Does The Queen Still Own Ireland?

UCDCritic

Someone once told me that although we gained our political indepdance the queen and others still owned the land.

Any truth to this?

Take for example the issue with rental outlets and how the rent can only ever go up, why is that the case? It sounds completely unfair, like the deal a colonial power would make.

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Please don't give me a lot of stick for this post if it's completely wrong.

Judgement Day

Oh dear.

tomwaterford

UCDCritic wrote: »

Someone once told me that although we gained our political indepdance the queen and others still owned the land.

Any truth to this?

Take for example the issue with rental outlets and how the rent can only ever go up, why is that the case? It sounds completely unfair, like the deal a colonial power would make.

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Please don't give me a lot of stick for this post if it's completely wrong.

sounds like complete bollix to me....youd do well to find someone else to listen to

B.A._Baracus

Wind up threads used to be better in After Hours :pac:

Slicemeister

Roll it there Roisin.

Renegade Mechanic

Sweet baby Jesus this gon' be good!:D

Fratton Fred

You probably mean the Crown Estate, which the queen doesn't own.

No, it does not own any land in Ireland.

kingchess

true,the queen is kicking my grand uncle out of his house-the house he was born and reared in and lived in for the last 87 years-he is not happy but what can you do?,the law is the law.she might have to spend a few bob to bring it up to scratch but it should drive up house prices in the parish

kneemos

She has an Emerald in her crown as well.Hmmm.

c_man

UCDCritic wrote: »

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

True. Just last week she kicked my old Granny out of her house and moved Charles and Camilla in :mad:

glued

UCDCritic wrote: »

Someone once told me that although we gained our political indepdance the queen and others still owned the land.

Any truth to this?

Take for example the issue with rental outlets and how the rent can only ever go up, why is that the case? It sounds completely unfair, like the deal a colonial power would make.

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Please don't give me a lot of stick for this post if it's completely wrong.

Hi, have you just discovered a time machine or something?

Give Padraig Pearse my regards

The Backwards Man

Do you eat everything you see OP?

I honestly thought this was a Teddy Tedson thread when I read the title.

The Queen is not the boss of me anyway.

RobbingBandit

Not sure if appropriate. :rolleyes:

Banjo String

Everyone knows your man Stephen from braveheart owns the island of Ireland. It's his island.

Keep up.

Aongus Von Bismarck

It's the calibre of question I'd expect from a UCD graduate to be honest.

forgotten password

my Guinness is evaporating

biko

She only own a few counties, 6 or thereabouts.

sdanseo

UCDCritic wrote: »

Someone once told me that although we gained our political indepdance the queen and others still owned the land.

Any truth to this?

Take for example the issue with rental outlets and how the rent can only ever go up, why is that the case? It sounds completely unfair, like the deal a colonial power would make.

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Please don't give me a lot of stick for this post if it's completely wrong.

I'd love to know where you got your information. Did you read it in a column by Kevin Myers or did you just make all this up as you went along?

smcgiff

I think the OP is getting mixed up with ground rent title claims. This is still causing problems in places.

There'a US trucker claiming the land my father's shop is built on because he is related to some long dead absentee landlord. Kid you not.

Custardpi

The OP may possibly be thinking of ground rent. I've heard that in some cases the land may still technically be owned by a British landlord, who could well be aristocratic, though I don't know how common this still is. I'd imagine that at this stage a lot of that historic ground rent would have been bought out where possible anyway.

Yellowblackbird

I seem to remember reading something similar a while back - thread in history forum.

LeBash

Yup, she bought it for a buck 53 in yonder

LeBash

Yup, she bought it for a buck 53 in yonder

The Backwards Man

A lot of the boglands would still be owned by the landed gentry across the way with local farmers having turbary and grazing rights.

Lapin

UCDCritic wrote: »

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Yep.

I bought my house 8 years ago.

On the deeds it says I have to meet the Queen on Tuesday 16th of June 2105 after the last race at Royal Ascot and hand her back the keys.

Must remember to book the day off work.

Custardpi

The Backwards Man wrote: »

A lot of the boglands would still be owned by the landed gentry across the way with local farmers having turbary rights.

Interesting, has there ever been any proposals to buy it out?

tomwaterford

The Backwards Man wrote: »

A lot of the boglands would still be owned by the landed gentry across the way with local farmers having turbary rights.

we even have the ridicolus situation of the duke/what ever he/she is that owns Lismore castle owns the blackwater....the only river in the world that is owned

PropJoe10

*gets popcorn

Karl Stein

Peregrine Andrew Mornington Cavendish, the 12th Duke of Devonshire 'owns' a stretch of the Blackwater River in Munster and charges anglers for the pleasure of fishing 'his' river.

tomwaterford

Lapin wrote: »

Yep.

I bought my house 8 years ago.

On the deeds it says I have to meet the Queen on Tuesday 16th of June 2105 after the last race at Royal Ascot and hand her back the keys.

Must remember to book the day off work.

you should be safe to hold on for another 90 odd years
(assuming OPs info is correct)

Sir Arthur Daley

The Backwards Man wrote: »

A lot of the boglands would still be owned by the landed gentry across the way with local farmers having turbary and grazing rights.

Are you sure about the grazing bit?

dxhound2005

I own a bit of the moon. I bought it off the internet.

The Backwards Man

Custardpi wrote: »

Interesting, has there ever been any proposals to buy it out?

Who would want it? Where I cut the turf up the back is owned by the Shaftesbury Estate. The current Earl was over a year or two ago as there was an old WWII plane dug up. First time he ever saw the place in his life, I'd say he'd have no bother selling it. It's no good for anything though.

Yellowblackbird

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I own a bit of the moon. I bought it off the internet.

Lunatic.

drdeadlift

We rent the four courts aswell as a few other prominent building from the uk.It nuts but true.Will find sources if ye want

Custardpi

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Who would want it? Where I cut the turf up the back is owned by the Shaftesbury Estate. The current Earl was over a year or two ago as there was an old WWII plane dug up. First time he ever saw the place in his life, I'd say he'd have no bother selling it. It's no good for anything though.

Does he receive any income from the land?

The Backwards Man

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

Are you sure about the grazing bit?

Yep, depends on the estate I suppose, but most would have grazing rights for sheep attached to the deeds. Some are mapped off in sections and some are a part share of common ground, again depending on the Estate.

johnnyskeleton

A brief history of Irish land law by johnnyskeleton.

1. Normans conqueror England and make new legal system there - feudal tenure.
2. All land conquered belongs to the conquering king, who divides it up among his main supporters, who divide up their portions among their lieutenants who divide up their portions among their soldiers etc. Rent and fighting services are transferred back up to the king to keep their portion of the land.
3. English kings come to ireland with varying degrees of success, leaving traces of their customs and legal systems.
4. Bill of rights etc severely restrict kings right over land. Still notionally held under grant of king.
5. Act of union etc formalised English rule and implicit acceptance of English system of land ownership.
6. Land registry introduced but keeps language of old feudal tenure.
7. Irish free state and Republic of Ireland replaces royal estate with the new state. Royal prerogative abolished but state is the ultimate successor to unclaimed land and exercises soverign control over. 26 counties.
8. In all this, people forgot to abolish feudal tenure, until:
9. feudal tenure formally abolished by section 9 of the land law and conveyancing act 2009.

So any dubious argument was out to bed by 2009

The Backwards Man

Custardpi wrote: »

Does he receive any income from the land?

Those that don't have turbary are supposed to pay a land agent for the right to cut turf. Of course most people never bother their hole, so it will be interesting to see what happens this year after the Earl has been here and saw all the hundreds of acres of freshly cut turf for about two dozen households.:pac:

mike65

Karl Stein wrote: »

Peregrine Andrew Mornington Cavendish, the 12th Duke of Devonshire 'owns' a stretch of the Blackwater River in Munster and charges anglers for the pleasure of fishing 'his' river.

If I owned that stretch I'd be able to charge you as well - bloody riff raff.

Lapin

So does this....

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

9. feudal tenure formally abolished by section 9 of the land law and conveyancing act 2009.

So any dubious argument was put to bed by 2009

.....make shít of this ?

drdeadlift wrote: »

We rent the four courts aswell as a few other prominent building from the uk.It nuts but true.Will find sources if ye want

I hope so.

tomwaterford

Karl Stein wrote: »

Peregrine Andrew Mornington Cavendish, the 12th Duke of Devonshire 'owns' a stretch of the Blackwater River in Munster and charges anglers for the pleasure of fishing 'his' river.

AFAIK he owns all of it from where the tide ends down around yawl

he charges to fish from the riverbank.....though this can be got around just outside cappaquin where the road runs right upto the edge of the river


on a side note....surly its about time Ireland ran its own lifeboats as well....I was at a funeral of an old man last year who was a volunteer lifeboat man in Dunmore and he got a medal years ago for bravery and had to go the queen to receive it....he always said he was proud to get it...but resented going to England for it even 50 odd years later:eek:

mike65

http://www.anphoblacht.com/contents/6197

Cool Mo D

UCDCritic wrote: »

Someone once told me that although we gained our political indepdance the queen and others still owned the land.

Any truth to this?

Take for example the issue with rental outlets and how the rent can only ever go up, why is that the case? It sounds completely unfair, like the deal a colonial power would make.

I also heard that when you buy a house you're really only renting it for 99 years and after that time it goes back to the queen.

Please don't give me a lot of stick for this post if it's completely wrong.

Maybe if you remembered Junior Cert history it would help. There were several Land Acts passed just before and after independence, to allow tenant farmers to buy their land from the big landowners that historically owned the land. The Irish Government borrowed money to allow this, and one of the conditions of independence was paying back these loans. Later, the DeValera government decided to stop paying, leading to the economic war in the 1930s.

Sir Arthur Daley

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Yep, depends on the estate I suppose, but most would have grazing rights for sheep attached to the deeds. Some are mapped off in sections and some are a part share of common ground, again depending on the Estate.

The ones near you are they attached to people - if they die, their turbury rights go?

pragmatic1

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Wind up threads used to be better in After Hours :pac:

There was a good student one last night.

MagicMarker

She does own it, but we have Part 4 Tenancy, so it's all good.

The Backwards Man

Sir Arthur Daley wrote: »

The ones near you are they attached to people - if they die, their turbury rights go?

No, they are attached to the land, if you sell the farm the turbary goes along with it.

johnnyskeleton

Lapin wrote: »

So does this....



.....make shít of this ?



I hope so.

I think it's history is as follows:

Inns quay was originally a monastic settlement that was attained by Henry VIII and given to his buddy on condition it be leased to the barristers governing body (who then called themselves the kings inns). This site fell into disuse, was then granted by James I to the kings inns and then it was sorta taken over by the judges, the kings inns being relocated to henrietta street.

As this was quasi by consent the four courts took over the site as part owner part squatter with the admiral of the four courts as a kind of nominee/titular owner. They paid no rent to either the kings inns or to anyone else as far as I know, and that is still the position today. It was taken in charge by the office for public works at some stage.

Even if it was owned by the crown pre-1922 it would've been taken over by Eire in 1937 and any notional rent payment would've stopped in the trade war in 1932.

So it's possible that some crazy rent is being paid, without seeing the title
Documents I can't say. But I doubt it.

sligojoek

The queen never owned Ireland.