Print your own insurance certs

Fred Swanson

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the dark phantom

Get the real one sent out, Otherwise everytime your stopped at a checkpoint you will have to explain that you printed it out, Then you'll be asked to produce insurance at the station..

CiniO

What difference does it make if it's printed at your house or at insurance company premises.
It's still only to confirm your cover.
AFAIK there's no law requiring insurance certs and discs to be water marked or having any other security issued, so it can be printed anywhere.
I honestly can't see any issue with printing it at home.

No Pants

CiniO wrote: »

What difference does it make if it's printed at your house or at insurance company premises.
It's still only to confirm your cover.
AFAIK there's no law requiring insurance certs and discs to be water marked or having any other security issued, so it can be printed anywhere.
I honestly can't see any issue with printing it at home.

the dark phantom wrote: »

...everytime your stopped at a checkpoint you will have to explain that you printed it out, Then you'll be asked to produce insurance at the station.

That would be an issue for me if it happened.

Have they been doing these DIY discs for long?

mickdw

Im with Axa and Ive never heard of this.
Why the need to print a cert yourself?

Surely its a silly idea. Just a further temptation for some people to commit fraud.
It would be very easy to alter a cert with that system whereas to get a genuine looking hallmarked cert would take a bit of effort.

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

What difference does it make if it's printed at your house or at insurance company premises.
It's still only to confirm your cover.
AFAIK there's no law requiring insurance certs and discs to be water marked or having any other security issued, so it can be printed anywhere.
I honestly can't see any issue with printing it at home.

Because if you print it out yourself it looks a lot like youre being a cheeky bollox putting a homemade disc in your window to fool the Gardai. I could see it beinga right pain in the backside; Id imagine every time you are stopped you would be asked to produce your actual cert at a Garda station to verify.

No Pants

mickdw wrote: »

It would be very easy to alter a cert with that system whereas to get a genuine looking hallmarked cert would take a bit of effort.

Just pulled my insurance disc out and took a quick look at it. There's no hallmark or watermark on it, nothing from the state anyway. There's a large, faded Z in the background, presumably from Zurich, my insurer.

jimgoose

djimi wrote: »

Because if you print it out yourself it looks a lot like youre being a cheeky bollox putting a homemade disc in your window to fool the Gardai. I could see it beinga right pain in the backside; Id imagine every time you are stopped you would be asked to produce your actual cert at a Garda station to verify.

Aye. I'd imagine this printing-your-own-cert caper pisses off the Rozzers no end.

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

Because if you print it out yourself it looks a lot like youre being a cheeky bollox putting a homemade disc in your window to fool the Gardai. I could see it beinga right pain in the backside; Id imagine every time you are stopped you would be asked to produce your actual cert at a Garda station to verify.

If insurers give it to you online to print yourself, then I see no reason for Gardai not to accept it or have any doubts.

In Poland self printing insurance certificates are there for a long time, and no one has problem with it.
I travelled half of Europe with such cert, having road checks in Germany and France, and didn't have any bother.

Much handier, as you can print cert directly after purchasing policy online. You don't need to wait for few days (or even weeks) for them to come in post.

mickdw

No Pants wrote: »

Just pulled my insurance disc out and took a quick look at it. There's no hallmark or watermark on it, nothing from the state anyway. There's a large, faded Z in the background, presumably from Zurich, my insurer.

The title said print your own cert. Are people here referring to entire cert or just the disc?
My axa cert certainly has a hallmark on it.

Next it will be print your own NCT or tax disc to rightly muddy the waters.
I guess the disc should be pointless anyway with Plate recognition and adequate data bases.

jimgoose

CiniO wrote: »

If insurers give it to you online to print yourself, then I see no reason for Gardai not to accept it or have any doubts.

In Poland self printing insurance certificates are there for a long time, and no one has problem with it.
I travelled half of Europe with such cert, having road checks in Germany and France, and didn't have any bother.

Much handier, as you can print cert directly after purchasing policy online. You don't need to wait for few days (or even weeks) for them to come in post.

Bloody Continentals and their common-sense. Will you stoppit?? :pac::pac::pac:

blastman

My attitude is that if I'm spending several hundred Euro with them, they can print the piece of paper out and sent it to me.

Fred Swanson

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No Pants

mickdw wrote: »

The title said print your own cert. Are people here referring to entire cert or just the disc?
My axa cert certainly has a hallmark on it.

Next it will be print your own NCT or tax disc to rightly muddy the waters.
I guess the disc should be pointless anyway with Plate recognition and adequate data bases.

Sorry, I was referring to the disc only. The remainder of my insurance paperwork is upstairs and filed away.

I haven't had to wait for an insurance cert since the first one arrived. Normally it arrives as part of the renewal. There may be some further movement to be had on price, in which case another cert arrives, but at no point am I without paperwork.

CiniO

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Savings I suppose.

On the one hand it's very handy, and I would avail of it if my insurer offered such thing.
On the other hand, it might be pita for someone having no access to printer. They should still provide option to send cert on mail if requested.

Fred Swanson

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No Pants

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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This is worse than I first thought. I thought that maybe the Guard wouldn't like the look of the insurance disc and would ask you to produce the cert at the station. Your cert would come from the insurer and look kosher. However, if we're now talking about the entire cert being a home print job, I can see this being a problem is the Gardai aren't aware and haven't seen a few mock ups already.

Potential solution would be for the Guard to call the insurance company in question to check status.

Fred, what did your PDF turn out like, how does it compare to what you had received previously?

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

If insurers give it to you online to print yourself, then I see no reason for Gardai not to accept it or have any doubts.

In Poland self printing insurance certificates are there for a long time, and no one has problem with it.
I travelled half of Europe with such cert, having road checks in Germany and France, and didn't have any bother.

Much handier, as you can print cert directly after purchasing policy online. You don't need to wait for few days (or even weeks) for them to come in post.

Thats all well and good if youre in Poland or Germany. This is Ireland, a country where traditionally we do not have the facility to print out our own discs, and those that did were doing to in an effort to try and fool a checkpoint.

Im not saying it makes sense, Im just saying it is how it is. Good luck trying to convince a Garda that the cert printed from your inkjet at home is genuine.

Fred Swanson

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No Pants

djimi wrote: »

Good luck trying to convince a Garda that the cert printed from your inkjet at home is genuine.

And that's the real issue. I have no problem with the idea of printing off my own cert, but only if it gets me the wee wave at the checkpoint. If it gets me a producer and eats up 30 minutes of my time, then send me a cert in the post you cheap bastards. :pac:

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Que remarks,

I don't own a printer;
I can't open the file,
I can only print black and white,
It doesn't sit right on the page,
It's flimsy feeling of paper and looks fake,
Can I print of a few for my mates too ?
I paid money for insurance and I want something for it !

Wouldn't mind showing that to AXA !

But on the other side , when are we joining the UK and moving away from paper discs in the windscreen ? I would like the system of being completely automated , not having discs and still be insured etc. !

CiniO

djimi wrote: »

Thats all well and good if youre in Poland or Germany.

Hmm. Car from Poland can be legally driven to Ireland as well, and Irish garda would have to accept printed insurance cert in that case.

This is Ireland, a country where traditionally we do not have the facility to print out our own discs, and those that did were doing to in an effort to try and fool a checkpoint.

Im not saying it makes sense, Im just saying it is how it is. Good luck trying to convince a Garda that the cert printed from your inkjet at home is genuine.

This is Ireland where we don't normally have facility to print disc and cert - wrong. As you can see now we do have this facility so garda will have to adjust and start accepting it.

Del2005

djimi wrote: »

Thats all well and good if youre in Poland or Germany. This is Ireland, a country where traditionally we do not have the facility to print out our own discs, and those that did were doing to in an effort to try and fool a checkpoint.

Im not saying it makes sense, Im just saying it is how it is. Good luck trying to convince a Garda that the cert printed from your inkjet at home is genuine.

The only real difference is that insurance certs are usually printed on high quality paper, I've not had a watermarked cert in years, so just splash out for some quality paper if you're worried about printing at home.

For people saying it's wide open to fraud we've only recently had print your own insurance disk and insurance fraud has been going on since insurance was invented, it's as easy to alter a print out as take out a "checkpoint" insurance.

Fred Swanson

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Fred Swanson

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CiniO

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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What happens if you ring them at that number and request cert to be posted to you?

Fred Swanson

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oldyouth

Nice and handy if you do an alteration and amended papers are e-mailed to you straight away. Sounds like progress to me. 35 years driving and never once asked for a cert by a Garda

Stavros Murphy

I have a mate who has been printing his own cert for years. He says it saves him a fortune, I'm guessing he means on expensive postage..

djimi

CiniO wrote: »

This is Ireland where we don't normally have facility to print disc and cert - wrong. As you can see now we do have this facility so garda will have to adjust and start accepting it.

I didnt say normally; I said traditionally.

Im not disagreeing with you; all Im saying is that I wouldnt fancy being the first person that a Garda encounters with a home printed insurance disc, because I can guarantee you that this is going to cause issues for people at checkpoints with Gardai wanting to verify the validity of their home printed discs.

corktina

my Axa Broker prints my cert whilst you wait....no hologram , never had a problem though

MugMugs

The only real catching point is that it's manditory for there to be a green band on the disc. If you don't have a colour printer then you're non compliant and can be done.

No Pants

I don't have a printer and I have no intention of getting one. I'll have to keep an eye out for this when renewal time comes.

djimi

No Pants wrote: »

I don't have a printer and I have no intention of getting one. I'll have to keep an eye out for this when renewal time comes.

Nor do I, and the only printer that I have access to (in work) is B/W!

If Im being perfectly honest, for the money Im spending on insurance the least I expect is to get a bloody piece of paper printed out and sent to me!

No Pants

djimi wrote: »

Nor do I, and the only printer that I have access to (in work) is B/W!

The printers are the only reason I even go in to the office these days.

Irish solution to an Irish problem is all I can say. Maybe one day soon we'll finally get rid of the paper on the window altogether.

CiniO

I hope that day will come in some time.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

All ya need is something to edit the pdf and put on any reg ya like !

Its a crazy solution

Fred Swanson

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Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Fred Swanson wrote: »

Not only could they edit the reg number they could change the number of drivers and the class of cover.

I went into their office and they printed me out a cert on AXA paper. Checkpoint issues averted.

Policy dates too.

Seems to me like I can take out a policy with axa and never pay for insurance again with the free ability to edit dates etc. !

delthedriver

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Very interesting. Guess it is progress.


Certainly beats waiting on something to arrive in the post.

delthedriver

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

All ya need is something to edit the pdf and put on any reg ya like !

Its a crazy solution

Honesty is the best policy perhaps?

micks_address

Interestingly enough there are no insurance discs issued in the UK or at least there is no requirement to display on windscreen

delthedriver

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Certainly the idea was good, but flawed with security issues?


Nonetheless if the security issues could be resolved , it may be the future.?

delthedriver

micks_address wrote: »

Interestingly enough there are no insurance discs issued in the UK or at least there is no requirement to display on windscreen

True indeed.


AFAIK the Insurance disc was introduced in Ireland back in the '80s.

CiniO

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

All ya need is something to edit the pdf and put on any reg ya like !

Its a crazy solution

But you are probably aware, that vast majority of our society, even though it's childishly easy, won't do it.

The small remaining of people who will do it, were doing it anyway by forgering original discs and certs. Making it easier to do, won't suddenly cause half of society to do it. I don't believe it would make one extra person to do it.

If I was to pretend I have insurance for roadcheck purposes, it would make no difference for me if I was to just edit PDF, or do more complicated official cert forgery.

doolox

.. and other police procedure documentaries the police, at least in England do not rely solely on discs or certs but ring up the insurers to confirm coverage and can be told straight away whether someone is covered, who owns a car and when the cover lapsed etc.... all the necessary details.

Cars can be seized IMMEDIATELY if there is no insurance and the perp is given like only a week to pay fines and get insurance or else the car is crushed.

Same for having no tax.

A very heavy handed but probably necessary system.

johndaman66

MugMugs wrote: »

The only real catching point is that it's manditory for there to be a green band on the disc. If you don't have a colour printer then you're non compliant and can be done.

Presumably a green marker would do the trick there:P

It seems the reason behind this is to save Axa money on postage. Perhaps they may contest that its to ensure the motorist has their disc immediately and avoid potential hassle at checkpoints but I wouldn't see it as such, especially so if they will print it out for you if you call into them in person. Tight gits.....thats all I can say

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

doolox wrote: »

.. and other police procedure documentaries the police, at least in England do not rely solely on discs or certs but ring up the insurers to confirm coverage and can be told straight away whether someone is covered, who owns a car and when the cover lapsed etc.... all the necessary details.

Cars can be seized IMMEDIATELY if there is no insurance and the perp is given like only a week to pay fines and get insurance or else the car is crushed.

Same for having no tax.

A very heavy handed but probably necessary system.

and how many times do you see that happen when the car is displaying an insurance disc that shows in date ?

corktina

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

and how many times do you see that happen when the car is displaying an insurance disc that shows in date ?

there are no insurance discs in the UK and in fact it is often the case that they query a seemingly valid certificate and find that the policy has been cancelled for non payment of DDM. Their system isn't heavy-handed , it's bloody superb!

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

there are no insurance discs in the UK and in fact it is often the case that they query a seemingly valid certificate and find that the policy has been cancelled for non payment of DDM. Their system isn't heavy-handed , it's bloody superb!

Bloody superb?
I wouldn't call neither Irish not UK system superb. For one very important reasons - those system seem to make it really easy for people to drive uninsured, therefore making amount of uninsured drivers on road quite high.
In Ireland if you don't have insurance you can easily forger disc and cert, no matter if they are in PDF form to be printed at home, or if they are printed on "nice paper" in insurance company premises. Both are childishly easy to forge. Also fact that only insured and named drivers are good to drive, makes plenty of cases when someone else is driving uninsured.

Same story in UK. Probably harder to cheat the system with ANPR rolled out everywhere, but still the same problem with someone not named on policy driving causing unnecesery uninsuered drivers.

Superb system is what there is in Poland.
It's virtually impossible to drive uninsured, as system is designed to prevent uninsured drivers on the road.
Firstly every single car must be insured at all times, and this insurance must cover anyone to drive it. If there is any gap in insurance cover, this will be discovered by UFG (equivalent of MIBI) and very harsh penalties will be issued.
Also insurance policy renews automatically, unless you specifically cancel it in writing. And if you do, UFG gets informed about it, and they will check if you purchased policy with other insurer on the same day. If not - harsh penalty will be issued.
Even if you don't pay for your renewal, or you pay policy in instalments and fail to pay some of them, you are still cover. All what happens is you owe premium to the insurer, but they are obliged to cover you.
If you withhold some material facts when purchasing cover (f.e. to make your premium lower) your policy is still valid, and if insurer discovers it, all you need to do it pay additional premium.
If you sell a car to someone, insurance policy goes with it, to make sure new buyer is insured from very beginning he owns the car.
Generally speaking, there's virtually no possibility to be driving uninsured.
That's superb system.

Only one big disadvantage, is when you have few cars in your yard which you don't use, refurbish or anything, you need to pay insurance on all of them at all times.