6 months into lease - things not working

Sadderday

Hi,

Just a Q about how you stand with EA and if you've had any similar experiences.

I know the realistic thing is to check EVERYTHING when you sign a lease but it was our first time so we were naive.... (please don't give me a lecture about what we should have done... we know now)

Anyway, a tiolet has been broken (wont flush) since we've moved in. We contacted the EA a few times, she got a plumber out to look twice, he didnt actually fix the issue and shes ignoring us now, we had a tiny leak in the roof after very heavy rain, we let her know and sent pics but she didnt respond, we took the lawnmower out today for the first time since we've moved in. (the back garden is REALLY soggy) so I've never been to the shed and the OH just had a quick snoop and kept coal there.

The lawnmower is in bits!, it's all bent and wont start. We moved in in Nov by the way, only have a bit of grass in the front but it needs a cut now that we are a bit into spring.

We dont need a lawnmower my parents live nearby and we can borrow theirs for the few mins it takes every so often. I let her know via email today but she didnt reply. I just didnt want to be held accountable.

I think I was viewing when she was completing the inventory with the last tenants and because of the state of the back garden (esp in winter) she didnt actually go to the shed, whether she did later I don't know.

If she knew about this, should she have told us?
Could we be held responsible for only mentioning it at this stage?

I'm reluctant to complain or make a fuss cos our rent was late twice since we moved in (by 24hrs) because SEPA and Change of pay date over Xmas. Which were explained but EA wasn't happy.

any advice?

The_Conductor

The toilet being broken- and leaking roof- are items that she has to organise to repair/fix. The lawnmower- if it wasn't noted as broken by you, when signing the lease- is unfortunately most probably going to come out of your deposit.

Contact the Estate agent- and hassle the hell out of them until the toilet and the roof are fixed. You may have been a day late with the rent twice- but you're not in arrears, so you are entitled to be treated as a tenant in good standing. Demand to have the toilet and the roof fixed- demand it.

Vis-a-vis the lawnmower- you live, you learn- realistically, you're going to pay for a replacement, come what may.

Sadderday

The_Conductor wrote: »

The toilet being broken- and leaking roof- are items that she has to organise to repair/fix. The lawnmower- if it wasn't noted as broken by you, when signing the lease- is unfortunately most probably going to come out of your deposit.

Contact the Estate agent- and hassle the hell out of them until the toilet and the roof are fixed. You may have been a day late with the rent twice- but you're not in arrears, so you are entitled to be treated as a tenant in good standing. Demand to have the toilet and the roof fixed- demand it.

Vis-a-vis the lawnmower- you live, you learn- realistically, you're going to pay for a replacement, come what may.

Thanks for the response. I know it has been our responsibility since we moved in and I'm annoyed that she either didn't check this and deduct from the last tenant or just left us to discover it. I'm 99.9% sure she did not check the equipment in the shed so I wonder if it came to a head when we move out if we may have grounds to dispute the cost.

We havent touched this lawnmower and its in a heap so she either isn't completing inventories or isn't bothered about anything in general.

As for calls being ignored and emails not responded to ... I don't want to be to demanding incase she ups the rent or goes against us getting our full deposit back later.

Would all of this info combined be worth anything to the tenants board considering we do take good care of the place and stick to our terms of the lease?

Sorry and Thanks for help

Bigcheeze

The_Conductor wrote: »

Vis-a-vis the lawnmower- you live, you learn- realistically, you're going to pay for a replacement, come what may.

Doesn't sound realistic at all to be honest. If they moved in November they'd have no reason to touch a landmower until now and it's not realistic to check the thing is working when you move in.

Mrs OBumble

Put the lawnmower back where you found it: if it wasn't checked on move-in, it most likely won't be checked on move-out either.

runawaybishop

Sadderday wrote: »

Thanks for the response. I know it has been our responsibility since we moved in and I'm annoyed that she either didn't check this and deduct from the last tenant or just left us to discover it. I'm 99.9% sure she did not check the equipment in the shed so I wonder if it came to a head when we move out if we may have grounds to dispute the cost.

We havent touched this lawnmower and its in a heap so she either isn't completing inventories or isn't bothered about anything in general.

As for calls being ignored and emails not responded to ... I don't want to be to demanding incase she ups the rent or goes against us getting our full deposit back later.

Would all of this info combined be worth anything to the tenants board considering we do take good care of the place and stick to our terms of the lease?

Sorry and Thanks for help

They cant up the rent whenever they like, it can only be reassessed every 12 months and must be in line with market rates. They cannot withhold your deposit without valid reason - i.e you wreck something. Put your issues on the roof and toilet (and lawnmower if you wish) in writing and give them a reasonable time to fix them. After that time you can either arrange for them to be fixed yourself (you cant fix it personally) and deduct the cost from the rent after providing receipts, again informing them of this in writing, or you can move out without penalty. Law is completely on your side about all of this, being late a day on two occasions means nothing.

Sligo1

If the lawnmower is taken out of the deposit and the tenant takes a case with the PRTB I would have thought the LL would have to provide dated photos of the state of the lawn mower when the tenancy commenced and when it terminated? If she can't provide this evidence surely the tenant would get their money back?

OP make sure you email her the state of the mower now stating this is how you found it. Just so you have a record of this if you ever need it.

Milly33

Just make sure to keep all emails and texts that you have sent her about the problems, including the lawnmowers maybe take a few pics of it also. We have a very slow landlord to do anything what we normally do is, send him a few emails letting him know and then just send him a mail or text saying we are going to get this fixed and take it off the rent, make a copy and send him on the receipt then when ye pay the rent.

Sometimes landlords tend not to answer back everything if they think you will be contacting them for every little thing, which it sounds like ye are not ye are just informing them others then just couldn't give a sugar once they have someone there..

odds_on

When you advise a landlord or his agent (i.e. estate agent in this case) you should ALWAYS put a time frame by when the problems should be remedied. A reasonable time should be given which is usually considered as 14 days. For more serious cases, such as a toilet not working correctly (especially if there is only one toilet in the property) would be 1-3 days.

The time frame should be clearly stated as either within 14 days of the date of this letter (email) or phrased as "by xxxxxxx" (such as by the 24th April 2014)

As regards the lawnmower, how was it described in the inventory? It should have been described as working, not started, as well as the overall condition of the machine.

Inventories are best completed by an independent inventory clerk. This is the best proof of the condition of items in a property and the property itself. A quality inventory, for a 3 bed house would consist of at least a 2 pages for each room plus a number of introductory pages. being an independent inventory clerk would also be more convincing to any PRTB adjudicator.

I have noted that with the UK deposit holders, which also act as adjudicators in disputes re deposits, that some will no longer fully accept photos as proof of the condition as some have found photos to have been "Photoshopped".

Sadderday

Sligo1 wrote: »

If the lawnmower is taken out of the deposit and the tenant takes a case with the PRTB I would have thought the LL would have to provide dated photos of the state of the lawn mower when the tenancy commenced and when it terminated? If she can't provide this evidence surely the tenant would get their money back?

OP make sure you email her the state of the mower now stating this is how you found it. Just so you have a record of this if you ever need it.

Thanks, I emailed her this morning with this exact mail:

We wished to contact you as (the OH) took the lawn mower from the shed this morning for the first time and it is in bad shape (bent bars etc) and wont start.

We have a picture if you require it, please note we don’t necessarily need a replacement urgently as we can borrow from family nearby but we wanted to make you aware so that we are not held responsible.

I understand you may know this already as you had went through an inventory prior to us moving in, just wanted to let you know.

---

I know you may not agree with me stating that it isn't an urgent problem but I just wanted to make it easier for her to respond 'ok, noted' so we pretty much have clarification of her being aware of it. I thought if I started getting stern about it she could turn on us,

odds_on

Make sure you do all communication in writing and keep a dated copy in case there is a dispute at the end of the lease period.

Gasherbraun

Sligo1 wrote: »

If the lawnmower is taken out of the deposit and the tenant takes a case with the PRTB I would have thought the LL would have to provide dated photos of the state of the lawn mower when the tenancy commenced and when it terminated? If she can't provide this evidence surely the tenant would get their money back?

OP make sure you email her the state of the mower now stating this is how you found it. Just so you have a record of this if you ever need it.

Exactly.

Did the agent provide you with a copy of an inventory for approval or otherwise? If not then there is no agreed inventory of the move in condition and the agent cannot realistically expect to attribute damage to yourselves as tenants.

One risk is that poor agents / landlords may try and claim that an inventory was provided even if it was not. Once again this is the beauty of hindsight but if a tenant does not receive an inventory for any reason they should always write to the person managing the tenancy recording the fact that no inventory was offered or agreed. I do not think it is a good idea for a tenant to offer inventory evidence - it is a landlord or their agent's job to do this - although it is wise to hold it in reserve for your future use if needed.

Until the Irish rental market matures and loses its air of distrust between landlord and tenant it will be a realm where tenants and landlords have to cover themselves to levels that are necessary but really should not be so in a mutually beneficial business arrangement.

As regards the defective toilet. This is a bog standard (pun intended ;-) repair that should take any competent plumber no time to fix at minimal cost. There is simply no excuse for such repairs not being done promptly.

Sadderday

Hi,

This is what is listed in the inventory

Shed
Lawn mower
Lawn trimmer
Snow shovel
Various garden tools for maintaining the garden


No mention of the lawnmower being broken above but it the bedroom the lamp is noted as:

Bedside light (broken)


On the lease it states:

c)Tenants to maintain the gardens.

and also this:

2.8 To take good care of the property and the furniture and equipment and to keep them all clean and tidy and not to do or allow anyone else to do any damage to them and to replace such of the furniture and equipment as may be destroyed, broken or damaged beyond repair with other articles of equal value to the Landlord’s satisfaction.


2.10 To report promptly in writing to the Landlord all defects in the property which it is the Landlord’s duty to repair.

2.13 To keep the garden tidy and well tended.

and this:

2.29a When the Tenancy ends to return possession of the property to the Landlord, leaving the property in the state which this Agreement requires the Tenant to keep it.





I should have checked the shed. I know. I signed this.

_Kaiser_

Just on the above.. I thought the landlord was the one responsible for keeping the gardens?

Either way, getting them to sort out the toilet and leaking roof would be my priority. If it was me , I'd send them an email with 7 days to resolve it (in light of the previous - ignored - attempts you've made) or you'll be escalating the matter through the PRTB and/or your solicitor

Only thing cowboy (and cowgirl!) landlords understand. Renting is a service and I'd be damned if I'd be paying good money to them while stuff like that is unresolved.

Just my opinion mind.. the "right way" may differ, but until we have a professional renting market in this country it's pretty much a free for all - sure in another thread here people are advocating stripping a house of all furnishing in lieu of a deposit! :eek:

Sadderday

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

Just on the above.. I thought the landlord was the one responsible for keeping the gardens?

Either way, getting them to sort out the toilet and leaking roof would be my priority. If it was me , I'd send them an email with 7 days to resolve it (in light of the previous - ignored - attempts you've made) or you'll be escalating the matter through the PRTB and/or your solicitor

Only thing cowboy (and cowgirl!) landlords understand. Renting is a service and I'd be damned if I'd be paying good money to them while stuff like that is unresolved.

Just my opinion mind.. the "right way" may differ, but until we have a professional renting market in this country it's pretty much a free for all - sure in another thread here people are advocating stripping a house of all furnishing in lieu of a deposit! :eek:

Thanks!, I'm not 100% on who really is responsible for the garden myself but the OH loves all that jazz so we dont mind. Its a shame the lawnmower is fe'cked but he borrowed my mams today and did it as she only lives minutes away.

I just do not want to be held responsible for the lawnmower if I can help it at all. I suppose its feasible to suggest that even if the EA did check the shed, she never tested it to see if it was working... (have pics of garden when we moved in, grass was overgrown and no evidence of walking to shed etc) ...

I hope that it can be realised that we hadn't tested it ourselves as we believed to have signed an agreement in good faith and hadn't expected to find the lawnmower broken when it came into Spring and was time to cut the grass.

I will give the EA until tomorrow to respond and hopefully she will be understanding of our story... at that point I will go ahead and tell her to get the toilet fixed and she should have somebody to check out the roof.