Do all Homeplugs only have a 100mb port?

the_syco

Hey all,

Looking at the various 500mb Homeplugs, but finding they all have only 10/100mb connections.

€109 NETGEAR Powerline XWNB5201
€88 Linksys PowerLine PLWK400 (seems better than the one above)
€176 Devolo dLAN 500 AV Wireless+ Starter Kit
The Devolo has one gigabit homeplug and a 3*100mb port homeplug.

Thus I'm trying to figure out the benefits of them being 500mb, but with a 100mb port? True, at the moment I only have 50meg Eircom fibre, but do wonder if the above are of any use?

maki

You can find homeplugs with Gigabit Ethernet ports, but you do pay a premium for them.
The reason they mostly have Fast Ethernet ports is that the technology isn't anywhere close to 100% efficient. A 500Mb homeplug network is looking at 150Mb actual throughput at the very best. Factoring in distance and copper wiring quality, you're going to get a lot less that that.
I'm using 500Mb homeplugs to go up two floors in my house and I'm only getting about 70Mb at best.

So essentially the reason they're 10/100 ports is because they're cheap, and because the vast majority of people won't even be able to reach those speeds.

the_syco

maki wrote: »

I'm using 500Mb homeplugs to go up two floors in my house and I'm only getting about 70Mb at best.

Can I ask how you tested this, as I'd be interested to know the speed that I'm getting now.

riclad

most NET connections in ireland are maybe 20-50meg ,
I Cant think of a time where i,d need to download a file faster than 20meg per second.
10/100 should be fine for ordinary internet use.
The fastest download i got ever was 6meg/ per second.

http://www.speedtest.net/
click on ireland ,to test your net acess speed.
Most people use wifi, which will give a reduced speed depending on distance to router.
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/realworld/388024/how-to-get-broadband-to-a-garden-office

ALOT of info here ,re setting up a homeplug network.

maki

the_syco wrote: »

Can I ask how you tested this, as I'd be interested to know the speed that I'm getting now.

I'm on UPC 120Mb so I'm able to test it fairly easily. I get 120Mb downstairs when connected directly via ethernet using a speedtest, but only 70Mb when using homeplugs.

I suppose if you wanted to test it without having that much incoming bandwidth you could do a file transfer from one computer connected via homeplugs to another connected directly to the router.

vibe666

Everyone's internet is different. Plenty of people with UPC up to 200Mbps, and I've got 100Mbps ftth myself

The 500Mbps is a very liberal interpretation of the theoretical maximum full duplex speed, I.e. it counts a potential maximum 250mbps download and a 250Mbps upload as that 500Mbps speed, but that is lab conditions under absolutely perfect configurations with perfect and very short cabling.

Even with gigabit ports, a lot of people still aren't going to get above 100Mbps out of a 500Mbps homeplug within their home wiring, which is why the cheaper ones don't bother with them in the first place.

As an example, I had 200mbps ones and never got more than 30mbps out of them in my home, no matter what I tried.

the_syco

vibe666 wrote: »

Even with gigabit ports, a lot of people still aren't going to get above 100Mbps out of a 500Mbps homeplug within their home wiring, which is why the cheaper ones don't bother with them in the first place.

As an example, I had 200mbps ones and never got more than 30mbps out of them in my home, no matter what I tried.

Cheers for the reply.

Currently have the 85 homeplugs, which are the most basic, and find that any sort of streaming has a good bit of shuttering and buffering. They were the Homeplug 1.0 (2001 tech) however, and I wonder how the Homeplug AV (2005 tech) will be better. Most of the homeplugs in the market atm (200 & 500) are Homeplug AV.

The Gigabit homeplugs are seemingly Homeplug AV2 (2012 tech), but look expensive.

vibe666

from what i understand, the newer the homeplug technology in use, the better the error correction etc. will be, so although you're never going to see anything like the advertised speeds, you might get more than the increase you'd expect from going to 85mbps to 200mbps or 500mbps ones than the numerical speed indications on the box.

Cuddlesworth

the_syco wrote: »

Cheers for the reply.

Currently have the 85 homeplugs, which are the most basic, and find that any sort of streaming has a good bit of shuttering and buffering. They were the Homeplug 1.0 (2001 tech) however, and I wonder how the Homeplug AV (2005 tech) will be better. Most of the homeplugs in the market atm (200 & 500) are Homeplug AV.

The Gigabit homeplugs are seemingly Homeplug AV2 (2012 tech), but look expensive.

The current 500's average between 60-90 Mbps, the 200's around 40-60 Mbps. But with certain devices active or going over plug adapters, their speed can drop. My 500's currently can't do better than 40,when my 200's manage the same. So clearly my wiring is an issue.

vibe666

i've been told that some energy saver light bulbs and other electrical devices (microwaves and that kind of thing) can create a lot of electromagnetic noise within your home wiring loop, which can affect how well your homeplugs work and i know that jumping to a different circuit (i.e. upstairs to downstairs if they are on a separate fuse in your fuse box) can cause a big drop, versus the speed from devices on the same circuit but a lot of it is anecdotal, so don't take it as the gospel truth.

srsly78

OP there are homeplugs with gigabit ports, the very latest models. You have to read the smallprint very carefully to confirm this.

For example: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Devolo-dLAN-500-Wireless-Starter/dp/B00A67I5EK (see feature matrix, search for gigabit)

I have the version previous to this, with 100mbit ports - which is bottlenecking my lan speed. My internet is only 17mbit so I'm not that bothered tho

To test LAN speed do an ftp or filecopy across your network, do not use an INTERNET speed test.

WillyFXP

If talking gigabit, you also must remember that ALL devices in the network must be gigabit, otherwise all devices default to 10/100 anyway, so unless you have a full gigabit network, then getting any device over 10/100 is moot.

srsly78

Not generally correct. 100mbit devices can connect to gigabit switches, at 100mbit. They should not affect other links tho.

When was the last time you saw a 100mbit ethernet card anyway?

WillyFXP

srsly78 wrote: »

OP there are homeplugs with gigabit ports, the very latest models. You have to read the smallprint very carefully to confirm this.

For example: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Devolo-dLAN-500-Wireless-Starter/dp/B00A67I5EK (see feature matrix, search for gigabit)

Already in OP.

srsly78

No, the op did not spot there are many different models of the Devolo.

"**=dLan AVtriple+ and dLan 500 AVplus have Gigabit Ethernet connectivity"

WillyFXP

srsly78 wrote: »

Not generally correct. 100mbit devices can connect to gigabit switches, at 100mbit. They should not affect other links tho.

When was the last time you saw a 100mbit ethernet card anyway?

The vast majority of ISP supplied routers have 10/100 ports, even many new routers with so called superfast dual channel wifi are STILL being supplied with poxy 10/100 ports. This is why I said about the gigabit speed dropping to 10/100 when connected, I would imagine very few people will go out to buy a dedicated gigabit switch when they have 4 ports sitting empty on their modem/router.

srsly78

I was referring to the clients, not to the switch. Of course a 100mbit switch will mean 100mbit network.

Most people end up installing their own router anyway, as the UPC one is garbage.

riclad

Lets say you have 50meg, per sec internet speed,
i cannot see the point of getting 1000meg homeplug,
cos 50meg is the max speed you,ll get.
i used homeplug ,it worked fine, on youtube, rte player, etc
I never tested the speed.
And all isps in ireland have a download cap ,of various levels.
i,d say 10/100 is fine for 99 per cent of home users.
i know a few people with upc, they just used the net for facebook,youtube,casual browsing , until they got a netflix subsciption.
ITS like hdtvs, a standard hdtv is fine for most people,
not much point in buying a 4k tv at the moment.

WillyFXP

riclad wrote: »

And all isps in ireland have a download cap ,of various levels

Not cap, fair usage policy. I very much doubt any ISP will cap if bandwidth is used for legal streaming, no matter how much they use ( with exception of Magnet).

riclad

Call it what you want, if i go over a certain amount, in gigabyte usage,
i get an email warning,from the isp.

AlmightyCushion

If you plan on using the plug sockets beside the one the home plug is connected to get home plugs with a power socket on then for pass through filtering. I was getting 60 when using ones with out pass through, I get near 100Mb when using the ones with pass through.

The ones I have have gigabit Ethernet on them as well.

riclad

SO as far as i can tell theres ,no advantage to using a gigabyte homeplug,
as most people in ireland are on 50meg max network connection,
unlike some countrys which have 300meg broadband connections.
I,M not an electrician, the homeplug speed maybe effected by the quality of the electrical wiring in your home.

AlmightyCushion

riclad wrote: »

SO as far as i can tell theres ,no advantage to using a gigabyte homeplug,
as most people in ireland are on 50meg max network connection,
unlike some countrys which have 300meg broadband connections.
I,M not an electrician, the homeplug speed maybe effected by the quality of the electrical wiring in your home.

I have 200Mb broadband as do some of my friends. There are plenty of people with UOC who have better than 100Mb broadband so there are advantages to them.

srsly78

Some people also want to have gigabit lan, nevermind anything to do with their internet speed.

riclad

OK, i thought 50 meg was the max speed you could get in ireland .
ITS good to know someone can get 200meg broadband in ireland.

the_syco

riclad wrote: »

Lets say you have 50meg, per sec internet speed,
i cannot see the point of getting 1000meg homeplug

Two reasons. The first being upgradability. I've had these homeplugs since I was on 5meg BB. If buying another set, I'll use them until they die.

The second is transfer of data from my PC to my media player. It currently transfers data currently transmits at 1000KB/sec, give or take 50KB/sec, so a 320MB file takes 6 or 7 minutes. Transferring over a film takes maybe half an hour. Would prefer a quicker transfer rate.

riclad wrote: »

And all isps in ireland have a download cap ,of various levels.

All ISP's have a price for unlimited.

riclad wrote: »

i,d say 10/100 is fine for 99 per cent of home users.

For those that don't need low speed and/or low latency, wireless will do them just fine.

the_syco

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

If you plan on using the plug sockets beside the one the home plug is connected to get home plugs with a power socket on then for pass through filtering. I was getting 60 when using ones with out pass through, I get near 100Mb when using the ones with pass through.

The ones I have have gigabit Ethernet on them as well.

Interesting to know, esp as the plugs next to both have multiple plug sockets next to them. How much were the gigabit homeplugs, and where did you get them from?

AlmightyCushion

the_syco wrote: »

Interesting to know, esp as the plugs next to both have multiple plug sockets next to them. How much were the gigabit homeplugs, and where did you get them from?

They're Netgear XAVB5601 according to the box. I think they were about €120. I'm not using them any more, ended up swapping them for ones with WiFi built in. I was thinking of putting then up on adverts if you're interested.

vibe666

riclad wrote: »

Call it what you want, if i go over a certain amount, in gigabyte usage,
i get an email warning,from the isp.

not any more, most ISP's offer a truly unlimited service offering now with no FUP/AUP, at least with their higher speed products, including UPC, Sky Broadband and others.

I'm on magnet 100mbps fibre myself and they've never sent me any letters.

Nonoperational

riclad wrote: »

most NET connections in ireland are maybe 20-50meg ,
I Cant think of a time where i,d need to download a file faster than 20meg per second.
10/100 should be fine for ordinary internet use.
The fastest download i got ever was 6meg/ per second.

http://www.speedtest.net/
click on ireland ,to test your net acess speed.
Most people use wifi, which will give a reduced speed depending on distance to router.
http://www.pcpro.co.uk/realworld/388024/how-to-get-broadband-to-a-garden-office

ALOT of info here ,re setting up a homeplug network.

Are you mixing up megabits and megabytes?

Anyway, there are more reasons than download with streaming media and file transfer very important to some people.

srsly78

I got an AUP letter from upc last year, when I asked on phone there was no unlimited product. We were averaging about 700GB per month (house with 4 lads on 30mbit connection).

vibe666

srsly78 wrote: »

I got an AUP letter from upc last year, when I asked on phone there was no unlimited product. We were averaging about 700GB per month (house with 4 lads on 30mbit connection).

not any more, they had to bring out a 'proper' unlimited service because sky broadband brought out their own broadband with no limits.

the_syco

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

They're Netgear XAVB5601 according to the box. I think they were about €120. I'm not using them any more, ended up swapping them for ones with WiFi built in. I was thinking of putting then up on adverts if you're interested.

Ah, no. The one not plugged into the router has to have wireless (for laptops and phones), as the router box is behind a thick wall.

BArra

Bumping this thread, I've got Vodafone fibre in, getting 95mb down. WiFi and 200mbps homeplug only get around 45mb download speed.

What options do I have to get full speed, WiFi won't, 200mbps homeplugs won't.

And with the 500mbps plugs bottlenecked I'm confused what to do?

Ethernet direct to the hub isn't viable

Gadgetman496

You can get Gigabit 1000Mbps HERE:

BArra

Thanks but if the Vodafone hg658c only has 100mb ports it wouldn't do me much good or do I have it understood wrong?

Khannie

BArra wrote: »

Thanks but if the Vodafone hg658c only has 100mb ports it wouldn't do me much good or do I have it understood wrong?

Yeah, if the router / switch is limited to 100Mbps, that's all you'll ever get.

AlmightyCushion

BArra wrote: »

Bumping this thread, I've got Vodafone fibre in, getting 95mb down. WiFi and 200mbps homeplug only get around 45mb download speed.

What options do I have to get full speed, WiFi won't, 200mbps homeplugs won't.

And with the 500mbps plugs bottlenecked I'm confused what to do?

Ethernet direct to the hub isn't viable

Ones that have AC passthrough will give you much better speeds if you are using the power sockets next to the powerline adapter.

BArra

what difference does ac passthrough give? it just means you dont lose a plug socket?

AlmightyCushion

BArra wrote: »

what difference does ac passthrough give? it just means you dont lose a plug socket?

Yes, but it also filters anything plugged into it to reduce interference and increase speeds.

Cuddlesworth

BArra wrote: »

what difference does ac passthrough give? it just means you dont lose a plug socket?

As above you save a socket but it also limits the interface the device has to sort through, then tend to work better as most people drop their home plug into a power strip. If you don't, then its unlikely they will help.

If your getting 50Mbps with AV200 homeplugs then you should be able to reach 100Mbps with a pair of AV600. Just don't use the 200's with them.

AlmightyCushion

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

As above you save a socket but it also limits the interface the device has to sort through, then tend to work better as most people drop their home plug into a power strip. If you don't, then its unlikely they will help.

If your getting 50Mbps with AV200 homeplugs then you should be able to reach 100Mbps with a pair of AV600. Just don't use the 200's with them.

I never used my home plugs with a power strip, yet my AC passthrough home plugs gave me a big speed boost over the other ones I was using before. I was using the socket beside the home plug whereas now that is being plugged in to the home plug.