Quevega in foal - Punchestown to be last race

Jayo11780

In foal to Scirocco apparently??
What a servant to racing - truly brilliant mare, let's hope she goes out with a win!

Deco99

So i know nothing bout horses and even less about biology but you're saying she's preggers? and scirrocco is the dad???

Will he make an honest gal out of her? or she doin it to get on the welfare benefits??

Seriously though, is it common for a pregnant horse to run a competitive race?

TheMilkyPirate

Deco99 wrote: »

So i know nothing bout horses and even less about biology but you're saying she's preggers? and scirrocco is the dad???

Will he make an honest gal out of her? or she doin it to get on the welfare benefits??

Seriously though, is it common for a pregnant horse to run a competitive race?

Yes

Deco99

Deco99 wrote: »

So i know nothing bout horses and even less about biology but you're saying she's preggers? and scirrocco is the dad???

Will he make an honest gal out of her? or she doin it to get on the welfare benefits??

Seriously though, is it common for a pregnant horse to run a competitive race?

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

Yes

Yes to which bit? He will make an honest gal out of her?

Francie Barrett

Deco99 wrote: »

Seriously though, is it common for a pregnant horse to run a competitive race?

It's not very common, but it does happen. There are some that suggest that a mare in foal actually gains a performance benefit from the hormones going through her body.

rossom

This doesn't seem to be public knowledge as of yet.

ste2010

Again someone with more skin in the game will know better than me..but my understanding was the same as Francies.
When in foal the expectation was they perform even better.
If they thought it would hinder her performance surely they would have waited until 3 weeks from now

boysinblack

Can confirm the above is in fact not true.

ste2010

boysinblack wrote: »

Can confirm the above is in fact not true.

That quevega has one in the oven or re performance?

boysinblack

One in the oven..

andyman

Would like to see what kind of machine she and Shirocco could produce, having said that

Colonel Sanders

People saying on Twitter she's been covered by Beat Hollow

Still runs Thursday. No idea if it's true

bellybuster12

Colonel Sanders wrote: »

People saying on Twitter she's been covered by Beat Hollow

Still runs Thursday. No idea if it's true

Heard this as well, we shall know in a couple days

NewApproach

Beat Hollow?!!

Ah heeor...

Winning Ways Racing

She is getting on in years to be starting as a broodmare.

sting60

Beat Hollow it is and the smallest stallion available at 15.3hh.

kfallon

So Quevega was covered on Friday meaning she was in season on Thurs when she ran at Punchestown.

Thanks for telling everyone Willie, especially those people who put their hard earned money on her, he really is something else! :rolleyes:

kfallon

kfallon wrote: »

So Quevega was covered on Friday meaning she was in season on Thurs when she ran at Punchestown.

Thanks for telling everyone Willie, especially those people who put their hard earned money on her, he really is something else! :rolleyes:

I agree Mr Fallon. Willie should have let the people know. Bad form.

Having said that I think it was the ride Ruby gave her which got her beat.

Gringo180

As if Mullins gives a toss about the punters lads.

Francie Barrett

Disgusting really. He was directly asked whether Quevega was on foal before the race and he got all snooty saying it was no one's business.

NewApproach

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Disgusting really. He was directly asked whether Quevega was on foal before the race and he got all snooty saying it was no one's business.

But he's right...

Gringo180

NewApproach wrote: »

But he's right...

Why keep it a secret tho, if the horse is in foal what have they got to lose by telling the truth?

Francie Barrett

NewApproach wrote: »

But he's right...

If he's going to be racing the horse, then it very much is in the punters interest to know.

NewApproach

Francie Barrett wrote: »

If he's going to be racing the horse, then it very much is in the punters interest to know.

It would also be in the punters interests to get access to all the data he has on the horses performance on the gallops, split times etc, but we don't expect or get that.

NewApproach

Gringo180 wrote: »

Why keep it a secret tho, if the horse is in foal what have they got to lose by telling the truth?

Nothing, but he says this sort of info and they we expect more and more. He can't win.

premierstone

Are those bleeding hearts who are giving out again about Willie actually aware that all the evidence points to , and is widely excepted by experts, that a mare will actually run better when in foal?

Aside from that Willie's first obligation is to the horse and secondly the owners, whether we as punters like it or not, that is the reality.

Itsdacraic

TheTorment wrote: »

I agree Mr Fallon. Willie should have let the people know. Bad form.

Having said that I think it was the ride Ruby gave her which got her beat.

You do realise horses in foal tend to perform better due to the increased levels of hormones in their body?

kiers47

Ye do realise lads that the horse was in season(in heat) not in foal. Big difference.

faoile@n

kiers47 wrote: »

Ye do realise lads that the horse was in season(in heat) not in foal. Big difference.

You do realise that Mullins was only asked if she was in foal.

Quevega may have run before while being in season and it may not have been a concern to Mullins so there might not have been any need to mention it.

She ran a cracking race anyway and only for a bad jump two out would have won.

Softer ground and she would have won on the bridle imo.

NewApproach

What evidence is there mares run better when in foal?

kiers47

faoile@n wrote: »

You do realise that Mullins was only asked if she was in foal.

Quevega may have run before while being in season and it may not have been a concern to Mullins so there might not have been any need to mention it.

She ran a cracking race anyway and only for a bad jump two out would have won.

Softer ground and she would have won on the bridle imo.

I didn't say one bad thing about willie Mullins on this thread in fact I was the first to point out what he said in thT interview.

premierstone

kiers47 wrote: »

Ye do realise lads that the horse was in season(in heat) not in foal. Big difference.

I didn't actually, apologies I thought She was already in foal, my second point still stands though and Mullins has nothing to be sorry for in the slightest, people talking through their pockets!

premierstone

NewApproach wrote: »

What evidence is there mares run better when in foal?

Like most things in Sport the evidence is not 100% but most credible studies done o it have found that the increased hormone levels in the mare improves performance and in particular increases stamina, below is one of the first articles I recall reading on the subject, there have been counter arguemnts that its merely a coincidence but the very vast majority agrtee that there is a benefit -

BLOODSTOCK DESK
Published: 06/07/2007 (Sport) By Rachel Pagones
DO FILLIES and mares run better when pregnant? The thesis that they do, most recently raised by Racing Post columnist Alan Sweetman last month and fiercely discussed in online forums, was given more support on Wednesday when Redstone Dancer won the Group 3 Irish Stallion Farms EBF Brownstown Stakes.
In foal to Refuse To Bend, the five-year-old returned 4-1 when recording her first stakes win, leaving three previous black-type winners in her wake.
The answer is clearly significant to punters, to whom racing is obliged to supply such minutiae as whether the horse is wearing a tongue-tie, as Enid Ormerod pointed out in Wednesday's Chatroom. But trainers and owners may also want to take note, according to Professor Twink Allen of the Equine Fertility Unit in Newmarket.
That is because the answer is yes, fillies and mares do have a racing advantage when pregnant. "Progesterone is a mildly anabolic hormone. That means it builds muscle, it builds condition, it makes you feel good and it builds appetite," says Allen. "And progesterone is the dominant hormone of pregnancy."
Further anecdotal evidence of pregnancy's benefits is provided by Silence Is Golden's short-head second in the 2004 Group 1 Nassau Stakes. The race was run on July 31, and the mare, just a week shy of the 150-day pregnancy limit imposed by the rules of racing, would have been handicapped by about 15lb of foetus and foetal fluid, according to Allen. Yet she recorded by far the highest RPR of her career, 115, eight months before giving birth to a filly by Medicean.
Although Silence Is Golden's pregnancy was well advanced, she would not have had an advantage over a mare who was running earlier in her pregnancy, says Allen. "I don't think we have any evidence that more progesterone is better. The benefit is that it is constant."
The performance benefits of pregnancy are more subtle than those obtained by injecting horses with anabolic steroids - a banned practice. "As an anabolic agent it's mild compared to agents we inject," says Allen.
That is not to say the effects are insignificant, though. "All mares are cycling quietly during the summer months, but mostly they don't show it," says Allen. With cycling come the ups and downs well known to trainers, but a pregnant mare is not subject to these swings.
Research that Allen's team has done at the EFU suggests that a mare does not have to be pregnant to enjoy the benefits of not cycling.
While trying to find what causes a mare's uterus to recognise that it is pregnant, they infused a group of mares with a preparation containing estrogen in an oil solution, and found that nearly all the mares went into dioestrus, or a period of not cycling.
They then performed a control test, using a coconut oil medium without the estrogen. To their surprise, 90 per cent of the mares again went into dioestrus. Other types of vegetable oil proved to have the same effect. However, mineral oil, which is not plant-based, did not cause dioestrus; nor did estrogen in mineral oil, indicating that estrogen was not the active agent.
Allen and others have also found that placing a small plastic or glass ball, smaller than a ping-pong ball, into the uterus puts a stop on cycling. Although they do not know why it works, the technique is already used in various sport and performance mares, says Allen.
One theory for why the balls work is that simple physical movement causes maternal recognition of pregnancy. "In a normal pregnant animal, the embryo is moving around the uterus all the time for the first 17 days," says Allen.
He adds: "The bottom line is, it is very easy to kick a mare into prolonged dioestrus. If I was a trainer of fillies, I would want to take advantage of that."

Itsdacraic

Itsdacraic wrote: »

You do realise horses in foal tend to perform better due to the increased levels of hormones in their body?

As pointed out already she wasn't in foal.
Mares in season are tempermental and can be reluctant to train race or be themselves.

I'm not pocket talking either as I just watched the race.

NewApproach

premierstone wrote: »

Like most things in Sport the evidence is not 100% but most credible studies done o it have found that the increased hormone levels in the mare improves performance and in particular increases stamina, below is one of the first articles I recall reading on the subject, there have been counter arguemnts that its merely a coincidence but the very vast majority agrtee that there is a benefit -

I'm unconvinced to be honest. We only ever hear of the ones who happen to win when in foal. If there were thorough studies done with sufficient sample sizes it would be interesting though.

NaiveMelodies

Mullins has a duty to inform the punters? This is great news, since when?

I must have missed the memo.......