Garda Vetting, Teaching Council and National Vetting Bureau Act2012

neutralvu

.

dublin daz

neutralvu wrote: »

I am NQT, looking to get a garda vetting cert from the teaching council however i have a 2 struck out cases of burglary on my record, i am guilty of the crimes however the judge in the DC struck out my cases for my career sake and 1st offence ever (stupid things happen when your in college), my problem is that these show up in vetting. i know this for a fact having checked using the data access form lately and it came back with "date, court, offence=burglary, result=strike out". Now during the long time period when the cases were pending i chanced the vetting through the teaching council, being none the wiser and 3 months later the vetting came back with two cases pending on it, and the TC saying to apply for vetting again when the result of case is complete. (Should not have done this cos the TC now know something up :rolleyes:)
So here i am now wondering what to do next, it seems to me i am snookered in that as stated on the form all "unsuccessful prosecutions" can be furnished to the TC therefore my strike outs will be released meaning the TC will register me as i have no convictions and its not a violent or child abuse strike out, BUT i cant let a principal see "burglary" on my vetting struck out or not! However, i have researched this new National Vetting Bill2012 (similar to what england does in its garda vetting approach) which is yet to come in due to some analyzing of it by the high courts in england which means it may not be in for a while yet, and it seems according to the boss himself that acquittal cases dont show up but soft info may. http://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2013-06-25a.1059
My questions: (A) Even though the struck out cases showed on the data access form, would it be fairly certain they would show on garda vetting too?
(B) Are two struck out cases of burglary regarded as soft info in the new bill?
(C) For any legal heads here, can the garda hold struck out records on PULSE? Isnt there some time period they have for retaining it, like i taught that struck out = no record "the data shall not be kept for longer than is necessary for that purpose or those purposes"
- section 2(1)(c)(iv) of the Data Protection Act"

Also found this but i dont if this "barrister" guy is reliable? http://www.justanswer.com/ireland-law/77z5a-court-case-struck-against-showed-garda.html

I know too much about this stuff yet dont know anything at all. Just to clarify i did not recieve the Probation Act, i got an even better result in that it was Stuck out with no order, but i might as well have got a conviction the way this is playing out. btw ive read EVERY post on Boards about garda vetting.

Thanks everyone

a. Yes, they will appear as a disclosure on the return made by An Garda Síochána - every prosecution will appear. http://www.garda.ie/Controller.aspx?Page=1535

b. Depends how the Teaching Council view the allegations. They don't use that to determine guilt or innocence, that has been decided in the Courts, they use the information available to assess your suitability for the profession as a teacher;

c. the District Court is a court of record and as such is entitled to retain a record of the proceedings. The record contains factual information, it also contains the fact you were not convicted but did appear to answer a charge etc.

I know the TC has a committee who evaluate on an individual basis anyone's file who has a disclosure on their vetting form. They will decide what happens your application, whether you're recommended to be added to the register or otherwise.

dublin daz

No, my post was based on experience. I went through the TC registration process.

Did this only happen recently, as in January this year. The court will have a record even if it was a strike out and not a dismissal. There is a difference between the two outcomes.

If the case was struck out then why are you concerned? The TC will see that you were before the courts and the outcome will say whatever happened "strike out" etc.

The disclosure policy at present: details of all convictions and/or prosecutions, successful or not, pending or completed, in the State or elsewhere as the case may be are disclosed to the authorised liaison person in the registered organisation.

the liaison person is the CEO as far as I know at the TC

You also said you were guilty. What I would do is get a copy of the court order. You will have to pay 15 euro for this. The order will outline the case and decision. It wont say you were innocent if you have already pleaded guilty. As I said, the court is keeping on record facts.

The court order will outline the charge - instead of the allegation as per the summons it will say "you did xyz" and the outcome will be "strike out"

The fact is while you were spared a conviction you cannot say it did not take place, otherwise how could you have been "guilty".

dublin daz

PS - I would try sort this out with the Gardai and Courts Service before contacting the Teaching Council. From my experience they can be quite difficult and challenging to deal with over the most basic queries..

I wouldn't let this deter you or inhibit your ambition, the TC are not above the courts and if they decided not to register you based on this disclosure then I would look at taking legal action against them, their decision is always amenable to judicial review in any event.

Good luck in your career.

dublin daz

No, thankfully not!

I did read their policy documents and came across the one in relation to the treatment of court convictions and court outcomes. http://www.teachingcouncil.ie/_fileupload/Garda%20Vetting/Amended%20and%20%20ApprovedGuidelines%20mem%20AssessCourtConvictions%2017%20Sep%202012%20kel.pdf

Here is an article you might find interesting at p20 http://www.lawsociety.ie/Documents/Gazette/Gazette%202010/May2010.pdf

I can see where you are coming from - in the eyes of the law you're innocent and have no convictions but in the eyes of the school principal - potential prejudice - no smoke without fire syndrome.

You could make a complaint to the Data Protection Commissioner - the article raises the constitutional right to a good name - very valid but costly to litigate, perhaps.

Aineoil

As dublin daz says the Teaching Council are very difficult to deal with. My experience with them was far from positive. I was just your

ordinary Joan Soap who was moved because of the panel. In 2010 I had to move school because my job was suppressed. As a result I

had to get garda vetting, as I now was in a new school. Having to trawl back to the 1960's of where I lived etc was a real challenge.

To be honest the Teaching Council give you nothing but charge for the pleasure of that.