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2014 Cups & Shields

13468912

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    I'd love to see them play.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    Sorry - new to things here.

    How could somebody be that much of a favourite for what is a handicapped competition ?

    Enough people in the know, putting money on them I guess. The know being that there are five 12 handcappers who can play to about 7, and five 15 handicappers who can play to about 10. A ten shot advantage over real handicaps is difficult to overcome even for teams than are only hooky by 6 or 7 shots per pairing.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    I'm thinking of lumping on them even at 1/2......I've seen them play and any of their pairs on their team wouldn't look out of place in glen eagles ! Bookies have been burnt before by these lads......

    Good sting if it is.....
    An interclub team medal being a badge of shame for both players and club, it wouldnt surprise me if some group decided they may as well just make a few quid out of it at the bookie's expense.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,138 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    Wouldn't be surprised to see them getting into the final with another big win and then seeing them lose.

    They should be 1/4 or 1/5 in the final at that rate. The opposition about 7/2.... That'd be a proper sting... Throwing the final.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    Enough people in the know, putting money on them I guess. The know being that there are five 12 handcappers who can play to about 7, and five 15 handicappers who can play to about 10. A ten shot advantage over real handicaps is difficult to overcome even for teams than are only hooky by 6 or 7 shots per pairing.

    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,138 ✭✭✭✭PARlance


    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?

    Depends how you define a "straight" Fix.
    I think a straight / non bandit in these is someone with JUST 2 or 3 shots to spare.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 892 ✭✭✭Ben1977


    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?

    You'd be perfect for Jimmy Bruen Fix. Combined HC of 17 with the lowest being 6. Foursomes so you only have to worry about ever second shot.:D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    Someone said to me Ben.

    I'd have to just hit me good ones.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 494 ✭✭cairny


    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?

    We've had a couple of good runs, narrowly lost to eventual winners a few years ago. You can fight the bandits honestly if you have a few players who have got cut in the year of the comp. it goes on last years handicap so a guy who was 15 but gets down to say 11 playing with a 12 are a very strong team.

    There's nothing in golf like the buzz of playing for club team. Most clubs put up honest teams, all matches in our section this year were decided. 3-2.

    Winning it outright straight is a tall order but don't let that put you off playing in it, to me it's the best part of playing golf.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 787 ✭✭✭mafc


    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?

    Was fortunate enough to be part of Provincial Towns Cup winning team this year. Great buzz


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 184 ✭✭Sir montygom


    Spanish point are a club of 200 or so members going for back to back all Ireland purcells... Pressure might get to them as back to back is a big ask!!!' Might take value punt on an underdog!!!

    Their captains prize was on two weeks ago.... Winner (Purcell player) shot 3 over in all most unplayable windy conditions to win it ... 2nd another Purcell member shot 1 over....... For the rest of the years comps these guys can only shoot 30 or so points🙈


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 552 ✭✭✭A New earth


    Spanish point are a club of 200 or so members going for back to back all Ireland purcells... Pressure might get to them as back to back is a big ask!!!' Might take value punt on an underdog!!!

    Their captains prize was on two weeks ago.... Winner (Purcell player) shot 3 over in all most unplayable windy conditions to win it ... 2nd another Purcell member shot 1 over....... For the rest of the years comps these guys can only shoot 30 or so points��


    Can the GUI do nothing about that club that is destroying the honest/houourable name of this great game?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1 MashedPotatoe


    Cant wait for Paddy Power to open the book on Peirce Purcell for 2014. Judging by everything that is being said about Spanish Point here, looks like it could be easy money!

    PP are no fools Spanish Point are 1/2 . I wouldn't mind but I was watching this tread and was saving my money up to have a cut on them. I was expecting evens or 7/4 by the way lads were talking on this 1/2 is a joke!!! Anyway any other sure things out there?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17 thebigbandit


    Had ambitions to play in one of these "things".
    A little bit of me died today :)

    But a straight must win now and again. Any winners around here ?

    I can't believe everyone here is so nieve, any team in any GUI finals from junior cup on has a few shots in the pocket..granted Spanish point seem to have taken it to my level but I guarentee anyone watches finals will see plenty of people playing well above they're handicap.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 184 ✭✭Sir montygom


    I can't believe everyone here is so nieve, any team in any GUI finals from junior cup on has a few shots in the pocket..granted Spanish point seem to have taken it to my level but I guarentee anyone watches finals will see plenty of people playing well above they're handicap.

    Sure.... They are still all still all scrubbers and will feel the pressure as much as any of the finalist playing ... Maybe even more ... Probably value in backing the outsiders.!! Should be great weekend of entertainment for anyone going to watch the finals!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,215 ✭✭✭scrubber72


    Sure.... They are still all still all scrubbers and will feel the pressure as much as any of the finalist playing ... Maybe even more ... Probably value in backing the outsiders.!! Should be great weekend of entertainment for anyone going to watch the finals!

    Eh low blow......


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,215 ✭✭✭scrubber72


    Sure.... They are still all still all scrubbers and will feel the pressure as much as any of the finalist playing ... Maybe even more ... Probably value in backing the outsiders.!! Should be great weekend of entertainment for anyone going to watch the finals!

    Eh low blow......


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,000 ✭✭✭Russman


    PARlance wrote: »
    Depends how you define a "straight" Fix.
    I think a straight / non bandit in these is someone with JUST 2 or 3 shots to spare.

    This ^^^

    How to define a bandit or a straight, that's the question, especially in matchplay and even more in foresomes.

    Put it this way, in something like, for example Metro, which has a lower limit of 9, chances are that if you shoot 9 over par in a match in the latter stages, you'll probably lose, and badly. Did your opponent have a good day or is he a bandit ? its very grey. BUT by the same token you do also see plenty of matches where a guy is way over par and wins, especially in the lower handicap singles events and foresomes events of any type.

    Certainly not all teams are bandits, not even all winning teams, but most will have a few guys who carry a couple of shots, are they bandits though ? What is a bandit ? IMO its a bit naïve to expect any team of PP players to all have to play their best to play to 12, 15 or whatever the handicaps are.

    I'd agree there is something wrong when you have a situation where you know you need players who can easily beat their handicap to be competitive. Whether that "something" is the system or players' attitudes, who knows.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 7,023 Mod ✭✭✭✭charlieIRL


    Less of the auld gambling chat lads. Thanks.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    So if you are a player who is as low as they can go
    is there any point.

    Only point people are missing is.

    It is last year's hcaps. So lads improving have shots be design.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17 thebigbandit


    scrubber72 wrote: »
    Eh low blow......

    Haha the winners will be king of the scrubbers!!! Coolatin will be tough to beat if my source is right they every bit as good as the Clare men..we will be talking about a different team of bandits next month!! Long live the bandits!!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 494 ✭✭cairny


    So if you are a player who is as low as they can go
    is there any point.

    Only point people are missing is.

    It is last year's hcaps. So lads improving have shots be design.


    There is, I find I play better than my handicap in the matches and I resent every single 0.1 I incur.

    You tend to raise your game, it really helps your own game too, you learn to dig out a score.

    Don't let the bad apples rob you of a great golf experience.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,000 ✭✭✭Russman


    So if you are a player who is as low as they can go
    is there any point.

    Only point people are missing is.

    It is last year's hcaps. So lads improving have shots be design.

    Of course there is. One or two shots is nothing in a match in terms of where you might have left a couple out there. Its not a case of loads of clubs having mid handicaps playing like senior cup players, there might be one or two, but having a good run in an interclub event is a brilliant experience, even if you lose eventually in the latter stages. The better player doesn't always win in matchplay.

    There's never going to be an absolutely even playing field, unless you had a comp for every handicap digit and only for those who are at that limit for 3 years or more, or something.
    Lads improving - isn't that true of every sport though ? There's always someone better, younger coming through. OK, arguably you could make it current handicap rather than last year's, but I'm not sure that's a good idea, it would only encourage sandbagging if a guy knew he'd lose his place on a team mid-season by getting cut.

    There's so many potential scenarios that its impossible to cover every base, you could get drawn against a guy who was off scratch most of his life but has drifted out to 5 or 6 - he may not play like a scratch anymore but he'll still have the know how that's very hard to quantify and will help him in a match against another inexperienced 5 handicapper.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    Look. Will play . Love the heat of the battle.

    But earlier on. Lads were saying that lads have 4/5/6 shots in the bag.

    That is totally off the wall stuff.

    In fact it could be just a bit demoralising for your game.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,190 ✭✭✭opinionated3


    Played against Spanish point earlier this year. Demoralising is the word


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,133 ✭✭✭✭FixdePitchmark


    Played against Spanish point earlier this year. Demoralising is the word

    There you go.

    Whilst noble and all that. Not everyone is in to moral victories.

    Lads having shots in the bag that you have on the card is not sport.

    If you are playing your heart out. Go to that and get slaughtered by a bandit.
    May not be fun .

    I'd actually love the challenge. But, can see it putting lads off.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,000 ✭✭✭Russman


    Look. Will play . Love the heat of the battle.

    But earlier on. Lads were saying that lads have 4/5/6 shots in the bag.

    That is totally off the wall stuff.

    In fact it could be just a bit demoralising for your game.

    Definitely play on.

    If you come up against a juggernaut team that have 4/5/6 shots in the bag, write it off to bitter experience. There's not THAT many teams like that, for sure there are some, no denying that, and they'll likely be the winners of the mid range handicap events. But, unfortunately there's also no denying you need to be able to be pretty good off your handicap to compete in events that have handicap limits. PP is notorious for it regardless.

    Don't read too much into it though, what's the difference between being beaten by a guy off the same handicap as you who happens to have a good day, or a guy off the same handicap who is carrying 4 shots ? You won't really know which is the truth until someone says to you ".....oh him, sure he should be off X......"

    It could be you having that good day and all his team mates will say you're the one who's the bandit.
    Club golfers rarely admit to losing to bad golf, we always hear "...yeah, we lost on 15 but they were only 3 over par, how can we compete with that ?....", yet we rarely hear someone say "......I lost on 14 but I played sh1te, simples....."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,000 ✭✭✭Russman


    There you go.

    Whilst noble and all that. Not everyone is in to moral victories.

    Lads having shots in the bag that you have on the card is not sport.

    If you are playing your heart out. Go to that and get slaughtered by a bandit.
    May not be fun .

    I'd actually love the challenge. But, can see it putting lads off.

    True enough, but I'd have to say I've genuinely rarely, seen anyone play well and lose in interclub. If someone actually plays "well" they have a great chance of beating anybody, even a bandit.
    It did happen to me once, many moons ago in a Metro semi final, 2 over par when I lost on 14th, I opened up par, par, par, par, birdie, par and was 4 down after 6. It happens, but hey.

    Interclub really is, IMO, one of the best parts of playing golf, especially in the weekend events like Junior and Senior Cup where you're meeting guys year after year and catching up etc. Its a great experience. Some clubs take "winning" to the extreme and it'd be a shame for them to ruin it for the vast majority. Its like there's a certain amount of banditry accepted but you're not supposed to take the p1ss with it like some are now supposed to be doing !:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,431 ✭✭✭dvemail


    It's a shame really, as any club that wants to win the likes of the Purcell or the Bruen feel like they need junior cup standard golfers playing off 12 or more to compete.
    Every event in the cups & shields has a dark corner. The Junior Cup always has lads who could could play off at least 3 or less but refuse to go down. While in the Barton and Senior Cup some clubs have a massive recruitment drive in getting the best players in the area to play for them.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭SaveOurLyric


    PARlance wrote: »
    I think a straight / non bandit in these is someone with JUST 2 or 3 shots to spare.

    How do you reason this ? Unless it is someone on the downward handicap slope, and more arent than are, then someone with any shots to spare is a cheat. Making his team a cheating one.


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