Milk tanks

dar31

Any advise or comments on make of tanks.
Muller Packo, dairymaster direct expansion tanks
Pros / cons
Ordering in the next week

Timmaay

dar31 wrote: »

Any advise or comments on make of tanks.
Muller Packo, dairymaster direct expansion tanks
Pros / cons
Ordering in the next week

Ordered an 11kL darikool here awhile back from a crowd in cork, it was coming in the most competitive from any quotes I got for that size tank. Only slightly disadvantaged is it only has a 2 1/2 hp compressor, if I'm regularly filling the tank I'll probably need to fit a 2nd compressor, however I'm along way from anyway filling it yet, i decided to splash out on a nice big plate cooler instead.

dar31

When will ya have it in.
Didn't prove Dairy kool, had decided on one of the 3 above
Big variance in recommended compressors, will have 3 phase going in, and compressors ranged from 2*5hp, 2*7.5hp to 1*10 Hp.
Most likely a industrial spec plate cooler going in as well,
Do lads have a separate water heater for tank, wash requirement 150-200 l

st1979

Timmaay wrote: »

Ordered an 11kL darikool here awhile back from a crowd in cork, it was coming in the most competitive from any quotes I got for that size tank. Only slightly disadvantaged is it only has a 2 1/2 hp compressor, if I'm regularly filling the tank I'll probably need to fit a 2nd compressor, however I'm along way from anyway filling it yet, i decided to splash out on a nice big plate cooler instead.

Snap. Have same darikool 11000 litre but twin compressors. What I liked was it is the biggest tank for the lenght. They are short fat and tall. Other tanks were longer narrower and not as tall. Plus a 20 year guarantee on the heat exchanger part in tank (cant think of the part name)
The flooded evaporation system is very good to cool milk fast

Sam Kade

I will be getting a secondhand tank at the end of the year I was told the best tank was packo, they give least trouble.

Timmaay

dar31 wrote: »

When will ya have it in.
Didn't prove Dairy kool, had decided on one of the 3 above
Big variance in recommended compressors, will have 3 phase going in, and compressors ranged from 2*5hp, 2*7.5hp to 1*10 Hp.
Most likely a industrial spec plate cooler going in as well,
Do lads have a separate water heater for tank, wash requirement 150-200 l

I'm just waiting for the grant to be confirmed, only send that in in dec tho! And I'll be short on space from early April at a guess!! The tank can be installed fairly quick once I contact them, its getting the grant confirmed that is my only problem. If i here nothing by say march 1st I'll be on the phone to Glanbia telling them to either collect my milk every 2nd day or pull some strings to fast track the application!

Timmaay

Sam Kade wrote: »

I will be getting a secondhand tank at the end of the year I was told the best tank was packo, they give least trouble.

I priced up afew 2nd hand and it was a no brainer to go new with the grant.

dar31

Timmaay wrote: »

I'm just waiting for the grant to be confirmed, only send that in in dec tho! And I'll be short on space from early April at a guess!! The tank can be installed fairly quick once I contact them, its getting the grant confirmed that is my only problem. If i here nothing by say march 1st I'll be on the phone to Glanbia telling them to either collect my milk every 2nd day or pull some strings to fast track the application!

I wouldn't get to concerned about 3 day collections for next year, they will still pick up your milk.
New tank will only be for future max numbers for 2 day collections not overly concerned by 3 / 3.5 day collections
Planning on new parlour in 3-5 yrs so will move or change tank then, depending on situation at the time

Deepsouthwest

dar31 wrote: »

Any advise or comments on make of tanks.
Muller Packo, dairymaster direct expansion tanks
Pros / cons
Ordering in the next week

Put in a dairymaster 12,750L direct expansion back in may, seems ok so far. Had a packo ice bank tank, which was also ok, nothing special. Involved in an effiency programme down here with Carbery(our milk buyer/processor). Will find out from them the difference over the last 6mts in cooling costs between the two and post it here. Wouldn't get too caught up in all the sales talk, most tanks sold in Ireland are just a lump of stainless steel all cooled by a cope land scroll compressors, except darikool who have the flooded system. If I had any advice it would be not to spend all your money on the tank, a good properly worked plate cooler is where the real savings are made.

dar31

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

Put in a dairymaster 12,750L direct expansion back in may, seems ok so far. Had a packo ice bank tank, which was also ok, nothing special. Involved in an effiency programme down here with Carbery(our milk buyer/processor). Will find out from them the difference over the last 6mts in cooling costs between the two and post it here. Wouldn't get too caught up in all the sales talk, most tanks sold in Ireland are just a lump of stainless steel all cooled by a cope land scroll compressors, except darikool who have the flooded system. If I had any advice it would be not to spend all your money on the tank, a good properly worked plate cooler is where the real savings are made.

Did you go for the digi or cool control system, 2k extra seems a lot for the extra bit of control, some of the sales men don't half know how to talk, maybe it's worth the extra!
Did you look at other tanks, and what sold you on the dairy master

eddiemunk

Wudnt go dairymaster heard they are giving trouble id go Alfa Laval or packo myself two best tanks on the market

biddy2013

LOOKING for a tank here too, have grant approval. Do kilkenny still do milk tanks?

dar31

eddiemunk wrote: »

Wudnt go dairymaster heard they are giving trouble id go Alfa Laval or packo myself two best tanks on the market

What problems were there with the dairymaster tank, and how long ago, rep did say there was a few problems in the first few tanks as they are only making them 4 years

Kilkenny don't make tanks any more, old one is a Kilkenny ice bank

awaywithyou

dar31 wrote: »

What problems were there with the dairymaster tank, and how long ago, rep did say there was a few problems in the first few tanks as they are only making them 4 years

Kilkenny don't make tanks any more, old one is a Kilkenny ice bank

Dairymaster tanks are absolutely flying out the door of the factory in Kerry... You won't go wrong with a dairymaster tank but have someone in competition with them or they will fleece you

Deepsouthwest

dar31 wrote: »

Did you go for the digi or cool control system, 2k extra seems a lot for the extra bit of control, some of the sales men don't half know how to talk, maybe it's worth the extra!
Did you look at other tanks, and what sold you on the dairy master

Cool control system, 4k extra I thought when I was pricing it. Didn't think it was necessary, never got a txt from my last tank and didn't think I needed it either! Priced Liscarrol, Packo, Darikool, Darikool being the most competitive, but just felt the copeland scroll compressor was more proven, and local tank service man reckoned Dairymaster had the best wash system. Also, whether right or wrong I wanted to buy an Irish made tank, us farmers are long enough preaching about buy Irish. Just to finish, a friend of mine recently put in a tank, and this guy would really do the research, he went mueller,

funny man

biddy2013 wrote: »

LOOKING for a tank here too, have grant approval. Do kilkenny still do milk tanks?

Yea they still sell them contact Paddy Smee he's the owner, liscarroll make them and they are a good tank also. Keep away from dairymaster over priced compared to either of the above

biddy2013

funny man wrote: »

Yea they still sell them contact Paddy Smee he's the owner, liscarroll make them and they are a good tank also. Keep away from dairymaster over priced compared to either of the above

paddy smee is a pure gentleman, thanks

delaval

biddy2013 wrote: »

paddy smee is a pure gentleman, thanks

It's his daughter I dealt with, sound no messing like her old man. I'd deffo deal with them again.

Our old tank leaked and I was over a barrell, dealt with them as closest, they could've assaulted me but gave good price.

biddy2013

delaval wrote: »

It's his daughter I dealt with, sound no messing like her old man. I'd deffo deal with them again.

Our old tank leaked and I was over a barrell, dealt with them as closest, they could've assaulted me but gave good price.

can you pm me a number please... i bought my milk tank of them when i started out, they couldnt have been more helpful. i have 2 tanks now a 550 kilkenny and a 1000 gallon icebank, want to get rid and just have 1

Timmaay

dar31 wrote: »

I wouldn't get to concerned about 3 day collections for next year, they will still pick up your milk.
New tank will only be for future max numbers for 2 day collections not overly concerned by 3 / 3.5 day collections
Planning on new parlour in 3-5 yrs so will move or change tank then, depending on situation at the time

You still got just a 12 unit? , are you going to throw on afew more units meanwhile? Milking 80 in my 6uint does my head in, would be very awkward to put in more units and cowflow poor in anycase. So I'll throw up a new on while i got the grant also.

TopCon

A lot of people buy tanks based on cheapest price. I can never understand why.
I suppose the main reason is people don't know much about refrigeration. But should at least know the wash process.

Mueller have most efficient cooling system, good washer and all parts used are top quality. Hence they tend to be expensive. Certainly most expensive to produce anyway.

Packo/dairymaster/delaval not are not far behind. Using copeland scroll direct expansion. For me packo and dairymaster use the best wash systems.

Then you have liscarroll and darikool. Don't know much about new liscarrolls. Darikool 'flooded' evaporator system can work quite well as its basic not many components to go wrong. Washer not up to standard of others in my opinion.

A lot to be said for buying irish and in fairness to dairymaster they provide lots of jobs and shook up the bulk tank market a bit.

Feel free to pm me if you want info. I'm not connected to any. Beware of sales talk.

loveta

Bought a muller M3 9k lts twenty grand plus vat 40%grant left me out 12k don't know how good of value that is now but I liked the tank and prob got sucked into the sales talk but all the companies slated dari cool flood evaporate system said it was crude and a mess waiting to happen be they right or wrong I don't know but I am very happy with the new tank esp if the lorry is late quick wash time, tbc mostly round 3-5k so must be cleaning correct

dar31

Timmaay wrote: »

You still got just a 12 unit? , are you going to throw on afew more units meanwhile? Milking 80 in my 6uint does my head in, would be very awkward to put in more units and cowflow poor in anycase. So I'll throw up a new on while i got the grant also.

yea, still banging them through the 12 unit, put 230 through it at peak last year, before we started selling in any great quantity.
dont plan on extending existing parlour, and a new one is still 3-5 yrs out.
will wait and see how post 15 pans out, before committing to a new parlour

delaval

biddy2013 wrote: »

can you pm me a number please... i bought my milk tank of them when i started out, they couldnt have been more helpful. i have 2 tanks now a 550 kilkenny and a 1000 gallon icebank, want to get rid and just have 1

http://m.goldenpages.ie/detail/kilkenny-bulk-milk-tanks-kilkenny/1/

Sam Kade

Timmaay wrote: »

I priced up afew 2nd hand and it was a no brainer to go new with the grant.

4k L secondhand is 5k fitted. Do you have to be under 40 to get the grant?

Uibh Fhaile

Also looking at Delaval and Kilkenny. Have a Kilkenny ice bank at the moment, didn't give any trouble. Priced Delaval tank, 1100 euro between 9700 and 11000 litre tank. Maybe this increases running costs tho for the sake of extra unneeded capacity for now.

Are the new Kilkenny tanks as good as the other manufactures ?

Anyone consider putting in or already have put in a heat exchanger ?

Greengrass1

Depending on grant I will be putting in tank next yr. If not, the packo sales man that was here said he can get us a 5k litre tank at no cost provided we buy packo, to do us for a year until we can sort out money for a bigger one.
Haven't made a decision on ice bank or DX yet as our transformer here is too small if we put in bigger parlour aswell, and if we are going to be charged to upgrade it we meet might buy ice bank

awaywithyou

dar31 wrote: »

yea, still banging them through the 12 unit, put 230 through it at peak last year, before we started selling in any great quantity.
dont plan on extending existing parlour, and a new one is still 3-5 yrs out.
will wait and see how post 15 pans out, before committing to a new parlour

Why? If you plan on milking cows for a few yrs.. Would you not just go ahead with it?




230 cows in 12 unit must take forever.....

funny man

Uibh Fhaile wrote: »

Also looking at Delaval and Kilkenny. Have a Kilkenny ice bank at the moment, didn't give any trouble. Priced Delaval tank, 1100 euro between 9700 and 11000 litre tank. Maybe this increases running costs tho for the sake of extra unneeded capacity for now.

Are the new Kilkenny tanks as good as the other manufactures ?
Yes they are a well made tank, they were made by Liscarroll which is an Irish based company also and they sell the same tank under their own name.

Anyone consider putting in or already have put in a heat exchanger ?
in most cases you would get a better return from a cool plate.

my views above

funny man

TopCon wrote: »

A lot of people buy tanks based on cheapest price. I can never understand why.
I suppose the main reason is people don't know much about refrigeration. But should at least know the wash process.

Mueller have most efficient cooling system, good washer and all parts used are top quality. Hence they tend to be expensive. Certainly most expensive to produce anyway.

Packo/dairymaster/delaval not are not far behind. Using copeland scroll direct expansion. For me packo and dairymaster use the best wash systems.

Then you have liscarroll and darikool. Don't know much about new liscarrolls. Darikool 'flooded' evaporator system can work quite well as its basic not many components to go wrong. Washer not up to standard of others in my opinion.

A lot to be said for buying irish and in fairness to dairymaster they provide lots of jobs and shook up the bulk tank market a bit.

Feel free to pm me if you want info. I'm not connected to any. Beware of sales talk.

Muller is over priced over rated in my view.
Darikool flooded evaporator claim of cheaper running costs are un proven.
nearly all makes use Copeland scroll compressor units so I would put more emphasis on back up and keep electronics to a minimum no matter what tank make you choose.

delaval

Lads it's a stainless steel container, cooling system and washer unit

Service contract, it can phuck up weekly still won't cost you.

Greengrass1

delaval wrote: »

Lads it's a stainless steel container, cooling system and washer unit

Service contract, it can phuck up weekly still won't cost you.

Two tanks we have here are 20 years old and near 35 yes old. Only thing ever gone wrong is the cogs in the agitator and relays. Ring the local lad and he is always here within the day if possoble

Timmaay

Sam Kade wrote: »

4k L secondhand is 5k fitted. Do you have to be under 40 to get the grant?

No, but it closed in Dec! No news about a new one opening again, I wouldn't hold my breath. That price isn't too bad, they always need a new compressor etc anyways. I saw one or two 2nd hand 4400L tanks for about 6500, crazy money 2bh.

Timmaay

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Two tanks we have here are 20 years old and near 35 yes old. Only thing ever gone wrong is the cogs in the agitator and relays. Ring the local lad and he is always here within the day if possoble

Out of interest do many of yas know what way the insurance works on lost milk in your tanks! We lost almost a full tank of milk awhile ago, when the cooling system in the tank failed (water got into the electrics), the milk wasnt fit for collection, which Glanbia confirmed and all that in writing, alongside an estimated collection amount based on the previous collection, I think the value of the milk was about 1300quid, but FBD told us our policy only covered us up to a value of 700quid, so that was all we got! So just a word of warning to check that!

biddy2013

Timmaay wrote: »

Out of interest do many of yas know what way the insurance works on lost milk in your tanks! We lost almost a full tank of milk awhile ago, when the cooling system in the tank failed (water got into the electrics), the milk wasnt fit for collection, which Glanbia confirmed and all that in writing, alongside an estimated collection amount based on the previous collection, I think the value of the milk was about 1300quid, but FBD told us our policy only covered us up to a value of 700quid, so that was all we got! So just a word of warning to check that!

at renewal they normally go through policy, they normally ask what value you put the milk at, they do this annually here

delaval

biddy2013 wrote: »

at renewal they normally go through policy, they normally ask what value you put the milk at, they do this annually here

Always value the tank full

TopCon

Timmaay wrote: »

Ordered an 11kL.Only slightly disadvantaged is it only has a 2 1/2 hp compressor.

Are you sure it's only a 2.5 hp compressor?

[QUOTE=Deepsouthwest; most tanks sold in Ireland are just a lump of stainless steel all cooled by a cope land scroll compressors, except darikool who have the flooded system. [/QUOTE]

Mueller don't use direct expansion. Darikool use copeland scrolls too but different process.

Uibh Fhaile wrote: »

Have a Kilkenny ice bank at the moment, didn't give any trouble. Priced Delaval tank, 1100 euro between 9700 and 11000 litre tank. Maybe this increases running costs tho for the sake of extra unneeded capacity for now.
Are the new Kilkenny tanks as good as the other manufactures ?
Anyone consider putting in or already have put in a heat exchanger ?

Running costs should not be higher. Ice bank tanks IMO not suited to higher volumes and quicker milking times. Takes longer to build ice than cool milk with direct ex. Variable speed pumps or diaphragm a necessity with ice banks as electric pump pushes milk through plate cooler too fast.

Heat exchanger a waste of time as an efficient cooling setup will not be running long enough to make huge difference heating water.

If you mean plate cooler I think best suited to those with well water. But are a great help cooling. Use run off for volume washer. Its a waste of time if you've an electric pump pushing milk through too fast.

delaval wrote: »

Lads it's a stainless steel container, cooling system and washer unit
Service contract, it can phuck up weekly still won't cost you.

I disagree. It's a considerable investment. A reliable setup should not require service contract for at least 5yrs. Considering contract for 2 compressors and washer can be over 500e per year it's an expense. Most likely the biggest contributor to your esb bill. A good washer essential in keeping tbc down and not using too much hot water.

Daniel1122

be careful when buying the tank, there will be a difference in price if getting 1 or two compressors.
muller or packo are the tank in the market. I bought a liscarroll tank myself, had one previously. dairymaster keep will clear of there tanks they are not fully tested yet, they use farm for there R & D, and if something goes wrong you will be paying dairymaster for it.

loveta

Have any of you guys solid prices that ye can post to compare and see who is the movers and the shakers????

Timmaay

TopCon wrote: »

Are you sure it's only a 2.5 hp compressor?

Just double checked, i was wrong, its a 5hp, was an option to put in a 2nd 5hp compressor, but the salesman said not to bother unless I expected to be filling the tank to the brim regularly, and instead to spend the money on a good platecooler.

Greengrass1

Timmaay wrote: »

Just double checked, i was wrong, its a 5hp, was an option to put in a 2nd 5hp compressor, but the salesman said not to bother unless I expected to be filling the tank to the brim regularly, and instead to spend the money on a good platecooler.

He wanted to do the same with us but when we had the packo lad in the yard, his price was dearer but only because he was giving us two compressors not one

Daniel1122

darikool 8600. litres 5HP compressor €18500. dairymaster 8000 litres 5HP com €18500
muller 8200 litres 5HP com €21500. Liscarrol 8350 litres 2x 3.5 HP com €21500

TopCon

Timmaay wrote: »

but the salesman said not to bother.

You might want to check your quotes again against others who may have been pricing 2 units as greengrass said.

They are guaranteed sale of second unit (probably at greater cost to you in long run) once the tank is in.

11kl I think should have 2units. I know the flooded evap gets stick from competitors but I've seen it first hand and it does cool good. running well I believe the mueller is the only one to cool faster.

You mentioned "filling to the brim regularly". That should only be an issue at peak volume for perhaps a month. For example if you are full to the brim in September you obviously didn't have enough space for may etc.
have you two day collection.

Really you should be allowing for expansion. However I did see your earlier post regarding post 2015 so understand your reasons for not going all out on size.

Timmaay

I think the 11k darikool with one 5hp compressor was in around the 21k, hard to separate the price as I've included a plate cooler and afew other bits with it. Also, I've a deal done already, and I was told the prices was due to go up (which could be salesman talk in fairness!)

Timmaay

TopCon wrote: »

You mentioned "filling to the brim regularly". That should only be an issue at peak volume for perhaps a month. For example if you are full to the brim in September you obviously didn't have enough space for may etc.
have you two day collection.

That tank will allow me 3days storage of about 150 spring calvers all knocking out 25L in June, which would allow me to stock my grazing block at 3.4cow/ha. God knows what other land might showup in time surrounding me but in fairness it would be pointless going any bigger, I'm already jumping from 3500L up to 11k ha, my dad and one or two of the neighbours say I'm mad as is :P

TopCon

Timmaay wrote: »

I think the 11k darikool with one 5hp compressor was in around the 21k, hard to separate the price as I've included a plate cooler and afew other bits with it. Also, I've a deal done already, and I was told the prices was due to go up (which could be salesman talk in fairness!)

Whatever way ya look at it that's a damn good deal. :cool:

Even if you do end up putting in a 2nd unit your still doing well.

biddy2013

bimping this up for milk profit

loveta

biddy2013 wrote: »

bimping this up for milk profit

geez biddy good job ya did n hit the p letter instead of the b in that last post

biddy2013

loveta wrote: »

geez biddy good job ya did n hit the p letter instead of the b in that last post

Fecking phone

farmerjj

I,m thinking of getting a new packo direct expansion tank,anyone have any good/bad experience with this type of tank or is there a better make,or would a ice bank be better/

milkprofit

Should a new tank not come with a 5 year guarantee
Like most new cars