Appealing Dart Fine

jamieakd

I received a dart fine for fare evasion on Tuesday 15.04.14 I was travelling from Kilbarrack to Clontarf Road. I have a leap card which I always use whilst travelling on DARt, Dublin Bus and Luas services. The most frequent journey which I make is from Kilbarrack to Clontarf Road and then back again three times a week. I was going through the electronic turnstile and went to tag-on with my card and walked through. I heard the machine beep, so I knew the fare hadn't been taken from my account. I boarded the train anyways and intended to pay at my arrival destination of Clontarf Road, which I have done several times before without any problem. Anyone familiar with the station would know it's impossible to get through without having a valid ticket/paying at the arrival ticket desk as the turnstiles are always closed and the office is always manned.

Anyways before I even got to sit down a ticket inspector asked me for my ticket, I said I didn't have one but I had a leap card. Before he even asked me a further question he took out his book of fines and started to write one up for me. I then tried to explain too him and offered to get off the train and pay the fare, pay the fare to him or pay the fare at the other end. All of which he refused. May I add the train doors had yet too even close before he fined me! Anyways he asked my details and I gave them, when he decided he wasn't happy with my proof of identification he took me off the DART at Harmonstown station. As I had no proof of my address with me he threatened to call the gardaí for them to come down to the train station and verify I was who I claimed to be. He told me failure to verify who I said I was would result in a further fine for wasting police time, when I questioned him about this he said he would issue me with a further €50 fine for wasting Garda time (the gardaí themselves wouldn't issue me with a fine) when I told him I had no proof of address as all I have with an address on it are letters which are at my home as I don't carry such things around with me as I have no need to, he then called the gardaí. Whilst trying to ensure him I was who I claimed to be, I remembered I had an account online which had my name and address on it and he accepted that as proof, he then proceeded to cancel the gardaí to come and verify me. He finally handed me my fine and said I must pay within 21 days and if I wish too appeal I must to do so within that time frame.

I don't ever evade fare on any public transport I use. I have my account history on my leap card too prove this, I have always paid each time I used the DART or any other public transport. I always believe I never really evaded a fare as I was fined before the train doors shut and before the train began in motion. I also felt threatened by the inspector with the gardaí and with another fine for wasting Garda town which would be issued by the inspector and not the gardaí themselves. I have encountered problems with the new turnstiles at Kilbarrack before. A few examples are,

One day I topped up my leap card and went to tag-on and the machine kept refusing my card, I hopped on the DART and ended up having to pay the fixed return rate of €4.60 at Clontarf Road when I tagged-off instead of the €2.00 single fare.

Another time the same thing happened me as I tagged-on at Clontarf Road, I then arrived at Kilbarrack and tried to tag-off but the machine kept refusing my card. As there was nobody at the ticket office I decided to just leave it as I had tried several times to tag-off. This resulted in me having to the fixed return fare of €4.60 instead of the single fare of €2.00 for bizarrely not tagging-off.

I would also like too add the fact that the inspector never made me pay the initial fare, only the €100 fixed penalty. I find it quite ironic and bizarre that I would be fined for fare evasion and then be allowed to continue to my final destination without having too pay the fare which I was being fined for evading. It makes no sense to allow me to travel on the train without paying the fare and fining me for it, which is essentially what happened.

I am also unable to pay the €100 fine within the 21 days as I do not have the finances to do so. I wish to either appeal my fine or have it reduced. I understand that at the end of the day I did evade the fare and broke the rules. But I feel a €100 fine for a law abiding citizen is quite harsh. I could've easily ran away and refused to cooperate with the inspector but I chose not too.

Any advice is much appreciated and I wish to thank everybody for taking their time to read my post and to reply to it. I apologise for how long it is, but feel I need to get my point across and explain exactly everything that happened. Thank you again.

uck51js9zml2yt

In this case you weren't a law abiding citizen. You knew the fare hadn't been taken and yet continued onto the train.
You don't have grounds for appeal.

partyatmygaff

Even if you had valid ethical grounds for appeal, you'd achieve more talking to a brick wall.

spurious

jamieakd wrote: »

Anyways before I even got to sit down a ticket inspector asked me for my ticket, I said I didn't have one but I had a leap card. Before he even asked me a further question he took out his book of fines and started to write one up for me.

I don't understand this bit. You wouldn't have a 'ticket' as such even if the electronic turnstile had worked. Unless he had some way of scanning your leap card to check for the deduction, or had watched you try to pay and then pounced on you knowing it hadn't worked, how did he know you had not scanned your card? 'I had a leap card' could mean 'I used my leap card'.

The leapcard is not foolproof. I have had a number of journeys which don't appear to have registered on my account. They'll be coming for me next.

schemingbohemia

You state you knew the leap card hadn't worked yet you still boarded the train. Why do you think you have any grounds for appeal?

jamieakd

schemingbohemia wrote: »

You state you knew the leap card hadn't worked yet you still boarded the train. Why do you think you have any grounds for appeal?

I feel I have grounds for appeal as the machine at Kilbarrack train station was only recently installed and I have had problems with before as I stated I couldn't tag off one day and ended up paying the penalty fare of €4.60 for not tagging off. I know of many people that have also had problems with the machine at the train station. I therefore assume it is faulty.

jamieakd

spurious wrote: »

I don't understand this bit. You wouldn't have a 'ticket' as such even if the electronic turnstile had worked. Unless he had some way of scanning your leap card to check for the deduction, or had watched you try to pay and then pounced on you knowing it hadn't worked, how did he know you had not scanned your card? 'I had a leap card' could mean 'I used my leap card'.

The leapcard is not foolproof. I have had a number of journeys which don't appear to have registered on my account. They'll be coming for me next.

I have noticed this on my account that some journeys don't seem to show up and sometimes when I top up my card it doesn't show up either.

jamieakd

spurious wrote: »

I don't understand this bit. You wouldn't have a 'ticket' as such even if the electronic turnstile had worked. Unless he had some way of scanning your leap card to check for the deduction, or had watched you try to pay and then pounced on you knowing it hadn't worked, how did he know you had not scanned your card? 'I had a leap card' could mean 'I used my leap card'.

The leapcard is not foolproof. I have had a number of journeys which don't appear to have registered on my account. They'll be coming for me next.

So there is no way of a ticket inspector checking my card to see if I had or had not paid the fare ? So therefore he had no right to issue me with a ticket.

whomitconcerns

jamieakd wrote: »

I feel I have grounds for appeal as the machine at Kilbarrack train station was only recently installed and I have had problems with before as I stated I couldn't tag off one day and ended up paying the penalty fare of €4.60 for not tagging off. I know of many people that have also had problems with the machine at the train station. I therefore assume it is faulty.

well assumption is the mother of all fu%k ups as we all know! You have no grounds unfortunately

BeanbagBallbag

jamieakd wrote: »

So there is no way of a ticket inspector checking my card to see if I had or had not paid the fare ? So therefore he had no right to issue me with a ticket.

Inspectors can scan your leap card to verify that you have tagged on, I've had mine scanned several times. I would assume all inspectors carry the scanners at this stage.

Bob1234.

Its a know fact that Kilbarrack validators don't work from time to time. This could mean that when you started the journey you could not tag on. If you can prove that, there can be no fine issued for you.