Is it difficult to get noticed in Ireland?

Chazz Michael Michaels

As opposed to, say, the UK? Would a band be better off leaving these shores to fulfill there ambitions?

I'm not in a band, just curious for your thoughts.

rgjmce

I think it depends on what kind of ambitions you have. Although knowing a few people who can get you some decent gigs is certainly a help.

It also depends on the style of music you play. I know a uk based metal band that are finding it very hard to have enough money to live on. They do have fans but still it's tricky.

I know metal isn't the best genre example though.

jane82

The average north dublin girl isnt interested in going to see some band thats not on mtv or doesnt have a hit single. I can only speak from experience and where I am.
The average north dublin man isnt interested in going somewhere with no women in it.
So getting a following isnt easy. Even getting somebody anybody to listen to a demo isnt easy.
So I would say here is not as easy as maybe 20 years ago but it wasnt all that easy 20 years ago but americanisation hadnt fully hit then.

rgjmce

jane82 wrote: »

The average north dublin girl isnt interested in going to see some band thats not on mtv or doesnt have a hit single. I can only speak from experience and where I am.
The average north dublin man isnt interested in going somewhere with no women in it.
So getting a following isnt easy. Even getting somebody anybody to listen to a demo isnt easy.
So I would say here is not as easy as maybe 20 years ago but it wasnt all that easy 20 years ago but americanisation hadnt fully hit then.

The good thing about this modern age, although most of it I don't agree with. It means you possibly have connection to a much wider audience but like anything else, takes hard and a bit of luck or just a whole lot of luck.

It does mean in theory that you can get a crowd more tailor fit to your style of music, could mean you are only a recording success rather than a live one though.

keyboardcook

It's a worldwide thing.

Bands from abroad will get a better audience out of their own country.

Easier to fill a venue abroad than in your own country.

It's not just an Irish thing.

rgjmce

keyboardcook wrote: »

It's a worldwide thing.

Bands from abroad will get a better audience out of their own country.

Easier to fill a venue abroad than in your own country.

It's not just an Irish thing.

Not true actually, if I band has a great following (although it needs to be huge) they can end getting signed etc and tour other countries that appreciate their music more.

Going Forward

A band has to be marketed.

It's a product the same as washing powder.

A few strokes, gimmicks, free gigs, a bit of sulphur, it's not rocket science.

It does help if there's some talent on board and some brains, not necessarily owned by band members.

Some genres are easier than others alright, a metal band is going to find it tougher to even find somewhere to rehearse!

miju

Going Forward wrote: »

A band has to be marketed.

It's a product the same as washing powder

after years upon years in the industry i can safely say this is a simple fundamental fact that 90% of Irish bands dont fully understand in the slightest and that's not including the other 9.5% of bands who think they do but don't.

my personal favorite is when bands cant make it here and decide to head to Germany or somewhere.

like really you cant get a top 10 in this country (so simple) but yet you somehow think you can break the highest European market. It always gives me a giggle.

Bottom line and harsh reality is that alot of bands failed to get noticed because they are simply not good enough and / or lack the work ethic

rgjmce

miju wrote: »

iBottom line and harsh reality is that alot of bands failed to get noticed because they are simply not good

I don't agree with that.

I think it's just cause we are such a small island that it's impossible for enough to diversity to come out. The majority of Ireland like Louis Walsh's reproduced crap and because he is a successful salesman Irish people somehow feel like they should be proud of him.

Although Ireland is a great place to learn your craft, certainly as far as live playing is concerned. The key is not to get bogged down when you aren't getting anywhere.

miju

rgjmce wrote: »

I don't agree with that.

I think it's just cause we are such a small island that it's impossible for enough to diversity to come out. The majority of Ireland like Louis Walsh's reproduced crap and because he is a successful salesman Irish people somehow feel like they should be proud of him.

Although Ireland is a great place to learn your craft, certainly as far as live playing is concerned. The key is not to get bogged down when you aren't getting anywhere.

Your entitled to disagree but I've lost count the amount of times I have heard this rationale offered as a reason for a band / musician struggling here with original material.

Like it / lump it / disagree with it but it is the cold hard truth of the matter. Give me an example of a band that are Irish and "good" and are not doing as well as they should be.

rgjmce

miju wrote: »

Your entitled to disagree but I've lost count the amount of times I have heard this rationale offered as a reason for a band / musician struggling here with original material.

Like it / lump it / disagree with it but it is the cold hard truth of the matter. Give me an example of a band that are Irish and "good" and are not doing as well as they should be.

I agree that a lot of bands don't "produce" their music as well and it does move anywhere or have a good message even. It's cause kids these days think it's easy to make a hit record or a good song.

As far as examples, The answer haven't exactly been heard of, although they are northern so not sure that counts. Another example would be primordial, they are huge in scandinavia, I'm a metal fan but not one of theirs. I'll admit it's not my thing but plenty of people love it.

It can never be explained why a good band is good. It might not even be the music that makes them that. I just find Ireland doesn't even give the "growing" bands a chance.

In Ireland music is a business, end of. At least when it comes to the big acts anyway.

miju

rgjmce wrote: »

In Ireland music is a business, end of. At least when it comes to the big acts anyway.

its the same around the world which is why its called an industry

rgjmce

miju wrote: »

its the same around the world which is why its called an industry

Does no one do it for the love of it anymore though? certainly in Ireland this could be debated to be true.

Going Forward

rgjmce wrote: »

I don't agree with that.

I think it's just cause we are such a small island that it's impossible for enough to diversity to come out. The majority of Ireland like Louis Walsh's reproduced crap and because he is a successful salesman Irish people somehow feel like they should be proud of him.

Although Ireland is a great place to learn your craft, certainly as far as live playing is concerned. The key is not to get bogged down when you aren't getting anywhere.

Shouldn't such a small island be easy to crack then?

All successful managers/promoters/impressarios are good sales people, it's nothing to be suspicious of!

Again, different genres will be easier to succeed with, 'pop' is mass marketable with good potential, and it does not require re-inventing the wheel.

rgjmce

Going Forward wrote: »

Shouldn't such a small island be easy to crack then?

All successful managers/promoters/impressarios are good sales people, it's nothing to be suspicious of!

Again, different genres will be easier to succeed with, 'pop' is mass marketable with good potential, and it does not require re-inventing the wheel.

It would seem so but writing a hit song is harder than it seems. It's either case of the fact people feel silly writing something like that, doubtful cause I'd plenty do try.

The far more likely thing is that it's really hard and anyone here who thinks writing a good catchy song (in any genre) is easy is sadly mistaken.

Going Forward

rgjmce wrote: »

It would seem so but writing a hit song is harder than it seems. It's either case of the fact people feel silly writing something like that, doubtful cause I'd plenty do try.

The far more likely thing is that it's really hard and anyone here who thinks writing a good catchy song (in any genre) is easy is sadly mistaken.

Definitely true, nor is it not easy to get a good combination of genuinely interested workwise group personnel who also happen to possess a natural ability to rattle off hit songs, but bands often reject covers as a way of launching/boosting their careers.I wouldnt recommend any band to let artistic pride get in the way of "taking ownership" of a cover, in their own style.

(Pity Bell x1 wouldnt just cover a few Talking Heads songs instead of.....:eek:)

Quite a number of respected "hits" over the decades have just been updated re-workings of 20 or 30 year old songs, long forgotten and probably never even heard by today's listener. Most listeners are not terribly discerning, IE if a song/band sounds good, they'll be happy.

maccored

I agree with miju - good tunes have to be the first and foremost things, and not too many bands have those.

miju

rgjmce wrote: »

The far more likely thing is that it's really hard and anyone here who thinks writing a good catchy song (in any genre) is easy is sadly mistaken.

Which brings me back to my earlier point lack of work ethic. You see a successful band who are good and talented and deserve it.

You also see successful bands who are middle of the road at best who also deserve success because although they might not be as good they have worked their asses off to get there.

I've seen bands who have gotten "the deal" think they are on their way and who at the end of the day fall flat because they don't put in any work after "the deal". I've equally seen bands dropped from likes of Universal / Parlaphone after working their asses off and though talented as fook they just couldnt generate sales but then again they should have stayed independent in the first place in relation to this particular UK band.

rgjmce

maccored wrote: »

I agree with miju - good tunes have to be the first and foremost things, and not too many bands have those.

It might what you look for, bands/artists can get by by other means though. I mean I love a great live band which people these days don't seem to get point of. You go to see a band live for something different something special, it drives me up the wall when people when a singer or whoever was great live cause they sounded like the cd......waste of money just listen to the cd if that's what you're after.

Also my real point is that a band can become famous without substance, jedward one example and kiss another in my opinion. They were a great live band and put on a show (which no one does anymore).

miju wrote: »

Which brings me back to my earlier point lack of work ethic. You see a successful band who are good and talented and deserve it.

Yeah you've got to work hard regardless, kids these days don't get that at all. Although yes the record companies don't make it easy, then again you can do well without a record company these days. It's not easy but neither is getting a record deal, so either way you'll still have to put in a lot of hard work.

maccored

rgjmce wrote: »

It might what you look for, bands/artists can get by by other means though. I mean I love a great live band which people these days don't seem to get point of. You go to see a band live for something different something special, it drives me up the wall when people when a singer or whoever was great live cause they sounded like the cd......waste of money just listen to the cd if that's what you're after.

Also my real point is that a band can become famous without substance, jedward one example and kiss another in my opinion. They were a great live band and put on a show (which no one does anymore).

Jedward are entertainers - not a band. Would you go to see a live band that played crap songs well? Quick answer is no you wouldnt, regardless of how good they are live. Theres just too many mediocre bands out there to get anywhere being a good mediocre one. the only thing songwriters can do to get noticed is write good songs.

Leftyflip

It doesn't matter how good the songs are, if you can't play them live, with a good live show, with a good image and energy, people won't respond.

I've seen bands with terrible songs get a great reception because they looked and played the part, they were tight and entertaining to watch. And I've seen bands with amazing songs just stand there and do nothing, there was nothing to captivate you.

You have to have that good mix of an entertaining live show, good songs and a good image. Then behind all that you have to market yourselves, get out there, get to singer songwriter nights, showcases, other gigs, support artists and make your contacts. Get a some decent promo shoots done, have something on your social media pages to actual give to the fans, links to music or a video or something.

I hate being invited to X, Y or Z band's Facebook page to read "hard rock band from Dublin" and see a few grainy phone pictures of the band drinking beer or doing stupid ****.

You have to give big time to get in the industry. And always remember where you came from, just because you started selling out venues that hold 300-500 people does not mean you're God's gift to Earth, when you start being a cock about that stuff, people will lose interest pretty fast.

jane82

Ive seen a fair few bands make it that arnt much use live. They could play their songs cleanly though.
There are two industries at play here. The rockstar selling albums is the first one. What people dont realise is the great party life they are living and the admiration they receive makes a whole other industry.
It makes instruments sell. Every kid with a guitar gets a pile of pedals before they can play anything now. Photographers are hired for band pictures. Venues are booked and paid for so 4 lads can play infront of their parents and a girlfriend or two.
If you want to get noticed give off the vibe that you are making alot more money than you are, sadly it makes people interested and start to root for you.

rgjmce

jane82 wrote: »

Ive seen a fair few bands make it that arnt much use live. They could play their songs cleanly though.
There are two industries at play here. The rockstar selling albums is the first one. What people dont realise is the great party life they are living and the admiration they receive makes a whole other industry.
It makes instruments sell. Every kid with a guitar gets a pile of pedals before they can play anything now. Photographers are hired for band pictures. Venues are booked and paid for so 4 lads can play infront of their parents and a girlfriend or two.
If you want to get noticed give off the vibe that you are making alot more money than you are, sadly it makes people interested and start to root for you.

Well I don't think this discussion is about them kind of bands and I agree that if a band has great songs they can still be successful and good live because of that. That is a different vibe though it depends what you're into and what you prefer.

guitarzero

Honestly, if you got the goods I doubt it matters, in fact you dont even need to be that good and you can still get noticed, Riptide Movement for example. Word gets around regardless, if there's any buzz surrounding a band it tends to travel a bit.

Stereomaniac

All it takes is for one band to set a trend every so often, in my opinion. Then if other bands sound similar they can often ride the coattails so to speak. Kodaline. The Riptide Movement. Etc.