Ireland selection for Scotland game?

stpaddy99

So what match day 23 would you select? Lot of competition and lot of places up for grabs?

Lets state what appear to be the obvious ones first

15. Kearney (On fire)
14. Bowe.
13 BOD
12 D'arcy
11

10. Sexton. (Class)
9. Murray (getting better)
8 Heaslip
7
6
5 POC
4
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

Reps?

.ak

Don't think Bowe is certain. Hasn't played much rugby and looked a bit off form in the AIs. I'd have Fitz and Earls to start.

stpaddy99

.ak wrote: »

Don't think Bowe is certain. Hasn't played much rugby and looked a bit off form in the AIs. I'd have Fitz and Earls to start.

who else? ps do u mean earls wing? what about kearney? etc

.ak

Yes Earls to wing, Fitz to the other wing, with Rob Kearney at FB. Host of players available for the 23 then; Bowe, Ferg, D. Kearney, Trimble, Gilroy, Zebo etc.

antogz1979

Earls and Fitzgerald have to be the wingers, Bowe shouldn't just walk back into the team. Both players are in great form and deserve their shot. Bowe has to play some decent rugby before he get's back into the team. I hate the line "that class is permanent" that is always spun out for Bowe and he should automatically get back in the team. Bowe is class by the way but it shouldn't justify him walking back into the team

ItsChecoTime

I'd pick Moore over Ross, offers a lot moore in the loose and seems to be better in the scrum than ross as well.

danthefan

Bowe is one of the must-start players imo if he's fit, just a class act.

sydthebeat

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13 BOD
12 D'arcy
11 Fitz

10. Sexton.
9. Murray
8 Heaslip
7 Henry
6 POM
5 POC
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

16 Cronin
17 McGrath
18 D Fitz
19 MMC
20 Henderson
21 Reddan
22 Jackson
23 Bowe (if fit) if not Henshaw

thebaz

barring injuries , I'd pick the same team that played New Zealand - it was the best performance I've seen from any Irish team - consistency is what irish rugby needs now - not one good game / one bad game - sends out a clear message to the players, play well & you won't be dropped.

antogz1979

sydthebeat wrote: »

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13 BOD
12 D'arcy
11 Fitz

10. Sexton.
9. Murray
8 Heaslip
7 Henry
6 POM
5 POC
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

16 Cronin
17 McGrath
18 D Fitz
19 MMC
20 Henderson
21 Reddan
22 Marshall
23 Bowe (if fit) if not Henshaw

I'd just swap MMC for Toner, have Jackson over Marshall and Varley over Cronin on the bench. I think your team is spot on in what Joe will pick. I think he will go with Jackson on the bench.

ssaye2

thebaz wrote: »

barring injuries , I'd pick the same team that played New Zealand - it was the best performance I've seen from any Irish team - consistency is what irish rugby needs now - not one good game / one bad game - sends out a clear message to the players, play well & you won't be dropped.

Joe wants to develop a squad not a Kidney undroppable 15

He said so himself

antogz1979

ssaye2 wrote: »

Joe wants to develop a squad not a Kidney undroppable 15

He said so himself

I wouldn't hold my breath to be honest. The centre, partnership and tighthead will test that theory.

sydthebeat

antogz1979 wrote: »

I'd just swap MMC for Toner, have Jackson over Marshall and Varley over Cronin on the bench. I think your team is spot on in what Joe will pick. I think he will go with Jackson on the bench.

jesus , totally forgot 10 cover.. ill edit

danthefan

ssaye2 wrote: »

Joe wants to develop a squad not a Kidney undroppable 15

He said so himself

Well Kidney used to say "build a squad" about 17 times in every interview he did too, look how that turned out.

bilston

sydthebeat wrote: »

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13 BOD
12 D'arcy
11 Fitz

10. Sexton.
9. Murray
8 Heaslip
7 Henry
6 POM
5 POC
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

16 Cronin
17 McGrath
18 D Fitz
19 MMC
20 Henderson
21 Reddan
22 Marshall
23 Bowe (if fit) if not Henshaw

Not sure if it's a typo or not but Marshall as out half cover would be a big risk. I think it could be something to look at further down the line but he would need a few games for Ulster at 10 for it to be considered by Ireland.

stpaddy99

this copeland fella at cardiff may be a dark horse for the squad, hes on fire

sydthebeat

bilston wrote: »

Not sure if it's a typo or not but Marshall as out half cover would be a big risk. I think it could be something to look at further down the line but he would need a few games for Ulster at 10 for it to be considered by Ireland.

my bad, total brain fart my end

bilston

stpaddy99 wrote: »

this copeland fella at cardiff may be a dark horse for the squad, hes on fire

I would be surprised if he isn't the 42 man squad. But as said elsewhere I doubt he'll be in contention for anything other than a run out for the Big Dogs at this stage.

thebaz

ssaye2 wrote: »

Joe wants to develop a squad not a Kidney undroppable 15

He said so himself

who am I to question but , what kind of message does that send to Ross, Toner, D'Arcy, Kearney or whoever get dropped - not a good one, after a perfomance of ther lives ... sick of the inconsistency of Irish perfomances , thats probably why we have never got beyond a quarter final at WC , lack of consistency

antogz1979

stpaddy99 wrote: »

this copeland fella at cardiff may be a dark horse for the squad, hes on fire

I suppose in the unlikely event Heaslip got injured he would have a chance. I'd say Coughlan would be brought in just for the short term though.

brinty

ssaye2 wrote: »

Joe wants to develop a squad not a Kidney undroppable 15

He said so himself

Well said ssaye2..

I'll give this a lash for what its worth

R Kearney
T Bowe (if fully fit)
R Henshaw
L Marshall
S Zebo (if fully fit)
J Sexton
C Murray
J Heaslip
P O'Mahony
R Ruddock
P O'Connell
D Toner
M Ross
R Best
J McGrath

S Cronin
C Healy
D Fitzpatrick
D Tuohy
J Murphy
K Marmion
I Madigan
K Earls

stpaddy99

zebo?

Zzippy

15. Kearney
14. Earls
13 BOD
12 Marshall
11 Fitz
10. Sexton
9. Murray
8 Heaslip
7 Henry
6 POM
5 POC
4 McCarthy
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

16 Cronin
17 McGrath
18 D Fitz
19 Toner
20 Henderson
21 Marmion
22 Jackson
23 Henshaw

stpaddy99

brinty wrote: »

Well said ssaye2..

I'll give this a lash for what its worth

R Kearney
T Bowe (if fully fit)
R Henshaw
L Marshall
S Zebo (if fully fit)
J Sexton
C Murray
J Heaslip
P O'Mahony
R Ruddock
P O'Connell
D Toner
M Ross
R Best
J McGrath

S Cronin
C Healy
D Fitzpatrick
D Tuohy
J Murphy
K Marmion
I Madigan
K Earls

wow no bod and no darcy?

Artful_Badger

15. Kearney
14. Gilroy
13 Cave
12 Marshall
11 Earls

10. Sexton.
9. Murray
8 Heaslip
7 Henry
6 POM
5 POC
4 Toner
3 Ross
2 Best
1 Healy

16 Cronin
17 McGrath
18 Moore
19 MMC
20 Henderson
21 Reddan
22 Jackson
23 Fitz

Artful_Badger

stpaddy99 wrote: »

wow no bod and no darcy?

I didnt include them either. Reason being I cant see BOD starting 4/5 six nations games. It would be a massive ask as well as Joe shooting himself in the foot given BOD is gone at the end of it. Other 13's need game time and I think Cave is one of the main players Ireland will be looking to once BOD is gone.

As for Darcy I think the Scotland game would be a great chance to see Marshall (who isnt too far off Darcy anyway) to start alongside Cave.

easy peasy

I know he's only one player but those teams all look suspect without SOB!

In my opinion, Zebo would not get within an ass's roar of a full strength Ireland team the way Fitz and Earls are playing. Bowe is number 1 in the pecking order and i'd still expect him to start, despite what people are saying about Schmidt wanting to build up a squad. If Cave/McFadden were playing out of their skin, and drico/d'arcy were in Bowe's situation, the old reliables would still start. Don't see this being any different.

Hope Toner continues from where he left off in the NZ game. Would love to see henshaw get a game as well. And really hope Jackson gets the bench ahead of Madigan.

All told, we probably won't win the tournament, but i don't remember selection being as competitive and as exciting in a long time.

awec

Healy
Best
Fitzpatrick
POC
Tuohy/McCarthy
POM
Henry
Heaslip

Murray
Sexton
Earls
Marshall
BOD
Fitzgerald
Kearney

Cronin
McGrath
Ross / Moore
Toner / Tuohy / McCarthy
Henderson
Reddan
Jackson
Bowe / Henshaw

boredatwork82

My team would be:

1. Healy
2. Cronin (with sob out his dynamism and ball carrying is crucial)
3.Ross
4. poc
5. Touhy (need his power against the scots)
6. O'Mahoney
7. Henry (until heenan is irish qualified )
8.Heaslip
9.Murray
10. Sexton
11.fitz (playing to well to be left out)
12. Marshall
13. Henshaw (sharing time with bod. Bod starting the wales game & french game)
14. Kearney
15. Kearney

16. Mcgrath
17.best
18. moore
19. Henderson
20. mclaughlin
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Earls


really tough call for toner.
Bench picked with versatility in mind. No need to be putting bod out in poor physical games. Let robbie do the grunt work.

stpaddy99

what about jordi murphy

The Rooster

Without a doubt, Bowe was our worst player during the Autumn Internationals. Now hopefully form is temporary and class is permanent, but he's been injured since thus hasn't been able to prove it was just a blip. So at the moment Earls and Fitzgerald have to be on top of the pecking order of wings until others can prove otherwise.

boredatwork82

My team would be:

1. Healy
2. Cronin (with sob out his dynamism and ball carrying is crucial)
3.Ross
4. poc
5. Touhy (need his power against the scots)
6. O'Mahoney
7. Henry (until heenan is irish qualified )
8.Heaslip
9.Murray
10. Sexton
11.fitz (playing to well to be left out)
12. Marshall
13. Henshaw (sharing time with bod. Bod starting the wales game & french game)
14. Kearney
15. Kearney

16. Mcgrath
17.best
18. moore
19. Henderson
20. mclaughlin
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Earls


really tough call for toner.
Bench picked with versatility in mind. No need to be putting bod out in poor physical games. Let robbie do the grunt work.

awec

stpaddy99 wrote: »

what about jordi murphy

No chance.

jamiedav2011

easy peasy wrote: »

I know he's only one player but those teams all look suspect without SOB!

In my opinion, Zebo would not get within an ass's roar of a full strength Ireland team the way Fitz and Earls are playing. Bowe is number 1 in the pecking order and i'd still expect him to start, despite what people are saying about Schmidt wanting to build up a squad. If Cave/McFadden were playing out of their skin, and drico/d'arcy were in Bowe's situation, the old reliables would still start. Don't see this being any different.

Hope Toner continues from where he left off in the NZ game. Would love to see henshaw get a game as well. And really hope Jackson gets the bench ahead of Madigan.

All told, we probably won't win the tournament, but i don't remember selection being as competitive and as exciting in a long time.

How can Bowe start if he hasn't played a game since November though?

wp_rathead

stpaddy99 wrote: »

what about jordi murphy

Ahead of Henry? Unlikely

stpaddy99

how can so many write off zebo? the bloke looks super talented, hes lightning quick, hes pretty big, great balance and he scores tries. surely thats the type of talent weve been looking for?

.ak

stpaddy99 wrote: »

how can so many write off zebo? the bloke looks super talented, hes lightning quick, hes pretty big, great balance and he scores tries. surely thats the type of talent weve been looking for?

Because he needs to earn his place. The guys who've been playing out of their skin this season deserve to start, and are logical starters.

Giving the start to somebody who has barely touched a rugby ball this year is crazy.

sydthebeat

Im afraid the boat has sailed for Locky at this stage, i would be extremely surprised to see him involved in any match day 23's unless torrid injuries occur.

stpaddy99

zebo looks ot be more test class than fitzy or kearney....he scores tries , hes quicker and better balanced...big lad too

easy peasy

jamiedav2011 wrote: »

How can Bowe start if he hasn't played a game since November though?

Sorry, should have clarified that I would select Earls and Fitzgerald but I wouldn't be surprised to see Bowe start. Its just one of those things that we have seen before with numerous players. He's has an outside chance of playing this weekend against leicester, and I think he will start for Ireland if he gets game time. If not, the boys have it.

-( i )- Wicker

Tommy O'Donnell has been on great form recently when he's not injured, would like to see him in green again

easy peasy

stpaddy99 wrote: »

zebo looks ot be more test class than fitzy or kearney....he scores tries , hes quicker and better balanced...big lad too

Whatever about Dave Kearney, Zebo is nowhere near the same level as Fitzgerald with both playing at their very best. He may score tries, but isn't as skillful, isn't quicker and I also don't think he's better balanced! Zebo was fast tracked into the Ireland team because of injuries, Fitzgerald was fast tracked (at a younger age) because of his raw ability.

Volvic12

1. Healy
2. Croinin
3. Ross
4. POC
5. Henderson
6. O'Mahoney
7. O' Donnell
8. Heaslip
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Fitzgerald
12. Darcy
13. O'Driscoll
14. Earls
15. Bowe/Zebo/Kearney/Henshaw

16. Best
17. Kilcoyne
18. Moore
19. Tuohy
20. J.Murphy
21. Marmion
22. Madigan
23. Bowe/Zebo/Kearney/Henshaw

Not convinced by R.Kearney defensively and his counter attacking ability. Has alot of good attributes but I like a good defender at 15 and more importantly someone who is a threat from deep.

jm08

easy peasy wrote: »

Whatever about Dave Kearney, Zebo is nowhere near the same level as Fitzgerald with both playing at their very best. He may score tries, but isn't as skillful, isn't quicker and I also don't think he's better balanced! Zebo was fast tracked into the Ireland team because of injuries, Fitzgerald was fast tracked (at a younger age) because of his raw ability.

Luke was also lucky that Denis Hickie retired when he did.

stpaddy99

easy peasy wrote: »

Whatever about Dave Kearney, Zebo is nowhere near the same level as Fitzgerald with both playing at their very best. He may score tries, but isn't as skillful, isn't quicker and I also don't think he's better balanced! Zebo was fast tracked into the Ireland team because of injuries, Fitzgerald was fast tracked (at a younger age) because of his raw ability.

zebo is a lot faster than fitzy, a lot faster
zebo is the fastest player in Ireland and top 10 fastest players in the world

molloyjh

The Scotland game isn't a stand alone game where we can afford to play whoever wherever for the craic. It's a week before the Wales game. So it will be incredibly important to get something close to the XV we're looking at to play Wales. We need to make sure as many as possible are as settled into their roles as possible. There may be an opportunity to look at one or two fringe players off the bench but that's about it. With that in mind, and some of this could change depending on selections and performances this weekend:

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Ross
4. McCarthy
5. POC
6. POM
7. Henry
8. Heaslip

9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Fitz
12. Marshall
13. Drico
14. Earls
15. R Kearney

16. Cronin
17. McGrath
18. Fitzpatrick
19. Toner/Tuohy
20. Ruddock
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. McFadden/Henshaw

We need two things from the game against Scotland - the win and real prep for the Wales game. The Italian game could give a bit more scope for variation depending on how we're doing at that point.

Artful_Badger

stpaddy99 wrote: »

zebo is a lot faster than fitzy, a lot faster
zebo is the fastest player in Ireland and top 10 fastest players in the world

Where did you get this piece of info ? I recall this speed thing coming up plenty of times and McFaddens name mentioned as being the fastest man in the squad. Even if Zebo was slightly faster than McFadden, Fitz or Gilroy I seriously doubt he's in the top 10 fastest players in the world.

bilston

molloyjh wrote: »

The Scotland game isn't a stand alone game where we can afford to play whoever wherever for the craic. It's a week before the Wales game. So it will be incredibly important to get something close to the XV we're looking at to play Wales. We need to make sure as many as possible are as settled into their roles as possible. There may be an opportunity to look at one or two fringe players off the bench but that's about it. With that in mind, and some of this could change depending on selections and performances this weekend:

1. Healy
2. Best
3. Ross
4. McCarthy
5. POC
6. POM
7. Henry
8. Heaslip

9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Fitz
12. Marshall
13. Drico
14. Earls
15. R Kearney

16. Cronin
17. McGrath
18. Fitzpatrick
19. Toner/Tuohy
20. Ruddock
21. Marmion
22. Jackson
23. McFadden/Henshaw

We need two things from the game against Scotland - the win and real prep for the Wales game. The Italian game could give a bit more scope for variation depending on how we're doing at that point.

Pretty close to what I'd pick Molloy.

Has McCarthy been outperforming Toner at Leinster? Toner adds a lot of security to the lineout which I think would be important against Jim Hamilton who took our lineout apart last season.

I would agree with the rest of your team with the possibility of dropping D'Arcy in against Wales and maybe rotating between him Marshall throughout the tournament.

I'd definitely have Tuohy on the bench, Fitzpatrick or Moore, I'm not sure about, Fitzpatrick was very effective against NZ, he had a hard time though against Montpellier, although began to get to grips with it towards the end. Personally I'd have Henderson ahead of Ruddock, but Ruddock is getting more starts at the moment, but Hendy also covers lock so if you apply the Madigan logic from Nov to it then Henderson for me. No.23 is a spot I'd be happy with just about any one of four or five players so McFadden, Henshaw, Trimble, a returning Bowe or Zebo, any of those guys will do, I'd probably edge towards Bowe as we want to get him up to speed but maybe he is better off forgetting the first two rounds of the 6Ns.

accidentprone1

I'm really really happy that Earls is playing well enough on the wing to feature in most people's match-day XV.

The forum is a much happier place without arguing over him.

.ak

accidentprone1 wrote: »

I'm really really happy that Earls is playing well enough on the wing to feature in most people's match-day XV.

The forum is a much happier place without arguing over him.

So long as it isn't at 13.

.ak

bilston wrote: »

Pretty close to what I'd pick Molloy.

Has McCarthy been outperforming Toner at Leinster? Toner adds a lot of security to the lineout which I think would be important against Jim Hamilton who took our lineout apart last season.

I would agree with the rest of your team with the possibility of dropping D'Arcy in against Wales and maybe rotating between him Marshall throughout the tournament.

I'd definitely have Tuohy on the bench, Fitzpatrick or Moore, I'm not sure about, Fitzpatrick was very effective against NZ, he had a hard time though against Montpellier, although began to get to grips with it towards the end. Personally I'd have Henderson ahead of Ruddock, but Ruddock is getting more starts at the moment, but Hendy also covers lock so if you apply the Madigan logic from Nov to it then Henderson for me. No.23 is a spot I'd be happy with just about any one of four or five players so McFadden, Henshaw, Trimble, a returning Bowe or Zebo, any of those guys will do, I'd probably edge towards Bowe as we want to get him up to speed but maybe he is better off forgetting the first two rounds of the 6Ns.

McCarthy has been a bit of a revelation for us in the last few months, he's been my MoTM for his last 3 games alone but has been ousted by eye-catching plays of Jordi Murphy and Rob Kearney. He was immense against Ulster after Christmas too. His fitness levels now seem to be where we want them to be and he's definately added muscle mass.

He's been the long awaited answer to our Hines question. His work in the tackle area is massive, and he's nearly involved on every breakdown on the pitch and generally provides the ballast for our backrow to attack the ball.

He carries well too, has a bit of a 5.5 about him with ball in hand.

Has he been out playing Toner? Hard to compare to the two. They make a great partnership as Toner has all the skills to pop up around the park and add hands to a move, or be imperious in a line out or carry that extra yard in the tight, but McCarthy is that niggily, massively strong lock with a bit of attitude.

McCarthy to start for me though, POM and POC are excellent jumpers and Henry's not to shabby either, don't think we'll need to dominate at line out time and if we do Toner can always come off the bench. Whilst Hamilton ripped us apart here last year I'm not sure if it'll be as much an issue this year, a lot of our problems came down the the set piece crumbling away anyway.