon they should provide everyone with a basic income and get it over with.

They already do:rolleyes:

wes

A stupid idea solely designed to kick people, when there down. I am amazed that there are people who think this is a good idea. All, it will do is create unnecessary extra work and cost, for the sole purpose of punishing those down on there luck.

bumper234

wes wrote: »

A stupid idea solely designed to kick people, when there down. I am amazed that there are people who think this is a good idea. All, it will do is create unnecessary extra work and cost, for the sole purpose of punishing those down on there luck.

You mean the people who have never ever worked a day in their life and who are not only happy to be on the dole for many years but SNEER at those who go out to work.

Maphisto

bumper234 wrote: »

You mean the people who have never ever worked a day in their life and who are not only happy to be on the dole for many years but SNEER at those who go out to work.

Of course you can back that up with evidence.

The rule apparently only applies to people out of work 3 years or more. In that case maybe it's ok when the alternative is more training courses, if you're out for 3 years you might need some up to date skills courses.
Skeptical as usual though - read a thing by someone on the dole who couldn't make their sign on time due to an interview, informed the offices in time and made alternative arrangements, got docked anyway. For going to a job interview

WilyCoyote

Mack Squeaking Teen wrote: »

Don't forget all those It jobs we keep hearing about that conveniently forget to say you need to be fluent in a second language

Cockney slang, Mockney or Estuary English? Shurely shomefing wrong!

Bubbaclaus

the_syco wrote: »

Requirement; PHD and 5 years work experience needed.

Explain how a student can fill this post, will ya? A fecking load of jobs ask for similar requirements

There are currently 3,000 unfilled low level jobs in the hotel industry in Ireland.

wes

bumper234 wrote: »

You mean the people who have never ever worked a day in their life and who are not only happy to be on the dole for many years but SNEER at those who go out to work.

Ah, so that all of them, right? Its not like the economy hasn't tanked, and that there aren't plenty of people who haven't been able to get a job for the last 3 years (anyone over 3 years on the dole are to be punished), who before the most recent economic troubles have worked for years before it?

So everyone should be punished due to a minority who are taking advantage.

There are plenty of people who due to various reasons have been unlucky enough to be unemployed for more than 3 years. This sort of sweeping nonsense sole purpose exist to be seen to be doing something against something that probably doesn't exist to the extent that some people imagine it to be.

Also, there is the added administration cost to implementing such a system, but sure money is no object to have a go at the unemployed.

It is nothing short of amazing at how brave Governments and various people who support this nonsense, are when it comes to having a go at people least able to defend themselves.

osarusan

bumper234 wrote: »

You mean the people who have never ever worked a day in their life and who are not only happy to be on the dole for many years but SNEER at those who go out to work.

Would this system identify those people and make only them sign on every day?

bumper234

Maphisto wrote: »

Of course you can back that up with evidence.

Ah the evidence post.

Personally know 2 people same age as me went to school with them and they have been on the dole since they left school (1987) But that's not evidence right :rolleyes:

whats newxt

bumper234 wrote: »

They already do this, It's called the dole.

A basic income is provided to everyone working or not. they did a study in Canada which has a generous welfare system similar to our own and they shown that the removal of the administrative costs of the current welfare systems would allow for a basic income of $7800 p/a without tax increases.

bumper234

osarusan wrote: »

Would this system identify those people and make only them sign on every day?

I don't know that's something you would have to ask the people who are implementing these measures.

Bubbaclaus

bumper234 wrote: »

You mean the people who have never ever worked a day in their life and who are not only happy to be on the dole for many years but SNEER at those who go out to work.

A friend of mine does that. Spends his week arsing around the place. He once asked me why do I bother going to work "just go on the dole lad"

mikom

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

A friend of mine does that. Spends his week arsing around the place. He once asked me why do I bother going to work "just go on the dole lad"

What was your reply to your "friend"?