Spitfire Total Rebuild!

Darraghmh91.

The car is really takin good shape its actully starting to look like a car now which is id imagine a good morale boost for you
Again as iv said in previous posts super work man fair play
Your doing it slow but correct which is the best way in the end .. this will be a car to hand down to the kids in the future

SpitfireIV

Darraghmh91. wrote: »

The car is really takin good shape its actully starting to look like a car now which is id imagine a good morale boost for you
Again as iv said in previous posts super work man fair play
Your doing it slow but correct which is the best way in the end .. this will be a car to hand down to the kids in the future

Takin' my time alright, between work and other commitments I dont get to put a whole lot of time in, but, I'm in no rush, getting it done right as you say, cheers!


Well, I've been tipping away at it over the past little while. The biggest job tackled wasnt even on the car, it was the poly tunnel which you may remember failed and collapsed on me during some strong winds several weeks back!!

Thats been sorted like so....


^ From this.



^ To this.....


^ And finally this. I reformed the old metal loops and slipped them into some inch and a quarter poly pipe. Drove scaffold pipes into the ground and slipped the ends of the plastic tubes into these. Braced the loops with the reused metal tubing, tec-screwed on galvanise sheeting before reapplying the poly cover; pulling tight and fixing to the galvanise with lats.

It shant be going anywhere for a while and feels substancially stronger than the previous 'thing'. Next step is to lay down a layer of pallets on the ground and timber sheeting on top, should suffice as a spray booth then.




So, back to the car. Little jobs like these needed attention....


^ A previous door repair by myself that I hadnt cleaned up yet, but, there was no point as the curve didnt really match the wing. So, chop it out and try again!



^ New section with plenty of meat on it chopped, bent and ready to be fitted.



^ Tacked in and the excess chopped, ready to be folded over.



^ Another bit of attention should see her right, but, looking much better already!



Removed the bottom brace from both doors (finally) and discover a patch of rust on the lower A post that was unsettling me, so, decided to tackle it.


^ Bad stuff cut away and next the area was to be cleaned down with a wire brush before....



^....a new patch was beat into shape and applied. Took a bloody long time to get right. Seems its always the small fiddly jobs that are the most time consuming, there was a similar, but smaller repair to do on the driver side also. But, I'm happy I got it done and done right!



^ With the repairs done the inside was rust primed then I lashed tec-7 into the seams; very hard to access and get your fingers through the small window, hence the mess :rolleyes:

SpitfireIV

Then onto very important issues indeed.


Styling and color choice! :cool:


As you may remember I modified the rear end of the car; different lights, dropped the number plate lower and split the bumper, well, these came in the post last week (as well as a complete poly bush kit).....



^ As seen on Heralds, TR3's, 4's, Spit 1,2 and 3's etc but never on a 70's MkIV, until now.....


^ I think they look good! :cool:


Now, color! Big decision to be made. Its getting near the stage where color will be introduced. The underside is ready to be stonechipped and top coated, as well as the interior. I need to get cracking on the chassis too, that will be body color, so, once thats painted and reassembled, the tub can be dropped on and then its onwards and upwards from there.

The original color of the car was no 66 'Valencia Blue', a very rare color for a MkIV, been used only between 1968 - '71 (mine is a 71). Thats quite cool thats its rare and unique, but, its kind of a 'marmite color', you either love it or loathe it, unfortunately I tend to bounce back and forth between the two.


^ GT6 Mk3 in valencia. Not so bad eh?! I also plan on doing the rear light panel in black like this to help the lights and lettering stand out that bit more.

TR3 in Valencia.


My car is a blank canvas, original color would be nice and certainly period, even if this green blue is very 60's! I could be justified in claining that theres even mish mash of parts gone into the car and new panels that there's very little of the original car body left! So, with all this in mind and hundreds, thousands, hell, even hundreds of thousands of color shades to choose from, I chose..............

































Color no66, Valencia Blue! :pac::pac:


^ Sample cut from a section of scrap car.


Valencia it is, love it or hate it. So the plan is to hit Vinny Byrnes in Dublin later in the week and pick up everything I need in one fowl swoop. The paint code is availible in 2pak, but I'm gonna go down the cellulose route as an ameteur, so, hopefully armed with a few samples I should be able to get a match in paint, as well as primer, thinners, spray gun, mask, panel wipe, measuring cups, filters, tape etc etc etc.......

dball

I like the colour - good choice

Falcon L

+1 on the colour. Period colours are always best, in my opinion.

Matt black on the back panel is also period. I used to do it on my cars at the time.

kev1.3s

+1 on the colour, as you said there is 100's of thousands of colour choices and if you were to overthink it but that colour is nice and even tho you say it's an original colour it looks quite different.

SpitfireIV

Cheers guys!


I'd like to say I was flying along but unfortunatly I had a bit of a set back, nothing major, but still, a bit of a headache; my own rookie mistake.


Anyway, so, like I may have mentioned the plan was to treat the underside of the car with UPOL Gravitex; a stonechip protective layer. Back in early Jan I had stripped back the underside of the crud and junk, de-rusted with Bilt Hamber Deox Gel and after this applied Hydrate 80 (a chemical rust convertor and barrier......supposedly, I'll get back to that.)

Over this I applied two coats of an oil based rust primer 'Lowe', seam sealing between the two coats. So, fast forward to last week and I'm prepping to apply the stonechip, scuffed up the paint, cleaned and wiped it down, on with the schultz gun and away I go, getting a nice lite coating on, let it flash off, about 20/30 mins and went on with another coat. Went on grand and the underside was looking really well.

But then, a little while later little wrinkles appears which soon turned to blisters which soon after was a mess, so much so I could peel off the stonechip and the Lowe rust primer as one, back to the black layer of Hydrate 80!!

Rookie mistake: Oil based paint and a cellulose, solvent heavy stonechip just dont get along! Valuable lesson learned. Had to get as much of the soggy, solventy mush off before it set again; dishearening!




So, off it all had to come, the black layer of Hydrate 80 and all!! Which, to be dissapointment seemed to have very light areas of fresh orage rust under it in patches!! This stuff is supposed to kill, convert and prevent rust, but I was seeing evidence of fresh stuff under it after only a few months!!! Even after the underside was treated with rust remover and wirebrushing, hmmm.




So, next plan of action is to hit the underside, after its cleaned back to bare metal once more, with a layer of epoxy primer, seam sealing will be done with tiger seal and then another shot at the gravitex. Epoxy primer is supposed to be the ideal rust barrier and as it sets harder than the stonechip there shouldnt be any issues.


However, next problem, if you remember a few posts back, the inside was treated in a similar method to the underside! Problem perhaps? It was either a case of try and put a barrier over the oil based primer or strip it all back once more and strart from scratch; I choose the former....


So, took a trip to Vinny Byrnes in Dublin and picked up my supplies including 5lts of Valencia Blue



Also picked up the epoxy primer for the underside and barcoat for the interior. Thinners, panel wipe, high build 1k primer and LVLP spray gun and some other bits a bobs.


The set back at any other time would truely have been a killer, but the fact that I have all the paint material is a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel. Sure, it'll be a paint stripping the underside back, but, it has to be done and done right this time round!!

Falcon L

Probably a blessing in disguise. If the rust was returning and you didn't know it was there, well... At least you found out there was a problem before it turned up as rust holes! :eek:

Darraghmh91.

That was a bit of a bummer man but atleast it happened now instead of when the car was all put back as 1 piece
Great work tho and a lesson you won't make again you were rightists strip it all down and do it all again itl all pay off in the end
I'd love to see this car some time it's a very enjoyable build

sogood

Thanks for the heads up on the paint issue. I have been reading a bit lately about spray painting/pepping etc. and came across a similar point, regarding the use of different types of paint/primers and their different chemical structures. It has also been pointed out that using "matching" materials, but from different manufacturers can also lead to similar consequences.

Thanks again for the post and enjoying your work.

SpitfireIV

Wow, been a while since I posted. I'd love to say I've been so busy doing work on the car and that I'm well advanced in the project but, thats not the case! :cool:

Still though, getting a few bits done, like so:



^ Underside is cleaned back to bare shiney metal after my little disaster as highlighted in my post above.



^ Bit of a final sanding and she'll be ready for treating again. The plan is to apply a 2k epoxy primer, then seam seal with Tiger Seal, over this will go the stonechip and finally the base coat.




Then it was time to give the bootlid some love:


^ Rust along the seam and lower edge of the lid.


^ Holes through the skin in the upper left corner. All in all its not the worst bootlid ever, certainly better than the original which was rotten through!

Bit of work is needed.....


^ The bad stuff being cut and peeled away.



^ Newly exposed metal cleaned up and ready to be rust primed.



^ Replacement section cut and folded. The slits down the side are to allow it to be subtly bent to the curve of the bootlid.



^ Tacked in place.



^ Paint removed and rust spots treated with rust remover before being wrapped up in cling film to allow it to do its magic.



^ New section seam welded and ground down. There is a rather low section in the upper left corner and other nicks and knocks as indicated by the black marks. Its gonna take a bit of work still to bet it straight and presentable!

SpitfireIV

After that it was back to the poly-tunnel...



^ Barrier laid out and then....



^....pallets laid on top. Plan is to eventually get some sheeting, light stuff would do, 1/4 inch ply or whatever and lay it on top of the pallets.




^ All the junk back in! The chassis pictured I had planned on using, it seemed a good clean one that I assumed had been well prepared and painted and just needed a scuff up before being reprimed/painted in my valencia color, but, on closer inspection I found this.......



^ A. rust was coming through in places and with a bit of a scrape found that the paint was applied directly over the metal, no primer was used! Bugger.

Still, like I said, on closer inspection it wasnt as clean as I thought, the paint job was a bit shoddy. I removed the gearbox mounting plate and found it was left in place when the chassis was being painted and there was a layer of dirt, grit and tiny bits of broken glass under it!!

So, how can this problem be fixed? One thing is for certain, I'd have to avail of a sandblasters services.

But that leaves me with two options:

1. Sandblast this orange chassis, use it and sell off the original, not so pretty, in need of cleaning up chassis.

or

2. Sandblast the original chassis which is remarkably sound and use that, put the orange one back together and sell that on. After all, it is a bit more presentable, if not useable in its current state.


I'm gonna go with option 2!


So, the old, original chassis that I had used to rebuild the body tub on was hauled out for inspection and repair. There was just one bit of work needed doing, under one of the outriggers some rust had broke through.



^ Bad stuff cut away which involved cutting through the outrigger and the chassis rail.



^ Patch applied to the chassis rail and the weld flattened. Next another patch would be applied on top for the outrigger.


And that folks, is me up to date!

biketard

Loving this thread, CroppyBoy1798. Thanks for posting it.

SpitfireIV

biketard wrote: »

Loving this thread, CroppyBoy1798. Thanks for posting it.

Cheers biketard, glad youre enjoying it


Not much else happening since, was at the Durrow show and picked up a set of stainless trim/vanity rings for the wheels.

I've had the tires knocked off the rims ready to be sandblasted so curiosity got the better of me; rooted out some old black gloss and slapped some on one of the wheels (dont worry, its not the final product, they'll be blasted and sprayed)







Think I'm gonna go with black. The rear light panel I plan to so black with the chrome trim, so I thought it'd tie in nice with the wheels which will be black with chrome trim.

We'll see :cool:

SpitfireIV

Bit more progress to report!


After what seemed like an exhausting eternity scraping, cleaning and sanding the underside back to bare metal after my little....mishap(?) I finally got to apply the epoxy primer, two coats of.





^ Shiney underside. For the finale it was roughed up with 80 grit real well, cleaned, wiped down and then the 2K epoxy primer came out.








^ Looking all clean and fresh!! Delighted


Working within a tight timeframe now as I want to get the successive layers on without the particular time windows. So next it'll be seam sealed and then time to try the gravitex stonechip once more *fingers crossed* and hopefully by the weekend I might even get the color on the underside!

kev1.3s

Looks pretty good, can't wait to see some colour.

SpitfireIV

kev1.3s wrote: »

Looks pretty good, can't wait to see some colour.

You and me both! Cheers.


Well, she's all wrapped up now, after being seam sealed yesterday evening. With any luck I'll get the stonechip on later today. I made sure and tried a couple of test patches first to be sure there was no reactions! One heavy and thick, the other light. Think the best plan of action is to give a dusting first, let that flash and then go on with a proper coat, although I've been assured that the epoxy can handle the solvent heavy gravitex. Lets hope so....



^ In hindsight, I probably should have put a new patch in the near arch, sticks out like a sore thumb now, it was an old patch that was solid so I left it be.


^ Test patches; so far so good!

sogood

Still very impressed with your work and dedication. A question that you might be able to answer or me is, when you cut out some rust, weld in a new panel and grind it down etc. what do you use to seal/protect the bare metal before you get around to filling and painting?

Given that I would tend to do all such main repairs first, with the finishing further down the line, would a simple "red lead" rust primer liberally hand painted on, be good enough for a temporary seal. I know different paints have very specific undercoats and primers and assume that the red lead would be mostly removed prior to filling etc.

The reason behind this query is the problem I've had in the past, when doing small simple repairs, and found that some time later, after filling, priming, painting etc, small signs of rust have appeared, coming back through the repair from underneath.

Or would you recommend a sealant that could be worked on top of when it comes to filling etc.

As usual, keep up the great work and any thoughts much appreciated.

SpitfireIV

sogood wrote: »

Still very impressed with your work and dedication. A question that you might be able to answer or me is, when you cut out some rust, weld in a new panel and grind it down etc. what do you use to seal/protect the bare metal before you get around to filling and painting?

Given that I would tend to do all such main repairs first, with the finishing further down the line, would a simple "red lead" rust primer liberally hand painted on, be good enough for a temporary seal. I know different paints have very specific undercoats and primers and assume that the red lead would be mostly removed prior to filling etc.

The reason behind this query is the problem I've had in the past, when doing small simple repairs, and found that some time later, after filling, priming, painting etc, small signs of rust have appeared, coming back through the repair from underneath.

Or would you recommend a sealant that could be worked on top of when it comes to filling etc.

As usual, keep up the great work and any thoughts much appreciated.

Hi SoGood, glad you're enjoying the build! I dont think I'll be of much help, seems that with this project I've learned a lot of things after doing it the wrong way, hah. If I were to do it again I'd probably have applied a weld through primer over repairs, thus if any got into any little crevices or cracks it'd be no harm really. I was using LOWE rust primer (perhaps similar to the 'red lead'?) this was an oil based paint, which I thinned a little and sprayed over the bare metal knowing I'd be sanding/cleaning it back eventually. In some areas I simply used a cheap can of aerosol that did the job.

The tub has been in my not so ideal or dry shed since December for the most part back to bare metal and I've had very very little rust appear, any that has I just gave a bit of a rub to clean it back.

SpitfireIV

Well, a nice update to share! Turned a corner in the project for sure with the edition of color!!

Thursday evening after the stonechip test patches showed no ill effects the underside was rubbed down with a scotchbrite pad, cleaned with panel wipe and then it was out with the Gravitex (three bottles of) which were dunked in a bucket of hot water to soften it up.

Really happy with how things are going, but, as always, the pictures will do the talking........



^ Dusted on a coat of stonechip, still apprehensive of reactions or general badness.....let it flash off, all seemed good, so, on with the proper coats



^ Went on pretty well, only had three one litre bottles and as the stuff comes out of the gun quite thick and fast thse werent long about dissapearing. But, I just scraped by.



^ Finish wasnt too bad at all, little bit dry in areas, but, satisfactory.

Now the waiting, would it react? Would blisters appear?!! I knew they wouldnt, but still at the back of my mind I feared a little, but, I had no reason to, all was good and it flashed off and cured *phew*


Fast forward three evenings later, the stonechip was cured and still within the recoat window without having to scuff it up and it was out with the new LVLP spray gun, the paint (Valencia Blue) and thinners, two hours later and 5 or so coats and we have something that looks like this.......






\

Its an odd color, looks very blue in the pictures but looks more green in person, how it'll look in natural light I look forward to seeing!


Delighted

biketard

Awesome. Looks fantastic.

sogood

Many thanks for your response regarding "recurring rust". And major kudos to you as usual. Seeing colour going on to your project has to be very gratifying and represents a major turning point.

I was thinking about the rust issue and it occurred to me that in the past, whenever I used filler with wet and dry paper, I always tended to sand it "wet" as it seemed to be easier and gave a smoother finish.

However, this must surely lead to the filler absorbing a certain amount of water, which is then trapped inside, when paint is applied. The result? Rust!

So maybe my problem wasn't so much to do with the initial metal repair rusting, but to my approach to the filling?

Either way, I will be rubbing down "dry" in the future. And as usual, keep up the great work, truly inspirational!

SpitfireIV

Cheers guys! :-)

I'd never wet sand filler, it is porous, as too is filler primer. A car left for long enough in primer can develop issues, that is if its not sealed with an epoxy underneath.


A popular method used a lot in the states and seems to be gaining here is, once the car is stripped back to bare metal it is totally epoxy primed, regardless of work that needs to be done or filler that may need to be applied. Any filling is done over the epoxy and if the layer of epoxy is broken through you simply reapply sealing in repairs and filler alike.

SpitfireIV

Been busy! :P


Over the weekend the inside of the car seen a dramatic change, from the patchy look of rust primer and epoxy primer to bar coat, then primer to color.

Took a number of hours just to get it scuffed up, cleaned down, wiped off, wrapped up and good for spraying, but, it was all worth it.....





^Inside got a light dusting of bar coat to seal in a rust primer that I had used, I had a reaction with the underside previously (earlier in the thread) and didnt want to chance that happening again! Let that sit overnight to make sure there was no reactions or ill effects and thankfully there wasnt. This was sprayed with a 1.4 suction gun.






^ Sunday morning and the high build goes on. Light dusting at first then full coats. This went on with a 1.8 gravity gun.









^ Then after letting the primer sit for an hour or so it was on with the color!!

This was applied with a 1.4 LVLP gun which I'm finding very hard to set up correctly and feed right! I'm not getting as 'wet' a coat as I'd like, cant understand why. So although it looks nice I'm not overly happy with it, tis grand, but a bit orange peely and dry in place :rolleyes: But, not to worry, eventually it'll be covered in carpet and rarely if ever seen!! hah.



So in between all the painting I put together a trial electrolysis tub and popped a few parts in to cook. Its basically a means of using a low current from a battery charger to chemically remove rust without all the mess and hassle of grinding, wire brushing etc. Simply pop in the bits you want to clean and let them stew while you get on with the rest of your work.....


^ Ummm ummmmmmm.....looking good!



^ Comparison, after about 12 hours in the tank. Results speak for themselves!

Darraghmh91.

They are shocking results from the rust remover
I'd love to put my wheels in there and just strip them off to bare metal and spray straight up
Super work tho it's taking great shape now and starting to look like a whole car instead of bits of rusty metal on the floor ha
Great work

SpitfireIV

Darraghmh91. wrote: »

They are shocking results from the rust remover
I'd love to put my wheels in there and just strip them off to bare metal and spray straight up
Super work tho it's taking great shape now and starting to look like a whole car instead of bits of rusty metal on the floor ha
Great work

Cheers! The electrolysis tub is handy to make up, all you need is a plastic tub, some scrap metal, a battery charger, water and some soda crystals (can be bought in Tesco!) and let it do its magic!



Project is still ongoing, slowly at times, but still going never the less. Have since removed the hardtop from the tub so the window frame can be prepped for spraying. The plan is to spray the outside of the tub with epoxy primer, there by sealing it against rust. Any filling that needs to be done can be applied over the epoxy, before being sealed again with another coat of epoxy and then onto high build and color.



^ Dropped the chassis and rims off at the blasters over the weekend so I hope to get those back in a day or two. With the chassis blasted and prepped it'll just be a case of painting and rebuilding.




The electrolysis pot is still cooking away and making great work of removing rust and saving me time and effort! A few air vents and vent opening trims that'd be a pain to sand/wirewheel. No hassle...........



^ After 24 hours in the pot

SpitfireIV

Little update.....

Got the chassis blasted at last so it's all go on that end of things then.



^ Back from th blasters. I opted for a regular ol' sand blast as opposed to media or soda blasting and got the blaster to spray a zinc primer on it for me.



Got the rims blasted and primed too. Now, just have to figure out what rims to use! Hmmmm :P



^ After leaving it sit for a couple of days I sprayed it with Tetrosyl Chassis Black. I was divided on whether to go black or go body color (as it would have originally been) but, as you can see opted for the black instead. This paint is a special chassis paint, so will be hard wearing and rust protecting. It's oil based so spraying cellulose color over it would have caused an issue.


^ Turrets and some of the drums got a blast too. The paint is easy enough to spray once thinned down 5-10% with white spirits. Two coats are needed if spraying and it has a nice gloss to it.

The rims I feel need a little more work before painting, a good sanding and a coat or two of high build to remove little nicks and scratches before spraying black also.

Bigus

The auld poly tunnel is effective enough in summer !

SpitfireIV

Bigus wrote: »

The auld poly tunnel is effective enough in summer !

It is indeed! Does get a bit hot, but with the door open its just nice. It's spacious enough, clean, dry and warm; perfect!

Flipped the chassis over since and gave it another shot of paint. As well as another few odds and ends. You'll notice three drums, well, I'll only be using two but figured it'd be no harm to paint the third, would have painted the forth but its still attached to the hub via a very stubborn screw!


Lots more suspension odds and ends to clean and paint up as well as tackling the differential and the rear swing/leaf spring.....

SpitfireIV

After accumulating a heck of a lot of part the last number of weeks it was tuime to clean them up and spray em!






^ The parts have all spent some time in the electrolysis tank to remove paint and rust. Now, due to the lenght of time some of them have been out of the tank they aquired a bit of surface rust, this was cleaned off with a scotchbrite and then they were all sprayed with two coats of chassis black, the chassis frame got three coats top and bottom.







^ As you might imagine its been bloody warm in the poly tunnel the past few days, but, no harm, helps with the drying process. Now that all that lot is done I'll leave it for a week or two to set hard and then I can gradually start building up the suspension and fitting the new poly bush set I got.


The back end however is gonna be more problematic, ie the differential!


^ This one I had hoped to use, the bearings seemed nice and tight, no slack and good preload. Figured I'd just get away with a new seal kit, €18 there or there abouts. On closer inspection the case was cracked with the leaf spring attaches and upon opening it up found a lot of brown gunk and oil inside.......water had got into it as some stage! After washing it out with kerosene the bearings were a little slack. Bugger.



Diff number 2? The original one from the car. Well, without opening this one it was clear it needed a full rebuild (bearings & seals).



^ Thankfully on opening this one up there was no water present. But, like I said, it was need total stripping and rebuilding. Full rebuild kit is about €130/€140 euro, bugger again, but, I guess its worth doing and doing right.



And now for something a little different.........



^ Picked up a 'retro'? or vintage sewing machine, good ol' heavy solid one to try and repair some of the seat covers, interior trim, try make a new head lining for the hardtop and add edging to the carpet.........all when the time comes of course, which may be in the long distant future! :P