How to get car back on the road with car tax arrears?

narmst

I've been out of work for some time (doing some training to get a qualification to get something) and I've had the car off the road. I'm in Kildare and public transport to work isn't an option.

My car was last taxed in June 12 and the back tax / arrears is now about €1500.
I didn't declare the car off the road. In retrospect I know this was stupid but I was sending CVs while doing the course and hoped that I'd get something.
Anyway .. that's the situation and I have to deal with it.

My problem is that I can't afford the €1500 car tax but I still need to get the car on the road for interviews and hope to start back to work very soon (there's a few iron's in the fire).

I've asked at my local garage about the possibility of paying the arrears in stages at the motor tax office and he just laughed .. wondering if anyone know if they offer this options under any circumstance?

My other option would be to sell the car and buy a banger .. but really that isn't a runner as if I don't have the €1500 for arrears I don't have it for a banger.

The last options .. and this is why I'm writing .. I've read on the Irish Indo that there's been a huge jump in people selling their cars and the new owner not having to pay the past tax and arrears. Please don't write a lot of hate replies/spam saying I'm trying to avoid road tax .. I'm not .. if I could pay the arrears now I would .. if there was a way to pay in stages I would .. but without those options what can I do?

Does anyone know if it's possible to sell the car to a friend .. ask her to tax it for a year .. then buy it back? When I then go to tax it in my name would the arrears be waiting for me? Actually I don't mind if they are .. as that will give me the opportunity to save up and pay it .. again I'm not trying to avoid car tax .. but I'd like to know that it would be waiting because then I know I've got to put aside €125 per month to then tax the car in month 13.

If anyone knows any gottya's with this plan I'd appreciate it.
If anyone knows any way I can get my car on the road any other way again I'd appreciate it.

colm_mcm

What you're suggesting will work.
Doesn't make it right or moral or legal or whatever but it will work.

e.r

Put log book in spouse's name tax car from then simples.

chillywilly

I thought the new law brought in meant that the new owner was liable for any tax owed? Open to correction btw!

e.r

chillywilly wrote: »

I thought the new law brought in meant that the new owner was liable for any tax owed? Open to correction btw!

You could be dead right, my bro did it last year thou

SCOOP 64

chillywilly wrote: »

I thought the new law brought in meant that the new owner was liable for any tax owed? Open to correction btw!

No , the new owner isnt liable, so this may be away around it.

debabyjesus

chillywilly wrote: »

I thought the new law brought in meant that the new owner was liable for any tax owed? Open to correction btw!

Nope, clean slate. However, technically the seller would still be liable for the tax owed. Maybe they will close this loophole and start chasing back-tax as it's open to strategic 'selling' and buying back at the moment.

The_Honeybadger

I recently taxed a new (used) car that had been off the road a while, tax was out since September last year. There was no mention of arrears, had to pay from the date on the change of ownership. Maybe they will pursue the old owner for the arrears, I doubt it though.

mickdw

Just change ownership.
You were off the road so it's fair enough.
Mistake you made was not declaring it off road when new system came in.

bazz26

As said just transfer ownership to a spouse and then get him/her to tax it. Arrears don't stay with the previous owner or transfer to the new owner.

Just be aware of the insurance stance though, insurance companies normally want the registered owner to be the main policy holder. I'd be transferring registration back into your name not long after your spouse receives the new log book.

L-M

But also, in the eyes of the insurer, they see it as your car as soon as the moneys has been transferred...

Anyway, easiest option, sell it, regret said decision, buy it back.

It's not illegal.

CiniO

colm_mcm wrote: »

What you're suggesting will work.
Doesn't make it right or moral or legal or whatever but it will work.

Nothing illegal in selling a car to a friend and buying it back.

CiniO

mickeyk wrote: »

I recently taxed a new (used) car that had been off the road a while, tax was out since September last year. There was no mention of arrears, had to pay from the date on the change of ownership. Maybe they will pursue the old owner for the arrears, I doubt it though.

They won't chase him. No legal grounds for doing so.

CiniO

debabyjesus wrote: »

Nope, clean slate. However, technically the seller would still be liable for the tax owed. .

Seller wouldn't be technically liable for tax owed.
Person becomes due to pay motor tax arrears only at the moment of paying tax.
If car is sold, there is nothing due to be paid.

corktina

I beleive there is a mechanism for a car long term off the road from before the regs came in. Search the website, 'm sure you can do this properly.

wotswattage

What about once you buy it back?
Are you liable for the period during which you previously owned the car? I'd imagine not..

140490

I just did this thing last week, instead of paying 450 now i only have to pay 179 for new 3 months tax!! Happy days

dodzy

wotswattage wrote: »

What about once you buy it back?
Are you liable for the period during which you previously owned the car? I'd imagine not..

Your imagination is correct

wotswattage

First time for everything

pinky1312

Im in the same situation, how do you tax your car in the other name without an insurance policy number??

power pants

im about to sell the car to my friend then when the log book goes to his address, "buy" it back

not paying the €200 arrears I currently owe. pmsl

Atlantic Dawn

pinky1312 wrote: »

Im in the same situation, how do you tax your car in the other name without an insurance policy number??

You need an insurance policy.

power pants

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

You need an insurance policy.

They dont care, I didnt have my details back in Dec and he said, dont worry

Atlantic Dawn

power pants wrote: »

They dont care, I didnt have my details back in Dec and he said, dont worry

If you are doing it online you need to enter a number, however you can enter anything you like and it will let you through.

pinky1312

That's what I was wondering if I just put down any policy number will they check who's name the policy is in?

power pants

pinky1312 wrote: »

That's what I was wondering if I just put down any policy number will they check who's name the policy is in?

think they are just interested in the credit card details being correct tbh

Wicklabman

Same situation, but will I have to change my insurance aswell and then change it back to make it look like I'm starting a new policy?

quadrifoglio verde

Wicklabman wrote: »

Same situation, but will I have to change my insurance aswell and then change it back to make it look like I'm starting a new policy?

Nope just the tax but you can't be insured to drive a car you don't own.

Dee light1

Hi there, I'm in similar predicament to yourself and was wondering if you went with the changin ownership option? I was reading on independant.ie that it is not illegal and am thinking of going down that route as after being unemployed and now finding work I need car but can't afford the arrears.

Thanks a mill

Wicklabman

["Dee light1;91140235"]
Hi, I have literally just sent the tax book away this morning in my friends name . Not sure if it's better to to get my friend to tax it or change it back to my name and then tax it.

Dee light1

Hi there, after trawling internet and discussion boards it seems if your friend were to tax it would have to use an insurance policy number and that could b risky if it's stil insured on your policy. Looks like better to just send back without taxing and get back in your name again. Anything could have happened for "sale" to have went wrong and u had to take back car so general opinion and on independant.ie is nothing illegal being done. ?

Busted Flat.

narmst wrote: »

I've been out of work for some time (doing some training to get a qualification to get something) and I've had the car off the road. I'm in Kildare and public transport to work isn't an option.

My car was last taxed in June 12 and the back tax / arrears is now about €1500.
I didn't declare the car off the road. In retrospect I know this was stupid but I was sending CVs while doing the course and hoped that I'd get something.
Anyway .. that's the situation and I have to deal with it.

My problem is that I can't afford the €1500 car tax but I still need to get the car on the road for interviews and hope to start back to work very soon (there's a few iron's in the fire).

I've asked at my local garage about the possibility of paying the arrears in stages at the motor tax office and he just laughed .. wondering if anyone know if they offer this options under any circumstance?

My other option would be to sell the car and buy a banger .. but really that isn't a runner as if I don't have the €1500 for arrears I don't have it for a banger.

The last options .. and this is why I'm writing .. I've read on the Irish Indo that there's been a huge jump in people selling their cars and the new owner not having to pay the past tax and arrears. Please don't write a lot of hate replies/spam saying I'm trying to avoid road tax .. I'm not .. if I could pay the arrears now I would .. if there was a way to pay in stages I would .. but without those options what can I do?

Does anyone know if it's possible to sell the car to a friend .. ask her to tax it for a year .. then buy it back? When I then go to tax it in my name would the arrears be waiting for me? Actually I don't mind if they are .. as that will give me the opportunity to save up and pay it .. again I'm not trying to avoid car tax .. but I'd like to know that it would be waiting because then I know I've got to put aside €125 per month to then tax the car in month 13.

If anyone knows any gottya's with this plan I'd appreciate it.
If anyone knows any way I can get my car on the road any other way again I'd appreciate it.

The friend would have to insure it as well a put you on as a named driver.

Dee light1

Ya too much hassle! so best just tax wen comes back in your own name again?

Diemos

narmst wrote: »

My other option would be to sell the car and buy a banger .. but really that isn't a runner as if I don't have the €1500 for arrears I don't have it for a banger.

But but but......if you sell your car you will have money to buy a banger......

Beggars and choosers etc.

Wicklabman

Ok thanks for that. So would there be any issue when I go to tax it after that, as I will have been insured for a long time before "owning" the car

Dee light1

I wouldn't think so if was an issue u just say u never cancelled insurance as sale fell thru so continuing on same policy pre sale

Dee light1

If u google independant.ie-Irish news-thousands-use-loophole-to-avoid-motor-tax-arrears it says it's not illegal to do this

bmwguy

As everyone else has said, work away. Enough tax to pay without back paying tax. I have a lovely Peugeot 406 coupe that owes over a grand at this stage, if I ever do want to drive it again I'll transfer to my brother then swiftly back again

Jesus.

Sell it and buy it back. Anyone saying its not moral honestly must be having a laugh!

Renegade Mechanic

Jesus. wrote: »

Sell it and buy it back. Anyone saying its not moral honestly must be having a laugh!

I have a jeep parked up with about 3k plus of a tax bill waiting for me. Probably be 4 before it goes back on. Im in talks with the credit union now for a loan :pac:

Sam Kade

My sister in law bought a car at a main dealer in April and the tax was out in Jan the garage had to back tax it. I also know a man that was trading in his car to a garage that was out of tax and they told him to tax it for 3 months. Change of ownership didn't work in those cases

Dee light1

Think that May be because of a garage being involved would have to be all sorted for a sale or a trade in. I traded in a car with year bak tax and garage said he'd sort an I never heard anymore so dunno maybe diff garages diff rules ? ????

quadrifoglio verde

Sam Kade wrote: »

My sister in law bought a car at a main dealer in April and the tax was out in Jan the garage had to back tax it. I also know a man that was trading in his car to a garage that was out of tax and they told him to tax it for 3 months. Change of ownership didn't work in those cases

The man got screwed over by the garage in that one.
If you are going to sell it to your friend for sandwich etc it's only really worth doing on a car with a high number of owners or that's old. No point in doing it on a 3 year old merc where the number of owners can affect the selling price

ironclaw

Jesus. wrote: »

Sell it and buy it back. Anyone saying its not moral honestly must be having a laugh!

With all due respect, its that overall attitude of denial of responsibility that has our world and country in the state its in. In the words of Fr. Stack "I had my fun and thats all that matters"

Irregardless of where the money for motor tax goes, or how unfair it is as a system (And I agree, it is!) or how its misspent, every motorist has an obligation to pay it. Its part and parcel of being on the road. By not paying it, you're basically ignoring your obligation (And the law) and sticking two fingers up to the rest of us who share the road with you. Economically, and I have no idea how this is done in the tax office, but if you owe them €3k and you decide not to pay it, that €3k has to be accounted for and written off. It just doesn't disappear because John down the road sold his car to avoid paying it. Someone, somewhere has to pick up the line of credit.

On a small scale, your operating like the banks who owe millions. Trying to walk away from credit you owe to society. And although its perfectly legal (No argument there) its completely morally objectionable in my eyes.

Sam Kade

quadrifoglio verde wrote: »

The man got screwed over by the garage in that one.

It was a fair sh!t bucket that he was trading in.

roofer1988

ironclaw wrote: »

With all due respect, its that overall attitude of denial of responsibility that has our world and country in the state its in. In the words of Fr. Stack "I had my fun and thats all that matters"

Irregardless of where the money for motor tax goes, or how unfair it is as a system (And I agree, it is!) or how its misspent, every motorist has an obligation to pay it. Its part and parcel of being on the road. By not paying it, you're basically ignoring your obligation (And the law) and sticking two fingers up to the rest of us who share the road with you. Economically, and I have no idea how this is done in the tax office, but if you owe them €3k and you decide not to pay it, that €3k has to be accounted for and written off. It just doesn't disappear because John down the road sold his car to avoid paying it. Someone, somewhere has to pick up the line of credit.

On a small scale, your operating like the banks who owe millions. Trying to walk away from credit you owe to society. And although its perfectly legal (No argument there) its completely morally objectionable in my eyes.

No one has to pick up the tab some where down the line.Its not like someone was providing a service or goods, where there is money outstanding on supplies so your comment makes no sense,tax is high enough on petrol and diesel and VAT and VRT when you buy the car. Government cant have it every way

Dee light1

ironclaw wrote: »

With all due respect, its that overall attitude of denial of responsibility that has our world and country in the state its in. In the words of Fr. Stack "I had my fun and thats all that matters"

Irregardless of where the money for motor tax goes, or how unfair it is as a system (And I agree, it is!) or how its misspent, every motorist has an obligation to pay it. Its part and parcel of being on the road. By not paying it, you're basically ignoring your obligation (And the law) and sticking two fingers up to the rest of us who share the road with you. Economically, and I have no idea how this is done in the tax office, but if you owe them €3k and you decide not to pay it, that €3k has to be accounted for and written off. It just doesn't disappear because John down the road sold his car to avoid paying it. Someone, somewhere has to pick up the line of credit.

On a small scale, your operating like the banks who owe millions. Trying to walk away from credit you owe to society. And although its perfectly legal (No argument there) its completely morally objectionable in my eyes.

Jaysus the country won't go into recession at all if I don't pay my back tax so calm down lol and my car was genuinely off road but I was unable to give them 3 months notice that it would be so that's down to their stupid new laws which are making people resort to this!

Renegade Mechanic

roofer1988 wrote: »

No one has to pick up the tab some where down the line.Its not like someone was providing a service or goods, where there is money outstanding on supplies so your comment makes no sense,tax is high enough on petrol and diesel and VAT and VRT when you buy the car. Government cant have it every way

Ah hah hah hah hah, true but whatch them bloody try!:D

bmwguy

ironclaw wrote: »

With all due respect, its that overall attitude of denial of responsibility that has our world and country in the state its in. In the words of Fr. Stack "I had my fun and thats all that matters"

Irregardless of where the money for motor tax goes, or how unfair it is as a system (And I agree, it is!) or how its misspent, every motorist has an obligation to pay it. Its part and parcel of being on the road. By not paying it, you're basically ignoring your obligation (And the law) and sticking two fingers up to the rest of us who share the road with you. Economically, and I have no idea how this is done in the tax office, but if you owe them €3k and you decide not to pay it, that €3k has to be accounted for and written off. It just doesn't disappear because John down the road sold his car to avoid paying it. Someone, somewhere has to pick up the line of credit.

On a small scale, your operating like the banks who owe millions. Trying to walk away from credit you owe to society. And although its perfectly legal (No argument there) its completely morally objectionable in my eyes.

Are you serious? Nobody picks up this tab! It does just disappear because John down the road didnt pay his tax. Question to you ironclaw, if you were in this situation would you pay? Honestly now.

ironclaw

bmwguy wrote: »

Are you serious? Nobody picks up this tab! It does just disappear because John down the road didnt pay his tax. Question to you ironclaw, if you were in this situation would you pay? Honestly now.

Yes, I would. Genuinely. If I couldn't afford the car, I'd sell it or declare it off the road to avoid paying the back tax in the first place. I could probably avoid paying my income tax, wait til I have a nice nest egg and high tail it out of the country. Its the same thing. Its just walking away from a responsibility to society and the rules we all have to follow (Fairly or unfairly as they may be)

Financial forecasting in any department would be done based on actual income and with a degree of speculative forecasting based on income from tax arrears / money owed. Obviously you can't bank on money you don't have, but if there was a significant amount of back tax owed to the department and its just constantly getting wiped out by people doing exactly this, long term planning etc becomes impossible. And we all suffer as a result. To say that someone just draws a line through what you owe and that has no effect elsewhere is nonsense.

Just my view lads, I can see the other side as well. Its like the keying of cars in the other threads, people just decide what social norms to follow and which ones to ignore. In the end, it costs someone somewhere something.

quadrifoglio verde

Very noble of you. However if I can find a way to legally reduce my tax liabilities for the year I bloody well will. It's not my fault that there are loopholes in the system and any loophole that can be exploited, I'll exploit.