Consultants and doctors

Metal_Maiden

I have a condition called postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome. However most doctors here have never heard of it and some others use different terms, so I end up using vague terms like 'autonomic dysfunction' or 'orthostatic problems'. Basically it means whenever I'm standing my heart goes extremely fast, and I can faint. When it gets bad, like now, I have daily low fevers, and spend most of my time sweating and/or vomiting with chest pains, agitation and all sorts of horribleness. I was admitted to hospital a few days ago basically to recuperate a bit cos I couldn't stand at all, but then my doctor, who treated the condition when he was abroad, went away and I had to see a different guy.

Well. The thing with autonomic dysfunction is that none of the drugs currently work very well, and I haven't had any luck with them. There's basically nothing doctors can do for it sometimes, except physio or weekly IV saline infusions, neither of which are done in this country. So it's a chronic debilitating condition (or 'nuisance' as some docs say) that doctors can't do anything about, and they absolutely love those. So naturally docs who don't know much about it have to imply you're psychologically ill, because otherwise you should be able to handle it according to them. Like the guy today: 'you can have a pain in your leg, but some people perceive it worse than others'. I reminded him that he really has no idea what my condition feels like. I told him that before I was diagnosed I was on benzodiazepines (xanax, valium) for months, and while they made very calm and positive, they did nothing to help me stand. When I would take issue with something, he would ask his underlings 'is that what I said?' and they had to go 'No, no!' instantly. He demonstrated complete ignorance about my condition (saying for example that exercise didn't help it, which is the opposite of true according to all research ever), and instead of admitting it, he got sarcastic when I had to correct him. He walked away from my bed and down the hall going 'Wow. Wow.' In short, he was a ****, and I was feeling way too sick to put up with it. For the temperatures, he called them 'weird' and gave me a prescription for paracetamol (which I was already taking).

This is far from the first experience of this sort I have had, nor the worst, and I know others with any kind of chronic condition experience the same. My mom even had very rude, dismissive treatment from some when she had serious cancer. Why do they have to be like this? Some of them can manage to say 'I can't help much but I understand this is very difficult' but many can't. They feel that people should be able to ignore anything they can't treat. They act as if, if they can't treat it, it must be trivial or your fault somehow. They feel they have the authority to concoct all kinds of weird theories about your life, and you leave feeling utterly degraded sometimes. The lack of resources atm has made treatment of non-fatal conditions practically evaporate I know, but there's more to it than that. There is something truly wrong in the medical culture here.

(Btw, if anyone reading this has POTS and feel you could use some help, please message me as I'd like to see about setting up a support group in Ireland. Even if you're doing okay, I'd like to get an idea about numbers.)

c68zapdsm5i1ru

There are some very nice consultants out there but yes, some are very arrogant - either talking down to patients or using complicated jargon that the patient can't understand. I suppose there's people like that in every area of employment but because you're usually feeling worried and vulnerable when you're visiting a consultant that kind of behaviour really impacts on you.
I'm sorry you're having such a bad time of it.

'They' aren't all the same, and most of them are very caring.

In the public system many of them are very pressed for time and under extreme amounts of pressure, and it doesn't always make for a pleasant mood. It's no excuse, but sometimes you catch them on a bad day, just like everybody else.

Metal_Maiden

Candie, I wish that was it, but it's not. I never said they were all the same. Since I got sick, I have encountered a number of different types of doctors. Some who cared and try to help (the smallest group), some who think autonomic dysfunction is simply incurable but at least didn't patronise me, and some who were very rude. That last group has been about 25%, and higher amongst amongst hospital doctors. Try being a young woman with a slightly rare, chronic condition and see what kind of treatment you get.

Hitchens

there are a lot of fúckin' cocksuckers like him in the medical field

Outkast_IRE

Honestly I feel its partially to do with the ridiculous points it is in the leaving cert and the pressure that people going for high points feel the need to pick medicine. The result being a segment of them that are in medicine for the wrong reasons and ultimately don't really have much compassion or bed-side manners worth talking about.

There are some very good consultants out there who I couldn't fault. But like every other profession there are a good segment who would probably be happier doing other work but stay for the financial reward.

suicide_circus

my father has a medical condition, told by GPs and consultants here that nothing could be done and he would "have to learn to live with it". He decided against this sage advice and now visits his homeland (continental europe) every few months where he receives a broad range of innovative treatments and therapies (for free and no waiting list) and has vastly improved his quality of life. if he had listened to medical professionals here, he would likely be in a wheelchair by now.

JuliusCaesar

Yes I have encountered amazing patronising attitudes from consultants, when I went to see them as a patient. Incredible arrogance and talking down to me.

One left me furious as she contradicted me about something in my own field, something I'm a bit of an expert on, and all but said 'there, there' to me.

One contradicted me and then later in the consultation said exactly what I had said at the beginning, leaving the medical student and myself to gawp at each other behind his back.

I saw 4 consultants about the one problem; one was great, the rest patronising. The great one was absolutely awesome, though, and very nearly made up for the other three.

Metal_Maiden

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Honestly I feel its partially to do with the ridiculous points it is in the leaving cert and the pressure that people going for high points feel the need to pick medicine. The result being a segment of them that are in medicine for the wrong reasons and ultimately don't really have much compassion or bed-side manners worth talking about.

There are some very good consultants out there who I couldn't fault. But like every other profession there are a good segment who would probably be happier doing other work but stay for the financial reward.

Yes I would say that has a lot to do with it. Becoming a doctor in this country has little to do with wanting to help people. Some of them do want to do that, but not enough.

I have vast experience of consultants in most fields.

Some, quite a few in fact, have a "god complex". There's no doubt about it. There are even some specialties which will have a higher number of these god complex folk.

Overall though, in my experience, most consultants who I have dealt with care very much about their patients.

Adamantium

The best doctors are scientists and oddly enough when you're dealing with something as existence ending as cancer or plethora other problems, there bedside manners while comforting won't get cut out the cancer. You can't "feel" aka "pray" it away.

"Your feelings while important, are also entirely irrelvant to what I have to do"

Note: I've been down this road from personal experience.

It's about right action, right solution.

ABC101

Unfortunately there are difficult and awkward people in every profession.

I was speaking to a consultant once... just a general chat about a certain medical condition... and I happened to mention one of the "great evils".. I was looking up research of medical conditions on the internet.

I then got a lecture on how the internet is "dangerous" and not recommended for understanding health conditions. He then said.. "no need to look up the www... that's why you have me"...

Of course booking a 10 minute appointment with same such consultant was 150 euro a go.... !!!!!

There are "habitually condescending" people everywhere... unfortunately.

If you are unhappy with your Doctor or consultant.. then change if you can.

vicwatson

Whatever about some consultants, some of their secretaries are right aholes altogether, jumped up madams, grrrrrr

ABC101

ABC101 wrote: »

Unfortunately there are difficult and awkward people in every profession.

I was speaking to a consultant once... just a general chat about a certain medical condition... and I happened to mention one of the "great evils".. I was looking up research of medical conditions on the internet.

I then got a lecture on how the internet is "dangerous" and not recommended for understanding health conditions. He then said.. "no need to look up the www... that's why you have me"...

Of course booking a 10 minute appointment with same such consultant was 150 euro a go.... !!!!!

There are "habitually condescending" people everywhere... unfortunately.

If you are unhappy with your Doctor or consultant.. then change if you can.

If you are researching conditions online. I would only use peer reviewed papers.

polydactyl

It's cause most of the genuinely caring ones became paediatricians

Adamantium wrote: »

The best doctors are scientists

I serious don't agree with this however. These docs are just the ones who realised how much they hated patients/ were dreadful with patients and went for the science aspect (again obv not all).... Unless by doctors you meant people with a PhD not medical docs

OP there is no excuse for rudeness at all. Yes some of them have a god complex but hopefully most are approaching retirement for all our sakes.

" what's the difference between God and a medical consultant? God doesn't think he is a medical consultant"

Lucas Castroman

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Honestly I feel its partially to do with the ridiculous points it is in the leaving cert and the pressure that people going for high points feel the need to pick medicine. The result being a segment of them that are in medicine for the wrong reasons and ultimately don't really have much compassion or bed-side manners worth talking about.

There are some very good consultants out there who I couldn't fault. But like every other profession there are a good segment who would probably be happier doing other work but stay for the financial reward.

Indeed, the correlation between getting high points in your leaving cert and being an asshole is well documented.
Stupid people are invariably lovely.

Lucas Castroman

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Yes I have encountered amazing patronising attitudes from consultants, when I went to see them as a patient. Incredible arrogance and talking down to me.

One left me incandescent with rage as she contradicted me about something in my own field, something I'm a bit of an expert on, and all but said 'there, there' to me.

One contradicted me and then later in the consultation said exactly what I had said at the beginning, leaving the medical student and myself to gawp at each other behind his back.

If you're such an expert on your own condition why do you feel the need to attend this doctor.
It's obvious from your post why he/she might be irritated by you.

Adamantium

ABC101 wrote: »

Unfortunately there are difficult and awkward people in every profession.

I was speaking to a consultant once... just a general chat about a certain medical condition... and I happened to mention one of the "great evils".. I was looking up research of medical conditions on the internet.

I then got a lecture on how the internet is "dangerous" and not recommended for understanding health conditions. He then said.. "no need to look up the www... that's why you have me"...

Of course booking a 10 minute appointment with same such consultant was 150 euro a go.... !!!!!

There are "habitually condescending" people everywhere... unfortunately.


If you are unhappy with your Doctor or consultant.. then change if you can.

I was recently in London with THE top headache specialist in the world. When you get to that high level in any field, you will find quirks, eccnetricities.

I too mentioned some "objective research", based on a condition I DID have and am convinced I still do, TMJ, I have had a 24/7 completely one sided headache, eye grit pain. Life ruining. Haven't had a clear thought in over 4 years, dropped out of college, personality altering, anyway ....This is a problem I've wrote about on boards.ie several times

He basically told me to avoid looking up "Dr Google" as it could lead to trouble, ironically enough it was my internet research that lead to me him in the 1st place

I then mentioned the extraordinary memory problems whereby I literally can not recall what I said seconds ago and remarked to me "that note paper is also useful to me when I forget"

The flippancy was astounding, I never wanted the ground to swallow me up more

As a 22 year old man, soon to be 23, who has his late teens completely destroyed since I was 18, pretty much crying everyday, fighting like a warrior to keep my head above water; I was close to throttling him

Total lack of self awareness!

Going out the door he remarked "Don't let your whole life pass you by"

Internally I was thinking:
Gee I don't know,Thanks for reminding me of the eternal truth of my life that I think about every second, you patronising ****, I am fighting and my life is passing me by"

Adamantium

polydactyl wrote: »

It's cause most of the genuinely caring ones became paediatricians



I serious don't agree with this however. These docs are just the ones who realised how much they hated patients/ were dreadful with patients and went for the science aspect (again obv not all).... Unless by doctors you meant people with a PhD not medical docs

OP there is no excuse for rudeness at all. Yes some of them have a god complex but hopefully most are approaching retirement for all our sakes.

" what's the difference between God and a medical consultant? God doesn't think he is a medical consultant"

I agree with your points and some days I switch my own views and views similar to your own. It leaves me very disillusioned.

ABC101

Lucas Castroman wrote: »

If you're such an expert on your own condition why do you feel the need to attend this doctor.
It's obvious from your post why he/she might be irritated by you.

That was not my understanding of what the poster mentioned...

"as she contradicted me about something in my own field, something I'm a bit of an expert on"

As the posters own field could have been in electronics or engineering and not the medical condition itself.

fits

I was seeing one for several appointments once and on the last one, he actually ranted at me for five minutes about his secretary, checked me for five second (not exaggerating) and charged me 120euro for the pleasure. I dont think Id stand for it now, but they're a very exalted profession in Ireland and get away with all sorts as a result. (like the priests and bankers)

Xeyn

fits wrote: »

I was seeing one for several appointments once and on the last one, he actually ranted at me for five minutes about his secretary, checked me for five second (not exaggerating) and charged me 120euro for the pleasure. I dont think Id stand for it now, but they're a very exalted profession in Ireland and get away with all sorts as a result. (like the priests and bankers)

How exactly do you equate consultants and the acts of sexual abuse and the crippling downturn in the economy?

Arbiter of Good Taste

Xeyn wrote: »

How exactly do you equate consultants and the acts of sexual abuse and the crippling downturn in the economy?

Same lazy strawman, different day. That's how

fits

Xeyn wrote: »

How exactly do you equate consultants and the acts of sexual abuse and the crippling downturn in the economy?

Too much power is not a good thing. Being able to perform your work without it being questioned or critiqued except by your peers (friends) is not a good thing. I'll add law to the list too.

Fr_Dougal

Sounds like Lupus.

MisterAnarchy

I think this clip hits the nail on the head about consultants

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlWvk5CUD5w

Bazzo

As somebody who has met many many many consultants and worked in the medical field, not as a doctor, I couldn't disagree more.

The vast majority of consultants I came across were intelligent, professional, and caring individuals. Occasionally there were some assholes, people that didn't have a great bedside manner, or people who were just useless at their job, but it was a relatively small amount. I doubt I could put up with some of the abuse/legal threats/etc that some of those people got off patients they were often trying their best to help.

Muise...

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

Honestly I feel its partially to do with the ridiculous points it is in the leaving cert and the pressure that people going for high points feel the need to pick medicine. The result being a segment of them that are in medicine for the wrong reasons and ultimately don't really have much compassion or bed-side manners worth talking about.

There are some very good consultants out there who I couldn't fault. But like every other profession there are a good segment who would probably be happier doing other work but stay for the financial reward.

That's what nurses are for. Doctors do the intellectual, analytical stuff. Sometimes they overlap, but that's the general idea.

Lucas Castroman wrote: »

Indeed, the correlation between getting high points in your leaving cert and being an asshole is well documented.
Stupid people are invariably lovely.

Not sure if serious...

If not, I have snark-crush.

Dr conrad murray

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMUBoa0URlY

Red Nissan

You have a nearly unique syndrome, I can't comment at all.

Consultants in general are very arrogant and somewhat displeasing people, you WANT to fight them, you want to argue with them, but that is 'perhaps' part of their assessment.

I last argued with my cardiologist consultant and three weeks later had a triple heart bypass operation ~ so go figure.

From a month in hospital I now admire the guy immensely, he worked like 24 hours like a man possessed, I won't say robot, but he seemed to possess super human powers.

He is still an arrogant ass, though, I firmly believe that this is in fact part of the act.

Though, not always, as I suffered under another arrogant ass of a consltant, now dead, for my psoriasis, which, unlike my cardiologist [and surgical team saved my live physically], he was akin to the middle ages and leeches bleed everything cure-all and certainly unworthy of the title 'consultant'.

Nonoperational

I'd love if some of the people commenting here spent a week doing a consultants job and then posted their opinions on them. There are bad apples in every field but a big lot of them do a tough job well in ****ty conditions.


To be honest, for every one patient that has properly researched something and has a constructive input, there are 10 insisting they know it all when in reality they don't.

Metal_Maiden

Muise... wrote: »

That's what nurses are for. Doctors do the intellectual, analytical stuff. Sometimes they overlap, but that's the general idea.



Not sure if serious...

If not, I have snark-crush.

See it's not the bedside manner I have an issue with so much as the confident ignorance. Some of them will issue pronouncements on a condition they have barely heard of and never dealt with before. They act as if they know what they're talking about even if they completely don't. It doesn't bother me so much when they just admit 'I don't know'. I mean, it would be great if they tried to find out beyond the most basic of tests, or read even a brief summary of my condition, but I suppose this isn't, y'know, fairyland.

steddyeddy

Lucas Castroman wrote: »

If you're such an expert on your own condition why do you feel the need to attend this doctor.
It's obvious from your post why he/she might be irritated by you.

I could tell you more about the biochemistry of some illnesses than most consultants but I will still attend a doctor. Are people supposed to pretend not to be experts in case they make a consultant uncomfortable?

Czarcasm

steddyeddy wrote: »

I could tell you more about the biochemistry of some illnesses than most consultants but I will still attend a doctor. Are people supposed to pretend not to be experts in case they make a consultant uncomfortable?

Eddy it's the patients that think they're experts on their own illnesses that make everybody uncomfortable. The OP is a perfect example of this phenomenon. To tell a medical professional that they "really have no idea what my condition feels like", that's just arrogant, and to meet so many medical professionals that are so horrible, well, that's either incredibly unfortunate as to be odds on impossible, or far more likely that it's the attitude of the patient themselves that acts like a condescending know-it-all.

kupus

Czarcasm wrote: »

Eddy it's the patients that think they're experts on their own illnesses that make everybody uncomfortable. The OP is a perfect example of this phenomenon. To tell a medical professional that they "really have no idea what my condition feels like", that's just arrogant, and to meet so many medical professionals that are so horrible, well, that's either incredibly unfortunate as to be odds on impossible, or far more likely that it's the attitude of the patient themselves that acts like a condescending know-it-all.

No its not the the attitude of the patients. Ive had run ins in the past with doctors and i fully concur with the OP. A lot of them are t1ts.
They dont liked to be questioned on their authority and being made to look like a fool. and will start this condescending plamase sh1t that sends me up the wall even further.
And as for taking blame that they fcuked up. FOrget about it.

I seem to remember another group of people who thought they were infallible.
Maybe the doctors have taken on the mantle of the priests are always right mentality nowadays.
oh and one more thing i saw recently that doctors would not rat out another doctor if that doc was incapable of doing work. Gotta love the loyalty there over their patients customers well being.

Czarcasm

kupus wrote: »

No its not the the attitude of the patients. Ive had run ins in the past with doctors and i fully concur with the OP. A lot of them are t1ts.
They dont liked to be questioned on their authority and being made to look like a fool. and will start this condescending plamase sh1t that sends me up the wall even further.

Who DOES like to be questioned and made to look like a fool when they have at least seven years of study and probably ten more years of experience over one person that spent a few evenings poring over the internet and thinks that must mean they know better than the cardiologist, the neurologist, or the orthapaedic consultant that will see more people and research more information than that person ever will in their lifetime.

And as for taking blame that they fcuked up. FOrget about it.

And as for the arrogance of the patient thinking that they might NOT actually know better than the person that does this shìt for a living, forget about it indeed.

I seem to remember another group of people who thought they were infallible.
Maybe the doctors have taken on the mantle of the priests nowadays.

Yeah, completely the same thing of course.

pragmatic1

I find most consultants courteous and informative when asked. Some can be dismissing, but when you consider their level of expertise and the level of pressure they work under, I think they can be cut some slack.

JuliusCaesar

Lucas Castroman wrote: »

If you're such an expert on your own condition why do you feel the need to attend this doctor.
It's obvious from your post why he/she might be irritated by you.

I didn't say I was an expert on my condition, although I had read up the peer-reviewed papers on it - I was an expert on a related condition which is in my field. There is an overlap between medicine and psychophysiology (a field within psychology) you may be surprised to hear.

Adamantium

TheZohan wrote: »

Sounds like Lupus.

or Lyme disease, an incredible amount of lupus (and POTS for that matter) cases are now been revealed caused by misdiagnosed Lyme cases. Lyme has become known as "the great imitator", due to the vast amount of other conditions it resembles,as weLL as the furore in the US in particular over whether it is even a real thing. Greatest medical tragedy of the 21st century.

There are more 30 times more people been diagonsed with Long term Lyme than are HIV positive in the USA. It's in the 100's of thousands. I'll get the link to those statistics if I can.

Under our skin is a documentary on the epidemic and the war in the medical community over it.

To the OP, my intention is not to divert you from your current course of treatment or send you down any dark dead end alleys!

Adamantium

Czarcasm wrote: »

Eddy it's the patients that think they're experts on their own illnesses that make everybody uncomfortable. The OP is a perfect example of this phenomenon. To tell a medical professional that they "really have no idea what my condition feels like", that's just arrogant

The truth is never arrogant, when it's the truth. It's not like you have only one life..... oh wait a minute...

Czarcasm

Adamantium wrote: »

or Lyme disease, an incredible amount of lupus (and POTS for that matter) cases are now been revealed caused by misdiagnosed Lyme cases. Lyme has become known as "the great imitator", due to the vast amount of other conditions it resembles,as weLL as the furore in the US in particular over whether it is even a real thing. Greatest medical tragedy of the 21st century.

There are more 30 times more people been diagonsed with Long term Lyme than are HIV positive in the USA. It's in the 100's of thousands. I'll get the link to those statistics if I can.

Under our skin is a documentary on the epidemic and the war in the medical community over it.

To the OP, my intention is not to divert you from your current course of treatment or send you down any dark dead end alleys!

Too late for that now Adamantium, the OP will already have blithely ignored this part of your post and have a new tab open googling Lyme disease already, printed it out and ready to bring with them to shove it in their consultant's face in that "Up yours! This is what I have!" fashion.

MS.ing

doctor =/= consultant

just sayin, unless you know for a fact (rare) that he/she is, the chances are you are talking to one of the doctors on his team made up of different levels of seniority, which CONSULT with the consultant, thats why they are called that.

consultants are not the guys in the trenches (thats the doctors) they are the generals

Adamantium

MS.ing wrote: »

doctor =/= consultant

consultants are not the guys in the trenches (thats the doctors) they are the generals

It explains why many won't get their hands dirty, unless it's pull to your wallet, out of your face down in the mud cold dead corpse

davo10

Consultants are arrogant, self assured and have God complexes. And that's just the type of consultant I want treating me and my family.

I want him/her to feel that if I need surgery they can defy the odds and cure me, God can't do that. If I'm going in to surgery, I don't want them worrying about the patient they operated on before me or John who died this morning from complications. God doesn't answer a beeper at 3am when some kids come in to A&E without their limbs after a car crash or when Dad has a heart attack. HE isn't going to cure your cancer, bypass that blocked artery, put those bones back together the right way, restore your sight etc but that arrogant arsehole you dislike so much just might.

When I see a consultant I want him to make me believe that he/she can make me better, to inspire me with confidence by projecting an air of confidence in their opinions, I don't want them changing their opinion just because I tell them about some some research I googled, that wouldn't give me confidence.

I have GP and consultant friends and they tell me that the first 10 mins of an appointment are often spent convincing a patient what they don't have (google) before they can discuss the ailment they do have.

For all those who say Doctors are dispassionate or detached from their patients ask your self if you could go in to a room and do this, tell a family that despite the Doctors best efforts their son/daughter/mother/father etc has died from their illness/injuries. Sympathise with them while watching their lives fall apart, then leave the room, gather yourself for a moment and then go back to your job of treating sick people and saving lives. Maybe you could do that, I couldn't, maybe that's why they come across as uncaring?

In relation to the intelligence/points argument, sorry but I want a bright spark working on my children not someone who got a D in pass maths and who isn't good at problem solving.

Lastly, you are not paying €150 to see the consultant, you can do that for nothing in the public system, you are paying €150 to jump the que and see him/her in their private consulting rooms in weeks rather than months/years. The advice/diagnosis/treatment will be the same whether you pay or not.

MS.ing

Adamantium wrote: »

It explains why many won't get their hands dirty, unless it's pull to your wallet, out of your face down in the mud cold dead corpse

no its because they are a wealth of knowledge on their discipline, and so are the go to man for the doctors to learn from and for him to pass the knowledge on to for when he retires and an up and coming consultant steps in to fill his shoes. consultants teach doctors, by doctors consulting with them. its an exchange of ideas and experience and opinion.

when your doctor leaves the room he is consulting with colleagues alot of the time (if you are in a day clinic situation for one)

look Im not getting into this, they are a precious resource whether one realises or not, time is limited in hospitals, you (again one) are not the only patient he has, and without offending the drama lamas here, who are the ones coming across as the ones with the god complex, you have to just suck it up and trust his judgement, which is what its coming across in this thread. mistrust.

there are a number of phases of.......life altering news (grief)

denial
anger
bargaining
depression
acceptance

the sooner or later you come to terms with the cards you were dealt the quicker you get to acceptance.

Adamantium

MS.ing wrote: »

no its because they are a wealth of knowledge on their discipline, and so are the go to man for the doctors to learn from and for him to pass the knowledge on to for when he retires and an up and coming consultant steps in to fill his shoes. consultants teach doctors, by doctors consulting with them. its an exchange of ideas and experience and opinion.

when your doctor leaves the room he is consulting with colleagues alot of the time (if you are in a day clinic situation for one)

look Im not getting into this, they are a precious resource whether one realises or not, time is limited in hospitals, you (again one) are not the only patient he has, and without offending the drama lamas here, who are the ones coming across as the ones with the god complex, you have to just suck it up and trust his judgement, which is what its coming across in this thread. mistrust.

there are a number of phases of.......life altering news (grief)

denial
anger
bargaining
depression
acceptance

the sooner or later you come to terms with the cards you were dealt the quicker you get to acceptance.

It was a joke, jeez.

MS.ing

Adamantium wrote: »

You kicked my arse into touch, I will now use the losing mans retort. it was a joke jeez.

there we go.

Adamantium

MS.ing wrote: »

there we go.

Look I was trying to offer some levity to the OP and myself, the thread in general, and the OP's his/her ordeals in particular in what is an unimaginable situation and the harsh financial implications which (often) go along with it. Nobody writes a first post like that and does so for happy reasons.

Yeah you're an ass kicker, good for you. You think that was loss? That wasn't loss, if it was you've haven't lived! What exactly did I lose? Your respect? **** me I've been losing for years long before you!

Would you like to offer any help now that you're at sitting at a keyboard that a doctor couldn't otherwise offer at this hour of the night? It's not like the OP probably hasn't heard the 5 stages of grief ad nauseum already, who simply just wants to be heard and feel less alone in his/her predicament.

Next time you come to a thread try to be less presumptious and more sympathetic, hell why not have the novel idea of letting the said person grieve over the breakdown of their body, doesn't it say so in your five steps?

kupus

Czarcasm wrote: »

the OP will have a new tab open googling Lyme disease already, printed it out and ready to bring with them to shove it in their consultant's face in that "Up yours! This is what I have!" fashion.

Good heavens, imagine someone who has an opinion on whats wrong with them.
First rrule of business. the customer is always right. now the customer may be wrong 100% and maybe the biggest d!ck in the world but he's still right. Its upto the consultant to change the customers mind. Its up to the consultant to put the customer at ease and then treat customer in whatever way paossible.

davo10 wrote: »

Consultants are arrogant, self assured and have God complexes. And that's just the type of consultant I want treating me and my family.

I have no problem with people that are arrogant, self assured and have god complexes, I know quite a few people like that and its always a pleasure talking with them. Its even better when you get a few of them in the same room. you can see the fireworks from the moon.

THe problem I have is when the arrogance is not backed up by the quality of work. it just means your just another arrogant spoofer.

Czarcasm

kupus wrote: »

Good heavens, imagine someone who has an opinion on whats wrong with them.
First rrule of business. the customer is always right. now the customer may be wrong 100% and maybe the biggest d!ck in the world but he's still right. Its upto the consultant to change the customers mind. Its up to the consultant to put the customer at ease and then treat customer in whatever way paossible.

We've discussed this before y'know -

kupus wrote: »

so you are saying its ok for a doctor to do what they like instead of listening to you as a paying customer.

1st rule of business: the customer is ALWAYS RIGHT.

And my answer now is still the same as it was back then -

Czarcasm wrote: »

Except that a doctors surgery is not a business, and you are not a customer. You are a patient, and an uninformed one at that. The doctor has seven years of medical studies up on you for a start, and then they will see more colds, flus, etc, on a daily basis than you ever will.

As for your assertion that the customer is always right- no they sure as hell aren't, especially an uninformed or misinformed customer (such as those who "know their rights!" and misinterpret the sale of goods and services acts), or in this particular instance- a person who self diagnoses and presents with symptoms of emotional distress.

davo10

kupus wrote: »

First rrule of business. the customer is always right.

THe problem I have is when the arrogance is not backed up by the quality of work. it just means your just another arrogant spoofer.

I would presume the "back up" is the 20 years if training it typically takes to be a consultant. As for "spoofer", my guess is they would be found out before reaching consultancy status.

The first statement above is just BS, when it comes to medicine/sickness/injury, how is the "customer always right"?.